Big 98.1

[davideduardo]

In LA and Dallas Audacy owns both classic and variety hits stations (KRTH and KCBS).

The way to handle it is by adjusting percentages. There are enough songs that you can do that.

People here are freaking out when they hear songs that might not fit. But they're taking those songs out of context from the rest of the format.

What you are getting at is that people listen to different stations because they are different... but within the range of music tastes of each listener.

The PPM revealed that listeners often had two or three favorite stations, and the use of each varied by the day, the week and over time. Not a lot of non-proprietary research has been done in this area but I can say that choices vary by things like mood, intensity of work performance, social environment and the time of the day.

Generally, listeners that have a variety of stations they use "a lot" pick different formats. In some markets, you might see a classic hits, an AC and a country station sharing top preferences. Or a CHR, Hot AC and AC station. There are some who flip between identical formats in markets where there is such a thing, but that is not the main reason for different choices.

My first experience with overlapping playlists was 62 years ago during my internship in Mexico City. Two of the stations played what we'd call Top 40. One played all Spanish songs, the other played about half and half Spanish and English Top 40 hits; the all-Spanish language music station played a slightly different blend of those songs. The operator of those stations did do research and found that the listeners to one did not like the other; there was no sharing or splitting of audience at all. And both were very highly rated. The all-English song station did better in upper income listeners, and the all Spanish music one was stronger in middle to upper-low income listeners.

 

[davideduardo]

The maps don't tell the whole story for 94.7. Even after the move to the 710 site, the real-world WXBK signal significantly underperforms the paper contours within NYC limits.

It's a combination of front-end overload from all the FMs on Empire, numerous pirates on adjacent channels in Brooklyn, and an antenna in NJ that's several hundred feet lower down than much of the Manhattan skyline that the signal has to penetrate.

Where my daughter lives in Brooklyn, you need a very good radio to get WXBK clearly indoors. And it's not like she can listen in the car, since like most city residents, she doesn't (need or want to) drive.

I can imagine on-channel boosters being useful in this situation, even if they're set up as HD-only.

Never underestimate the effect of a "wall of girders and rebar" to block signals.

In some cases, if you move nearer to that wall of buildings, you get even greater blockage due to the simple math of angles.

I vehemently opposed the purchase of a suburban NYC Class A for an absurd amount of money because no consideration was given to the blockage of the signal in the HDHAs by seemingly millions of apartment buildings and high-rises.

When we decided to move the KRCV site "off the mountain" to the center of the San Gabriel Valley on a smallish hill we eliminated the distant signal building blockage and put an "umbrella" signal over the zone we wanted. The ratings, with the same format, almost tripled. But on a map, it seemed like we had lost coverage.

 

[Seltzer]

So thought it would be interesting to see how CBS FM is handling this "evolution"
They seem to have a better handle of it'
#1 Newest song in regular rotation is 2004. So they are staying in that 20-25 year thinking of a song shouldn't be considered for Classic Hits until its actually "aged"
They play the Backstreet Boys NSYNC and Britney from the 90s. Possibly OGL avoids them because of B 101. Very deep in the 90s which we can all agree is where the format needs to have more of a presence in. But all genres and sounds from the decade are well represented. Obviously because 106.7 is owned by a different company, they can breathe a little more.
CBS FM has always been a trailblazer in this format.

 

[TheBigA]

So thought it would be interesting to see how CBS FM is handling this "evolution"
They seem to have a better handle of it'

I have lived and worked in New York and Philadelphia, and I'm here to tell you they are very different cities, culturally, ethnically, demographically, and many other ways. I love both of them for their differences. The fact that WCBS and WOGL are handling this differently is no surprise to me. They're programmed by different people. WOGL was closer in sound to WCBS at one time, but that led to an aging of the demographic. That's why they've made this recent shift.

BTW WOGL plays I Want It This Way by Backstreet Boys ten times a week.

 

[Miguelito]

So thought it would be interesting to see how CBS FM is handling this "evolution"
They seem to have a better handle of it'
#1 Newest song in regular rotation is 2004. So they are staying in that 20-25 year thinking of a song shouldn't be considered for Classic Hits until its actually "aged"
They play the Backstreet Boys NSYNC and Britney from the 90s. Possibly OGL avoids them because of B 101. Very deep in the 90s which we can all agree is where the format needs to have more of a presence in. But all genres and sounds from the decade are well represented. Obviously because 106.7 is owned by a different company, they can breathe a little more.
CBS FM has always been a trailblazer in this format.

This is getting really tedious. You're saying the same thing over and over again. We get it. You don't like what Big 98.1 is doing. Make yourself a playlist and get over it! At the very least, stop using phrases like "which we can all agree," because most of people in the void you're screaming into do not agree with you.

 

[davideduardo]

At the very least, stop using phrases like "which we can all agree," because most of people in the void you're screaming into do not agree with you.

Absolutely! 🏆 for this post.

And all of us, when we comment as listeners, have to recognize that stations deeply research the songs they play to determine "fit", rotation and preferences by age and gender among the station's most heavy listeners.

And, as I have said before, there is no harm in having stations owned by the same group having overlapping "shared" songs. It's the song "the other station" does not play that defines each format.

 

[K.M. Richards]

At the very least, stop using phrases like "which we can all agree," because most of people in the void you're screaming into do not agree with you.

I know that I certainly don't.

 

[Seltzer]

I have lived and worked in New York and Philadelphia, and I'm here to tell you they are very different cities, culturally, ethnically, demographically, and many other ways. I love both of them for their differences. The fact that WCBS and WOGL are handling this differently is no surprise to me. They're programmed by different people. WOGL was closer in sound to WCBS at one time, but that led to an aging of the demographic. That's why they've made this recent shift.

BTW WOGL plays I Want It This Way by Backstreet Boys ten times a week.

I stand corrected on one Backstreet Boys song. It's one song but it is from the 90s so it certainly is in the right age for the format. I guess it comes down to what the demo of a Classic Hits station is supposed to be. 25- 54 adults with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female split. These post 2004 songs isn't helping things and certainly the station leans more female now. Which makes no sense when you have B 101 and TDY as clustermates. I guess we'll see when the ratings come out. That will be the ultimate judge. And funny...in terms of an aging demo....that that wouldn't be a concern for CBS FM then but it would be for OGL.

 

[Seltzer]

This is getting really tedious. You're saying the same thing over and over again. We get it. You don't like what Big 98.1 is doing. Make yourself a playlist and get over it! At the very least, stop using phrases like "which we can all agree," because most of people in the void you're screaming into do not agree with you.

It has nothing to do with what I personally like or don't like. It comes down to the target demo of your format. Classic Hits is 25-54 with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female. Hot AC like TDY is Adults 25 to 54 with a core of women 18 to 49. And AC like B 101 is 25-54 adults with a core of women 30 to 45. OGL is clearly leaning more female now which makes no sense when you already are targeting women with two cluster mates. You need that 50 50 Male to female split, You don't agree that the 90s should be a big part of a Classic Hits station in 2025? By doing the math and figuring out when these people were in high school you are clearly wrong.

 

[Seltzer]

I know that I certainly don't.

Don't agree that the 90s are a big part of Classic Hits in 2025? And songs by Adele and Gotye are? I'm pretty sure my statement is pretty accurate.

 

[davideduardo]

Don't agree that the 90s are a big part of Classic Hits in 2025? And songs by Adele and Gotye are? I'm pretty sure my statement is pretty accurate.

If the songs you refer to don't test against the core, then they have no place on the station.

 

[TheBigA]

I guess it comes down to what the demo of a Classic Hits station is supposed to be. 25- 54 adults with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female split.

And as I said earlier, this station hasn't been Top 5 25-54 all year. The core has been 45-64, which is terrible. That's why they're adding newer songs.

Look at the bigger picture: This station is still 65% 80s. They still play songs from the 1970s. That's why their core is so old.

Meanwhile, WMGK is mainly 70s and 80s with a handful of 60s and 90s and they're #2 in 25-54.

 

[Miguelito]

It has nothing to do with what I personally like or don't like. It comes down to the target demo of your format. Classic Hits is 25-54 with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female. Hot AC like TDY is Adults 25 to 54 with a core of women 18 to 49. And AC like B 101 is 25-54 adults with a core of women 30 to 45. OGL is clearly leaning more female now which makes no sense when you already are targeting women with two cluster mates. You need that 50 50 Male to female split, You don't agree that the 90s should be a big part of a Classic Hits station in 2025? By doing the math and figuring out when these people were in high school you are clearly wrong.

Here, again, you are saying the same things. Almost word-for-word, you repeated the 25- 54 adults with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female split "rule" from your previous posts. There are no rules anymore. In the modern-day audio media landscape, if a company programs any station based on these outdated rules--especially when they own other stations in the market--they will go down in flames.

You keep saying that what they're doing "makes no sense." Clearly, it makes no sense to you. But we're talking about a behemoth broadcast company with a group of talented programming and management professionals basing their decisions on volumes of research, while navigating conditions in this particular market and how to best impact each of the stations in their cluster. Do you really think you know better?

Maybe Audacy has decided to aim for a "wall of females" since Beasley has pretty much locked up the "wall of men" with their cluster. Maybe not. We can't know why they're making the decisions they're making because we don't work there. We just participate in an online radio forum.

You have mentioned songs you think they shouldn't be playing. They've decided to play them. If you don't like it, listen to something you do like. The drum has been beaten. The wheels have been spun. The barrel is empty. The horse is dead. (These are examples of saying the same thing over and over again.)

 

[Miguelito]

Another thing--and forgive me if this has already been mentioned elsewhere in these nine pages of commentary--is that programmers may be having a hard time finding consensus with early- to mid-nineties music. Eighties music is easy, and late-nineties to early-aughts saw things start to gel again. Some Classic Hits stations might practically skip that era when things got super fragmented (when CHR couldn't decide whether to play Nirvana, even though they were one of the biggest acts releasing music at the time). Over the next five years, Classic Hits' core libraries might just skip from eighties directly to late-nineties/early-aughts.

 

[kevtronics]

"1980s-sounding" music actually lasted until 1992. That was the last gasp of New Wave and hair metal. A lot of careers ended when Nirvana came in and suddenly redefined what rock music sounded like.

 

[TheBigA]

Currently the most successful Audacy classic hits station is KRTH. They're #1 in 25-54.

 

[K.M. Richards]

Don't agree that the 90s are a big part of Classic Hits in 2025? And songs by Adele and Gotye are? I'm pretty sure my statement is pretty accurate.

Go back to my post and note what part of Miguelito's quote I used. I am not going to agree with you so long as you fall back on that tired phrase "we can all agree that ..."

That said, I happen to be one of those programmers who (obviously) believes Classic Hits is going to be very 80's-centric for a while yet. For a variety of reasons, that decade's music also attracts listeners who weren't even alive when those songs were currents.

When 90's music went off in multiple directions, CHR fragmented into subformats, and Classic Hits pretty much has to decide which "flavor" of CHR to include for that decade ... if you try to be inclusive every segue has a potential for "button-pushing" by some segment of the audience.

In fact, Albuquerque's other Classic Hits station is wobbling all over the place with their choice of 90's titles, diluting the 80's in the process (I have Powers that they don't play at all, and I wonder sometimes what -- if anything -- they are using for research) and then throwing in at least one 70's title per hour. I believe I am getting most of the audience that wants more consistency, and apparently it works for our advertising clients.

 

[Delete My Account]

You keep saying that what they're doing "makes no sense." Clearly, it makes no sense to you. But we're talking about a behemoth broadcast company with a group of talented programming and management professionals basing their decisions on volumes of research, while navigating conditions in this particular market and how to best impact each of the stations in their cluster. Do you really think you know better?

Being a large or even broadly successful company doesn't mean every decision made was wise or correct, especially in the case of Audacy.

And I wouldn't necessarily say the 90s, though"consensus" is definitely an issue, is any less fragmented than the 2000s, as a matter of fact, as technology accelerated and people delved into their own niches, pop radio being even less relevant to some, what's there in the 2000s that has that consensus? Taylor Swift, Adele, Coldplay? Dig much further and there's even less universally appealing pop music. The 70s had superstar bands like Fleetwood Mac. The 80s had great, uptempo pop music and big stars. Streaming era classic hits becomes a different game entirely.

 

[Seltzer]

Here, again, you are saying the same things. Almost word-for-word, you repeated the 25- 54 adults with a core of 35-54. 50 50 Male to female split "rule" from your previous posts. There are no rules anymore. In the modern-day audio media landscape, if a company programs any station based on these outdated rules--especially when they own other stations in the market--they will go down in flames.

You keep saying that what they're doing "makes no sense." Clearly, it makes no sense to you. But we're talking about a behemoth broadcast company with a group of talented programming and management professionals basing their decisions on volumes of research, while navigating conditions in this particular market and how to best impact each of the stations in their cluster. Do you really think you know better?

Maybe Audacy has decided to aim for a "wall of females" since Beasley has pretty much locked up the "wall of men" with their cluster. Maybe not. We can't know why they're making the decisions they're making because we don't work there. We just participate in an online radio forum.

You have mentioned songs you think they shouldn't be playing. They've decided to play them. If you don't like it, listen to something you do like. The drum has been beaten. The wheels have been spun. The barrel is empty. The horse is dead. (These are examples of saying the same thing over and over again.)

Of course there are still rules. And I'd love to see the research that went into some of these decisions. Considering Audacy's financial situation, I doubt any research at all is being done. And this is the case of throwing something up against the wall and hoping it'll stick. But again ratings will be the final judge. I think CBS FM will continue to thrive in NYC...not so sure about OGL. Formats were designed to attract certain demographics. Maybe this is the beginning of OGL moving from a Classic Hits format to Classic Rhythm. Watch Ben FM and see if they take advantage of this situation.

 

[Seltzer]

Another thing--and forgive me if this has already been mentioned elsewhere in these nine pages of commentary--is that programmers may be having a hard time finding consensus with early- to mid-nineties music. Eighties music is easy, and late-nineties to early-aughts saw things start to gel again. Some Classic Hits stations might practically skip that era when things got super fragmented (when CHR couldn't decide whether to play Nirvana, even though they were one of the biggest acts releasing music at the time). Over the next five years, Classic Hits' core libraries might just skip from eighties directly to late-nineties/early-aughts.

That could very well be true.