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66 WNBC/97.1 FM

I'm not sure about that. In 1973 and 1974 WNBC was airing an automated rock format called The Rock Pile
Yes, true. Imus's show was simulcast 6-9 until the "Music For Lovers" format began, then I guess his shock jock persona and the edginess of his humor were considered incompatible with the revised image on the FM. Not that it mattered, NIS was already on the drawing board for a mid-1975 launch. I think it launched a little early on WNWS to allow for some live shakedown before the other subscribing stations went live with it. It was a very professionally-sounding operation, just too expensive to wait out enough markets joining as paying subscribers, and enough audience finding it for the whole shebang to hit profitability.
There was some selective simulcasting that was done during that time. Rambling With Gambling was simulcast for a time on WOR-FM. WNEW simulcast it's AM top of the hour newscasts on the FM. It happened from time to time.
Gambling's show was initially simulcast on WOR-FM in 1966. That went away around the end of that year, when they split-shifted Scott Muni and Johnny Michaels to allow for 20 hours a day of live programming. (IIRC, they continued overnight simulcasting from 2 am when Rosko's program ended, until 6 am when Michaels started his first shift. Eventually they hired a morning man, Dick Burch, and everyone went to single four-hour shifts, but by then RKO corporate and Bill Drake had other plans for the station.)

WNEW's TOH newscast did air in drive times, and certain other TOH's, on the FM for quite a while. It was the Vietnam War era, and many of the college-aged listeners appreciated being kept informed from a very highly regarded news operation. They also had one hourly each evening (7 pm?) which featured a commentary by Edward Brown, which also fit the FM format just ahead of Rosko's, and later Jonathan Schwartz's show. It was a newscast that worked for both operations. (Unlike at OR-FM, where either newscast would have sounded out of place on the other station.)
 
It would appear, given the New York Times article being dated December 18, 1974, that the "Love of New York" automated format that was successor to the "Rockpile" format was the last music format before NIS was launched six months later.

Per an article in Radio & Records' December 17, 1976 issue, the WYNY format was to begin January 1 as NIS was "phased out" (it shut down at the end of May 1977). The article said they would be running Bonneville's "Soft Rock" so apparently they still had the WNBC-FM automation.
That's correct. If you read some of what Herb Barry has written on the other board, he and the other on-air staff had to work within a very inflexible operating environment, and nobody could touch any equipment unless they wanted the union to jump down their throats. Over time that situation improved, the music evolved into something more interesting, and the station began to develop some buzz. (Not to be confused with hum.) But it took a couple of years, and until then it was largely a waste of electricity. (And Con Ed's electricity has never been cheap!)
 
I know. I was just trying to keep it brief. That's why I called him John III and didn't go into his return when he unretired. The fact that one of three men with the same first and last names held down morning drive for 88 years strikes me as more than a little interesting!
It's still important to get names right. 🙂
 
So perhaps the music came from Bonneville with live assist.

I was thinking the same thing, A. It would have made perfect sense since the playback equipment was already in place.
 
I was thinking the same thing, A. It would have made perfect sense since the playback equipment was already in place.

Racks of reel to reel machines, all run by union technicians.

That's correct. If you read some of what Herb Barry has written on the other board, he and the other on-air staff had to work within a very inflexible operating environment, and nobody could touch any equipment unless they wanted the union to jump down their throats.

WNBC/WYNY studios were located in 30 Rock. Perhaps on the 2nd floor? Working at a network O&O wasn't much different from working at the network. Same kind of union rules about who could do what.

When the radio stations were sold in 1988, WNBC became WFAN and moved out to Kaufman Astoria studios, and WYNY moved a few blocks away to 1700 Broadway.
 
Not that it mattered, NIS was already on the drawing board for a mid-1975 launch. I think it launched a little early on WNWS to allow for some live shakedown before the other subscribing stations went live with it. It was a very professionally-sounding operation, just too expensive to wait out enough markets joining as paying subscribers, and enough audience finding it for the whole shebang to hit profitability.

Having been brought in as PD of an NIS affiliate to transition it to an AC format, I was in a good position to do a post mortem of sorts. Here's my take:

NIS indeed sounded great on the air, especially if the local affiliate executed all the "gates" for call letters and transitions to/from local segments. The station I was at had kept their ABC/I affiliation, which nicely covered the top-of-the-hour window that the main NBC network was using for its newscasts, and the ABC features that were available (Lou Boda's sportscasts still come to mind) helped fill the window at the half-hour.

But NBC blew it from the very start in terms of making the network viable. The only O&O where it worked, ratings and revenue wise, was WRC. There, they correctly saw that FM was going to be huge for music formats and they moved the top-40 format of AM 980 to FM 93.9 as WKYS. Yet, they did not realize that all-news was years away from being viable on FM ... yet they put NIS there in New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. I remember vacationing in the Bay Area for a couple of weeks during the KNAI years and they ran upbeat promos on KNBR that started "now there's a news station on FM!" To which the audience apparently asked "why?" and didn't tune in.

I think the contemporary MOR format would have done quite well on 99.7, if they had just done what they did in D.C. by just transferring everything, on-air talent included, over to FM.* And 680's signal would have been perfect to put a dent in KCBS' numbers. I also am inclined to think that WNBC's format would have done well migrated to FM (and would have still brought a welcome end to that "Love New York" format), and again, the 660 signal would have done serious damage to both WCBS and WINS if it had been running NIS. Ditto WMAQ, which did end up all-news anyway under Group W. (And WMAQ-FM was already doing an automated Country format to complement the one on 670, so how easy would that transition have been?)

* - Come to think of it, I think KNBR-FM was already running a similar format, automated, at that time.


NBC, pure and simple, didn't want to "sacrifice" most of their AMs ... or at least, that's the way the industry saw it. I can well imagine a lot of station owners saying "why should I take a risk on this if NBC is being half-assed in three of their O&O markets?" It didn't help that in other major markets where NBC did not own stations, the NBC affiliate turned them down. Imagine KFI taking on KNX and KFWB with their 50kW clear-channel signal using NIS ... but Earle C. Anthony turned them down flat. In those cases, NBC should have waived the NIS affiliation fee and paid the stations outright. Then pure barter outside the top-20 or -25 markets.

Instead, they were, to use a single word to describe it, stubborn. "We can make this work on FM in our O&O markets." "We don't need to pay anyone to run NIS, even if they are in the largest market where we don't own a station." So they ended up with a mere handful of medium-market affiliates, and a whole bunch of small-market affiliates. Not a recipe for success.

NIS would, I believe, have been a tremendous success for NBC if they hadn't stumbled out of the gate. I have not taken any time to speculate as to what would have happened to it as NBC divested its radio assets in later years. Maybe it would have become part of Mutual under Westwood One and strengthened that brand in the process. Who knows?
 
Racks of reel to reel machines, all run by union technicians.

Or perhaps, to satisfy Bonneville's format execution requirements, the old WNBC-FM automation overseen by a union engineer 24/7. Either way, you're correct that NABET wouldn't have signed off on it running without them at that point in time.
 
Having been brought in as PD of an NIS affiliate to transition it to an AC format, I was in a good position to do a post mortem of sorts. Here's my take:

NIS indeed sounded great on the air, especially if the local affiliate executed all the "gates" for call letters and transitions to/from local segments. The station I was at had kept their ABC/I affiliation, which nicely covered the top-of-the-hour window that the main NBC network was using for its newscasts, and the ABC features that were available (Lou Boda's sportscasts still come to mind) helped fill the window at the half-hour.

But NBC blew it from the very start in terms of making the network viable. The only O&O where it worked, ratings and revenue wise, was WRC. There, they correctly saw that FM was going to be huge for music formats and they moved the top-40 format of AM 980 to FM 93.9 as WKYS. Yet, they did not realize that all-news was years away from being viable on FM ... yet they put NIS there in New York, Chicago, and San Francisco. I remember vacationing in the Bay Area for a couple of weeks during the KNAI years and they ran upbeat promos on KNBR that started "now there's a news station on FM!" To which the audience apparently asked "why?" and didn't tune in.

I think the contemporary MOR format would have done quite well on 99.7, if they had just done what they did in D.C. by just transferring everything, on-air talent included, over to FM.* And 680's signal would have been perfect to put a dent in KCBS' numbers. I also am inclined to think that WNBC's format would have done well migrated to FM (and would have still brought a welcome end to that "Love New York" format), and again, the 660 signal would have done serious damage to both WCBS and WINS if it had been running NIS. Ditto WMAQ, which did end up all-news anyway under Group W. (And WMAQ-FM was already doing an automated Country format to complement the one on 670, so how easy would that transition have been?)

* - Come to think of it, I think KNBR-FM was already running a similar format, automated, at that time.

NBC, pure and simple, didn't want to "sacrifice" most of their AMs ... or at least, that's the way the industry saw it. I can well imagine a lot of station owners saying "why should I take a risk on this if NBC is being half-assed in three of their O&O markets?" It didn't help that in other major markets where NBC did not own stations, the NBC affiliate turned them down. Imagine KFI taking on KNX and KFWB with their 50kW clear-channel signal using NIS ... but Earle C. Anthony turned them down flat. In those cases, NBC should have waived the NIS affiliation fee and paid the stations outright. Then pure barter outside the top-20 or -25 markets.

Instead, they were, to use a single word to describe it, stubborn. "We can make this work on FM in our O&O markets." "We don't need to pay anyone to run NIS, even if they are in the largest market where we don't own a station." So they ended up with a mere handful of medium-market affiliates, and a whole bunch of small-market affiliates. Not a recipe for success.

NIS would, I believe, have been a tremendous success for NBC if they hadn't stumbled out of the gate. I have not taken any time to speculate as to what would have happened to it as NBC divested its radio assets in later years. Maybe it would have become part of Mutual under Westwood One and strengthened that brand in the process. Who knows?
Very good analysis, my friend. I think one of NBC's core problems was that "General" David Sarnoff was still alive until 1971, and his son Robert was running the company (into the ground) until 1975 when the board finally gave him his walking papers. The elder Sarnoff always seemed to resent and starve NBC's FM stations while treasuring and protecting their legacy, mostly blowtorch AMs. Robert either internalized the old man's thinking, or didn't feel he could challenge his dad, even posthumously. It wasn't until both Sarnoffs had left 30 Rock that NBC's FMs were finally allowed enough resources to breathe.

I will say that the NIS sounder package was top-notch, and with a little audio editing, makes for some great cellphone ringtones.
 
Herb Barry has discussed WYNY's convoluted setup at length on the NYRMB. He was there.

A link would be nice. A search on WYNY turns up a long list, none of which are intuitively about the station by their titles, and a search on Herb Barry turns up an even longer list which does not parse well.
 
Herb Barry has discussed WYNY's convoluted setup at length on the NYRMB. He was there.
Yessir, as I wrote above in #22:
That's correct. If you read some of what Herb Barry has written on the other board, he and the other on-air staff had to work within a very inflexible operating environment, and nobody could touch any equipment unless they wanted the union to jump down their throats. [...]
 
A link would be nice. A search on WYNY turns up a long list, none of which are intuitively about the station by their titles, and a search on Herb Barry turns up an even longer list which does not parse well.
Pick five of his posts at random, the probability is high that one of them will mention his days at WYNY. 🤣 🤣 🤣
 
Because Sarnoff was still battling the Armstrong estate over the FM patent. He knew how to hold a grudge.

No kidding. First he got the FCC to move the FM band just as it was starting to catch on (although I read somewhere that he outsmarted himself because FM worked better on the higher band). He did everything he could to prevent TV audio from being FM.

He even pushed Major Armstrong from that ledge, emotionally speaking. But that was 1954, a full two decades before NIS, and in those intervening years I wonder how much money RCA made selling FM transmitters.

David replaced his father four years before NIS began operation, and therefore was in a position to weigh in the decisions about same. If he had taken a "clean slate" approach and thought like a businessman instead of "the General's son" he might have seen the advantages of promoting the move of music formats to FM (both O&O's and potential affiliates) and affiliating the AMs with NIS. Yet, he obviously did not, nor did he last even until NIS' first anniversary.

Holding a grudge should have no place in business. Doing so too often results in bad decisions that end up hurting the bottom line.
 
For maybe a week--don't know what year, may have been between Christmas and New Year's--WNBC stunted with an "all-request" format. Some joker called in for The Star-Spangled Banner during Imus's show. Naturally he played it, then said that he hoped the engineers at "City Island and the Empire State Building" hadn't taken it as a cue to sign off. So he knew that he was on both AM and FM.
 
So he knew that he was on both AM and FM.

If you listen to that aircheck linked above, you will note that not only was he aware, he said "WNBC AM and FM" every time he gave the call letters. There's even one spot in there where he identified both frequencies.
 
If you listen to that aircheck linked above, you will note that not only was he aware, he said "WNBC AM and FM" every time he gave the call letters. There's even one spot in there where he identified both frequencies.
Before Imus was a political talk show host, before he was even a shock jock, he was a sharp and talented top 40 jock.

The reason for the "quack quack" in every time check was because he found some of the NABET board ops weren't paying attention to his cues. They'd be sitting at the board reading the Daily News (or whatever). He instructed them to fire off the quack whenever he did a time check to keep them on their toes, and the story was that he was not above throwing something (a cart?) at the ones who weren't.
 
The reason for the "quack quack" in every time check was because he found some of the NABET board ops weren't paying attention to his cues. They'd be sitting at the board reading the Daily News (or whatever). He instructed them to fire off the quack whenever he did a time check to keep them on their toes, and the story was that he was not above throwing something (a cart?) at the ones who weren't.

Not to mention that it was a good jab at the old "time tones" that had been prevalent in earlier days.
 


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