How do listeners form an impression of a station?

[tall_guy1]

Some stations seem to continually do well, while others continuously struggle. Do listeners just hear songs, or do they form an overall impression of a station which hekps them? For example, the KC station 95.7 the Vibe in 2010 was at a 6.8 share and second place despite a weak signal, but now sits at 1.9 share. Did listeners form a negative impression of the station? What goes into that?

 

[Daryl Lynn L.A.]

Some stations seem to continually do well, while others continuously struggle. Do listeners just hear songs, or do they form an overall impression of a station which hekps them? For example, the KC station 95.7 the Vibe in 2010 was at a 6.8 share and second place despite a weak signal, but now sits at 1.9 share. Did listeners form a negative impression of the station? What goes into that?

So..........one of the ways to answer this (based on what I've learned here), is to determine what their product is, who their competition is, and who beat them out in the ratings.

For example -- the 95.7 Vibe station is KCHZ Ottawa, KS, owned by Audacy,; and from listening for a little while, it seems to me that their format is CHR.

So, who else in KC plays a CHR format and competes with KCHZ for listeners? Is it KCMO- FM? Is it Jack FM? How many CHR stations compete with each other in KC?

How has the radio scene changed since 2010? Is there more competition now? Did 95.7 have the same format in 2010? Or did they change format in the past 13 years?

Is this one of the stations that you like to listen to? Does it sound okay to you? It sounds good to me, so I'm thinking that there might be another competing station, maybe one with a stronger signal. What do you think?

 

[tall_guy1]

So..........one of the ways to answer this (based on what I've learned here), is to determine what their product is, who their competition is, and who beat them out in the ratings.

For example -- the 95.7 Vibe station is KCHZ Ottawa, KS, owned by Audacy,; and from listening for a little while, it seems to me that their format is CHR.

So, who else in KC plays a CHR format and competes with KCHZ for listeners? Is it KCMO- FM? Is it Jack FM? How many CHR stations compete with each other in KC?

How has the radio scene changed since 2010? Is there more competition now? Did 95.7 have the same format in 2010? Or did they change format in the past 13 years?

Is this one of the stations that you like to listen to? Does it sound okay to you? It sounds good to me, so I'm thinking that there might be another competing station, maybe one with a stronger signal. What do you think?

They are owned by Cumulus actually. There is a competing legacy CHR KMXV (which had more of a Hot AC sound in 2010) and a Hot AC KZPT (was Gen X radio in 2010, so they weren't a competitor)which has gotten more current focused in recent years. So they definitely have more competition now. They sound alright to me. They had the same format in 2010.

 

[Kelly A]

Some stations seem to continually do well, while others continuously struggle. Do listeners just hear songs, or do they form an overall impression of a station which hekps them? For example, the KC station 95.7 the Vibe in 2010 was at a 6.8 share and second place despite a weak signal, but now sits at 1.9 share. Did listeners form a negative impression of the station? What goes into that?

Why would you like one type of food one year, and less the next? Why would you find one episode of a TV show less interesting than another? Why would you find a rainy day appealing one day, but annoying the next?

 

[Deleted member 108832]

Why would you like one type of food one year, and less the next? Why would you find one episode of a TV show less interesting than another? Why would you find a rainy day appealing one day, but annoying the next?

Why would you continue to engage these kinds of board participants, when they obviously aggravate you?

 

[Kelly A]

Why would you continue to engage these kinds of board participants, when they obviously aggravate you?

And obviously you can't tell what counts for aggravation. My point was: There is no way to determine a human condition like listening preferences. One needs to only look toward a personal preference on day to day things, to see that there are literally unlimited opportunities and variables that can't be assumed will be duplicated across the larger audience.
As has been explained to Tall_Guy many times; successful radio operations either buy into a station with a successful track record, then attempt to grow it by taking listeners from the competition, or start from the ground-up by conducting market research to either find vulnerabilities in potential competition, or what amounts to filling a hole, that fills a demographic that appeals to advertisers.

What Tall_Guy either doesn't understand, or want-to understand; is there aren't the individual artist or song nuances in determining whether a station is successful or not. That's why it's called broadcasting. The point is to appeal to as broad an audience within the targeted demographic, than focusing in on individual artists or titles, because there's a better than even chance that artist or title will be forgotten a month, or three months from now.

 

[Deleted member 108832]

And obviously you can't tell what counts for aggravation. My point was: There is no way to determine a human condition like listening preferences. One needs to only look toward a personal preference on day to day things, to see that there are literally unlimited opportunities and variables that can't be assumed will be duplicated across the larger audience.
As has been explained to Tall_Guy many times; successful radio operations either buy into a station with a successful track record, then attempt to grow it by taking listeners from the competition, or start from the ground-up by conducting market research to either find vulnerabilities in potential competition, or what amounts to filling a hole, that fills a demographic that appeals to advertisers.

What Tall_Guy either doesn't understand, or want-to understand; is there aren't the individual artist or song nuances in determining whether a station is successful or not. That's why it's called broadcasting. The point is to appeal to as broad an audience within the targeted demographic, than focusing in on individual artists or titles, because there's a better than even chance that artist or title will be forgotten a month, or three months from now.

All of this is true, and you and I both know it. However, the delivery you use in many of your responses to these folks leaves a lot to desire. It's no wonder they don't pay attention and actually learn something from the valuable information that you possess. Perhaps, and I say this to you with the utmost respect intended, you try some honey instead of all the vinegar. Maybe I am reading your intent incorrectly, but some of your words used in response are most off-putting.

 

[tall_guy1]

And obviously you can't tell what counts for aggravation. My point was: There is no way to determine a human condition like listening preferences. One needs to only look toward a personal preference on day to day things, to see that there are literally unlimited opportunities and variables that can't be assumed will be duplicated across the larger audience.
As has been explained to Tall_Guy many times; successful radio operations either buy into a station with a successful track record, then attempt to grow it by taking listeners from the competition, or start from the ground-up by conducting market research to either find vulnerabilities in potential competition, or what amounts to filling a hole, that fills a demographic that appeals to advertisers.

What Tall_Guy either doesn't understand, or want-to understand; is there aren't the individual artist or song nuances in determining whether a station is successful or not. That's why it's called broadcasting. The point is to appeal to as broad an audience within the targeted demographic, than focusing in on individual artists or titles, because there's a better than even chance that artist or title will be forgotten a month, or three months from now.

My point is there are stations that people leave when competition strengthens (like this one), just like stores like Kmart were big at one point but people fell out of habit of going there as in some way they had a better impression of the competitor.

 

[Kelly A]

My point is there are stations that people leave when competition strengthens (like this one), just like stores like Kmart were big at one point but people fell out of habit of going there as in some way they had a better impression of the competitor.

But you're going on the assumption that people leave a radio station for another and never return. That just isn't the case. My point is; there is no way of determining why any one person, prefers one station over another on a particular day, hour, or minute.
Sure, you can pay-for and conduct focus groups within the preferred demographic of why panelists like or dislike certain elements of stations in a market, but one has to consider that's what the panelist is feeling at that particular moment. We human's are fickle when it comes to listening and loyalty.

 

[Kelly A]

All of this is true, and you and I both know it. However, the delivery you use in many of your responses to these folks leaves a lot to desire. It's no wonder they don't pay attention and actually learn something from the valuable information that you possess. Perhaps, and I say this to you with the utmost respect intended, you try some honey instead of all the vinegar. Maybe I am reading your intent incorrectly, but some of your words used in response are most off-putting.

I can't help the way you read-into my responses. Doesn't make them any more or less valid.

 

[tall_guy1]

But you're going on the assumption that people leave a radio station for another and never return. That just isn't the case. My point is; there is no way of determining why any one person, prefers one station over another on a particular day, hour, or minute.
Sure, you can pay-for and conduct focus groups within the preferred demographic of why panelists like or dislike certain elements of stations in a market, but one has to consider that's what the panelist is feeling at that particular moment. We human's are fickle when it comes to listening and loyalty.

In the case of that particular station, their ratings started falling as competition strengthened in the early 10s (they started with a 6.8 share, fell to 5s and then 4s in late 2011), but by the late 10s to today they hovered around a 2.0 share almost continuously while their competitors have done much better, so it would appear people prefer their competitors to them.

 

[Kelly A]

In the case of that particular station, their ratings started falling as competition strengthened in the early 10s (they started with a 6.8 share, fell to 5s and then 4s in late 2011), but by the late 10s to today they hovered around a 2.0 share almost continuously while their competitors have done much better, so it would appear people prefer their competitors to them.

First of all, you're likely making the mistake (again) of assuming that 6+ ratings are some kind of a success or failure scoreboard. Unless you see ratings in the target demographic and know the revenue therein, likely you're making assumptions not based on any reality. We've had this same discussion many times...

Something to consider, are listeners typically move back and forth between stations for many reasons. And now with streaming and apps, listening moves between radio to streaming, and back, but don't stay in one or the other forever. There could be a million or more reasons why certain listeners would move from one station to another. Common ones are: Age. As listener's get older, they seek out music from their youth. Commute: Strong morning personalities get the commuting audience more than a station just playing music. Ad rates for popular morning shows generally bring in much more revenue than just playing music in the same time. Promotion: Newcomers need to promote outside their own station to drive sampling. Change the wrong way:
Stations can lose audience by going in the wrong direction. Problem is; you don't always know what the reaction will be. That's why smart programmers don't make wild-swing changes without at least research to give some assurances you aren't going to kill yourself. Even then, patience is warranted. Make a change, watch the target, adjust slightly as needed. Don't panic if there is a dip. Watch the trend over several books.

 

[tall_guy1]

First of all, you're likely making the mistake (again) of assuming that 6+ ratings are some kind of a success or failure scoreboard. Unless you see ratings in the target demographic and know the revenue therein, likely you're making assumptions not based on any reality. We've had this same discussion many times...

Something to consider, are listeners typically move back and forth between stations for many reasons. And now with streaming and apps, listening moves between radio to streaming, and back, but don't stay in one or the other forever. There could be a million or more reasons why certain listeners would move from one station to another. Common ones are: Age. As listener's get older, they seek out music from their youth. Commute: Strong morning personalities get the commuting audience more than a station just playing music. Ad rates for popular morning shows generally bring in much more revenue than just playing music in the same time. Promotion: Newcomers need to promote outside their own station to drive sampling. Change the wrong way:
Stations can lose audience by going in the wrong direction. Problem is; you don't always know what the reaction will be. That's why smart programmers don't make wild-swing changes without at least research to give some assurances you aren't going to kill yourself. Even then, patience is warranted. Make a change, watch the target, adjust slightly as needed. Don't panic if there is a dip. Watch the trend over several books.

But would a wild swing change the listeners perception of a station after a few months? ("What is the matter with this station?")

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

It’s like Groundhog Day. 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

 

[Daryl Lynn L.A.]

It’s like Groundhog Day. 🙄🙄🙄🙄🙄

I’ll be very candid here. I can do without this contemptuous eye-rolling , shaming , and bullying. It’s completely unnecessary. The OP wants to talk about stations in Kansas City. That’s perfectly okay. You and Kelly act as if it’s a grievous error for which the OP should be scolded and told off. He’s perfectly within his rights, he’s thoughtful, and he’s polite— unlike you who talks down to him with eye-rolling and uncivil snark. If you’re looking for a flame war, go troll elsewhere. I’m tired of this poster being the target of the cyber-bullying of two or three people who consider themselves “intellectually superior” to the rest of the group and want to pick a fight. That’s absolute nonsense.


If you cannot reply in a civil tone to the OP, then leave the thread. No one needs your intimidation and bullying. Too abrasive and obnoxious. Get over yourselves.

 

[AbrahamJSimpson]

I’m good, thanks.

 

[Kelly A]

I’ll be very candid here. I can do without this contemptuous eye-rolling , shaming , and bullying. It’s completely unnecessary. The OP wants to talk about stations in Kansas City. That’s perfectly okay. You and Kelly act as if it’s a grievous error for which the OP should be scolded and told off. He’s perfectly within his rights, he’s thoughtful, and he’s polite— unlike you who talks down to him with eye-rolling and uncivil snark.

Tall_Guy is a big boy, and can defend himself Daryl.

If you’re looking for a flame war, go troll elsewhere.

Same could be said for you. Don't like our responses? Don't read them.

I’m tired of this poster being the target of the cyber-bullying of two or three people who consider themselves “intellectually superior” to the rest of the group and want to pick a fight. That’s absolute nonsense.

You clearly don't know what the term cyber-bullying means.

If you cannot reply in a civil tone to the OP, then leave the thread. No one needs your intimidation and bullying. Too abrasive and obnoxious. Get over yourselves.

Again, not up to you Daryl. Maybe you should lobby to become a Moderator? Until then, I suggest you mind your own business.

 

[Kelly A]

But would a wild swing change the listeners perception of a station after a few months? ("What is the matter with this station?")

Again, are you using 6+ public ratings as your measure?

 

[tall_guy1]

Again, are you using 6+ public ratings as your measure?

I am just saying listeners in general might "view" the station differently if certain changes get made on a wide scale in a short period of time rather than a gradual process of changing its sound.

 

[davideduardo]

I am just saying listeners in general might "view" the station differently if certain changes get made on a wide scale in a short period of time rather than a gradual process of changing its sound.

When all stations had was single-day experiences in Hooper and Pulse and then, one week snapshots in Arbitron, we did not realize that "favorite station" is not the way radio listening works.

When we got the PPM, we realized that the average listener has two or three or even four primary stations. They listen more to one this week, and maybe more to another next week. They don't "stop listening" to any of the favorites... they just go through cycles or moods of listening a bit more to one than to the others, and that changes over time.

Further, many people have some additional choices they use occasionally. Maybe for a game, for breaking news, for occasional party music, or for traffic reports or the like (still some use that). So listening is a blend of total radio time spent listening using different ingredients each time.

Oh, and music stations change over time, mostly based on what regular music research says to add, slow down, speed up or drop. And talk stations vary widely based on topics that are sometimes hotter than other times. But stations don't change for the sake of change... they are constantly refreshing the playlist, imaging, and other content items.