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1170 WWTR is afraid of thunderstorms

W

westlife

Guest
Does this station have any lightning protection? It seems like every time a thunderstorm rolls through Bridewater, WMTR's simulcast station 1170 WWTR gets knocked off the air -- and it happened again this afternoon. Every other station on the dial -- even 1070 WKMB, with its ailing 33-year-old transmitter and jury-rigged equipment -- barely even blinks at lightning, but WWTR just curls up and plays dead when it gets zapped. As WBRW, 1170 in Bridgewater was built in a hurry in 1997 to get it on the air before the FCC cancelled its license, so perhaps it's time for Greater Media to make some upgrades to insure that WWTR isn't so afraid of thunderstorms anymore.

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> perhaps it's time for Greater
> Media to make some upgrades to insure that WWTR isn't so
> afraid of thunderstorms anymore.

Is it really worth spending ANY money on a 243 watt Daytime-Only AM signal sandwiched between two very strong adjacents (WVNJ & WOBM)?
 
> Is it really worth spending ANY money on a 243 watt
> Daytime-Only AM signal sandwiched between two very strong
> adjacents (WVNJ & WOBM)?

Yes. WWTR provides a more-than-adequate signal in the lucrative Middlesex/Somerset/Union market. It actually has better coverage with 243 watts non-directional than the old WBRW in Somerville (1971-1990) had with its 500-watt directional signal. And I've never heard WVNJ or WOBM cause any interference to WWTR, even at the fringes of its coverage area. WOBM puts out very little power to the north and WVNJ puts out very little power to the south, thus WWTR fits inbetween with room to spare.

It is an interesting side note, though, that WWTR (ex-WBRW/WSPW) and WOBM (ex-WHLW) were originally both daytimers on 1170 kHz, and both applied to move to 1160 kHz so they could put a nighttime signal on the air. WBRW even suggested operating on 1170 kHz during the daytime and 1160 kHz at night. But for better or worse, the FCC granted the full-time 1160 kHz signal to WOBM, leaving WBRW behind as a daytimer on 1170 kHz. WBRW went dark in December 1990 and its studio building and towers were eventually torn down, but a New York radio engineer bought its still-valid license in 1993 and finally put it back on the air in February 1997, just hours before the FCC declared that all "dark" AM stations would have their licenses permanently cancelled.
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Well ... basically, there is no such thing as
"lightning protection" for an AM transmitter.
Good grounding and the ball-gap at the base
of the tower, and a gas-discharge tube inside
the transmitter don't take care of everything.

Since you don't know exactly why it kicks off,
we can only guess. Was it a power outage ?
STL take a hit ? T-1 down ? Tower hit and
transmitter blew up ? Just went off and
didn't get turned back on ?

The old tube transmitters seem to hold up
better around lightning and antenna problems.

Most likely it all comes back to "no one knew it was off"
and it needed to be turned back on.

How long was WWTR off ?


> Does this station have any lightning protection?
 
There is some copper grounding for the equipment -- not sure how the TX itself is grounded. I know the copper was installed in 2000 after a lightning surge fried the Burk unit and I had to manually sign the station on and off for a week. Lack of backup power is a problem there -- when I did the Sunday morning show, one day the power went out right in the middle of the show -- and there was nothing we could do until the power came back on. They're not far from an electric sub station -- don't know why power is an issue there.

About "upgrades" -- part of the problem with the location / building has always been the issue of who wants a radio tower in their backyard. I think the stipulation when the Lohses bought the license was that the tower had to be within 2 miles of its original location, or they had to get special FCC approvals. Where could you put a radio station to maximize coverage and minimize neighbor complaints in Bridgewater? Up in the mountains isn't good for an AM. Where they are now, I don't think they can put up a permanent structure (lack of running water would be an issue).

Did they come back on? I was on the air during the storm, and they had already signed off by the time I left. We had no problems at 99.1 during the storm (except for the fly in the studio).

Frank





> Does this station have any lightning protection? It seems
> like every time a thunderstorm rolls through Bridewater,
> WMTR's simulcast station 1170 WWTR gets knocked off the air
> -- and it happened again this afternoon. Every other
> station on the dial -- even 1070 WKMB, with its ailing
> 33-year-old transmitter and jury-rigged equipment -- barely
> even blinks at lightning, but WWTR just curls up and plays
> dead when it gets zapped. As WBRW, 1170 in Bridgewater was
> built in a hurry in 1997 to get it on the air before the FCC
> cancelled its license, so perhaps it's time for Greater
> Media to make some upgrades to insure that WWTR isn't so
> afraid of thunderstorms anymore.
>
 
> Did they come back on? I was on the air during the storm,
> and they had already signed off by the time I left.

WWTR was off the air for at least half an hour. I checked back several hours later and they were finally back on the air by the late afternoon.

> We had no problems at 99.1 during the storm (except for the fly in
> the studio).

That's because you had Jesus on your side!
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> Yes. WWTR provides a more-than-adequate signal in the
> lucrative Middlesex/Somerset/Union market. It actually has
> better coverage with 243 watts non-directional than the old
> WBRW in Somerville (1971-1990) had with its 500-watt
> directional signal. And I've never heard WVNJ or WOBM cause
> any interference to WWTR, even at the fringes of its
> coverage area. WOBM puts out very little power to the north
> and WVNJ puts out very little power to the south, thus WWTR
> fits inbetween with room to spare.


I WOULD HAVE TO AGREE with "westlife." For a 243 Non-D stick still in a "makeshift on-air state" it DOES indeed throw out a pretty damn good signal. I would even go as far as to say that when WMTR was upgrading it's signal about a year or two ago and THEY were running at 250 Non-D at night it wasn't even comparable...Yes I know all bets are off at night. Obviously as you travel down 287 or Parkway headed toward Monmouth county WWTR does get pretty "beat up" by WOBM-AM, at which point you can still hear WMTR (AM-1250) for about 1/3 of the way down into Ocean county due to adjacent interference from WBUD in Trenton. So to sum up, I think it would be worth upgrading especially since it appears to be sensitive to different weather and also because of the "oldies" situation in the region...or the lack there of. WMTR/WWTR is certainly filling a "niche" IMO...

~DJinNJ
 
>
> Since you don't know exactly why it kicks off,
> we can only guess. Was it a power outage ?
> STL take a hit ? T-1 down ? Tower hit and
> transmitter blew up ? Just went off and
> didn't get turned back on ?
>

Power failure and breaker popping. This is almost always the failure at the site; the fault comes via the power lines and is seldom a direct hit on the site itself. Occasionally it wipes out one of the transmitter's switching power supplies, sometimes other equipment.

To my recollection this was the first failure since last summer.

> The old tube transmitters seem to hold up
> better around lightning and antenna problems.


The BE solid state transmitters there (same family as KXW-AM's, MID's and CMC's)are more susceptible to power problems than other transmitters I deal with. The power feed is near the end of Bridgewater's industrial park area, so there may be some unusual power bumps when lightning rolls through.

>
> Most likely it all comes back to "no one knew it was off"
> and it needed to be turned back on.
>
> How long was WWTR off ?
>

I got a call at 3:10 that it was off. Not sure how long it was off before that but probably not long.

While I didn't note the exact time we got it back on, it was about 3:30.



>
> > Does this station have any lightning protection?
>

The tower is better protected than most with extra gaps in place inside the ATU. Tower is grounded as it is a unipole. STL is fiber fed T-1. Optilator on the Burk line. Xmtrs and main rack connected via copper strap to the tower and ground rods.

The best solution may be to put the entire site, transmitters included, on a double-conversion UPS.

Mike
 
Re: 1170 WWTR is afraid of thunderstorms - Big to do over nothing

Oh, all this for only 20 minutes ? Jeez - I thought it
was off the air for days every time there was a storm !

>
> I got a call at 3:10 that it was off. Not sure how long it
> was off before that but probably not long.
>
> While I didn't note the exact time we got it back on, it was
> about 3:30.
>
 
Signals aside, is WWTR bringing in any MONEY for Greater Media or is all the revenue coming from people buying ads on WMTR and just getting WWTR as a "freebie".
 
> > perhaps it's time for Greater
> > Media to make some upgrades to insure that WWTR isn't so
> > afraid of thunderstorms anymore.
>
> Is it really worth spending ANY money on a 243 watt
> Daytime-Only AM signal sandwiched between two very strong
> adjacents (WVNJ & WOBM)?
>
I wouldn't spend it. Good observation.
 
> Signals aside, is WWTR bringing in any MONEY for Greater
> Media or is all the revenue coming from people buying ads on
> WMTR and just getting WWTR as a "freebie".
>


Well just as an "Observant Listener" I have been noticing more and more central jersey co's advertising on the station such as car dealers and the like. Granted they only seem to air when WWTR is on the air (which makes complete sense), if anything they are an adjunct to whatever revenue WMTR itself accrues. You have a valid point advertising wise, but if they took some of the potential BIG BUCKS that they are planning on spending on WPEN and used it here it would certainly be $$$ well spent. I also heard a rumor about a year or so ago that stated that WWVA on AM-1170 was planning on changing their night pattern. Now I havent heard anything since then, but perhaps that would allow WWTR to run on "minimal" power at night. That would be pretty cool!

~DJinNJ
 
> I also heard a rumor about a
> year or so ago that stated that WWVA on AM-1170 was planning
> on changing their night pattern. Now I havent heard anything
> since then, but perhaps that would allow WWTR to run on
> "minimal" power at night. That would be pretty cool!

When Don Lohse owned what was then 1170 WBRW, he said he could've applied for Pre-Sunrise / Post-Sunset Authorization (PSRA / PSSA) for 1170's signal, but it would only be around 10 watts, so he didn't feel it was worth it. That kind of peanut-whistle signal would cover Somerville and Manville, but not much else.

1170 does have a 500-watt transmitter, so they could more than double their daytime power without needing a new transmitter, but unless they make changes to their antenna system, it is unlikely that the FCC would approve a power increase for WWTR.

As for WMTR/WWTR having a presence in Central Jersey, a few weeks ago they did a live remote from a classic car show in Somerville, almost within walking distance of WWTR's transmitter site. I thought they would pack up and go home at sunset, but this remote continued several hours after WWTR had signed off!

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FYI- WWVA is not making any changes in its night pattern. It had been under consideration, but no longer. Many years ago, at WPAT-AM, we had one of the early Nautel solid state transmitters and it was very sensitive to thunder storms. So much so, that during such weather we would switch to the old Harris tube transmitter until the storm was over. We actually liked the audio on the old transmitter better. At that time it was still "beautiful music."
As far as the old WBRW goes...Yes our daytime 500 watt signal was too directional for its own good. It blasted into the Delaware Water Gap and into Pa. However, when we would go 250 w. non-d, the signal was excellent to the degree that WHLW would call us and say they were hearing us down in their area.
 
>Some of you seem to have this idea that doubling a station's output has some benefit. There is litle, if any benefit to this. Going from 500 to 1000 watts or from 250 to 500 watts yields only a 3dB increase in signal or half an "S" unit. It's pure physics. To double the power in the field, you have to quadruple the transmitter power. Hence any beneficial increase for a 500 watter would require a minimum 2000 watts.
WWTR's xmtr could make the jump to 500 or even 1000 watts but FCC approval is very unlikely and, again, a 3dB boost(doubling xmtr output power) is nothing to write home about.<P ID="edit"><FONT class="small">Edited by OldiesJock on 07/13/05 10:58 AM.</FONT></P>
 
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