February numbers are here

[Mediafrog+]

Hispanics are still majority Catholic and this kind of music is heretical to them. The extravagant and non-denominational crossover doesn't appeal to them. Catholicism is built in tradition and solemnity rather than mixing modern fads (strip mall churches, flashy dancing, loud music, etc.) with "Jesus".

That is changing. Evangelical movements have made huge progress in attracting Hispanics, and you can see that trend not only in the U.S. but in many Latin American countries. In those places evangelicals are increasing their influence on social policies and national politics, which is a key reason we are seeing a rightward shift in Latin American governments. Obviously they are finding something in Evangelical Christianity that they feel is missing in the Catholic Church.

As for the “modern fads” you can consider the evolution of Protestant denominations in the past 75 years. In the 1950s most Protestant services were built around a bland combination of hymns from the 18th and 19th centuries along with well worn and rather stuffy Orders of Service. Baby Boomers began to reject all that archaic ritual and demanded something more modern and relevant to their lives, and by the 1970s you were seeing the beginnings of more upbeat and higher energy church services. Individual denominational labels were dropped in order to attract more people, and contemporary music styles became commonplace, just with a religious message.

50+ years ago religious radio stations were little more than church sermons and old hymns. The exception were African-American churches, which pioneered the higher energy religious service.

Many people see “tradition” as pointless ritual done purely out of habit, or in order to “keep people in line.” That doesn’t work any more. Those churches clinging to creaky tradition are seeing their memberships plummet. The modern churches are full of people. Radio is following those trends.

 

[BamaTX]

What is "pay for pray revenue"? I've never heard of that term and don't have any idea what you are talking about. Was someone selling prayers?

Pay to Pray is a very well known term that goes beyond radio.

Your characterizations are not very helpful. Why are they "looney" if they are willing to donate to keep something they enjoy on the air?

I'm not a big public radio fan or a regular listener of classical music, but supporting a service you get value from or a cause that you believe in does not make you looney; seems perfectly rational to me.

You think I called them looney because they donate?

That is changing. Evangelical movements have made huge progress in attracting Hispanics, and you can see that trend not only in the U.S. but in many Latin American countries. In those places evangelicals are increasing their influence on social policies and national politics, which is a key reason we are seeing a rightward shift in Latin American governments. Obviously they are finding something in Evangelical Christianity that they feel is missing in the Catholic Church.

It wasn't necessarily an organic growth when you examine history. And we may be seeing a reversal in that trend across the world.

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www.nytimes.com

Catholicism is growing. It's just a matter of time before this trend reaches Latin America.

Many people see “tradition” as pointless ritual done purely out of habit, or in order to “keep people in line.” That doesn’t work any more. Those churches clinging to creaky tradition are seeing their memberships plummet. The modern churches are full of people. Radio is following those trends.

On the contrary. Many people believe tradition is what this younger generation is seeking and the reason why people are joining Catholicism/Orthodox around the world. Catholicism and Orthodox are rooted in almost 2000 years of uninterrupted structural faith that directly ties to the original apostles. Younger Christians see their Jewish and Muslim cohorts practice ancient religions with sacred traditions and customs that modern American protestant churches lack. There is no Lent, Ramadan, or Passover at strip mall churches. There is no ritualistic processions at megachurches. There are no ancient & historical Baptist/evangelical monuments or structures in ancient mesapotemia.

What they usually see from many protestant movements is exorbitant dancing, light shows, fireworks, concerts, and once in a blue moon someone speaking in tongues (cough cough Paula White). I'm not too sure that is resonating with younger people anymore. It seems that this younger generation may want to belong to something bigger, greater, and much older than themselves. They want a religion directly tied to Jesus instead of one that popped up in the last couple of centuries.

 

[Mrtejano]

Prime example of a station running that format, RADIO GOZO TX, a station that is being run by a visually impaired person Jay Gomez El Ciego de oro. Well was being run by him, don’t know if that still the case. But Radio Aleluya does that, most of their songs are Norteña.
La nueva radio Cristiana did that too when Paulino Bernal was alive RIP.

 

[davideduardo]

As a non-commercial station that is supported by pay for pray revenue? Maybe. It all depends if there are enough looney evangelicals out there willing to pay for it.

But as a commercial station? No. Hispanics are still majority Catholic and this kind of music is heretical to them.

Several studies done have shown that "less active" Catholics enjoy the music of faith on Christian stations. I have seen nothing from the Church that says it is heretical. One of the points that is often brought up in regards to such stations, particularly K-Love, is that the content is acceptable to those who find some current mainstream music to be offensive.

The extravagant and non-denominational crossover doesn't appeal to them. Catholicism is built in tradition and solemnity rather than mixing modern fads (strip mall churches, flashy dancing, loud music, etc.) with "Jesus".

But ones like K-Love are fairly subdued in tone. The delivery is respectful and not offensive.

 

[davideduardo]

That is changing. Evangelical movements have made huge progress in attracting Hispanics, and you can see that trend not only in the U.S. but in many Latin American countries. In those places evangelicals are increasing their influence on social policies and national politics, which is a key reason we are seeing a rightward shift in Latin American governments. Obviously they are finding something in Evangelical Christianity that they feel is missing in the Catholic Church.

Absolutely true. For example, it has been reported that over half the people in Puerto Rico who practice or believe in any religion are non-Catholic Christians now. Over a half-century ago when I got to the Island, it was essentially 100% Catholic.

I have seen the same trends in nearly all the countries where I have worked in recent years, from Chile to Mexico.

As for the “modern fads” you can consider the evolution of Protestant denominations in the past 75 years. In the 1950s most Protestant services were built around a bland combination of hymns from the 18th and 19th centuries along with well worn and rather stuffy Orders of Service. Baby Boomers began to reject all that archaic ritual and demanded something more modern and relevant to their lives, and by the 1970s you were seeing the beginnings of more upbeat and higher energy church services. Individual denominational labels were dropped in order to attract more people, and contemporary music styles became commonplace, just with a religious message.

The most common comment I heard in research in Puerto Rico was that people wanted to be an active part of religious services. That meant "feeling the music" and vocally responding to the preaching, often accompanied by swaying, standing and the like.

50+ years ago religious radio stations were little more than church sermons and old hymns. The exception were African-American churches, which pioneered the higher energy religious service.

I worked, as a teen, at R&B WJMO in Cleveland, and the staff took me to many religious services at Cory United Baptist church and it was really thrilling to be a part of the services. One of the great things was "sharing the feeling" with my friends from the station as that had a kind of unifying effect.

Many people see “tradition” as pointless ritual done purely out of habit, or in order to “keep people in line.” That doesn’t work any more. Those churches clinging to creaky tradition are seeing their memberships plummet. The modern churches are full of people. Radio is following those trends.

As cities grow and become more anonymous, the sharing of an exciting religious service is thrilling and fulfilling. As one person in that community said to me, "it's better that we celebrate the Lord than to follow a gang."

 

[b-turner]

I talked to a person associated with KLFT, a Catholic formatted FM, who told me about 60% of their listeners also listened to Air1/K-Love. That was perhaps 8 or 9 years ago.

 

[BamaTX]

"less active" Catholics enjoy the music of faith on Christian stations.

Kinda proves the point. While listen to generic CCM is not prohibited, most observant Catholics don't generally go out of their way to listen to non-denominational "Christian" music. The culture is just different and most Catholic run radio stations stick to "folksy" songs, traditional hymns, and modest recitals when they're not doing talk shows. Yes every region and ethnicity puts their own twist to their Catholic faith (see Mexico and their reverence of the Blessed Virgin Mary), but the result is always respect and modesty. Grandeur showmanship (musical acts, speaking
in tongues, or dancing) is strictly a protestant phenomenon.

I have seen nothing from the Church that says it is heretical.

There are plenty of condemnations from recent popes about the commercialization of Christianity for personal gain. I just don't see Catholics running towards a commercial Christian Regional Mexican station. It's heretical.

And there aren't enough protestant Hispanics to make it a highly rated radio station. This is why a Christian Regional Mexican station would need a loyal donor base to make it work.

I talked to a person associated with KLFT, a Catholic formatted FM, who told me about 60% of their listeners also listened to Air1/K-Love. That was perhaps 8 or 9 years ago.

KLFT isn't exactly a top rated station in a Catholic heavy part of the country. So that 60% in reality is a fraction of the overall region's congregation.

Yes, there are no directives to avoid listening to non-profit Christian music. But the fact that most Catholic owned radio stations don't play CCM says it all.

 

[BamaTX]

"less active" Catholics enjoy the music of faith on Christian stations.

Kinda proves the point. While listen to generic CCM is not prohibited, most observant Catholics don't generally go out of their way to listen to non-denominational "Christian" music. The culture is just different and most Catholic run radio stations stick to "folksy" songs, traditional hymns, and modest recitals when they're not doing talk shows. Yes every region and ethnicity puts their own twist to their Catholic faith (see Mexico and their reverence of the Blessed Virgin Mary), but the result is always respect and modesty. Grandeur showmanship (musical acts, speaking
in tongues, or dancing) is strictly a protestant phenomenon.

I have seen nothing from the Church that says it is heretical.

There are plenty of condemnations from recent popes about the commercialization of Christianity for personal gain. I just don't see Catholics running towards a commercial Christian Regional Mexican station. It's heretical.

And there aren't enough protestant Hispanics to make it a highly rated radio station. This is why a Christian Regional Mexican station would need a loyal donor base to make it work.

I talked to a person associated with KLFT, a Catholic formatted FM, who told me about 60% of their listeners also listened to Air1/K-Love. That was perhaps 8 or 9 years ago.

KLFT isn't exactly a top rated station in a Catholic heavy part of the country. So that 60% in reality is a fraction of the overall region's congregation.

Yes, there are no directives to avoid listening to non-profit Christian music. But the fact that most Catholic owned radio stations don't play CCM says it all.

 

[davideduardo]

Kinda proves the point. While listen to generic CCM is not prohibited, most observant Catholics don't generally go out of their way to listen to non-denominational "Christian" music. The culture is just different and most Catholic run radio stations stick to "folksy" songs, traditional hymns, and modest recitals when they're not doing talk shows. Yes every region and ethnicity puts their own twist to their Catholic faith (see Mexico and their reverence of the Blessed Virgin Mary), but the result is always respect

I either programmed or consulted Catholic stations in both Perú and Puerto Rico. In PR we programmed AC music and light tropical that had positive lyrics. Short messages were interspersed. In Peru, we did popular class music which could be compared to country in the US. In between songs, there were very short messages, sort of like advertisements, that could contain biblical or instructional or health related messages.

In both cases, the music was secular and select selected to represent a positive position. The station in Puerto Rico was programmed that way in the early 80s and I did the programming in Peru later that decade under the auspices of the Cardinal himself. Obviously, the Catholic Church approved of this type of programming and saw as a way around the common problem of church operating stations, which often is defined as “preaching to the choir“.

There are plenty of condemnations from recent popes about the commercialization of Christianity for personal gain. I just don't see Catholics running towards a commercial Christian Regional Mexican station. It's heretical.

Keep in mind that most Mexican targeted radio formats originated in Mexico. The Mexican government has a strict separation of church and state which is more limiting than anywhere else in Latin America. In addition, there are severe limitations on the operation of religious radio stations of any kind, whether they be evangelical or catholic.

And there aren't enough protestant Hispanics to make it a highly rated radio station. This is why a Christian Regional Mexican station would need a loyal donor base to make it work.

As has been mentioned, the evangelical Christian community in every major market of the United States has been growing very rapidly. Whether there is enough suitable music and someone wanting to make an investment in a new format remains to be seen.

Yes, there are no directives to avoid listening to non-profit Christian music. But the fact that most Catholic owned radio stations don't play CCM says it all.

The problem with the “catholic formatted” radio station stations in the United States is that they tend to be owned by groups that are very passionate lay members of the church. Because of that they tend to program what they themselves would like to hear rather than what unaffiliated or unguided persons might need to hear to bring them into the flock.

 

[Identnut]

Kinda proves the point. While listen to generic CCM is not prohibited, most observant Catholics don't generally go out of their way to listen to non-denominational "Christian" music. The culture is just different and most Catholic run radio stations stick to "folksy" songs, traditional hymns, and modest recitals when they're not doing talk shows. Yes every region and ethnicity puts their own twist to their Catholic faith (see Mexico and their reverence of the Blessed Virgin Mary), but the result is always respect and modesty. Grandeur showmanship (musical acts, speaking
in tongues, or dancing) is strictly a protestant phenomenon.

Evangelicals are more likely to listen CCM exclusively. Spanish-speaking Catholics, like my parents, will listen to it on occasion because it is positive. There is not as much of a lameness stigma attached to it like there is for English-dominant listeners. There was no South Park or King of the Hill episode in Spanish making fun of CCM. But don't count on Catholics to donate to the K-Love radiothon.

This is why the Fish failed in Chicago. A large swath of Chicagoland Christians are Catholic and Salem didn't have the infrastructure that K-Love had to make it stick.