Cleveland Radio April 24 Ratings

[vjm]

99.5 WGAR​

Cleveland's #1 For New Country!

Easy to say when you're the only game in town.

Nobody tries to go head to head with them because they know they'd get killed, as Cleveland tends to stick to ol' reliable.

Just like no one tries to go after WZAK with an urban format, WNCX with classic rock, or WMJI with oldies/classic hits.

WGAR has a pretty safe slogan as they have no in market competition. The one place where there is head to head competition is sports talk with WKRK, WKNR and WARF. And one can argue it is not an equal competition as one is FM and the others AM and WKNR does not subscribe to Nielsen so how can we tell?

WARF's purpose is as a flanker to WTAM (kind of like what KNR2 1540 was to WKNR) - it's not trying to go head to head with 850 or The Fan.

The biggest tell that 92.3 The Fan was beating WKNR was 850's constant lineup shuffling in the 2010s until they hit pay dirt in PM Drive with Emmitt Golden and Je'Rod Cherry as "The Next Level" in 2018. That stabilized things.

Then there's conservative talk, WTAM vs WHK. But, again, the corporate owners have different goals for the two stations. While some see WDOK VS WQAL VS KISS, in truth they are billed as different formats, AC, Hot AC and CHR.

Q 104's playlist is Clinton to Biden. Star 102's goes back to Reagan, thus some separation between the sisters.
Kiss is basically Obama to Biden, thus it has a more of a recent tilt to it.

 

[TheBigA]

True, but it's not as much fun for the audience.

The audience doesn't care. Just give them what they want for free.

Difference between corporate radio and radio done by old time broadcasters?

Radio stations have been owned by corporations since the 1920s. Westinghouse, RCA, GE, and Crosley. They were the technology companies of their day. Now everything is owned by Apple, Google, and Amazon. Not very different. There's a lot of romance and mythology about the old days, but they all wanted to make the most money. That's what distinguishes the US system from other countries. The dialogue you quote could have easily come from radio people in 1953. The big radio companies at that time knew there was more money to be made in TV. So they raided the radio talent and put them on TV.

 

[TheBigA]

Easy to say when you're the only game in town.

I was just responding to the comment that no one trumpets we're #1. Some people do.

Things change. WGAR just added a syndicated morning show. They opened themselves for some fresh competition.

In Boston, the #1 morning show was Toucher & Rich. iHeart just stole Rich for their classic rock station. They're going after #1.

 

[davideduardo]

Not like the "old days",Top 40 WKYC VS WHK VS WIXY or Rock WMMS VS WWWM VS WGCL. Those were "wars".

I always found the WKYC (or whatever the calls on 1100 were at the time) format to be closer to what we would call "chicken rock" a decade later. They seemed to rotate the more adult songs more, and the harder ones less or not at all.

The most fun was when WHK whacked WERE with "Color Radio Channel 14" against a more traditional rock station (we called Top 40's "rock" back then) that even had, for many years, the Holy Rosary every evening at 6 PM. And, of course, we had Pete "Mad Daddy" Myers on WJW in the evenings, even if the station was block / MOR in the daytime.

 

[davideduardo]

The audience doesn't care. Just give them what they want for free.


Radio stations have been owned by corporations since the 1920s. Westinghouse, RCA, GE, and Crosley.

And insurance companies (WSM), car dealers (KFI), watch-makers (WADO), farm supply providers (KMA), newspapers (WGN), department stores (WLS), universities (WWL) and all kinds of other enterprises. The idea was that owning a station enhanced their brand... it took a while to realize they could sell ads, too.

They were the technology companies of their day. Now everything is owned by Apple, Google, and Amazon. Not very different.

A good point I have not seen made before. But many early stations were owned by non-tech companies, such as those I mentioned. And the idea of a radio maker owning a station was to give people a reason to buy their product.

Best example: XEW in Mexico City, founded by Emilio Azcarraga who began by selling RCA radios on the train from the US to Mexico. He found that passengers headed to the capital city said there was not much to listen to, so he solved that problem by building a superpower AM station. That station gave birth to Televisa, probably the world's largest program producer and distributor today.

There's a lot of romance and mythology about the old days, but they all wanted to make the most money. That's what distinguishes the US system from other countries.

Actually, the US example was followed in nearly every nation in the Western Hemisphere. From Argentina to Canada, radio was principally begun by private individuals or companies and government radio was never dominant nor fully controlling except, to some extent, in a couple of nations controlled or influenced by England such as Canada, Belize, British Guyana, Jamaica and some Lesser Antilles colonies.

The dialogue you quote could have easily come from radio people in 1953. The big radio companies at that time knew there was more money to be made in TV. So they raided the radio talent and put them on TV.

And only to find in the early 50's that radio no longer wanted or needed talents like Arthur Godfrey because Top 40 radio exploded in the very early part of that decade.

 

[davideduardo]

Difference between corporate radio and radio done by old time broadcasters?

I'm sorry, but I'm definitely an "old time broadcaster" and you are wrong.

My first station went on the air in 1964 after 5 years of part-timing and apprenticeship. I knew that my product was listeners, and I had to have lots of them to get money from advertisers who had no interest in anything else I might be doing.

My product had to appeal to many listeners, so I tried to find out what they wanted to hear and gave it to them. Enough liked that to make that station #1 in one ad agency's private "ratings" to make the station profitable so I was able to continue doing the same thing and adding more stations.

There was no difference between what you call "corporate radio" today and what motivated me to make a highly popular station 60 years ago. None.

 

[Santa fe]

Precisely why the quote from that old movie remains relevant. The purpose of any business is to make money, to pay back investors, pay the bills, meet payroll and make a profit. We look upon the old timers as innovators who re-formed radio when TV came on the scene. Creative, inventive risk takers but they saw the potential for cash. Today, radio faces similar challenges and the medium may not remain the same RF supplied real-time product we have known for 100 odd years. Many of us may not like what it is or will become, but there will be the innovators and risk takers who will find a new paradigm and will profit from it.

 

[vjm]

I was just responding to the comment that no one trumpets we're #1. Some people do.

Things change. WGAR just added a syndicated morning show. They opened themselves for some fresh competition.

The thing is that WGAR was trumpeting themselves as the #1 country station in Cleveland, when they are the only country station in town, which is what made the claim funny.

You really think any Cleveland station is gonna go country to take a swing at WGAR?

 

[TheBigA]

The thing is that WGAR was trumpeting themselves as the #1 country station in Cleveland, when they are the only country station in town, which is what made the claim funny.

I know that. Once again, all I was responding to was that no one does it. Someone does.

 

[Rusty Muck]

The thing is that WGAR was trumpeting themselves as the #1 country station in Cleveland, when they are the only country station in town, which is what made the claim funny.

You really think any Cleveland station is gonna go country to take a swing at WGAR?

It reminds me of back in the mid-90s when WMJI trumpted themselves as "Cleveland's #1 and Oldies Station", which was both a good dad joke and not wrong in the slightest...

 

[thenetwork]

I always found the WKYC (or whatever the calls on 1100 were at the time) format to be closer to what we would call "chicken rock" a decade later. They seemed to rotate the more adult songs more, and the harder ones less or not at all.

The same could be said about the music heard on 1220-WGAR in the 70s. It was definitely leaning towards the more lighter "bubblegum" and AC music of Top-40 with a lot of "oldies" in the mix.

And despite playing "safer" music than other top-40 stations, they had some of the more edgy morning talent that occasionally raised eyebrows -- Don Imus, John Lanigan, etc...

I'm just surprised that for a 50,000 watt blowtorch that was heard by thousands in NEOH and the rest of the eastern half of the US in the 70s with such well-known personalities that 1220/WGAR's history and legacy is virtually non-existent in this day and age on the internet, despite being the longest-lasting pop music station, when compared to the top-40 years of other Cleveland AM stations WKYC and WIXY.

 

[skiwest]

I think 1220's early 70s lineup was Don Imus, Joe Mayer, Bob Vernon (with a V), Chuck Collier and Norm N. Nite. Not sure how long the format lasted. I seem to remember someone named Steve Cannon who did an evening talk show on 1220 in the late 70s or early 80s. I don't know if he was local or syndicated.

 

[vjm]

I think 1220's early 70s lineup was Don Imus, Joe Mayer, Bob Vernon (with a V), Chuck Collier and Norm N. Nite. Not sure how long the format lasted. I seem to remember someone named Steve Cannon who did an evening talk show on 1220 in the late 70s or early 80s. I don't know if he was local or syndicated.

Lanigan replaced Imus in 1971 when the latter went to NYC. Collier and Nite were "Big Apple" bound 2 years later. Of course Collier would return to Cleveland in short order, becoming an icon on both WGAR and (the future) WGAR FM 99.5

Cannon was local - he was previously on WHLO 640 in Akron before taking a job in Florida, then coming back north to be on WGAR (he was there like '82-'83ish)

 

[Radioguy_10]

If it's the same Steve Cannon I'm thinking of, He was also on 610 WTVN in Columbus when they played music. He did talk and trivia. He had a contest where he challenged listeners to stump him with a trivia question. I remember when he did a broadcast from the Ohio State Fair. I stumped him with a trivia question and won a T-shirt which read "I stumped the King of Trivia".

 

[vjm]

If it's the same Steve Cannon I'm thinking of, He was also on 610 WTVN in Columbus when they played music. He did talk and trivia. He had a contest where he challenged listeners to stump him with a trivia question. I remember when he did a broadcast from the Ohio State Fair. I stumped him with a trivia question and won a T-shirt which read "I stumped the King of Trivia".

As per his Linkedin page, it is indeed the same Steve Cannon.

 

[Santa fe]

Memory Lane...I was in the military in the early 70's. One hot summer our unit was on field maneuvers deep in the woods near Camp Pickett, Virginia. I had pulled some sort of all night duty, guard, CQ, I don't remember. But I had my Sony pocket AM/FM radio with an earplug and I remember listening without problem to WGAR. I also remember the only other area station that came barreling in like WGAR was WSLR 1350. Both stations had live jocks all night. Didn't get WWWE that night. Still, for a lonely soldier, they were welcome voices from home.
Today, such a person has a cell phone, earbuds, and as long as they have service they can stream any hometown station from anywhere in the world if they wish. The more things change...

 

[davideduardo]

The same could be said about the music heard on 1220-WGAR in the 70s. It was definitely leaning towards the more lighter "bubblegum" and AC music of Top-40 with a lot of "oldies" in the mix.

Lund's WGAR in the earlier and mid-70's was a gold based AC before such stations were called "Adult Contemporary". Competitors at Top 40 stations called it "bubblegum" music but they were scared as it took lots of the over-25 women away.

I was doing the same format, with a higher percentage of currents (Think "Ben" and "The Morning After") than WGAR, as was Bill Tanner in Jackson, MS.

We used Top 40 formatics, and did not play any of the typical MOR songs like Andy Williams and the like. Heck, we even played "Dead Skunk in the Middle of the Road"!

And despite playing "safer" music than other top-40 stations, they had some of the more edgy morning talent that occasionally raised eyebrows -- Don Imus, John Lanigan, etc...

And I had Doug Layton in Birmingham, and he was also the voice of the Crimson Tide which did not hurt in Alabama.

I'm just surprised that for a 50,000 watt blowtorch that was heard by thousands in NEOH and the rest of the eastern half of the US in the 70s with such well-known personalities that 1220/WGAR's history and legacy is virtually non-existent in this day and age on the internet, despite being the longest-lasting pop music station, when compared to the top-40 years of other Cleveland AM stations WKYC and WIXY.

WGAR was (and is under current management) a highly directional station that did not cover the Cleveland Metro Survey Area totally day and night and had little or no listening outside the Cleveland / Akron area. It had horrendous protection requirements towards Mexico where 100,000 watt XEB would boom in to Ohio when WGAR would be off on Sunday night/Monday morning.

 

[radiofollower]

Lund's WGAR in the earlier and mid-70's was a gold based AC before such stations were called "Adult Contemporary". Competitors at Top 40 stations called it "bubblegum" music but they were scared as it took lots of the over-25 women away.

I was doing the same format, with a higher percentage of currents (Think "Ben" and "The Morning After") than WGAR, as was Bill Tanner in Jackson, MS.

We used Top 40 formatics, and did not play any of the typical MOR songs like Andy Williams and the like. Heck, we even played "Dead Skunk in the Middle of the Road"!

And I had Doug Layton in Birmingham, and he was also the voice of the Crimson Tide which did not hurt in Alabama.

WGAR was (and is under current management) a highly directional station that did not cover the Cleveland Metro Survey Area totally day and night and had little or no listening outside the Cleveland / Akron area. It had horrendous protection requirements towards Mexico where 100,000 watt XEB would boom in to Ohio when WGAR would be off on Sunday night/Monday morning.

True. But since both WGAR and WSLR had generally "north/south" patterns, that explains them being heard at Camp Pickett in Virginia at night.

 

[Rusty Muck]

WGAR was (and is under current management) a highly directional station that did not cover the Cleveland Metro Survey Area totally day and night and had little or no listening outside the Cleveland / Akron area. It had horrendous protection requirements towards Mexico where 100,000 watt XEB would boom in to Ohio when WGAR would be off on Sunday night/Monday morning.

In a way, George Richards was lucky to get WGAR to that power level and frequency the way he did, especially with his ownership of WJR. That it was on XEB's frequency but far away enough likely made it passable for the FCC.

When 1220 was WKNR (when I remember listening to the station), the nighttime range was bad in the suburbs with frequent interference from 1210 in Philadelphia. It's likely gotten worse today as a senior care facility was built next to the towers at Akins and Broadview, let alone further degradation of the towers and whatever radials still exist.

 

[Yabadabado1]

The same could be said about the music heard on 1220-WGAR in the 70s. It was definitely leaning towards the more lighter "bubblegum" and AC music of Top-40 with a lot of "oldies" in the mix.

And despite playing "safer" music than other top-40 stations, they had some of the more edgy morning talent that occasionally raised eyebrows -- Don Imus, John Lanigan, etc...

I'm just surprised that for a 50,000 watt blowtorch that was heard by thousands in NEOH and the rest of the eastern half of the US in the 70s with such well-known personalities that 1220/WGAR's history and legacy is virtually non-existent in this day and age on the internet, despite being the longest-lasting pop music station, when compared to the top-40 years of other Cleveland AM stations WKYC and WIXY.

It's virtually non-existent nowadays because I would say many of their former listeners may be pushing up daises. Same reason you don't hear people spouting off about "Those 1929 Cord autos were the bomb!" anymore-except for car groupies-because the ORIGINAL drivers/owners of those vehicles back then are long gone. There are plenty of air checks on Youtube and a few on Ellis Feaster's radio aircheck channel of WGAR. "Vernon with a V" had a website with a lot of his old bits on it but it disappeared from the internets about a year before he died. I assume he was too sick to keep it going. While most people my age were listening to WMMS or WGCL, I was one of the "nerds" who was listening to 1220 WGAR [and WHLO] and ended up writing some jokes for Lanigan beginning my senior year of high school until I went into radio myself.