Buffalo & Rochester Nov. '22 trends

[ckg279]

Usual disclaimers: Per AllAccess.com & **************** . 12+ only. Only the top 5 in each market are shown.

First...

BUFFALO

1. WBLK/93.7 9.5(down 1.0)
2. WYRK/106.5 8.5(up .9)
3. WGRF/96.9 8.4(down .4)
4. WGR/550 6.7(up 1.1)
5. WHTT/104.1 6.1(down .6)

(Sidebar: CFLZ(101.1 More FM)and CJED(105.1 the River)pulled a .8 and a .2, respectively. For whatever reason, they didn't register in the last 3 trends.)

ROCHESTER

1. WDKX/103.9 7.7(down .8)
2. WHAM/1180 7.0(down .2)
3. WBEE/92.5 6.3(down .8)
4. WCMF/96.5 5.7(down .5)
5. WPXY/97.7 3.7(no change)

The floor is open.

 

[TheBigA]

Once again, WYRK and WBLK are doing their annual doe-see-doe, flip flopping at the top of the chart. Expect the dance to be reversed in the spring.

 

[Mark1981]

As I predicted in the October 2022 ratings thread, WGR supplanted its sister station WBEN in the top five. In all my years of following Buffalo radio, I don’t think there’s ever been a time when WBEN was not in the top 5 12+. The trend is clear. After years of 9 to 10 shares, WBEN is now in the 6 to 6.5 share range. I wonder what insiders at 500 Corporate Parkway think about this. November was a month when WBEN should have attracted listeners in droves, especially with the massive snowstorm. Even I, a frequent critic of the station’s right-wing talkers, spent a fair amount of time listening to WBEN during the storm because of its excellent coverage. WBFO is now within 2.2 points of WBEN — a margin that has never been closer. Very interesting!

I feel so sorry for my friends at WEBR. No matter how hard they’re trying, the station can’t gain any traction. Its paltry .04 share fell to a .02. Part of WEBR’s problems is it has a fringe AM signal and no FM translator. It interrupts its music programming twice a day with talk. Plus, mixing ‘70s soft rock with American standards just doesn’t work. I like both musical styles. But as one noted local radio consultant noted in a conversation I was privy to — he likes pickles and he likes ice cream. Just not together! But I’ll keep listening, especially to my buddies Ralph Irene, Barry Lillis and John Farley on weekends.

 

[SirRoxalot]

Get all of the reporting stations here:

Buffalo: Radio Industry News, Radio Show Prep, Radio Promotions, Radio Station Data, Podcast News

WGR AM is getting their autumn Bills bounce. Star 102.5 switched to all Christmas at the beginning of November, but it doesn't seem to have had much effect on their numbers. It looks like Byrnes Communications bought the US book to see if CFLZ or CJED had much impact here. The answer is no. WECK is back up to a 3.0 share. Not a lot of movement beyond what you can see above.

Rochester: Radio Industry News, Radio Show Prep, Radio Promotions, Radio Station Data, Podcast News

The biggest story in Rochester is a continuing slide for WBEE. They've gone steadily down from an 8.7 in the August trend to a 6.3 in November. It's hard to say where those shares have gone, but a lot of Rochester stations aren't showing up in Nielsen ratings. There are only 16 stations listed. It seems that a lot of owners aren't buying the book. Audacy stations in general are trending down in Rochester.

 

[tbolt909]

Once again, WYRK and WBLK are doing their annual doe-see-doe, flip flopping at the top of the chart. Expect the dance to be reversed in the spring.

And once again WBUF and WLKK The Wolf remain entrenched in the gutter. Both stations are below a 2 share.
The Corporate cluster strategy must be -- Let's find the worst possible formats that won't impact our other stations. Radio brings no new listeners into the tent and the downward spiral continues...

 

[TheBigA]

November was a month when WBEN should have attracted listeners in droves, especially with the massive snowstorm.

I believe the survey period ended November 9th, which was a week before the snowstorm. But included the election.

 

[TheBigA]

Radio brings no new listeners into the tent and the downward spiral continues...

"Radio" is not one thing. Stations have ways of bringing new listeners into the tent without changing formats.

 

[Buddy Shula]

And once again WBUF and WLKK The Wolf remain entrenched in the gutter. Both stations are below a 2 share.
The Corporate cluster strategy must be -- Let's find the worst possible formats that won't impact our other stations. Radio brings no new listeners into the tent and the downward spiral continues...

We don't want to forget about WMSX being in the gutter. Another joke.

 

[Rusty Bridges]

Some stations fall into the consistently good category, and then there are those that make people who read a post on these boards scratch their heads and wonder why?!

Over the years, the savants here have written about cluster synergies and the values of WBUF and WLKK to their clusters in their respective formats "as is." If you say so. They may have value to their clusters in their present formats, on air, streaming, program clearance and whatever ... but both stations sound awful. Let's call it what it is. Bad effin radio.

Seriously. Who's listening to the Beer and Wings morning show, when WGR, 97 Rock, WYRK, the Edge, WBEN, WHTT, Kiss, Steve Harvey on WBLK ... even NPR on WBFO, are running full bore? And the music? "Everything that rocks?" Laughable. It's not Classic Rock, it's not Classic Hits, it's not even "playing what we want." The Wolf? Shoot it and put it out of its misery.

Like Mark1981, I too feel bad for the people at WEBR. What's the format? Is it music? Is it talk? 0.2 Persons 12+ Just imagine shelling out money for the Nielsen numbers, opening the report and seeing results like that.

 

[Buddy Shula]

I no longer look at ratings as “the Bible”, but. It’s all we have to show any benchmark.

There are going to be 3 categories of stations

A
WGRF
WBLK
WYRK
WBEN

B
WTSS
WKSE
WECK
WMSX
WEDG
WBFO
WBUF
WLKK
WNED
WGR

C
WXRL
WUFO
WEBR
WLVL
WWKB
WHLD
WBBF
WWWS

What has always encouraged me is that the B group is the mainstream. The A group will always be big, and the C group will always be very low.

I like the opportunity to fight in the B group, because for me, “it’s doable “

A few people who have been on this thread say the “feel sorry” for WEBR. As much as I respect Bill as a person, and I know he reads these threads, he has never listened to any of the suggestions I gave including to not buy WJJL. For whatever reason, which is up to him he did. The unfortunate thing is the answer to any success on that station is as clear as day. It’s a Niagara County station. For starters, admit that, then think of the best way to serve Niagara County. I think we all know what the real answer would be. I know it. It’s pretty simple really. So “feel sorry” to me is a little dramatic when the answers are on the wall and they are not following them. That’s nobody’s fault but their own.

The 50KW losers : WBUF, WMSX, WWKB, WNED- wasted signals. Corporate has killed them, and it won’t get better

The other loser who should blame themselves for a lack of doing anything right: WLKK. The correct genre, the incorrect format, and much too late in the game. Not even sure they listen at the Bliss Hotel like they did 30 years ago.

 

[TheBigA]

Who's listening to the Beer and Wings morning show,

Apparently quite a few people. Enough to attract some advertisers and make money. They probably won't win any awards or get into the Hall of Fame. But that's not what they're there for. The other side of the coin for Townsquare is they have two stations that alternate 1 & 2 every month, and it's been that way a long time. They understand that not every station they own is going to be #1.

The Buffalo Bills kicked the poop out of the Steelers a few weeks ago. The Steelers have a losing record with an inept offense. One could ask who is watching the Steelers when there are so many better teams in the league to watch. That's the kind of argument you're making.

 

[davideduardo]

Apparently quite a few people. Enough to attract some advertisers and make money. They probably won't win any awards or get into the Hall of Fame. But that's not what they're there for. The other side of the coin for Townsquare is they have two stations that alternate 1 & 2 every month, and it's been that way a long time. They understand that not every station they own is going to be #1.

And one of the things we have learned from the PPM where we can track usage over up to two years instead of just 7 days is that "my" most used station this week may not be the top choice next week. Music listeners in particular use two or three stations heavily, and they alternate between the most and least listened to choices.

That fact can account for the week to week variations in numbers and, to some extent, the monthly variations.

 

[tbolt909]

Apparently quite a few people.

No, very few people are listening to WBUF in Buffalo based on the ratings. Perhaps the show does better in other markets. Obviously, not every station can be #1. WBUF and WLKK are so bad they're not even serving a niche. They have no identity, relevance, ratings, or listener passion.

Your football analogy is weak. Fans are tribal and tend to support their local team win or lose. However, interest goes up when a team is winning. Bad Radio formats (local or otherwise) won't generate "fans" like professional sports teams...

 

[tbolt909]

And one of the things we have learned from the PPM where we can track usage over up to two years instead of just 7 days is that "my" most used station this week may not be the top choice next week. Music listeners in particular use two or three stations heavily, and they alternate between the most and least listened to choices.

That fact can account for the week to week variations in numbers and, to some extent, the monthly variations.

How is this relevant to diary markets like Buffalo? In the case of WBUF and WLKK, those stations are consistently near the bottom of the ratings. "Sampling" obviously makes no impression and they are quickly forgotten...

 

[SirRoxalot]

I no longer look at ratings as “the Bible”, but. It’s all we have to show any benchmark.

There are going to be 3 categories of stations

A
WGRF
WBLK
WYRK
WBEN

B
WTSS
WKSE
WECK
WMSX
WEDG
WBFO
WBUF
WLKK
WNED
WGR

C
WXRL
WUFO
WEBR
WLVL
WWKB
WHLD
WBBF
WWWS

You seem to have missed WHTT. They've grown quietly over the last couple of years to consistently look like a group A station to me.

WNED FM does exactly what it's programmed to do. It makes more than enough money to support itself and it presents classical music to a very loyal (and typically affluent) audience. To me, it fulfills its public broadcasting mission effectively.

 

[MarkW]

Good numbers for 103.3 The Edge. They are clearly doing something right, and they're accomplishing that feat with a format (alternative rock) that often struggles in other cities. The new morning show is probably performing well, too.

WBUF's purpose in life seems to be to reach an audience (albeit a relatively small one) the other stations in the cluster cannot reach at as low of cost as possible.

 

[davideduardo]

How is this relevant to diary markets like Buffalo? In the case of WBUF and WLKK, those stations are consistently near the bottom of the ratings. "Sampling" obviously makes no impression and they are quickly forgotten...

It's relevant, Sir Negative, because the PPM shows that P1 is not a permanent status, and a person's P1 varies between periods of time, which might be weeks, or fortnights or months. And that can explain, beyond normal statistical wobble in a random probability sample, why stations seem to "bounce" when various periods of time are analyzed.

While that data was never noted in music stations going back to Pulse, Hooper, Mediatrends and even Arbitron up until the PPM began because each individual was only measured over the period of a week (or even just one day in coincidental surveys earlier on).

On the other hand, low rated stations don't seem to be affected by this as they don't have a significant nucleus of higher preference level listeners. Further, their numbers are so low that the very high statistical margin of error in the reported numbers masks any data on actual behaviour.

 

[TheBigA]

No, very few people are listening to WBUF in Buffalo based on the ratings.

We're talking about thousands, likely tens of thousands of people. Should they be discriminated against because they're not as many as 97Rock? They obviously choose to listen, and if the format changed, they would be unhappy.

WBUF and WLKK are so bad they're not even serving a niche. They have no identity, relevance, ratings, or listener passion.

Their identity is strong enough and the passion of their listeners is strong enough to cause them to write their call letters down in a diary. Do you know how much effort it takes to fill in a radio listening diary every day, every hour? That's a lot of work.

Your football analogy is weak. Fans are tribal and tend to support their local team win or lose. However, interest goes up when a team is winning. Bad Radio formats (local or otherwise) won't generate "fans" like professional sports teams...

But these aren't "bad radio formats." WYRK and WGRF prove it.

 

[Buddy Shula]

We're talking about thousands, likely tens of thousands of people. Should they be discriminated against because they're not as many as 97Rock? They obviously choose to listen, and if the format changed, they would be unhappy.



Their identity is strong enough and the passion of their listeners is strong enough to cause them to write their call letters down in a diary. Do you know how much effort it takes to fill in a radio listening diary every day, every hour? That's a lot of work.



But these aren't "bad radio formats." WYRK and WGRF prove it.

BUF has a weekly cume about 55k
LKK has a weekly cume of about 49k
MSX has a weekly cume of about 61k


BLK has a weekly cume of about 177k

 

[Buddy Shula]

You seem to have missed WHTT. They've grown quietly over the last couple of years to consistently look like a group A station to me.

WNED FM does exactly what it's programmed to do. It makes more than enough money to support itself and it presents classical music to a very loyal (and typically affluent) audience. To me, it fulfills its public broadcasting mission effectively.

When I say A stations, I am talking about the mammoths. HTT is not that, like WECK it fluctuates . HTT has been down to a 5 share and it not a 30 year format station. The A stations I mentioned not only have had huge cume for decades, they are entrenched in the format. In my opinion, WHTT can drop if not watched very carefully, the others will always stay up there. I am concerned about WBEN. I don’t think they’ve ever had a lower share. They have 20k more listeners than WECK. that’s not a lot. I think WBEN is vulnerable, but it’s too much a staple to drop that far. WHTT is more vulnerable as they move the format around quite a bit, which I understand