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Omnia.9 Bass help

D

djnoah225

Hello y’all,
I am using Omnia.9 ptn, and I need some tips/advice on how to get heavier bass without sounding bad. I also want to be loud but not fatiguing. I’m programming it for my web-only station which has an Urban format. (Hip Hop, Throwbacks, and R&B). Any advice/help will be greatly appreciated!
 
djnoah225 said:
Hello y’all,
I am using Omnia.9 ptn, and I need some tips/advice on how to get heavier bass without sounding bad. I also want to be loud but not fatiguing. I’m programming it for my web-only station which has an Urban format. (Hip Hop, Throwbacks, and R&B). Any advice/help will be greatly appreciated!
Click to expand...
I was talking to Greg Ogonowski a coupla' days ago and we got into a discussion of recording studios that used a pair of 3" speakers to listen to a near-final mix so they would know how it would sound "on the radio" or on a consumer's kitchen or clock radio.

Today, ones like these do the job: Mixcube Active | Avantone Pro

My trainer carries her iPhone with her and listens to a yacht rock stream on the built in speaker.

Think about that when you want to boost bass... sounds great on a batch of huge speakers in a club, but just make the dashboard vibrate in a car.

The only reason to seek "loud" in a stream is to avoid big ranges of soft-to-loud where the soft parts let background noise (such as in the car or at work or putzing around in the garage) overcome the music.
 
davideduardo said:
I was talking to Greg Ogonowski a coupla' days ago and we got into a discussion of recording studios that used a pair of 3" speakers to listen to a near-final mix so they would know how it would sound "on the radio" or on a consumer's kitchen or clock radio.

Today, ones like these do the job: Mixcube Active | Avantone Pro

My trainer carries her iPhone with her and listens to a yacht rock stream on the built in speaker.

Think about that when you want to boost bass... sounds great on a batch of huge speakers in a club, but just make the dashboard vibrate in a car.

The only reason to seek "loud" in a stream is to avoid big ranges of soft-to-loud where the soft parts let background noise (such as in the car or at work or putzing around in the garage) overcome the music.
Click to expand...
You make a good point. I don’t aim for bass that overtakes the entire stream, but I definitely want it to be audible and enhanced (e.g. bass clipping/Bass-EFX/etc). Right now I’m using one of the “open” presets with some tweaks. It sounds great on my Bluetooth speaker, wired earphones, and my “fake Airpods.” It sounds good in my car (no subs, 4 speakers). I still need to test it in my truck (premium audio system/factory sub) but I’m mostly satisfied with the result. If you want to hear it, the website is djnoahfm.caster.fm . I don’t broadcast 24/7, but I’ll have the schedule posted on there soon. Also I will only be broadcasting on there until I return to student radio in the fall
 
That's a common myth of Hip-Hop fans that nearly everybody falls for because It's All About That Bass, y'know?

But this is the hard, agonizing truth; Bass On Top of Bass is Baseless.

You see, the bass is already as deep as it will ever get in a Hip-Hop studio recording itself. That's a fact.

The true factor is the end listener. What they're listening on. Do they have audio controls? You should leave enough room in your audio processing scheme for them to play with whatever they have. As the middle guy, your audio processing role is much more limited.

Even though you're a webcaster and since phones and computers typically don't have readily accessible user tone/bass/treble/EQ controls the way stand-alone terrestrial radios did, I actually completely understand why you would feel a need to boost the bass for the listeners to compensate where they directly can't. But they are capable of finding their own EQ app/software solutions (perhaps you can test and maybe recommend the best sounding ones across the platforms and link to them.) The best you can really do honestly is play the music. (Yet keep the zeitgeist; There's always different ways of channeling that excess energy...)

The trouble with enhancing bass (even slightly) on a recording already with enhanced bass, even on professional audio processing equipment, is it can do terrible things. Like muddy up the rest of the audio spectrum up through the midrange and the high end in fatigue-inducing ways. (The early death of some terrestrial Rhythmic CHRs.) And this can happen with even small artificial bass boosts on many Hip-Hop recordings.

BUT, that doesn't mean nothing else can be done about it. A very good way to get improved bass in your stream without having to resort to artificial gimmickery is to make sure all your throwback jams are the very latest remasters. Also, I don't know your bitrate (you're offline as I write.) But make it as high as possible (320kb for Caster). Bass sounds depend on that in a web stream.

Also, you can try vinyl for Hip-Hop digitizing. Bass frequencies really shine through digital transfers from this medium. Way better than any direct digital form.

Beyond that, maybe widening the stereo imaging/separation a tad might help a little (many listen to Hip-Hop on headphones.)
 
Bongwater said:
That's a common myth of Hip-Hop fans that nearly everybody falls for because It's All About That Bass, y'know?

But this is the hard, agonizing truth; Bass On Top of Bass is Baseless.

You see, the bass is already as deep as it will ever get in a Hip-Hop studio recording itself. That's a fact.

The true factor is the end listener. What they're listening on. Do they have audio controls? You should leave enough room in your audio processing scheme for them to play with whatever they have. As the middle guy, your audio processing role is much more limited.

Even though you're a webcaster and since phones and computers typically don't have readily accessible user tone/bass/treble/EQ controls the way stand-alone terrestrial radios did, I actually completely understand why you would feel a need to boost the bass for the listeners to compensate where they directly can't. But they are capable of finding their own EQ app/software solutions (perhaps you can test and maybe recommend the best sounding ones across the platforms and link to them.) The best you can really do honestly is play the music. (Yet keep the zeitgeist; There's always different ways of channeling that excess energy...)

The trouble with enhancing bass (even slightly) on a recording already with enhanced bass, even on professional audio processing equipment, is it can do terrible things. Like muddy up the rest of the audio spectrum up through the midrange and the high end in fatigue-inducing ways. (The early death of some terrestrial Rhythmic CHRs.) And this can happen with even small artificial bass boosts on many Hip-Hop recordings.

BUT, that doesn't mean nothing else can be done about it. A very good way to get improved bass in your stream without having to resort to artificial gimmickery is to make sure all your throwback jams are the very latest remasters. Also, I don't know your bitrate (you're offline as I write.) But make it as high as possible (320kb for Caster). Bass sounds depend on that in a web stream.

Also, you can try vinyl for Hip-Hop digitizing. Bass frequencies really shine through digital transfers from this medium. Way better than any direct digital form.

Beyond that, maybe widening the stereo imaging/separation a tad might help a little (many listen to Hip-Hop on headphones.)
Click to expand...
Thanks for replying! My stream can only go up to 128kbps because I have the free plan (as I previously stated, I am returning to student radio in the fall). As for my format, I mainly focus on the Hip Hop and R&B that’s on the charts, but I also include some throwbacks from 90’s-2000’s-2010’s to attempt keep the older people from tuning away, and I usually use higher quality mp3’s from DJ pools but I also have a few recordings from CD’s and a couple from vinyl. On a couple occasions I had to use YouTube to Mp3 to get some clean versions. I keep my station 100% clean (even though some of today’s Hip Hop songs do get a little edgy sometimes).

As for the processing, I use Omnia.9ptn. (You’ll be surprised about what kind of software you can find cracked). I use one of the “open” presets with some tweaks to the eq. I try not to make it fatiguing but at the same time I don’t want to be too quiet so I turn the loudness up about half a dB. I won’t get into too much detail but overall I’m satisfied with the sound so far.

And when I test the audio in my car, I listen with a flat eq then I turn the car’s bass up (which doesn’t do a whole lot since I have no subs). I also still need to test it out in my truck (which has a premium audio system and a factory sub).
If you want to hear it I will go back on air sometime this week.
 
If anyone is interested in hearing how my processing sounds, I am live until 9pm tonight. I switched to another preset and did more tweaks.
 
djnoahfm.caster.fm

right now it sounds a little louder than it is because when I record mixshows I usually use a limiter to prevent distortion and sometimes sounds more compressed if a song’s gain is too high.
 
djnoah225 said:
Caster doesn’t do pre-roll ads
Click to expand...
Did for me. Refreshing the page played same ad every time. Could not have been live. Audio sound about right, maybe too much ultra low freq rumble. You want to be careful how much sub harmonic synthesis you add. Find a good sounding FM station to record and do A/B comparison to your own processing. Also reduce the amount of sweepers between songs to just one short one. Lost my patience listening to 3 sweepers in a row.
 
Anton P said:
Did for me. Refreshing the page played same ad every time. Could not have been live. Audio sound about right, maybe too much ultra low freq rumble. You want to be careful how much sub harmonic synthesis you add. Find a good sounding FM station to record and do A/B comparison to your own processing. Also reduce the amount of sweepers between songs to just one short one. Lost my patience listening to 3 in a row.
Click to expand...
I try to keep it at 1 in a row but sometimes the fixed time markers don’t do their job correctly. As for the processing, I went ahead and ever so slightly cut the bass. But make sure to check it out one more time if you feel like it. I’m jammin’ till 9pm
 
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djnoah225 said:
I try to keep it at 1 in a row but sometimes the fixed time markers don’t do their job correctly. As for the processing, I went ahead and ever so slightly cut the bass. But make sure to check it out one more time if you feel like it. I’m jammin’ till 9pm
Click to expand...
I missed it. Do you take requests or ever play Rabbit in the Moon?
 
radiofan2023 said:
I missed it. Do you take requests or ever play Rabbit in the Moon?
Click to expand...
I put the schedule in the description on the website. You’ll have to scroll to see it, but it won’t be as consistent as when I did it last year. Also I do take requests if I can access my computer. I do not know what Rabbit in the Moon is. I play current Hip Hop & R&B, Throwbacks. I also do Zydeco saturdays before the mix, Gospel then Jazz on Sunday mornings, then I come back at 4pm with R&B Oldies and end it out with Southern Soul & Blues 5-8pm. Sometimes I do the Quiet Storm (Slow jams/belly rubbin’ music) on monday nights 8-10pm.
 
Bass definition will be lacking at 128kbps, especially if you're using MP3. AAC will sound slightly better but if you can increase the bitrate to 192kbps you will see a marked improvement. Also disable the wide band AGC and just use the input AGC in Omnia9ptn, it will pump less and allow more bass through.
 
mpx said:
Bass definition will be lacking at 128kbps, especially if you're using MP3. AAC will sound slightly better but if you can increase the bitrate to 192kbps you will see a marked improvement. Also disable the wide band AGC and just use the input AGC in Omnia9ptn, it will pump less and allow more bass through.
Click to expand...
Unfortunately I can only broadcast in 128kbps. As for the station, it is off the air until next summer, but every now and then I turn the stream on and play a little music so I can keep the website. Next time I turn the stream on I’ll let y’all know so you can take a listen
 
Lossy codec artifacts will mostly affect the high end, not the low end. A 128 kbps MP3 stream can sound fine as long as you're feeding it lossless audio, have processing that avoids hard clipping, and use the LAME encoder.
 
kevtronics said:
Lossy codec artifacts will mostly affect the high end, not the low end. A 128 kbps MP3 stream can sound fine as long as you're feeding it lossless audio, have processing that avoids hard clipping, and use the LAME encoder.
Click to expand...
been a while since I visited this forum. For the streaming I use the built in encoder on Omnia. I have settled on another preset with a few tweaks. I also have a second station in the works that plays 100% Southern Soul and Blues now that I found out my computer could handle such things. Still working on the processing for the latter one. Whenever I have time to turn my stations on I’ll tell yall so yall can hear how they sound.
 
Don´t forget to update your PTN to latest Omnia Enterprise 9S. big improvements on HD processing and low frequency. just don´t drive final limiters too hard
 


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