1360 Format Change

[Biz Listener]

Based on the WCPT numbers, think for a moment about what this format might do on a signal like WLS--not that we are likely to find out anytime soon.

Advocates of liberal news/talk formats have been singing that same old song for over a decades. What might this format do in a stronger station? If only we had more clearances. If only we had more stations. If only ...

If only it would work repeatedly and predictable across the board instead of one or two isolated examples. Ever hear the saying that even a broken watch (analog, of course) is right twice a day?

Plenty of people in radio have thought about what that format might do. It's been thought about, considered, tried, and usually failed since Bob Dole was running for President. How many times are you going to beat that dead horse?

 

[talkjim]

"Based on the WCPT numbers, think for a moment about what this format might do on a signal like WLS--not that we are likely to find out anytime soon."-TalkJim

"Advocates of liberal news/talk formats have been singing that same old song for over a decades. What might this format do in a stronger station? If only we had more clearances. If only we had more stations. If only ..."-Biz Listener

Biz, one skill that I routinely employ in my posts that you have yet to learn is the use of data--particularly ratings data. You philosophize, I introduce data, and when you find my data threatening to your biases, you respond with some more random, unsubstantiated thoughts. Anyone who doubts this is invited to check back through the posts on this thread.

It's really very simple, though. If WCPT can score a .9 in the Chicago ARB on a suburban daytimer without pre-sunrise authorization, and no daily local programming (although the station is doing some substantial local content on weekends)...it's perfectly reasonable to surmise that WCPT could do substantially better on a 50,000 watt, full-time, non-directional property such as WLS, with even a minimum of local programming, and the traditional WLS news, weather and traffic services.

"Plenty of people in radio have thought about what that format might do. It's been thought about, considered, tried, and usually failed since Bob Dole was running for President. How many times are you going to beat that dead horse?"

You're half right, Biz. It has been thought about and considered, but as I have repeatedly pointed out, it has rarely been given a fair test. By that I mean a full-time, city-grade signal, with quality news, weather and traffic elements, and at least one well-produced local show. The truth is that there may be only one station in the nation that has really gone all the way with a format that leans somewhat progressive and at the same time is service-oriented, and that would be KGO/San Francisco, which of course has much to show for itself. Yes, it's a progressive-leaning market, but not nearly to the extent that many conservatives have deluded themselves into believing. KGO's sister station, KSFO, is all-conservative, and routinely does well, although, I must say--not as well as KGO, which is a station that I would think others would want to emulate. And until they do, Biz, I'll be here, at least occasionally, beating on my dead horses.

 

[Biz Listener]

"Based on the WCPT numbers, think for a moment about what this format might do on a signal like WLS--not that we are likely to find out anytime soon."-TalkJim

"Advocates of liberal news/talk formats have been singing that same old song for over a decades. What might this format do in a stronger station? If only we had more clearances. If only we had more stations. If only ..."-Biz Listener

Biz, one skill that I routinely employ in my posts that you have yet to learn is the use of data--particularly ratings data. You philosophize, I introduce data, and when you find my data threatening to your biases, you respond with some more random, unsubstantiated thoughts. Anyone who doubts this is invited to check back through the posts on this thread.

It's really very simple, though. If WCPT can score a .9 in the Chicago ARB on a suburban daytimer without pre-sunrise authorization, and no daily local programming (although the station is doing some substantial local content on weekends)...it's perfectly reasonable to surmise that WCPT could do substantially better on a 50,000 watt, full-time, non-directional property such as WLS, with even a minimum of local programming, and the traditional WLS news, weather and traffic services.

"Plenty of people in radio have thought about what that format might do. It's been thought about, considered, tried, and usually failed since Bob Dole was running for President. How many times are you going to beat that dead horse?"

You're half right, Biz. It has been thought about and considered, but as I have repeatedly pointed out, it has rarely been given a fair test. By that I mean a full-time, city-grade signal, with quality news, weather and traffic elements, and at least one well-produced local show. The truth is that there may be only one station in the nation that has really gone all the way with a format that leans somewhat progressive and at the same time is service-oriented, and that would be KGO/San Francisco, which of course has much to show for itself. Yes, it's a progressive-leaning market, but not nearly to the extent that many conservatives have deluded themselves into believing. KGO's sister station, KSFO, is all-conservative, and routinely does well, although, I must say--not as well as KGO, which is a station that I would think others would want to emulate. And until they do, Biz, I'll be here, at least occasionally, beating on my dead horses.

Whatever. I predict that you'll introduce some trivial but meaningless "fact" that proves nothing, and you introduce some trivial but meaningless fact that proves nothing, then you brag about providing "data".

I told you what facts would prove that the liberal news/talk format as the potential appeal that would turn it into a mainstream format instead of a niche programming gimmick that only works in a handful of markets, and you don't provide any such facts. Instead, you provide isolated examples that prove that liberal news/talk is a programming gimmick that only works in a handful of markets. And on top of that, you claim that your handful of isolated examples aren't proof that the only proof that exists is a handful of isolated examples.

Tell you what. You want to prove that liberal new/talk radio is as viable a format capable of working in as many markets as conservative news/talk? Don't list isolated examples. Post some "facts" about the large number of markets that have seen significant success with liberal news/talk. As long as you keeping posting examples and "facts" about the tiny handful of markets where liberal news/talk has been a success, I don't need to. You're posting the facts that prove my point, so why should I bother?

Liberal news/talk is a niche format that only works in a handful of markets. It is not a mainstream format that can be expected to bring success.

Now, let's see you post some "facts" that prove that simple statement wrong. And remember, any facts about the success of liberal news/talk in a handful of markets proves me right, it doesn't prove me wrong.

 

[talkjim]

Biz,

This is my final post in this thread-enough is enough. I've been posting facts since my first post here--facts in the form of ratings data that you have chosen to ignore because the data don't support your biases. But they are nonetheless facts, and other posters, including some who don't necessarily agree with all of my interpretations of the facts, have credited me with bringing some substance to this discussion.

All you have done in return is to bash in angry fashion without evidence, and you have sadly continued to do that in your most recent post. It's time to do some homework Biz, provide some hard evidence to support your case, and stop with the anger. Either that, or just dry up, which is what I'm going to do.