104.3 returning to a music format

[Johnnie_Radio]

Sports is failing miserably on 104......


will music ever come back to this frequency, somthing other than Country & Rock which this market has plenty off ??? ???

 

[JacksonB]

you know, that's really not true...it's the leading sports outlet in the city ratings-wise....(you can't count KOA). And the afternoon show has performed respectably in its male target.

 

[Kent]

It's likely billing more than the last few music formats it ran. Sports radio doesn't need high 6+ or 12+ ratings to get advertisers. Your typical sports station, even in the 1-2 share range, will be top-5 25-54 male.

 

[Johnnie_Radio]

you know, that's really not true...it's the leading sports outlet in the city ratings-wise....(you can't count KOA). And the afternoon show has performed respectably in its male target.

Sorry sir, but that's not saying much considering this market and the other sports FM being KDSP 102.3's 0.9 they are making, plus their signal is on a Class A which doesn't cover the whole city anyways

Again, this market doesn't need sports on FM,especially 2, not every market can win with this format, KKFN was doing better on when it was on 950. Why not move it back and simucast FM on the 103.1 translator and move KRWZ over to 1600 because KEPN isn't doing anything at all. Only in markets such as Detroit, New York, even Philly where you have more people and the also those sports teams are bigger sellers. Nothing against the Bronocs, Nuggets or Avs.

Why not utulize the 104.3 signal with a music format, here is a thought, since you own KQKS, why not have a format such as Jammin's R&B Hits and Old school which would be a compliment to the Hip Hop played on 107-5

Jammin has never really has a chance first being on 92.5 with that tower being in Longmont and now on 101.5 with that tower being way out in Bennet.

 

[Kent]

Only in markets such as Detroit, New York, even Philly where you have more people and the also those sports teams are bigger sellers. Nothing against the Bronocs, Nuggets or Avs.

The Avs alone used to pay the bills for Fox Sports Rocky Mountain. The Broncos also do very well. When is the last time they were blacked out in Denver? I can't imagine they'll have any trouble selling tickets this season with Peyton Manning coming on board. Both franchises should generate plenty of talk.

Why not utulize the 104.3 signal with a music format,

Because it makes money! If both are holding to the power ratios they had a few years ago, it should be outbilling KS-107.5, which has a history of underbilling its ratings share.

 

[Johnnie_Radio]

Only in markets such as Detroit, New York, even Philly where you have more people and the also those sports teams are bigger sellers. Nothing against the Bronocs, Nuggets or Avs.

The Avs alone used to pay the bills for Fox Sports Rocky Mountain. The Broncos also do very well. When is the last time they were blacked out in Denver? I can't imagine they'll have any trouble selling tickets this season with Peyton Manning coming on board. Both franchises should generate plenty of talk.

If i can Recall when KKFN was on 950 didn't they have the Nuggets and Avs before the decided to copy everyone else and move to FM ???
Why not utulize the 104.3 signal with a music format,

Because it makes money! If both are holding to the power ratios they had a few years ago, it should be outbilling KS-107.5, which has a history of underbilling its ratings share.

Yeah and they were making money on 950 and also AM travels farther than FM, Why is it because you see WXYT move to FM then you have to move KKFN to FM. It's always Money...Money, what i suspect is it's more money for these Brain Childs who make these moves in their pockets because they can run a Sports or News Station Cheaper.

Of course non of these People care about the listeners, it's all about what they want and how they always want to copy from what another market has done. KKFN lost both of those teams when they went to 104.3, and as far as Manning is concerned, he is one of the best QB's ever, but you don't need 3 stations all jumping at his feet on FM.... :

 

[XCountry285]

104.3 should go top 40. 107.1 failed at top 40 because of it's weak signal.

 

[1069_KIFR]

AMP 104.3!

 

[Kent]

Yeah and they were making money on 950 and also AM travels farther than FM,  Why is it because you see WXYT move to FM then you have to move KKFN to FM.  It's always Money...Money,  what i suspect is it's more money for these Brain Childs who make these moves in their pockets because they can run a Sports or News Station Cheaper. 

The fact that AM travels further than FM is irrelevant.  Spot radio is not bought regionally, never has been and never will be.  And, yes, of course you're seeing sports radio move to FM because of money.  That's what drives the business of radio.  Sports, by the way, is usually significantly more expensive than a music station.  The increased billing, however, more than makes up the cost of the additional overhead. 

Of course non of these People care about the listeners, it's all about what they want and how they always want to copy from what another market has done. KKFN lost both of those teams when they went to 104.3, and as far as Manning is concerned, he is one of the best QB's ever, but you don't need 3 stations all jumping at his feet on FM.... :

As someone who's worked mostly in programming when in radio (a little in engineering and production but never sales), I know people hate to hear this, and programming staff hates to think about it.  However, when push comes to shove, the listener isn't radio's customer (unless it's a non-commercial station, anyway); it's the advertiser.  The listener, in and of himself, doesn't pay the radio station's bill.  Radio's job is to deliver the advertiser his customer, which is the listener.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the listener should be ignored.  After all, if you don't get listeners, you can't get them to the advertisers, which means you don't get enough advertisers to make money.  My point is that the advertisers have the most influence over what's available in the market.  The reason you don't have smooth jazz or easy listening anymore isn't because no one will listen to them.  It's because not enough advertisers feel like reaching those listeners is worth the cost.  In Denver, a very large portion of the advertisers want 25-49 males, and almost nothing delivers that age group better than all sports. 

 

[Johnnie_Radio]

Yeah and they were making money on 950 and also AM travels farther than FM, Why is it because you see WXYT move to FM then you have to move KKFN to FM. It's always Money...Money, what i suspect is it's more money for these Brain Childs who make these moves in their pockets because they can run a Sports or News Station Cheaper.

The fact that AM travels further than FM is irrelevant. Spot radio is not bought regionally, never has been and never will be. And, yes, of course you're seeing sports radio move to FM because of money. That's what drives the business of radio. Sports, by the way, is usually significantly more expensive than a music station. The increased billing, however, more than makes up the cost of the additional overhead.

Of course non of these People care about the listeners, it's all about what they want and how they always want to copy from what another market has done. KKFN lost both of those teams when they went to 104.3, and as far as Manning is concerned, he is one of the best QB's ever, but you don't need 3 stations all jumping at his feet on FM.... :

As someone who's worked mostly in programming when in radio (a little in engineering and production but never sales), I know people hate to hear this, and programming staff hates to think about it. However, when push comes to shove, the listener isn't radio's customer (unless it's a non-commercial station, anyway); it's the advertiser. The listener, in and of himself, doesn't pay the radio station's bill. Radio's job is to deliver the advertiser his customer, which is the listener. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying the listener should be ignored. After all, if you don't get listeners, you can't get them to the advertisers, which means you don't get enough advertisers to make money. My point is that the advertisers have the most influence over what's available in the market. The reason you don't have smooth jazz or easy listening anymore isn't because no one will listen to them. It's because not enough advertisers feel like reaching those listeners is worth the cost. In Denver, a very large portion of the advertisers want 25-49 males, and almost nothing delivers that age group better than all sports.

In my Hometown of Detroit where the economy is struggling and Jobs are few in between people there need something to take their minds off of the negative things going on, This is one of the many reasons why WXYT was moved to 97.1, not to mention the Red Wings and Tigers are 2 of the top Sports Franchises in the country and you have fans all over and adverstisers as well who can sell these games anywhere....WXYT was doing fine on AM 1270, but the fact the Frequency Modulator is clearer and sounds better. Denver on the other hand has a much better quality of life and more Jobs, I just didn't see why Lincoln needed to Flip KKFN to 104.3 when this is such a smaller market, i can appreciate the advertisers make the station money, but the problem with radio today is that there is no more Origination, everything is copy see.....copy do.



When i programmed my show years ago i had total control of the playlist and i had my listeners who appreciated a Radio Personallity who talked to them and actually wanted to be different than every other station. However i know that things are different now, with more Coorporate suites who bought up all the stations and they want to maximize profit. I can appreciate the making money aspect, however Radio isnt fun to listen to anymore....Jazz and Funk arent even a Genre you hear anymore ....people do actually still love this kind of music, but now you have to pay for it on Satellite or Direct TV.

 

[Kent]

In my Hometown of Detroit where the economy is struggling and Jobs are few in between people there need something to take their minds off of the negative things going on, This is one of the many reasons why WXYT was moved to 97.1, not to mention the Red Wings and Tigers are 2 of the top Sports Franchises in the country and you have fans all over and adverstisers as well who can sell these games anywhere....WXYT was doing fine on AM 1270, but the fact the Frequency Modulator is clearer and sounds better. Denver on the other hand has a much better quality of life and more Jobs, I just didn't see why Lincoln needed to Flip KKFN to 104.3 when this is such a smaller market, i can appreciate the advertisers make the station money, but the problem with radio today is that there is no more Origination, everything is copy see.....copy do.

Looking at Detroit, WXYT did okay on 1270. It does phenomenally on 97.1. It hasn't been below a 5 share, almost all of it 25-54 men, in quite some time, and it's been at or above a 7 three times in the last six months. CBS could easily find itself doing $1 out of every $3 spent on the Detroit market this year, and WXYT-FM alone will likely be responsible for over 1/3 of the entire cluster's revenue! You're also correct that it's definitely getting a benefit from carrying the Red Wings and the Tigers. So, yeah, WXYT did okay as a sports station at 1270, but it would never have done this well, even if it did have all the sports rights. Again, you're looking at possibly as high as $1 out of every $8 spent in the entire market going to WXYT-FM alone. I'm sure LFM would like to see 104.3 do what 97.1 Detroit has accomplished (so would CBS in several of its markets!). Obviously, it's not doing nearly as well, but it's still doing as well or better than every station in the cluster except KYGO in terms of billing.

When i programmed my show years ago i had total control of the playlist and i had my listeners who appreciated a Radio Personallity who talked to them and actually wanted to be different than every other station. However i know that things are different now, with more Coorporate suites who bought up all the stations and they want to maximize profit. I can appreciate the making money aspect, however Radio isnt fun to listen to anymore....Jazz and Funk arent even a Genre you hear anymore ....people do actually still love this kind of music, but now you have to pay for it on Satellite or Direct TV.

The unfortunate side of radio for us programming staff is that tight playlists and extreme research get more listeners than freeform radio. If that tight programming and formula-based radio didn't work, nobody'd be doing it. There's not a one of us who wouldn't like to be able to do something different and be number one in the market, but that rarely happens. When it does, it's usually a case of someone finding something everyone else is missing and doing the research to back that up and fine tune it. That's kind of like what I hear happened with the Jack FM format. I'll also admit that I enjoy smooth jazz and several other music genres that don't appeal to the money demos anymore. No, I don't like it, but I have to live with it and find other ways to get that music.

 

[radioguy39nj]

The other issue facing FM music stations is high royalty fees. That's one expense you don't have when you run a spoken word format. Another is demographics. The under 55 crowd didn't grow up with AM. KOA on 850 AM is #1 in Denver, but eventually it may have to move to FM to secure that demo.

Regardless of band or demo, the station has to be well programmed and executed. FM doesn't guarantee success as the recent failure of FM News 101.9 in NY proves.

Spoken word formats will continue to migrate to FM as people get used to getting their music from other sources. Personally, I'm fine with spoken word migrating to FM and I grew up with AM. I haven't listened to music on an FM station in a decade. Advertisers don't care about anyone my age but I'm still entitled to my opinion!

 

[JeeperOne]

Ugh how I hate it when East Coasters come on here thinking THEY know what's best for Denver Radio :

I know there's no sports radio on FM in New York City (Unless Cumulus changed that with ESPN Radio) but that doesn't mean sports radio on FM won't work anywhere else. Look at Boston as an example of this. Virtually all the Boston sports stations are on FM in some form (Even WEEI is on FM even though it's basically a simulcast of 850 AM)\

Getting back to Denver now, First off KKFN will NEVER work on AM anymore. Too many people are accustomed to it being on FM now. Secondly, KEPN 1600 is committed to the upstart NBC Sports Radio Network. What makes you East Coasters think they'll drop that in favor of Fox Sports Radio exclusively? That's what will happen if KKFN were to go away completely (People won't give up on Crusin 950 as it gets a modest audience as an Oldies station. Not only that, but it's also good competition for KEZW & is also the NBC News Radio Network affiliate in Denver)

That said though, I do think AM 1600 should drop the KEPN call letters as that's more indicative of an ESPN Radio affiliate but that can be interpreted as being semantic as well

JMO.....

Cheers & 73

 

[pbf1]

Ugh how I hate it when East Coasters come on here thinking THEY know what's best for Denver Radio :

I know there's no sports radio on FM in New York City (Unless Cumulus changed that with ESPN Radio) but that doesn't mean sports radio on FM won't work anywhere else. Look at Boston as an example of this. Virtually all the Boston sports stations are on FM in some form (Even WEEI is on FM even though it's basically a simulcast of 850 AM)\

No sports FM in NYC? ESPN on 98.7, WFAN on 101.9.

Also, 850 Boston is ESPN, now, split from the FM.

 

[radioguy39nj]

Ugh how I hate it when East Coasters come on here thinking THEY know what's best for Denver Radio :

I know there's no sports radio on FM in New York City (Unless Cumulus changed that with ESPN Radio) but that doesn't mean sports radio on FM won't work anywhere else. Look at Boston as an example of this. Virtually all the Boston sports stations are on FM in some form (Even WEEI is on FM even though it's basically a simulcast of 850 AM)\

No sports FM in NYC? ESPN on 98.7, WFAN on 101.9.

Also, 850 Boston is ESPN, now, split from the FM.

I don't know what's best for Denver radio or any other market for that matter, but national trends indicate a migration of spoken word formats to FM. That is what it is.

Once ESPN parked itself on 98.7 FM in NYC, most radio observers knew it wasn't a matter of if WFAN, despite it's 50 kW non-D blaster on 660, would add FM. It was a matter of when!

 

[JeeperOne]

Okay so I was wrong on the NYC sports stations but still KKFN here in Denver will NEVER go back to AM. Plain & Simple. In fact, it's no longer a question as to IF the Denver Broncos will join the other sports teams in town by having their games broadcast on FM, but WHEN.....

The Denver Broncos are still on KOA (As are the Colorado Rockies) while the Nuggets & Avs are on KCKK (Which can be heard on FM via 93.7)

Cheers & 73