Seattle-Tacoma Radio Ratings: March 2023

[Cobra14]

Yes, and the reason is that there is not much agency business in small markets, and they likely decided that the potential business is not worth the cost since agencies get the full data anyway. If they are not subscribed, buyers still see the full data but the station can't use it to make presentations. They probably feel that they will do just as much agency business without adding the expense.

Potential advertiser “Prove it’s absolute accuracy, this is my money on the line”

Sales person “trust me it’s accurate, because they said so”.

 

[davideduardo]

Potential advertiser “Prove it’s absolute accuracy, this is my money on the line”

Sales person “trust me it’s accurate, because they said so”.

Ratings are labeled as "estimates". Advertisers who use ratings, mostly agencies, know this and that is why they buy off 4, 6 even 10 month rolling averages.

And most markets have their Nielsen book MRC accredited... and the MRC is pretty much an organization supported by the advertising community to verify the accuracy of ratings.

And time buyers don't ask stations to "prove" the ratings. Agencies buy ratings themselves and do so because they believe that radio ratings are as accurate as possible within the budgets given to the services.

 

[xmtrland]

I would check the encoding monitor. Make sure it's hooked up to a tuner, tuned to the station. Make sure encoding is passing over the air. Before you point the finger be sure it's not pointing at you.

 

[Gregg.]

KICR is 172 watts from a tower that is 1,844 feet above average terrain, several hundred feet taller than the Empire State Building. KICR plays country music and is licensed to Coeur D'Alene in Northern Idaho. My guess is, that's what folks in Northern Idaho listen to, not to one of Spokane's two country stations.

Northern Idaho is fairly rural and agricultural, great for a local country station. In the Spokane market, a listener in Northern Idaho counts as much as one in downtown Spokane. So while KXLY-FM and KDRK are the country stations for Spokane and Eastern Washington State, KICR is the country station for Northern Idaho, where country is a way of life.

Admittedly, KICR's ratings do wobble. In the 3's in January, in the 5's in March. That's probably a function of where the diaries are. Perhaps this time around, more diaries came from Northern Idaho. I notice the rock station for Northern Idaho, 94.5 KHTQ in Hayden, also wobbles. Since January, it's gone from the 4's to the 2's. So maybe some folks in Northern Idaho are recently listening more to country, less to rock.

 

[pjc1961]

Top 5+ demo rankings analysis for ages 25-54, 18-34 + 18-49:

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25-54: 1. KJEB (up from #4) 2. KEXP 3. KQMV 4. KKWF (up from #9) 5. KHTP 6. KISW (down from #2)
------- 7T. KBKS 7T. KIRO-FM 7T. KZOK
18-34: 1. KEXP 2T. KQMV (up from #5) 2T. KJEB (up from #14) 4. KKWF (up from #9) 5T. KZOK (down from #1) 5T. KUOW 5T. KHTP
------- 8. KISW (down from #3)
18-49: 1. KJEB (up from #5) 2. KQMV 3. KEXP 4. KKWF (up from #7) 5. KISW 6T. KZOK 6T. KHTP

 

[RadioMaxwell]

There’s probably a good reason why.

I competed against Stephens in one of their markets (if you even want to call what they did competing) and, at least in that market, they definitely wouldn't have wanted to see it. I've also heard they have some serious cash flow issues.

 

[davideduardo]

KICR is 172 watts from a tower that is 1,844 feet above average terrain, several hundred feet taller than the Empire State Building. KICR plays country music and is licensed to Coeur D'Alene in Northern Idaho. My guess is, that's what folks in Northern Idaho listen to, not to one of Spokane's two country stations.

This is not about Northern Idaho but about the Spokane market. Coeur D’Alene is in one of the two counties of the Spokane Metro Survey.Area and gets its revenue in that market, despite having a simulcast partner outside the metro.

Northern Idaho is fairly rural and agricultural, great for a local country station. In the Spokane market, a listener in Northern Idaho counts as much as one in downtown Spokane. So while KXLY-FM and KDRK are the country stations for Spokane and Eastern Washington State, KICR is the country station for Northern Idaho, where country is a way of life.

But we are talking about how the station got a significant share in the Spokane book. That is due to being inside that market, even if the signal misses the farther western extreme.

Admittedly, KICR's ratings do wobble. In the 3's in January, in the 5's in March. That's probably a function of where the diaries are. Perhaps this time around, more diaries came from Northern Idaho.

The diaries only come from two counties, INE in Idaho and one in Washington. Nothing else counts.

 

[bobdavcav]

Re: Spokane. Greg, you might be right, but 94.5 has a much better signal into the core of Spokane than 102.3, so I would be surprised if more of its listeners come from north Idaho as opposed to the larger Spokane. Back to Seattle, Lance is usually really good about noting when stations have their largest share in a long time, but he didn't for 100.7. That kind of surprised me. I expected KPNW to have a bad book this month, but this is downright terrible.

 

[Kelly A]

KICR is 172 watts from a tower that is 1,844 feet above average terrain, several hundred feet taller than the Empire State Building. KICR plays country music and is licensed to Coeur D'Alene in Northern Idaho. My guess is, that's what folks in Northern Idaho listen to, not to one of Spokane's two country stations.

Problem is with that geography around Spokaneistan, is there are a lot of rolling, and not-so rolling hills. Coeur D'Alene is essentially in a valley/trough between two pretty big hills. Unless you have a site with everyone else on Tower Mt., you end up being a rimshot. That, and 172W ERP means zero building penetration, and lot's of fading behind hills.

Northern Idaho is fairly rural and agricultural, great for a local country station. In the Spokane market, a listener in Northern Idaho counts as much as one in downtown Spokane. So while KXLY-FM and KDRK are the country stations for Spokane and Eastern Washington State, KICR is the country station for Northern Idaho, where country is a way of life.

One of the many problems with that market, and trust me, my stations tried to sell in Spokaneistan, is the sheer number of stations. It's got to be one of the most radio-saturated, small markets on the planet, with everyone duking-it-out for what amount to the remaining advertising crumbs.

 

[Cobra14]

So the current issue with KPNW is the lack of the market knowing it even exists and the country audience didn’t cross over much, if at all. So they’re literally starting from scratch. It’s a niche format. The Mountain listeners didn’t immediately move into it. Those that are listening aren’t part of the Nielsen panel currently.

The solution: give it time. Get a marketing campaign. Spring summer events, hit the streets and do the traditional footwork. Fix that logo. It looks sloppy and unprofessional. Polish the schedule so the music rotations aren’t stagnant and schedule the commercials so they air at points where the listener stays long enough to get the station it’s PPM credit for the hour. One button/click enabled audio stream on the website. Let the air staff do what they do.

That’s what comes to mind from my armchair.

 

[davideduardo]

...schedule the commercials so they air at points where the listener stays long enough to get the station it’s PPM credit for the hour.

Just a clarification: the PPM system does not give credit for "hours". The currency here is the "quarter hour" where a PPM panelist's meter must register detections in 5 individual minutes in a quarter hour (or 3 detections in a 5 minute period with 2 "non adjacent missing minutes" with no other detections in between).

Shares are based on the Average Quarter Hour detected listening.

 

[Cobra14]

Just a clarification: the PPM system does not give credit for "hours". The currency here is the "quarter hour" where a PPM panelist's meter must register detections in 5 individual minutes in a quarter hour (or 3 detections in a 5 minute period with 2 "non adjacent missing minutes" with no other detections in between).

Shares are based on the Average Quarter Hour detected listening.

Got it. So with that in mind schedule accordingly. Clocks.

 

[davideduardo]

Got it. So with that in mind schedule accordingly. Clocks.

This has been researched over and over since the original Philadelphia PPM tests around 2002... and even more since PPM went "live" starting in 2008. The conclusion of all testing for music formats has been: two stops an hour, crossing either :00 and :30 or :15 and :45.

 

[Cobra14]

I would check the encoding monitor. Make sure it's hooked up to a tuner, tuned to the station. Make sure encoding is passing over the air. Before you point the finger be sure it's not pointing at you.

Shouldn’t they have remote monitoring on that device so it alerts programming and engineering if it’s not functioning? Right away so it can be fixed if it’s broken. That’s money right there.

 

[Cobra14]

This has been researched over and over since the original Philadelphia PPM tests around 2002... and even more since PPM went "live" starting in 2008. The conclusion of all testing for music formats has been: two stops an hour, crossing either :00 and :30 or :15 and :45.

Seems like the brain trust at Hubbard should know all this stuff and should already be doing it.

comes down to giving it time and for people to learn the station exists, by whatever means to do so.

 

[TheBigA]

Seems like the brain trust at Hubbard should know all this stuff and should already be doing it.

They do and they are. The rest is up to the audience. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

 

[Cobra14]

They do and they are. The rest is up to the audience. You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

Why does KPNW water taste better than the other water? What is it about the water the horse(s) don’t like? How do they compromise so the horses that do like the water continue to while attracting the horses that currently don’t. How long does it take for the horses to find the current water as it is? How much money can the current water make when it is found?

 

[dxsphere]

KICR is 172 watts from a tower that is 1,844 feet above average terrain, several hundred feet taller than the Empire State Building. KICR plays country music and is licensed to Coeur D'Alene in Northern Idaho. My guess is, that's what folks in Northern Idaho listen to, not to one of Spokane's two country stations.

Northern Idaho is fairly rural and agricultural, great for a local country station. In the Spokane market, a listener in Northern Idaho counts as much as one in downtown Spokane. So while KXLY-FM and KDRK are the country stations for Spokane and Eastern Washington State, KICR is the country station for Northern Idaho, where country is a way of life.

Admittedly, KICR's ratings do wobble. In the 3's in January, in the 5's in March. That's probably a function of where the diaries are. Perhaps this time around, more diaries came from Northern Idaho. I notice the rock station for Northern Idaho, 94.5 KHTQ in Hayden, also wobbles. Since January, it's gone from the 4's to the 2's. So maybe some folks in Northern Idaho are recently listening more to country, less to rock.

KICR/KIBR are targeted mainly at North Idaho (Sandpoint and Coeur d'Alene) and the playlist tilts a bit older with more variety country than KXLY, KDRK or KISC-HD2 (K257FX 99.3). Signal-wise, KICR gets out pretty well despite its wattage - from east of Ritzville to Lookout Pass on I-90; and on Hwy 2 toward Newport. KICR gets weaker north of Coeur d'Alene due to rough terrain, which is where KIBR fills in to cover Sandpoint.

 

[Cobra14]

How much money will it cost to advertise the water? To market it? To do so in the most effective way possible with the least amount of overhead? How to maintain the marketing so the initial investment is worthwhile? What worked in other markets? What didn’t work? What works in the Seattle market? What doesn’t work in the Seattle market that does elsewhere and vise-versa? Estimated time for results with wiggle room and cost basis? How much is overthinking and how much Is beyond control?

 

[xmtrland]

Shouldn’t they have remote monitoring on that device so it alerts programming and engineering if it’s not functioning? Right away so it can be fixed if it’s broken. That’s money right there.

The newer PPM Monitor have built in Email notification and contact closure to hook up to a Burk or other monitoring device. It's up to the station to integrate on how it alerts if there is an encoding issue. They can also log into the newer units and see how well the audio for the station is encoded.

Nielsen does give a station that encodes an encoding monitor but it's up to the station set it up and to use it.