106.7 FINDING NICHE, TAKING ADVANTAGE OF OTHERS LIMITED & MISSING OLDIES

gregg75 · Jan 2, 2011

106.7 seems to be going after B-98's baby boomer listeners of late. B-98 only plays limited
adult comtemporary oldies, and the ones they play and played over and over and over.

106.7 now plays many past hits circa 1974-1984 that have become the missing and
lost children of B-98. The result leaves you wondering if you're listening to B-98 Jr. at times.
This is a smart move. To succeed they need some of B's listeners (as they are probably the
biggest oldies in town other than 106.7).

106.7 should not forget the R&B oldies though. Most Urban stations have little time for them
and just like B-98 they play the same ones over and over. When they first re-vamped they
were heavy on R&B and that sound was refreshing, as nobody else is TRUELY presenting it.

Talk_Dude · Jan 2, 2011

gregg75 said:
106.7 seems to be going after B-98's baby boomer listeners of late. B-98 only plays limited
adult comtemporary oldies, and the ones they play and played over and over and over.

106.7 now plays many past hits circa 1974-1984 that have become the missing and
lost children of B-98. The result leaves you wondering if you're listening to B-98 Jr. at times.
This is a smart move. To succeed they need some of B's listeners (as they are probably the
biggest oldies in town other than 106.7).

106.7 should not forget the R&B oldies though. Most Urban stations have little time for them
and just like B-98 they play the same ones over and over. When they first re-vamped they
were heavy on R&B and that sound was refreshing, as nobody else is TRUELY presenting it.

How are 98.5 listeners who would like this new format to know to tune in to 106.7? I don't think that many in the mass audience read the posts here on Radio-info.com.

gregg75 · Jan 2, 2011

When B-98 plays "You Light Up My Life" they hit the scan button.

Talk_Dude · Jan 2, 2011

gregg75 said:
When B-98 plays "You Light Up My Life" they hit the scan button.

So, let me see if I understand you. They're on 98.5, and they hit "scan", which goes to the next station, which is 99.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 99.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 103.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.3. If they don't like what's on that station, then they finally get to 106.7. Does that pretty much describe how the process works?

Sounds like a sure thing. :

But what happens if when they get to 106.7, 106.7 is playing a commercial? Is 106.7 counting on the new listener going through the same process the next time B-98 plays "You Light Up My Life"?

caller10 · Jan 2, 2011

I'm noticing some deeper cuts on B98.5 FM on this "Big 80s Weekend" that I have not heard previously like Glenn Frey "The Heat Is On" (in response to 106.7?) and an image promo into the :20 break that was kinda like "the biggest stars are here ..." (targeting 94.1?) B is feeling the pressure!

atlantaboy · Jan 2, 2011

Talk_Dude said:
They're on 98.5, and they hit "scan", which goes to the next station, which is 99.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 99.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 103.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.3. If they don't like what's on that station, then they finally get to 106.7. Does that pretty much describe how the process works?

Lol I can't believe you typed all that ;D

Honestly, I don't think 106.7 is very well advertised - before I joined this board, I didn't even know it was there - part of the reason I think is that in Atlanta, practically all of the pop/rock stuff is on the lower half of the "dial" (so when I scan, I never go up past Q100)

Talk_Dude · Jan 2, 2011

atlantaboy said:
Talk_Dude said:

They're on 98.5, and they hit "scan", which goes to the next station, which is 99.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 99.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 100.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 101.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.5. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 102.9. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 103.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 104.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.3. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 105.7. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.1. If they don't like what's on that station, they go to 106.3. If they don't like what's on that station, then they finally get to 106.7. Does that pretty much describe how the process works?

Click to expand...

Lol I can't believe you typed all that ;D

Honestly, I don't think 106.7 is very well advertised - before I joined this board, I didn't even know it was there - part of the reason I think is that in Atlanta, practically all of the pop/rock stuff is on the lower half of the "dial" (so when I scan, I never go up past Q100)

I didn't type it word for word. I made it by downloading a list of stations, and then using cut & paste to create all of the sentences.

I don't think anyone will actually read it, which is OK by me. I just wanted to strongly make the point that any radio station that lives and dies by whether or not it can sell advertising that doesn't believe in buying advertising to promote itself shouldn't be surprised when it fails.

bnaivar · Jan 2, 2011

After the first sentence I started hitting the "scan" button. ;D

ClarkKent · Jan 2, 2011

I won't argue the wisdom or the folly of 106.7's changes, but I do notice they're playing "Laughter in the Rain" almost as much as The River seems to play "Do You Feel Like We Do?"

Which is to say, too much. :

gregg75 · Jan 2, 2011

Most people into oldies already know it's there.

They will "find it" just as they find any other station.

If you're only aware of those who advertise talk_dude then you are only
listening to the River and B-98.

Talk_Dude · Jan 2, 2011

gregg75 said:
Most people into oldies already know it's there.

They will "find it" just as they find any other station.

If you're only aware of those who advertise talk_dude then you are only
listening to the River and B-98.

I'm aware of the stations that I researched when I moved to Atlanta. I researched to find out what was there, scanned and sampled the ones that sounded good to me, and I set my radio's buttons. That's a one-time thing that I imagine most people do when they move into a new market. I'm talking about the extra advertising push that must accompany a format change. I won't attempt to argue that stations must advertise if they keep on playing the same format year after year. That would probably be money wasted. But if a station is changing what it plays in order to find a new niche and take advantage of others limited and missing oldies, then that new innovation in what they're doing needs to be communicated to potential listeners who didn't like what they played before, but who might change their minds if they knew about the new changes.

What I liked most about Atlanta radio when I moved here was 92.9's morning show. The talk was entertaining, and they played some songs. When they got rid of the morning guy and went to all music, I stopped listening to 92.9 in AM drive.

jabba17 · Jan 2, 2011

The problem with 106.7 moving into the 80s is that, yes, they are moving into B98.5's wheelhouse. B98.5's problem, OTOH, is that they can't hold on to the 80s forever with Star 94 coming on strong with newer AC stuff.

Will we see another battle for 80s dominance between 106.7 and B98.5, similar to the battle between Star 94 and B98.5 15 years ago? Star 94, the "newer" station, couldn't keep the older tunes in their playlist without breaking format. Now B98.5 is the "newer" station, compared to 106.7.

106.7 also competes with the NEW 97.1 The River, but it's not hard for any station playing a lot of 70s/80s pop to tiptoe around River's tiny, AORish playlist.

Question: Does River (or, rather, the "classic hits" format in general) compete more with "oldies" (old 70s/80s top 40) stations like 106.7, or classic album oriented rock stations (I'm looking at you, Rock 100.5, at least with their format of the month).

atlantaboy · Jan 2, 2011

Talk_Dude said:
What I liked most about Atlanta radio when I moved here was 92.9's morning show. The talk was entertaining, and they played some songs. When they got rid of the morning guy and went to all music, I stopped listening to 92.9 in AM drive.

Lol it's the exact opposite for me - I like to hear music in the morning to get me ready for the workday, so I love how Dave-FM and 99X have music almost constantly during the morning drive - and Star 94 actually has a lot more music in the AM than most Hot ACs I think

gregg75 · Jan 2, 2011

jabba17 I don't listen to Star 94, but since they are a currents based format I doubt
they play a lot of 80's music.

This is not a new format for 106.7..........this is a tweak of the oldies format they already
had. There are a lot of 70's and 80's adult comtemporary classics just sitting there gaining
dust............should 106.7 want to play them again (as they have been all but forgotten)
even by the so called contemporary station B-98, then more power to them.......maybe
more listeners to them as well.

Talk_Dude · Jan 3, 2011

atlantaboy said:
Talk_Dude said:

What I liked most about Atlanta radio when I moved here was 92.9's morning show. The talk was entertaining, and they played some songs. When they got rid of the morning guy and went to all music, I stopped listening to 92.9 in AM drive.

Click to expand...

Lol it's the exact opposite for me - I like to hear music in the morning to get me ready for the workday, so I love how Dave-FM and 99X have music almost constantly during the morning drive - and Star 94 actually has a lot more music in the AM than most Hot ACs I think

The thing is, from the perspective of the radio station, making a change to attract new listeners, regardless of what that change is, includes some peril. Those who already listen to your station who don't like the change will know about it when it happens, and they'll leave right away. But those who will like your new changes can't be counted on to accidentally stumble across your new thing. Those of us who post in here are, after all, radio professionals and/or radio geeks with a higher than average interest in the details and minutiae of radio programming. Those who don't post on forums like Radio-Info can't be counted on to spend any of their time sampling all stations to keep abreast of all the changes.

If a station's management is convinced that they're broadcasting the right things and they aren't going to make any changes, tweaks, or adjustments, then it's probably not a good investment to do much advertising. A little might be a good thing. When I moved to Atlanta, I found out that The Fish existed because I saw one of their billboards. When I first moved here that was one of the stations I listened to a lot, until they changed their playlist recently and chased me away.

I'd be curious to know how many radio pros and/or radio geeks in here actually talk about what different stations are playing with their friends and acquaintances who aren't radio pros and/or radio geeks.

jabba17 · Jan 3, 2011

gregg75 said:
jabba17 I don't listen to Star 94, but since they are a currents based format I doubt
they play a lot of 80's music.

This is not a new format for 106.7..........this is a tweak of the oldies format they already
had. There are a lot of 70's and 80's adult comtemporary classics just sitting there gaining
dust............should 106.7 want to play them again (as they have been all but forgotten)
even by the so called contemporary station B-98, then more power to them.......maybe
more listeners to them as well.

Star 94 doesn't play 80s. But they used to have 80s weekends, similar to (and up against) B98.5, about 15-20 years ago. Star 94 eventually dropped the 80s while B98.5 expanded their 80s playlist. If I recall correctly from the time, Star 94 was having issues with its core hot AC/CHR listeners hating the 80s for being old; the special weekend 80s programming was not bringing new listeners or increasing TSL for existing listeners for them.

B98.5 had the opposite result, due to being a regular AC station with an older audience. It didn't hurt that B98.5 was battling AC competitor Peach by taking a "harder" approach to AC than Peach, and adding 80s pop fit right in to that. Peach was the last Beautiful Music station in Atlanta to flip to AC, and the "Peach" name was synonymous with BM. B98.5 exploited this endlessly, referring to their own format as "soft rock" and passing Peach off as "elevator Muzak".

A while back I posted that "oldies" stations would have to move into the 80s eventually: here's the thread http://boards.radio-info.com/smf/index.php?topic=168786.10 . The question I pose here, is how will that affect legacy 80s-heavy stations, specifically B98.5? Can 20-30 year old songs coexist on an adult contemporary station? Not saying they can't--when Fox 97 moved in in the 1980s, their first format was a "60s, 70s, and today" AC format--the same time period (in number of years prior, not actual decades) that B98.5 does today.

gregg75 · Jan 3, 2011

talk_dude I may be old school, but "if you build it they will come" works fine for me.
If you build it and ADVERTISE, may get them there quicker, but the end result will
be the same.

Let your music and station do your advertising for you instead of a costly billboard, TV or print ad.
A super duper ad is not going to help your station if that's all you've got going.

But, a great contest, which 106.7 is lacking, would possibly help them.

Talk_Dude · Jan 3, 2011

gregg75 said:
talk_dude I may be old school, but "if you build it they will come" works fine for me.
If you build it and ADVERTISE, may get them there quicker, but the end result will
be the same.

Let your music and station do your advertising for you instead of a costly billboard, TV or print ad.
A super duper ad is not going to help your station if that's all you've got going.

But, a great contest, which 106.7 is lacking, would possibly help them.

I am very "old school". That's why I believe in the power of advertising. I cannot understand how anyone who thinks advertising doesn't help, and that "if you build it they will come", can possibly be part of an industry that lives and dies by the sale of advertising. If you worked in radio, would you tell the people who might want to buy time on your station that they shouldn't bother, and "if you build it they will come" is enough for their businesses to succeed?

RoddyFreeman · Jan 3, 2011

I've been in advertising for 30 years, and I can tell you that good advertising works. I've seen it firsthand. However, the product better deliver. If the product is inferior, advertising might get people there to try it, but all the advertising in the world will not get them back.

As far as radio, I believe it depends on the competitive situation. When I lived in New York in the 1980's, the 2 Easy Listening stations, WPAT and WRFM, were going at it furiously. And both were all over local TV and buses. But despite my belief in advertising, I have to agree that in radio, especially when a station has format exclusivity, word spreads. Look at 94-9 The Bull. Advertising might have gotten them there faster (it took 2 years since the re-launch), but eventually word of mouth helped them beat Kicks in key demos.

jabba17 · Jan 5, 2011

Sounds like B98.5 isn't taking the threat from 106.7 lying down, and isn't worried about Star 94. B98.5 seems to have doubled down on 80s since they dropped Christmas. 106.7 seems to have pulled back a little on the 80s. I need to check yes.com when I get a chance.

Question: Even Delilah seemed heavy-80s. I know that Delilah does multiple shows for different formats, and they can replace songs in the playlist to better fit their format. They were playing "Jessie's Girl" last night and it didn't seem to be part of a dedication, plus that seemed to be a really odd song for her show both in terms of lyrics and melody, although it does qualify as a "sappy love song", to use Delilah's words, in several respects.

106.7 still needs to fix their processing--less dynamic range compression, and less rolloff of high and low frequencies. I toggled back and forth between the NEW 97.1 The River and 106.7, and the difference was almost painful. Are they trying to sound like an AM station for a period effect? Or is 97.1 still so NEW that they sound nice and shiny :

I like 106.7's new playlist, but their processing is almost too painful to listen to.