1340 WHAT... Programming for Profit?

[rtetro]

They only have half a ground system. Whoever rebuilt the AM tower aparently lost half the plans.

Not true. I investigated the ground system thoroughly and found that it is largely intact. A few radials are probably cut or missing, but nothing that would effect the signal. Most of the ground system is largely under pavement. The radials toward the south are limited by the site's property lines, but they are there up to that point.

The problem in NJ with WHAT is two fold. Firstly, WMID's signal is so phenomonal due to the transmitter being right right on salt water. For that reason, coupled with the tower height, WMID is limited to 890 watts. The salt water and largely underdeveloped area to the west, gives them a dramatic boost towards Philly. Secondly, WHAT's NJ signal is severely limited by the weak ground conductivity through Philly due to the heavy urban development of the area.

Apart from the Philly urban signal attenuation, and somewhat shorter than normal ground radials to the south due to property limitations, WHAT is pretty much right where a 1kw on 1340 should be.

Now, WHAT's night signal....well, that's another story. With a night limit (interference free contour) upwards of 22.5 mV/m on 1340, WHAT's night signal is virtually unlistenable more than 4-5 miles from the transmitter. Of course, this is often true with most Class C's on 1340 in the northeast.

 

[DanStrassberg]

Now, WHAT's night signal....well, that's another story. With a night limit (interference free contour) upwards of 22.5 mV/m on 1340, WHAT's night signal is virtually unlistenable more than 4-5 miles from the transmitter. Of course, this is often true with most Class C's on 1340 in the northeast.

Still. an NIF of 25 mV/m on a graveyard channel with 200 or more co-channel interferers is better than an NIF of 25 mV/m on a Class A channel with just one interferer

 

[gunsmoke]

What I don't understand is WHAT's degrading signal, but WURD continues to amaze me with their fantastic coverage. I remember passing their site in the 60's with their 3 guywire tower array, they were WFLN-A and ran 1kw-D only and would not get past Girard Avenue North and the airport South. Now it seems they hit the coast daytime and Oxford Valley at night when the Canadian station is not booming in, with their two stand alone units. Why do they have the authority to add a night signal and re-arrange their day pattern but WHAT is stuck??? Does anyone remember them in the 60's with their soul format going against WDAS, they ran 1kw-d and 250w-n and were heard loud and clean in all sections of the city...

 

[DG02816]

The reason for WURD's signal is due to their current chief engineer tackling a series of problems the former contract engineer didn't address. First was getting the transmitter matched to the array, getting both night and day patterns back in spec, aqnd adding some punchy audio processing. WURD can't increase power beyond the 1 kW-day, 105 watt-night due to WJWL Georgetown, DE. They're 10.8 kW-day, 1.08 kW-night.
WURD's chief is also looking into trying to use a presunrise authorization of 124 watts 6 am to sunrise, using the station's day pattern.

The reason again for WHAT's being boxed in is due to the large number of stations on the local channels-each frequency(1230, 1240, 1340, 1400, 1450, and 1490)has at least 100 stations
on it, and skywave from the others on the frequency comes in at night, making some a jumble. On 1340, you not only have WMID in Atlantic City getting out like gangbusters with 890 watts, but there's also WRAW in Reading to contend with. Rene hit the nail on the head saying that the normal interference free contour,the area where the station can be heard cleanly, drops sharply at night. I can herar HAT at night at home in Oreland, but barely above the co channel jumble.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

Come on, now, let's be realistic. AM radio is dead and FM isn't too far behind. That is simple reality. It was great while it lasted, but technology and consumption of media evolves. If more folks in terrestrial radio spent time, energy and resources on understanding new media and technologies and the social and behavioral changes of how its consumed instead of what ifs, they would be executing successful business models on a day-in, day-out basis. Stop going backwards.

People keep saying AM radio is dead and FM is close behind it, yet all the AM allocations in the NYC/Philly/Wilm/Balt/Wash metro are taken. Granted many are not making big money, but someone is listening to AM and as long as AM offers something not found on FM, it might be able to hang in a bit longer. Granted probably the bigger issue for AM's survival is not getting an audience, but getting one the advertisers want. I do agree that AM is becoming more religion and regional ethnic formats as news/talk and sports/talk are starting to migrate to FM. So AM's role will diminish more, but may be able to serve other groups of listeners who today are underserved as in various ethnic groups that can generate ethnic advertisers who want to reach their group, but maybe not to the level needed to support an FM station.

In terms of the "standards" format or what used to be referred to as popular music, there is an audience for that music - not all are 80+ years old either, just as there is an audience for Classical Music, Jazz, Blue Grass, Classic Country, Real Oldies, etc. These formats may generally skew older than the advertisers desire, as they don't get enough of the younger demos advertisers want. Yet there are people in their 20's who like all of those forms of music and do listen to stations playing that specific type of music if available in their area. A possible answer for the standards format might be the non-comm radio route. There are fewer and fewer commercial radio stations playing Classical Music, Jazz, Classic Country, Blue Grass, Real Oldies, Big Band/Standards, Polkas, etc. Many of these formats can be found on an NPR non-comm or college non-comm stations, so why not big band/standards? As Philly's WRTI covers Classical and Jazz, WHYY-FM offers some Classical, WVUD 91.3 Newark, DE U of Del offers on Saturday night a program called Scratchy Grooves, where the host plays from original 78 rpm's music from the 1920's through the 1940's. WVUD also airs a couple Blue Grass shows, plus other styles of music. WXPN Philly U of Penn offers alternative music. New Jersey's Rowen University radio 89.7 (forget the calls) offers Oldies sometimes, so why not a non-comm offering big band/standards as their primary format or even as a part of block programming similar to what WVUD is doing?

Frankly non-comm radio is where the real variety in music and the more creative type of programming is being found more and more. Between corporate underwriting and listener donations, it seems to work, where commercial radio's advertisers only want a real narrow segment of the audience and the commercial radio programming reflects that. As America's population continues to age, it might end up being that radio's "salvation" may be in non-comm radio, where you support your favorite station without the need of advertisers who's influence on programming would cease.

The thing I've never understood about the advertisers on radio's attitude towards the older demo vs cable TV's attitude. Commercial radio doesn't want anyone over 49, non-comm radio does want any one including the older demos, because they have more disposable income to donate. Cable TV found that selling the older demos works, just pick the right companies and products to sell to that aging Baby Boomer group. I don't think cable TV could survive without all the medicine spots. So why couldn't an Oldies or Big Band commercial radio station sell spots to those same companies? They'd be reaching the same audience that they get watching cable TV. But for some reason there's a mind set against that, so it seems the non-comm radio route is the answer for those of us who want that underserved style of music we like.

 

[MattParker]

@MFD: You raise some interesting points. And you are correct in your observation that several cable channels do target older viewers. But I think you are asking the wrong question: It should be why won't those same cable advertisers buy radio? In fact, the question can be asked more broadly: Why won't a lot of advertisers - including those targeting younger audiences - buy radio? If you think about the kinds of companies and products which were once big advertisers on radio, most of them still in business and going strong, but you don't hear most of them on radio any more. Radio people don't want to talk about this but top marketers and major agencies have been leaving radio as much as listeners. Why? Do they no longer see radio as an effective advertising medium? Do they not want to be associated with the controversy of talk radio or shock radio, or have their ads buried in a spot cluster on music radio? Does radio no longer have the advantage of being affordable - and targeted - compared to television with so many cable channels now available?

I know you don't like to have your assumptions questioned but it's just way too simplistic to think either than radio has this aversion to old people or that radio sales people are sitting on their thumbs and not bothering to pitch to any group of potential advertisers. You also seem to assume that if you pitch them, they will buy. Radio is a game of numbers, as is baseball. While you can bat .300 and be seen as a good hitter, really effective commission sales people are doing well batting .070. Another factor: Radio reps calling on cable advertisers would be asking them either to increase their ad budgets to add radio or to take some of their present spending in current media and move it to radio. This means persuading these advertisers radio can do as well or better for them than cable. Can it?

 

[MikefromDelaware]

@Matt, you make some good points. Your last one especially might describe where the problem for radio is coming from. At some point advertisers decided that radio wasn't as effective as maybe local cable TV advertising.

I watch very little TV, but when I do, I'm always pleasantly surprised to see local Wilmington area commercials (if you've got to sit through commercials better for your local area than some distant place). As you know Matt, it's definitely not cost effective for a Delaware business to advertise on the Philly TV stations as 95% of the audience is not in Delaware so you're paying way more money to reach people who aren't going to drive to Delaware to buy your product. About the only Delaware spots I ever see on a Philly TV station is political ads at election time as they've got millions of bucks to spend, that a local business could only dream of having for spots. So as a result, I've lived most of my life rarely, if ever, seeing TV commercials for something in Wilmington. So it's kind of a novelty to see them on Comcast. However, it helps to prove your point. More folks definitely watch TV over listen to the radio, so if local Cable spots are comparable in price and reach far more people in the target groups and metro area you want to reach, etc, etc, then sure why buy radio time when cable TV offers pictures of your product, restaurant, etc, etc. Cable TV appears to have become what radio used to be advertising wise, for the Wilmington area. I can't speak for other places, but maybe even in Philly where there is much local TV advertising, maybe the smaller businesses that can't afford the expense of OTA TV spots in Philly go to cable to reach their target demos, thus Cable TV even in a major market like Philly thrives and possibly is also taking away radio spot revenue as it appears to be doing in Wilmington.

 

[imhomerjay]

And the challenge with the radio to cable comparison is true of many niche formats--with cable or satellite radio, you can cobble together a viable audience from a larger pool. You can't do the same trying to run a standards format, for instance, in multiple cities, except for some that can get enough to just get by off a syndication service. The audience simply isn't there in large enough quantities to make it work the way it did a generation or two ago.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

And the challenge with the radio to cable comparison is true of many niche formats--with cable or satellite radio, you can cobble together a viable audience from a larger pool. You can't do the same trying to run a standards format, for instance, in multiple cities, except for some that can get enough to just get by off a syndication service. The audience simply isn't there in large enough quantities to make it work the way it did a generation or two ago.

Thus bringing us to my main point that maybe a Standards or Standards/Big Band format might be better served via non-comm NPR or non-comm college radio as other underserved musical formats are served in that venue and do quite well with loyal audiences and financial donations. A TV example would be Lawrence Welk, who's show originally was a popular TV show on ABC a long time ago, now revived as a popular show in reruns and some editing on PBS.

 

[MattParker]

And the challenge with the radio to cable comparison is true of many niche formats--with cable or satellite radio, you can cobble together a viable audience from a larger pool. You can't do the same trying to run a standards format, for instance, in multiple cities, except for some that can get enough to just get by off a syndication service. The audience simply isn't there in large enough quantities to make it work the way it did a generation or two ago.

Thus bringing us to my main point that maybe a Standards or Standards/Big Band format might be better served via non-comm NPR or non-comm college radio as other underserved musical formats are served in that venue and do quite well with loyal audiences and financial donations. A TV example would be Lawrence Welk, who's show originally was a popular TV show on ABC a long time ago, now revived as a popular show in reruns and some editing on PBS.

There are a couple of nostalgia - variety non-commercial stations around.
WRDV-FM 89.3, Warminster and WLBS-FM 91.7, Levittown simulcast in the northern Philadelphia suburbs.
And WDVR-FM 89.7 and 91.9 from Jersey covers Bucks County and a little more in PA.
Both have Internet audio streams you can listen to online.
Both are "listener supporter" both in terms of pledges and volunteer staff but it's my understanding neither meets the requirements to be a public radio station (and get CPB money).
Both emphasize standards, nostalgia, big band and real oldies but the formats are pretty ecclectic so genres as far afield as polka and bluegrass get air time, too.

There's also WNAR-AM 1620, Lansdale which runs a full 24/7 schedule of old time radio dramas, sitcoms, quiz shows, soaps, westerns, serials.... They also have an online audio stream.

As one who now listens to online radio much more than terrestrial radio, I get my "Great American Songbook" fix online so I don't miss stations like the old WIP, WPEN, WJBR-AM - or WJBR. At home I can listen on my computer. In my car or anyplace else, I listen on my smartphone (which can play through the car radio). Check out the "bring krth hd2 to wogl " thread currently running on this board.

 

[MikefromDelaware]

I'll have to go online and check those out. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Radio Wreck]

As far as their "incessant chatter", I believe that is a big part of their format. Not just chatter for the sound of it but talk that reaches to the audience. Reminiscent of 610 and 950 days. Very personal touch.

Getting back to the original topic, I don't think one can make an honest comparison between the sound and imaging of "The Station of The Stars" versus "The Greatest Music of All Time."

The old WPEN with Joe Niagara had great jingles and real personality. When it was news time at the top of the hour, the listener knew it! WHAT has no jingles and Mike Bowe sounds like he's about 100 years old. And Elaine? I'm surprised that she's not too embarrassed to return to Philadelphia radio after the Rabbi Neulander incident. I don't hold it against her personally, but some people have no shame I suppose.

 

[imhomerjay]

And you have what insight into whether or not she felt any shame at the time? That's what I figured.

 

[Radio Wreck]

And you have what insight into whether or not she felt any shame at the time? That's what I figured.

Slow down Mr. HomerJay. I have no insight on whether or not she felt shame at the time but it's obvious whatever shame as an adulterer she may or may not have felt back then, it hasn't prevented her from returning to radio and espousing her inappropriate lead in to public adjuster advertisements.

For example, a couple of months ago there was a huge fire that destroyed many homes out west and she lead into her commercial with, "the people who are affected by these fires should pay attention to this..." Really Elaine? My house is burning down and now is the best time to pay attention to your endorsement? Not to mention the obvious fact that since WHAT's signal barely covers the suburbs, let alone the western hemisphere, the folks affected by the fire would have had to be listening thru the internet which considering the circumstances would be difficult since their modems were smoldering before their very eyes.

Oh well. I thought it was in poor taste.

 

[jlongstreet]

You just love slamming Elaine, don't you, Radio Wreck? Do you happen to know her personally? Are you her pastor? Doctor? Friend?

Low blows.

And you have what insight into whether or not she felt any shame at the time? That's what I figured.

Slow down Mr. HomerJay. I have no insight on whether or not she felt shame at the time but it's obvious whatever shame as an adulterer she may or may not have felt back then, it hasn't prevented her from returning to radio and espousing her inappropriate lead in to public adjuster advertisements.

For example, a couple of months ago there was a huge fire that destroyed many homes out west and she lead into her commercial with, "the people who are affected by these fires should pay attention to this..." Really Elaine? My house is burning down and now is the best time to pay attention to your endorsement? Not to mention the obvious fact that since WHAT's signal barely covers the suburbs, let alone the western hemisphere, the folks affected by the fire would have had to be listening thru the internet which considering the circumstances would be difficult since their modems were smoldering before their very eyes.

Oh well. I thought it was in poor taste.