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2 Active Rockers Bite The Dust In Chicago & Tampa

P

PassDutch

Guest
This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.

And today @ noon, 94-7 The Zone in Chicago signed off with Metallica's "For Whom The Bell Tolls" and became an oldies station.
 
> This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in
> Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa
> stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic
> rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.
>
> And today @ noon, 94-7 The Zone in Chicago signed off with
> Metallica's "For Whom The Bell Tolls" and became an oldies
> station.

Awww, and you were probably hoping they would become "Brew" stations.

(For those who don't read the Los Angeles, San Francisco, Atlanta, Seattle, Sacramento, Oklahoma, or Oregon boards, Mr. Dutch spammed all seven yesterday with his "predictions" that the Milwaukee-based "Brew" format would replace something in each market.)<P ID="signature">______________


</P>
 
> This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in
> Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa
> stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic
> rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.
>
> And today @ noon, 94-7 The Zone in Chicago signed off with
> Metallica's "For Whom The Bell Tolls" and became an oldies
> station.
>
Active rock is dead.... dead....dead...dead.The music has sucked for at least the last 10 years.Almost every rock station i know of that still plays the new junk, leans heavy on classics most times 50-50 sometimes even more.
If you think I am wrong name me one band since Kobain died that is the caliber of a Beatles, Cream,Doors, Led Zep,Black Sabbath,Queen,Skynyrd,Van Halen,Metallica,etc... name 1... Nickleback??? Pearl Jam??? LOL
What rock needs is another 60s type revolution. Back when I was in High School eveyone listened to rock. All the kids today listen to hip-hop.Heck even country gets better numbers 18-34 than rock.. I mean Gretchen Wilson sounds more rock and roll than rock does.... bash away people...
 
There is a lot of good rock music being made today:Beck, The Arcade Fire, Bloc Party, Coldplay, Death Cab For Cutie, Franz Ferdinand, Modest Mouse, The Postal Service, The Decemberists, Louis IV, The White Stripes and the list goes on.They just don't play it on active rock stations. You either have to listen to non-com stations or the occasional innovative commercial station like Indie 103.1 in Los Angeles.
 
> Mr. Dutch spammed all seven yesterday with his "predictions"
> that the Milwaukee-based "Brew" format would replace
> something in each market.)
>

Despite the "Dookie Passing's" so-called "Brewspam", "Classic Rocker" brought up some very legitimate points concerning the problems with the Active Rock format. The format will wither on the vine if it continues to be programmed in its current mindset.

First off, Active Rock is programmed as a singles-based format. Generally, most Active Rockers program their currents from a list of 25 or 30 singles. The singles are played roughly 40-80 times a week (thats roughly 5-10 times per day). Back when I was listening to the Rock stations of my youth, new music was programmed from albums, rather than singles. No, not every cut from the album would be played on the station (it takes a good MD to pull out the bad cuts), but if you can get six or seven listenable cuts from a new release, you immediately expand your base of currents to 210 tracks (30 albums x 7 tracks). This reduces listener burnout and increases an individual's time to listen to a station. I'd venture to guess that most people tune out from a station if they are going to hear the same song they heard 4 or 5 hours previously. Can you imagine the lack of repetition while still focusing on the current core mainstream artists?

People have argued that people listen less to the radio nowadays due to addtional distractions/media that are avialable to them now that were not available to them at an earlier time (i.e., video games and the Internet) . I personally don't think that's true. A person can turn on the radio and do vitually anything they do now except listen to a CD in their stereo/PC or download/listen to music from their MP3 files or other sources. I think people utilize these sources because the terrestrial Active Rock stations are not providing their listeners with enough depth and variety to keep them entertained and dedicated. Listeners would stay tuned in if the station kept the programming interesting.

Second, as far as throwing in "Classic" cuts to the mix goes, playing the same two or three Petty/Floyd/Zeppelin/Aerosmith/GnR tracks into the mix will only subject the station to ridicule. If the tracks for the "core" arists are expanded acccordingly, and some seminal lesser-known bands are thrown in as well, stations could pick up some higher-end demos from their targeted audience. Back when I was a teen, the local rocker played about 33 percent Classic cuts. And they went deep into the vault on occasion. I never knew what I would hear next, and that drew me in to listen a little longer.

Third, we're all aware that a lot of the listeners who might otherwise listen to Active Rock are listening to other forms of music (i.e., Hip Hop, Punk. Emo and Electronic). Back when I was a rabid dedicated listener of Rock Radio, the local Rock station would play Robin Trower (heavy Blues Rock) and Peter Tosh (Reggae) in the same set (and got 4.7 ratings 12 +). The station would throw in a song or two in between to allow for the transition between to allow a segue to make the music set flow naturally. That's where local, live talent with a knowledge of music and their audience comes in. Combine that with a good MD, PD and supportive management, and you'll probably have a recipe for ratings sucess.

Granted, ownership rules, costs and technology has changed the business of Contemporary Rock radio greatly in the past 10-plus years. However, Active Rock will continue to wither on the vine if it continues to be repetitive and mechanical. Younger listeners want excitement and variety in their radio, and they are certainly not getting that now, so they are turning to other media to get their music.

Just my opinion on the Active Rock situation.

Eggs...Light Bulbs...Paper Cups...Oh! They threw a Stroh's... : )

BTW, I think The Brew sucks.
 
> There is a lot of good rock music being made today:Beck, The
> Arcade Fire, Bloc Party, Coldplay, Death Cab For Cutie,
> Franz Ferdinand, Modest Mouse, The Postal Service, The
> Decemberists, Louis IV, The White Stripes and the list goes
> on.They just don't play it on active rock stations. You
> either have to listen to non-com stations or the occasional
> innovative commercial station like Indie 103.1 in Los
> Angeles.
>

Postal Service is more Synth Pop. But regardless its good stuff.
<P ID="signature">______________

AIM: JeremyA1069</P>
 
> >
>
> BTW, I think The Brew sucks.
>
Which one????lol... agreed,living in the Milwaukee area I have listened to it on and off for about a year now....talk about cookie cutting.
Latest trends in Milwaukee have the brew down and heritage WKLH back up on top.. thank God.
 
Korn
System of a Down
Staind
Sevendust
Disturbed
Chevelle
Papa Roach
Velvet Revolver
STP
Fear Factory
Megadeath
Slipknot
Atreyu
Cradle of Filth

Tired of typing. These bands sound great.
 
> > >
> >
> > BTW, I think The Brew sucks.
> >
> Which one????lol... agreed,living in the Milwaukee area I
> have listened to it on and off for about a year now....talk
> about cookie cutting.
> Latest trends in Milwaukee have the brew down and heritage
> WKLH back up on top.. thank God.
>

I'll bet they all suck...I personally went to the Columbus Ohio affiliate's website and had the "pleasure" of hearing soundbites of the format at their Home Page. Bad, bad, bad. Nothing but the hits...the bad ones. A recycle of the worst Burkhart-Abrhams Superstars top-tracks circa 1983. Obviously this is my opinion....but those same songs were played to death then....and now they want to play them to death again.
 
> This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in
> Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa
> stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic
> rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.
>

Where do you get the idea that 98 Rock is/was America's oldest active rocker? Remember, they dumped rock for a few years in the mid 80s and were CHR as "Z-98". Dunno when they debuted originally. WAAF in the Boston market has been a hard rocker continuously since the early 70s. WBCN has been some form of rock since the late 60s. I'm sure there are others.
 
> > This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in
> > Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa
> > stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic
> > rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.
> >
>
> Where do you get the idea that 98 Rock is/was America's
> oldest active rocker? Remember, they dumped rock for a few
> years in the mid 80s and were CHR as "Z-98". Dunno when
> they debuted originally. WAAF in the Boston market has been
> a hard rocker continuously since the early 70s. WBCN has
> been some form of rock since the late 60s. I'm sure there
> are others.
>
KDKB in Phoenix has been around for a long time...early 70s at least
 
> >
> KDKB in Phoenix has been around for a long time...early 70s
> at least
>

KDKB, Phoenix has been around since the summer of 1971 in one form of rock or another. KDKB's predecessors were KCAC (1010 AM) from 1969-1972 and KNIX-FM (102.5 FM) in 1968.


Speaking of long-running rockers.....KSHE (Saint Louis) AND WEBN (Cincinnatti) have been in a Rock format since 1967. KLOS in Los Angeles has been around since 1971, but has been one form of Rock or another since 1968 or so (as KABC-FM). Also, WMMR in Philadelphia has been around since 1968, but it started out in 1968 as WIP-FM.
 
> Active rock is dead.... dead....dead...dead.The music has
> sucked for at least the last 10 years.Almost every rock
> station i know of that still plays the new junk, leans heavy
> on classics most times 50-50 sometimes even more.

Could they have to lean on the classics because the record people don't want to try to give Active rock something it could call it's own without sharing with modern or mainstream rock since Rock has been fractured that much in the last 10 years? Besides Active Rock has been IMO considered mainstream rock that is heavier. I see you have a dim view like some to new rock no matter what. I have found a few who after a certain age do not like new rock no matter what... can't change their made up minds on it.

But the main reason Active rock stations lean on the classics could be <shock> that active rockers still like the classics? There are people who do like Nickelback and other new rockers while still breaking out the Van Halen and other classic rockers.... It's two fold right now with newer rockers liking some of the new rock not found on the active rockers and classic rockers like yourself who said "nothing good since Kurt Cobain" who are doing in Active rock IMO.




> If you think I am wrong name me one band since Kobain died
> that is the caliber of a Beatles, Cream,Doors, Led Zep,Black
> Sabbath,Queen,Skynyrd,Van Halen,Metallica,etc... name 1...
> Nickleback??? Pearl Jam??? LOL

Ok what made them so high caliber? could it be time my friend? Lynyrd Skynyrd was not given credit until after the plain crash by some..They were considered "redneck hicks" but now they are a great band of all time ... Nirvana was hated by mainstream rock as being crap punk from Seattle and only 10 years later are they really coming into their glory after Rolling Stone magazine and others harp on how good it was... Metallica..hum, they were too heavy until their black albumn and only now 15-20 years later is their 80's material getting the honest look it deserved by people like yourself...

New groups, hum Shinedown, Nickelback, 3 doors down, switchfoot, Kenny Wayne Sheperd, Dave Matthews Band, Blues Traveler to name a few .... A lot of the new groups are following in the bands you named steps but are rocking a little differently than they did, mainly to appeal to wider audiences and of course times chainging...
Wait the 10 years, when the groups I said above are playing on your classic rock station and cream, doors, beatles are thrown to the side because "they don't fit the demo we are looking for anymore".... I know I'm hearing less of those three everyday than 10 years ago. Instead of giving the new rockers a shot today and allowing the newer fans to get to know the Beatles, Cream, and the doors while at the same time classic rock will limit itself again in a few years when most of the fans of those classic groups are past the age 54 demo and get canned off the station like oldies stations are doing to some songs already today.

I think Nirvana and the whole scene that came out at that time fractured Rock. It wasn't a progression like it for the years previous was but a change that some wasn't wanting to come that quick.

So the AOR either went classic rock to hang on to the older style songs and listeners at that time or tried to hold on as Mainstream or Active rock stations, the people who wanted rock like Nirvana,Pearl Jam and groups of that nature started following modern rock or Alternative stations

Now, instead of that progression we had in the 60s- the early 90s, we have people who are turning off some of the newer rock and going to the classic rock stations because they beleive all new rock is crap even though some of it would appeal IMO to people like yourself if given the chance.


> What rock needs is another 60s type revolution. Back when I
> was in High School eveyone listened to rock. All the kids
> today listen to hip-hop.Heck even country gets better
> numbers 18-34 than rock.. I mean Gretchen Wilson sounds more
> rock and roll than rock does.... bash away people...
>


Everyone listened to rock cause it was what mom and pop hated (plus the music was good). Yeah the kids are listeneing to hip-hop but guess what? Hip-hop has started to retread just like rock did and the kids are tuning out of it and are starting to listen to modern rock again.. plus when the little league mom is singing along to Eminem it causes the kids not to want to listen to mom's station.

People are starting to grow tired of the same retread crap and are seeking out newer bands and formats, country is growing due to acts the people can relate to, it doesn't sound like the "hick" music they've heard previously (even though some are starting to enjoy the classic country as a form of Alternative go figure).. and is crossing over again to pop to the point that the music is getting blurred sometimes (with some country stations playing classic rock). Gretchen sounds like the music she grew up on and guess what? The new country acts like the pop and the hip hop and the rock stars just like rock stars like country (Metallica liking Waylon Jennings , Jack White of the white stripes doing doing on a Loretta Lynn CD)..The times, they are a changing..

You want a 60's rock revolution again? How about encouraging the new groups to sprout the wings, show what they can do , instead of being like the old codger going "it's never going to be 1969 again"

RFLA
 
> Korn
> System of a Down
> Staind
> Sevendust
> Disturbed
> Chevelle
> Papa Roach
> Velvet Revolver
> STP
> Fear Factory
> Megadeath
> Slipknot
> Atreyu
> Cradle of Filth
>
> Tired of typing. These bands sound great.
>
WJJO Madison is a good place to hear most of that stuff as well as Slipknot and Cradle Of Filth type stuff more often then the average active rocker. They also play a full hour of hard metal/death metal/black metal weekday mornings at Midnight. Stuff I couldn't ever imaging hearing on commercial radio. Usually confined to Headbangers Ball or College radio. A lot of it is uncensored too.<P ID="signature">______________

AIM: JeremyA1069</P>
 
> > This Friday, 98 Rock (America's oldest active rocker) in
> > Tampa shifted from active rock to modern rock. CC Tampa
> > stayed away from gold based rock when it flipped classic
> > rocker Thunder 103-5 to country US103-5 this April.
> >
>
> Where do you get the idea that 98 Rock is/was America's
> oldest active rocker? Remember, they dumped rock for a few
> years in the mid 80s and were CHR as "Z-98". Dunno when
> they debuted originally. WAAF in the Boston market has been
> a hard rocker continuously since the early 70s. WBCN has
> been some form of rock since the late 60s. I'm sure there
> are others.
>


WEBN/Cinci and WMMS/Cleveland, continuous rockers since 1968. WMMS "reported" as a CHR in the mid 80s to get record product and promotions to beat other stations, but they were still a rock station, just not in R&R's eyes. <P ID="signature">______________
Everyone is entitled to my opinion.</P>
 
Re: WMMS was very much a CHR station

WMMS "reported" as a CHR in the mid 80s to get record
product and promotions to beat other stations, but they were
still a rock station, just not in R&R's eyes.

> WMMS was very much a Top 40 station from the mid to late 1980's. I have a recording of WMMS from December 1985 and they played such artists as "Whitney Houston", and "Wham". The 90 minute tape did feature "New Years Day" by U2 and "The Last Time" by the Rolling Stones, but most of the rest of the music was CHR.

dlf
 
Re: WMMS was very much a CHR station

> WMMS "reported" as a CHR in the mid 80s to get record
> product and promotions to beat other stations, but they
> were
> still a rock station, just not in R&R's eyes.
>
> > WMMS was very much a Top 40 station from the mid to late
> 1980's. I have a recording of WMMS from December 1985 and
> they played such artists as "Whitney Houston", and "Wham".
> The 90 minute tape did feature "New Years Day" by U2 and
> "The Last Time" by the Rolling Stones, but most of the rest
> of the music was CHR.

I heard them a couple of times during their CHR phase...they sounded like a bit of a hybrid between rock & CHR...they still played a lot of AOR-ish stuff that didn't get much CHR airplay elsewhere mixed in with Wham! & Madonna. The presentation wasn't very high energy either...don't recall hearing any jingles or sweepers, jocks seemed kind of mellow (though they did talk over intros). Was the old G-98 still CHR or had they gone classic rock by then?
 
Re: WMMS was very much a CHR station

>
> I heard them a couple of times during their CHR phase...they
> sounded like a bit of a hybrid between rock & CHR...they
> still played a lot of AOR-ish stuff that didn't get much CHR
> airplay elsewhere mixed in with Wham! & Madonna. The
> presentation wasn't very high energy either...don't recall
> hearing any jingles or sweepers, jocks seemed kind of mellow
> (though they did talk over intros). Was the old G-98 still
> CHR or had they gone classic rock by then?
>

Someone from Cleveland may have the exact dates, but I want to say WGCL changed formats to Classic Rock as WNCX in either 1986 or 1987. I only heard WMMS as a CHR in December of 1985 and I have that tape stored away somewhere; "Matt the Cat" was the Jock on the tape and he seemed to be more of an AOR jock (which I say in a very positive manner, being an old AOR listener myself).
 
> > Active rock is dead.... dead....dead...dead.The music has
> > sucked for at least the last 10 years.Almost every rock
> > station i know of that still plays the new junk, leans
> heavy
> > on classics most times 50-50 sometimes even more.
>
> Could they have to lean on the classics because the record
> people don't want to try to give Active rock something it
> could call it's own without sharing with modern or
> mainstream rock since Rock has been fractured that much in
> the last 10 years? Besides Active Rock has been IMO
> considered mainstream rock that is heavier. I see you have a
> dim view like some to new rock no matter what. I have found
> a few who after a certain age do not like new rock no matter
> what... can't change their made up minds on it.
>
> But the main reason Active rock stations lean on the
> classics could be that active rockers still like the
> classics? There are people who do like Nickelback and other
> new rockers while still breaking out the Van Halen and other
> classic rockers.... It's two fold right now with newer
> rockers liking some of the new rock not found on the active
> rockers and classic rockers like yourself who said "nothing
> good since Kurt Cobain" who are doing in Active rock IMO.
>
>
>
>
> > If you think I am wrong name me one band since Kobain
> died
> > that is the caliber of a Beatles, Cream,Doors, Led
> Zep,Black
> > Sabbath,Queen,Skynyrd,Van Halen,Metallica,etc... name 1...
>
> > Nickleback??? Pearl Jam??? LOL
>
> Ok what made them so high caliber? could it be time my
> friend? Lynyrd Skynyrd was not given credit until after the
> plain crash by some..They were considered "redneck hicks"
> but now they are a great band of all time ... Nirvana was
> hated by mainstream rock as being crap punk from Seattle and
> only 10 years later are they really coming into their glory
> after Rolling Stone magazine and others harp on how good it
> was... Metallica..hum, they were too heavy until their black
> albumn and only now 15-20 years later is their 80's material
> getting the honest look it deserved by people like
> yourself...
>
> New groups, hum Shinedown, Nickelback, 3 doors down,
> switchfoot, Kenny Wayne Sheperd, Dave Matthews Band, Blues
> Traveler to name a few .... A lot of the new groups are
> following in the bands you named steps but are rocking a
> little differently than they did, mainly to appeal to wider
> audiences and of course times chainging...
> Wait the 10 years, when the groups I said above are playing
> on your classic rock station and cream, doors, beatles are
> thrown to the side because "they don't fit the demo we are
> looking for anymore".... I know I'm hearing less of those
> three everyday than 10 years ago. Instead of giving the new
> rockers a shot today and allowing the newer fans to get to
> know the Beatles, Cream, and the doors while at the same
> time classic rock will limit itself again in a few years
> when most of the fans of those classic groups are past the
> age 54 demo and get canned off the station like oldies
> stations are doing to some songs already today.
>
> I think Nirvana and the whole scene that came out at that
> time fractured Rock. It wasn't a progression like it for the
> years previous was but a change that some wasn't wanting to
> come that quick.
>
> So the AOR either went classic rock to hang on to the older
> style songs and listeners at that time or tried to hold on
> as Mainstream or Active rock stations, the people who wanted
> rock like Nirvana,Pearl Jam and groups of that nature
> started following modern rock or Alternative stations
>
> Now, instead of that progression we had in the 60s- the
> early 90s, we have people who are turning off some of the
> newer rock and going to the classic rock stations because
> they beleive all new rock is crap even though some of it
> would appeal IMO to people like yourself if given the
> chance.
>
>
> > What rock needs is another 60s type revolution. Back when
> I
> > was in High School eveyone listened to rock. All the kids
> > today listen to hip-hop.Heck even country gets better
> > numbers 18-34 than rock.. I mean Gretchen Wilson sounds
> more
> > rock and roll than rock does.... bash away people...
> >
>
>
> Everyone listened to rock cause it was what mom and pop
> hated (plus the music was good). Yeah the kids are
> listeneing to hip-hop but guess what? Hip-hop has started to
> retread just like rock did and the kids are tuning out of it
> and are starting to listen to modern rock again.. plus
> when the little league mom is singing along to Eminem it
> causes the kids not to want to listen to mom's station.
>
> People are starting to grow tired of the same retread crap
> and are seeking out newer bands and formats, country is
> growing due to acts the people can relate to, it doesn't
> sound like the "hick" music they've heard previously (even
> though some are starting to enjoy the classic country as a
> form of Alternative go figure).. and is crossing over again
> to pop to the point that the music is getting blurred
> sometimes (with some country stations playing classic rock).
> Gretchen sounds like the music she grew up on and guess
> what? The new country acts like the pop and the hip hop and
> the rock stars just like rock stars like country (Metallica
> liking Waylon Jennings , Jack White of the white stripes
> doing doing on a Loretta Lynn CD)..The times, they are a
> changing..
>
> You want a 60's rock revolution again? How about encouraging
> the new groups to sprout the wings, show what they can do ,
> instead of being like the old codger going "it's never going
> to be 1969 again"
>
> RFLA
>

New rock is good, until it gets overplayed, such as the case with Green Day, songs from American idiot are so overplayed it makes me want to scream every time I hear it<P ID="signature">______________


<div align="center"><a href="http://wrcf.tk">
wolf_logo3a.png
</P></span></P></span>
http://dingo100.tk
http://wrcf.tk</P>
 
> New rock is good, until it gets overplayed, such as the case
> with Green Day, songs from American idiot are so overplayed
> it makes me want to scream every time I hear it
>


I'm a person who loves new rock with classics, but unfortuately newer stuff ain't being made as much as it used to that can appeal to many generations. I'm not usually a Green Day fan, but American idiot was one of their best ever but because it became popular it was overplayed till people got sick of it.

Most new rock coming out is aimed for alternative and modern rock stations where I find active rock and mainstream rockers sometimes aren't as happy to play some of it (as it sounds too industrial)and that's one of the reasons stations like that are heavier on classics than they need to be (even though the classics they play are usually so tired it ain't funny)


RFLA
 
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