KEGL

[lanceventa]

According to AllAccess (what’s left of it), the PD is Patrick Davis.

Dominic ‘Zakk’ Zaccagnini took over the station last July after previously programming iHeart's Talk stations in Rochester and Syracuse NY. Zakk was also PD of Classic Rock "107.7 The Bone" San Francisco and has been a host at a number of Rock stations including WLUP Chicago, WRRK Pittsburgh, WTFX Louisville, WMFS Memphis, WTPT Greenville, KSJO San Jose, and WZGC Atlanta and hosting mornings on Fox Sports Radio from 2010-12.

My story at the time: https://radioinsight.com/headlines/...-revamps-schedule-under-new-program-director/

 

[Huff]

Back to Sabotage.

KVIL probably plays that twice per day. KEGL needs to do everything in it's power to set it apart from KVIL.

KVIL has played "Sabotage" TWICE so far in 2024.
It played a total of 18 times in all of 2023 (on average, 1.5 plays per month.)
Perception vs. Reality

 

[charles1234]

Well if a song didn't chart, why would you ever WANT to play it? Why would you play it? There's a reason there are different charts for different formats. Are we really having this conversation?

If you listen to your audience, they will tell you what to play and what not to play. The Eagle's audience doesn't want to hear Jelly Roll, 21 Pilots, Beastie Boys, and I could sit here and name 50 other artists. It's a ROCK station in a ROCK market with an ALTERNATIVE station - and 2 other stations that share similar music with KVIL, so why would you even CONSIDER playing alt music of ANY kind?

If I want to listen to alternative rock I would listen to Alt 103.7 instead of KEGL

 

[TheBigA]

If I want to listen to alternative rock I would listen to Alt 103.7 instead of KEGL

Except that KVIL isn't only playing strictly alternative songs. That's how they took listeners away from KEGL two years ago.

 

[MarkW]

KVIL has played "Sabotage" TWICE so far in 2024.
It played a total of 18 times in all of 2023 (on average, 1.5 plays per month.
Perception vs. Reality

I wonder if they've given "Intergalactic" a decent number of spins?

 

[MarkW]

Except that KVIL isn't only playing strictly alternative songs. That's how they took listeners away from KEGL two years ago.

The only song on their log that I can recall that I'd consider an odd choice for an alternative station in 2024 is "Headstrong" by Trapt.

Everything else I've seen on their log has support from numerous stations in the format.

KVIL doesn't lean too heavily in either the indie, crunchy rock, emo, or pop crossover directions. It stays more or less in the middle of the fairway with a focus on "consensus" songs for gold cuts.

 

[TheBigA]

I wonder if they've given "Intergalactic" a decent number of spins?

KVIL just played it tonight:

• 
  
  Intergalactic
  Beastie Boys
  7:58 pm

 

[davideduardo]

Well if a song didn't chart, why would you ever WANT to play it? Why would you play it? There's a reason there are different charts for different formats. Are we really having this conversation?

It might be an album cut never released as a single. Or a song that was popularized in a movie or TV series. Or...

If you listen to your audience, they will tell you what to play and what not to play.

Yes, there is a way to do this using accurate statistical techniques, such as music tests. Phone calls, messages and posts on your we4bsite are not accurate

The Eagle's audience doesn't want to hear Jelly Roll, 21 Pilots, Beastie Boys, and I could sit here and name 50 other artists.

You know this how? It's likely they tested the music against their target listeners and came up with the playlist

It's a ROCK station in a ROCK market with an ALTERNATIVE station - and 2 other stations that share similar music with KVIL, so why would you even CONSIDER playing alt music of ANY kind?

Because most listeners don't label music as alternative or whatever. They label songs as "I like it" or "I love it" or "I hate it.

 

[Kramer]

You know this how? It's likely they tested the music against their target listeners and came up with the playlist

Did it work last time? Easy answer.


Because most listeners don't label music as alternative or whatever.

Yes, they absolutely do. Read the comments on their Facebook page and other pages and you will see a very detailed account of what they hear. It's 2024.


Yes, there is a way to do this using accurate statistical techniques, such as music tests. Phone calls, messages and posts on your we4bsite are not accurate

LOL. These people had to keep Ben and Skin to have revenue. Markets have been depleted of any bodies in the buildings so they're all moving to these tiny little spaces - yet somehow you think they have money for testing music, which is astoundingly expensive. "Phone calls" - lol.

 

[Kramer]

This is from the Eagle's playlist tonight. No Sleep Til Brooklyn never charted. I actually kind of like it, but it didn't chart. All the other music from this page is right on target.

 

[Kramer]

Rounding out what's on that page. The Motley and Zep are tired. Shouldn't be on the station.

 

[TheBigA]

Read the comments on their Facebook page and other pages and you will see a very detailed account of what they hear. It's 2024.

You give way too much credit to social media. They will NEVER be happy with anything. They just complain all day.

They're also why active rock stations like KISW and WMMS run talk shows most of the day and use music as filler.

 

[Kramer]

We're talking about Dallas, TX - not Cleveland or SEATTLE. lol. The people on social media are honest. When you play 21 Pilots and 13 people in one thread say, "21 Pilots Sucks" . . . maybe you should ask yourself, "Hey me, should we really be playing 21 Pilots?"

The better question is, "Why do we continue to play it knowing the audience doesn't want to hear it?"

When I got back before the Eagle changed to The Freak, one of the biggest complaints was the alt music.

And here we are. The definition of insanity is . . . you can finish.

 

[davideduardo]

We're talking about Dallas, TX - not Cleveland or SEATTLE. lol. The people on social media are honest. When you play 21 Pilots and 13 people in one thread say, "21 Pilots Sucks" . . . maybe you should ask yourself, "Hey me, should we really be playing 21 Pilots?"

13 people when a station like that cumes in the hundreds of thousands?

The better question is, "Why do we continue to play it knowing the audience doesn't want to hear it?"

You don't find out about preferences with a social media site. You find out with a very precise statistical sample of your heaviest listeners (or potential ones with a new format) in which the participants are blind recruited and do not know for certain which radio station is doing the research.

When I got back before the Eagle changed to The Freak, one of the biggest complaints was the alt music.

By whom? Core listeners? A few friends? A few guys at the bar after a coupla'?

And here we are. The definition of insanity is . . . you can finish.

Insanity is looking for music research on social media.

 

[MarkW]

Active Rock P1 core listeners - men in their 30s and 40s who like guitar driven rock or aggressive sounding rock - do not want to hear Twenty One Pilots.

This is one of those "cume building" artists. Playing such artists may do more harm than good. Is that true in this instance? I don't know.

I also think the Blink 182 song shown on the snippet Kramer posted sounds somewhat out of place on Active Rock. Just my personal opinion. I know a good number of stations in the format do play that song (and also songs by Twenty One Pilots). I think there are other Blink 182 songs that might be a better fit.

The music category rotations are virtually identical to what they used in 2022. Therefore, I doubt any fresh music testing has been performed (so far).

 

[davideduardo]

Active Rock P1 core listeners - men in their 30s and 40s who like guitar driven rock or aggressive sounding rock - do not want to hear Twenty One Pilots.

Your research proved that?

This is one of those "cume building" artists. Playing such artists may do more harm than good. Is that true in this instance? I don't know.

Again, stations research among their own core, generally strong P1 and P2 listeners, about songs, not artists. They play a bit of the song and ask some variant of the question, "and how much would you like to hear that song today?"

I also think the Blink 182 song shown on the snippet Kramer posted sounds somewhat out of place on Active Rock. Just my personal opinion. I know a good number of stations in the format do play that song (and also songs by Twenty One Pilots). I think there are other Blink 182 songs that might be a better fit.

But radio programmers don't "think" in that way. With gold, they look at the overall appeal to their core and they look at how much negatives the song has.

The music category rotations are virtually identical to what they used in 2022. Therefore, I doubt any fresh music testing has been performed (so far).

The majority of changes involve songs that are not well liked by those who enter the core demo each year. So those changes are going to be rather minor. The biggest differences from test to test are often in how often each song is played.

 

[MarkW]

SXM does not play Twenty One Pilots on their active rock channels. It is a polarizing artist for active rock, which is why many FM stations in the format (such as WRIF) never play them. My suspicion is songs from them test well among folks in the target listening group who are not necessarily rock radio P1s.

Aren't many iHM FM music station playlists - especially in small and medium markets - developed solely on the basis of national test data?

Kramer worked a number of years in rock radio, including some time at the very station we are discussing. I think he most likely possesses a decent amount of knowledge on the format and the DFW rock audience.

 

[Kramer]

Insanity is . . .

Insanity is doing the same thing that made you change formats in the first place, to an even worse format and then change BACK to the same format you had before, done the same way.

The Eagle isn't totally getting it wrong. Don't get my words twisted. I'm coming here just sharing my thoughts based on what I know from many years not only at the Eagle, but programming rock stations. Most of the music is fine, but there are times when it's off. As far as listening to actual listeners on social media, you and I can just disagree. You seem to look at radio with a very mathematical thought process, and you're free to do so. It isn't exact lines - it's abstract, and not everything can be defined and put into a box. It's the very key to the irreversible negative stigma to radio. It's decline is irrefutable.

 

[davideduardo]

Insanity is . . .

Insanity is doing the same thing that made you change formats in the first place, to an even worse format and then change BACK to the same format you had before, done the same way.

The Eagle isn't totally getting it wrong. Don't get my words twisted. I'm coming here just sharing my thoughts based on what I know from many years not only at the Eagle, but programming rock stations. Most of the music is fine, but there are times when it's off. As far as listening to actual listeners on social media, you and I can just disagree. You seem to look at radio with a very mathematical thought process, and you're free to do so. It isn't exact lines - it's abstract, and not everything can be defined and put into a box. It's the very key to the irreversible negative stigma to radio. It's decline is irrefutable.

Criticize quantitative analysis all you want, but the fact is that radio advertising is sold quantitatively with little concern for qualitative aspects of a station, a format or the whole medium.

So a program director has to know that success will be based on the right audience numbers in the right ages and with even the right gender or ethnicity.

So one realizes, as a PD, they are like the artist who works for an ad agency. The creative aspect is controlled by the economic one: the client has to like the artwork of an ad or the visual images of a video commercial. There is a border, a frame, a set of limits. Going beyond loses your job or even the agency's account.

A PD's job, with those rare exceptions of picking maybe a new song or three every week, is to find out what their listener wants to hear on the radio today.

I have, in more recent years, found that women make better music station PDs in many cases because they do not have the "alpha male PD" personality that leads them to really believe that they know what listeners want. I've worked with a number of women who, instead, look at what pleases the listeners and not themselves.

 

[TheBigA]

We're talking about Dallas, TX - not Cleveland or SEATTLE. lol.

How much of the music people in Dallas like is actually recorded in Dallas? Oh, so people in Dallas actually like music recorded in LA or NY or other cities? People aren't as provincial and as local as you think. The problem with active rock is that everyone wants their own personal playlist. That's not how radio works.

The better question is, "Why do we continue to play it knowing the audience doesn't want to hear it?"

How do you know the people who post on Facebook are really your audience? Or are they simply looking at the recently played list on the website and ranting? We see that here a lot. Everybody has songs and bands they don't like. You drop a song because these people like it, and another group ask where's that song. It's a never ending game of whack a mole. Facebook isn't local. Anyone can post comments, including people from Nigeria. You can't get hung up on one song or one band. There will always be bands you don't like.

This is why most active rock stations around the country are built around talk show hosts with music as filler.

Active Rock P1 core listeners - men in their 30s and 40s who like guitar driven rock or aggressive sounding rock - do not want to hear Twenty One Pilots.

But its possible their girlfriends or wives do. Radio stations aren't aiming for men only. Rock stations want 25-30% women.

Insanity is doing the same thing that made you change formats in the first place, to an even worse format and then change BACK to the same format you had before, done the same way.

That's not what this is. They're playing more currents than they did before. They're playing a wider range of music. But no active rock station is built around music because it's too individual.

Kramer worked a number of years in rock radio, including some time at the very station we are discussing. I think he most likely possesses a decent amount of knowledge on the format and the DFW rock audience.

He's not talking about radio, he's talking about music. Radio isn't in the music business. People can stream the bands they want with their own playlists. Some people in radio forget what business they're in.