1250 WHNZ is hurting

[Parttimer]

People on this BBS snicker at TanTalk, informercial 1250, and other brokered or LMAed stations but if you owned one I bet you would be say HooRah! Clearly these stations are not setting the ratings on fire, yet people continue to pay to play even without measurable results. You dont get it, I dont get it, Don62 clearly doesnt get it, but obviously Clear Channel and Wagenvoord gets it.

A friend of mine relayed that a couple of years ago, an AE he knew from CC in Tampa said that 1250 was "printing money."

Nostalgia has also nailed it, there is a sizable group of pay-for-play broadcasters out there who will pay to do these shows whether it is making them money or not. Tan Talk was more prone to getting the lunatic fringe, whether it be psychics, sports shows, or the drunk New Yorkers, but they hung around until they ran out of money or got arrested or whatever.

Here's the point no one has made yet: Listener demand for conventional AM programming is very low. Few markets support more than 2 AMs ratings-wise (and for argument's sake I'll define "support" as more than a 1-share 12+). You can spend all that money to put "good" programming on , and odds are that you won't be able to sell it. Lots of great ideas get floated on this board, but reality is that in most of the top 100 markets, you've got one performing talk station on AM (usually Limbaugh's affiliate) and a maybe sports station that makes money. Well, guess what, CC has 970 and 620, and 620 is one of the highest-rated sports stations in the country. It's hard to say from the results of these two facilities that they "know nothing about broadcasting."

In Pittsburgh CC owns heritage rocker WDVE. The mantra inside the building there (known as "the flashcube"... it's a shiny square building on a hilltop) is "protect the mothership." They always consider the impact of any programming decision inside the cluster on DVE. Against their usual policy, they recently hired a very popular sports host, Mark Madden, who had put his foot in his mouth once too often for Disney/ESPN, and put him on one of their other stations..guess what, DVE went down.

Why on earth would they put something on 1250 that very likely could only take audience from one of their other two successful AMs, while there is a pile of money sitting out there from people who want to buy these shows. You want them to supply programming where there is little to no demand, and compete against themselves.

Does CC continue to own 1250 mostly so they don't have to compete against it? Probably. But that doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing. Quite the contrary. And only an adjustment to ownership rules will fix this, but I'd give you 100-1 odds that if someone else owned it, it would be running wither the stuff that's on there now, or religion, or Spanish-language programming.

 

[Don62]

Why on earth would they put something on 1250 that very likely could only take audience from one of their other two successful AMs, while there is a pile of money sitting out there from people who want to buy these shows. You want them to supply programming where there is little to no demand, and compete against themselves.

Does CC continue to own 1250 mostly so they don't have to compete against it? Probably. But that doesn't mean they don't know what they're doing. Quite the contrary. And only an adjustment to ownership rules will fix this, but I'd give you 100-1 odds that if someone else owned it, it would be running wither the stuff that's on there now, or religion, or Spanish-language programming.

A very poor rationale for multiple station ownership.
As many on these boards have suggested, to improve radio, multiple ownership rules should be revoked and co's should be broken up, like what happened to AT&T, which produced immediate competition and far better consumer choices.

The Telcom Act of '96 was touted as providing all these great and improved broadcasting choices. Instead, it mostly tightened programming and consolidated everything.

CC is clearly incompetent if it thinks Colon Blow programming is in the public interest.

This is a city-grade station heard across the state. 1250 isn't some 1kilo watter that no one cares about, you know, the other frequencies that CC has limited its competitors to operating.

Instead of helping the industry, CC's stranglehold on this market is dragging it down. CC is so fearful of harming its other properties, it lets a once-great station go down the toilet. Just like the way the company is: flushed with crap.

 

[Nostalgia]

Don62, please understand that I dont disagree with your basic premise about multiple station ownership and the downfall of radio as "we" like it. I just disagree with your statements that CC or anyone who plays what you think is crap on their frequency are bad businessmen. Believe me, despite my personal opinions of giant conglomerates, radio or otherwise, I do give credit where credit is due. And CC, Cox, CBS and others are (or were) making the kind of money that I wish I were making so these guys are not incompetent as you called them. Business 101 my friend: someone wants to pay to talk about colon blow, someone will take that money and make space on their station for it. The sad thing is that the AM spectrum as been designated the wasteland for this programming. You point about their 10kw daytime signal is valid but let us not deprive the listeners out in the fringes the benefits of a clean colon ;D.

Read my posts elsewhere on this board and you will see I am 100% for more localism in radio. Scottsvb5 question was answered by parttimer. As a standalone station, programmed independently against other stations in the market (not the cluster), it might be able to make more money. But CC has positioned itself well covering 3 of the formats popular on AM: news/talk, sports, and infocrap. If they grab a spanish/religous station they would have a clean sweep. But as parttimer points out, decisions are made not only about how they effect the competion but other stations in the cluster. That is unfortunate and probably not always "in the public interest" as your point out.

 

[Don62]

Just understand such "programming" puts CC in bed with the likes of Bro. Stair and other hucksters.

Real broadcasters in the past would have been embarrassed to have admitted to owning such a "station."

As for formats, there are other viable formats, such as adult standards, adult standards-lite AC like WGUL used to air, news-talk, etc., besides the crap aired now.

 

[Parttimer]

Understand a couple of things: I an not defending CC. However, if you're going to put a format on that depends on spot sales for revenue, that's going to be a tough road for a couple of reasons. First, it means you have to get ratings. That may or may not happen. The Marcoccis sold WGUL for a reason... even WITH some degree of ratings, the revenues were probably slipping. And where do the ratings and revenue come from? Probably from your own stations. It's a zero-sum game chasing those dollars.

Agreed, the only way it changes is if they are forced to sell some properties. They, like all others who broker time, do so in partnership with some questionable characters. It would be nice if they took the high road regarding client selection, but how many times in the course of American business has that happened? But spare us the rants about "crap." We all know it isn't good radio.

In the interest of full disclosure, did CC fire you at some point?

 

[Don62]

The Marcoccis in reports when the station was sold said they left the business because the locally-owned station couldn't compete against the multiple spot discounts provided by the large consolidators. Hence, another reason consolidation has wrecked the industry and nearly destroyed localism.

The station in 2005 also had strong ratings, much higher than the current occupant of the frequency which can't even pull a 1-share, according to posts on this very board.

You question concerning possible former employment with CC is off-base. I have never worked for CC.

 

[Parttimer]

The Marcoccis in reports when the station was sold said they left the business because the locally-owned station couldn't compete against the multiple spot discounts provided by the large consolidators. Hence, another reason consolidation has wrecked the industry and nearly destroyed localism.

The station in 2005 also had strong ratings, much higher than the current occupant of the frequency which can't even pull a 1-share, according to posts on this very board.

But think about it, you make my point to an extent. It got tougher and tougher to sell spots. i don't think a third CC AM would have a much easier time. you have to factor in the rapidly declining demand for AM ads in general, whether they be on corporate or locally-owned properties.

You question concerning possible former employment with CC is off-base. I have never worked for CC.

Sorry about that, just trying to figure out why you send so much anger their way.

 

[Nostalgia]

Just understand such "programming" puts CC in bed with the likes of Bro. Stair and other hucksters.
Real broadcasters in the past would have been embarrassed to have admitted to owning such a "station."
As for formats, there are other viable formats, such as adult standards, adult standards-lite AC like WGUL used to air, news-talk, etc., besides the crap aired now.

.
Firist, my personal opinion, the Marcoccis sold WGUL (and WLSS) because Salem threw 9.5 MILLION dollars at them. And while I never met the gentleman, from what I hear he was no dummy. Any and all other reasons pale to this.

Second, puh-leeeze Don62, hucksters and religious fanatics have been on radio as soon as they learned it was easier to reach thousands of suckers from one radio studio instead of going from town to town pitching their "crap" from a tent. And this was long before CC or consolidation, when owner/operators ran the stations (real broadcasters) but were not above taking money from some fool selling snake oil or autographed pictures of Jesus.

Third, yes some music formats on AM work, but your examples would not work for 1250. Why would you suggest airing Dove like music on AM with less fidelity and a crappier signal than Dove against the number 1 station in the market, the Dove? Pick your fights wisely grasshopper! , So, back to my earlier comment, CC has picked one of few formats for 1250 that works (bad radio/good business) in Tampa.

Unless one of us is on the CC board of directors, any further comments are not going to affect 1250 anyway. I will let you have the last word.