2 Country FM's Coming to L.A.?

[SuperRadioFan]

Re: Who is Elvis Presley? Who are the Beatles?

OldGringo/David Eduardo Gleason... If people who felt as you do were around radio broadcasting companies in the 1950's, 1960's, and 1970's how might that have changed the pop music icons we are all familiar with and the sound of pop music history?

Nice way to answer the question ......NOT!!!

Haha yes I'm worse than an elitist and Damn Proud of it! ;D

"I just did not try to sell through 10 new songs a week. "

What in the Wide World of Sports does that mean??

Re. the I-Pod I thought you were smart enough to discern exxageration, guess I was wrong about your IQ heh heh.

John77 you get it, so does David at USC, so do some others.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

BTW Old Gringo, I said it before ... You need to be slapped silly or spanked HAHAHAHAHAHA

Hey I can have fun

 

[OldGringo]

KYSR effectively began to "blow up" their station in late February and early March of this year. They were playing only 5-6 currents at that time and then the week of March 4th, they added new tracks from Fall Out Boy, The Fray, Bon Jovi, Daniel Powter, Train and Natasha Bedingfield... they twittled their thumbs for a few weeks before adding some more new songs on March 22nd...K.T. Tunstall's "Black Horse And The Cherry Tree" along with Nickelback's "Savin' Me" and Anna Nalick's "Breathe" were brought into the fray...

On April 9th, they began a more "listener intensive" approach, asking listeners to rate 100's of songs... and then deciding which ones to play more or drop based on those results... a lot of the 80's gold vanished and then they continued their evolution back to what they once were: an Alternative leaning, currents based Hot AC station...

Soon after that, their transition was complete... they have maintained their current format since mid-April of this year, with the current-heavy mix of songs ranging between 30 and 40 currents at any given time...

They are reaping the benefits now as the trends show... the station sounds fresh and lively and even the DJ's sound a lot happier on the air... it's a win-win situation all the way around... if they continue along this trek, there is no doubt they can get to the top 15 in the Arbitrons and maybe even higher.

What part of "going down each month in 18-34 and 25-54" was it hard for you to understand? The actual months of August and September and the extrap for October for Star show the station declining each month... of course the three month trend does not show the downtrend, just the average of three months. In fact, though, October is at the same level as March, before the alleged changes started. While there was a nice spike in the summer, it did not hold and the station, in 25-54, is, within the margin of error of the data itself, identical to where it was 10 months ago. 18-34 is significantly below the early 2006 level, meaning the station is older and has less audience. In fact, the mid-days and afternoons are off, and mornings are helping, along with weekends, to bolster the tepid numbers from 10 to 7.

FYI, the on-air "listener poll" makes for a nice "involvement" touch, but no station uses such data to program... they employ very well designed and well recruited tests of the actual songs, not top of mind impressions by the active part of the audience. Clear Channel has two research companies, one of which was used to test the KYSR library several times so far this year.

If they continue the way they have the last 3 months, it will be doubtful that they make the top 20 stations in LA. This, for a station that will end this year with less than half the billing it had when Ken Christensen was the GM.

 

[OldGringo]

Re: Who is Elvis Presley? Who are the Beatles?

"I just did not try to sell through 10 new songs a week. "

What in the Wide World of Sports does that mean??

New songs are hard to program, as it is widely known that they "hurt" each hour and are a key tuneout point in adult formats. This is why stations sandwich them between powers, and "sell" them via positioning to the audience. In other words, stations say, "hey, we know this song is unfamiliar, but take a listen anyhow" via some hook, like the strength of the artist, etc.

If you look at the Houston PPM data, you can see that the new songs (less than 100 spins on the station) cause more audience loss than commercials.

 

[BACKnUSSR]

Blah, Blah, Blah....same old "I know all" attitude.

1) Just curious...how does current intensive KROQ do (25-54) in Los Angeles?
2) NO Hot AC's in America start currents out at 30+ spins a week....light current rotations (where most new songs start out, average 7-12 spins a week) look at Mediabase.
3) How did Ruben Blades enter this discussion?
4) Maybe the commercials in Houston are particularly entertaining!! Haha.
5) I think he meant Jamie is Horrid rather tha "torrid" the "T" and "H" are close together And she is.

 

[OldGringo]

Blah, Blah, Blah....same old "I know all" attitude.

1) Just curious...how does current intensive KROQ do (25-54) in Los Angeles?

How does it what?

2) NO Hot AC's in America start currents out at 30+ spins a week....light current rotations (where most new songs start out, average 7-12 spins a week) look at Mediabase.

Most start at about a 5 hour separation, excluding morning drive in some of them. That gets the song about 20 plays a week, not 7. The highest rated hot AC in the US gives new songs about 2o spins a week.

This means that the songs can be put on callout in about 4 weeks, as before it the average listener has not even heard them 3 times.

Most staitions have either a separate new tune category or stick the new songs in the upbound current category... so they get enough rotation to be something other than an occasional irritant.

 

[john77]

Re: Who is Elvis Presley? Who are the Beatles?

OldGringo/David Eduardo Gleason... If people who felt as you do were around radio broadcasting companies in the 1950's, 1960's, and 1970's how might that have changed the pop music icons we are all familiar with and the sound of pop music history?

Nice way to answer the question ......NOT!!!

Haha yes I'm worse than an elitist and Damn Proud of it! ;D

"I just did not try to sell through 10 new songs a week. "

What in the Wide World of Sports does that mean??

Re. the I-Pod I thought you were smart enough to discern exxageration, guess I was wrong about your IQ heh heh.

John77 you get it, so does David at USC, so do some others.

Thank you, sir...

 

[john77]

25-54 cume fell under 4 hours in October, a sure sign of an unfamiliar, current-excessive playlist. This is supposed to be an edgy female AC, not an alternative rocker. Maybe that musch newer stuff works in Denver, but this is LA and the music is just not exposed enough for a fringy station to build cume with so much unfamiliarity. They shoulad have eliminated currents for a while, not the opposite. That said, they did increase cume about 50 thousand in October, so the advertising may have brought in some new cumers but they did not listen much, and brought the TSL down.

David...This position represents much of what is wrong with radio today. Disrespecting the demographic. The 25+ demographic is not serviced with currents, so they default to classics. Then a station like KYSR makes the wise choice to emphasize currents, sees its 12+ rise, and then veteran radio programmers, like yourself, look for any metric they can find to "kill off" the fresh thinking. Finally, KYSR has become a listenable station, after years of tired old retreads. Want to know what is holding KYSR back? It's Jamie. She's lovely to have around the halls of the station, but torrid on the air. Replace the morning show and watch the station take off.

KMVN built its approach around the morning show, but forgot to think through how repetitive and boring the rest of the day sounds. KBIG is much more "interesting" than KMVN outside of morning drive. Just like how KYSR is becoming a very listenable station, EXCEPT during morning drive.

Very well put, David at USC... even the part about Jamie... she's been the worst part of the station for a long time... I've been saying for a very long time at many other places that their morning show has to go...
you can definitely be funny without being crude...

 

[john77]

You are seeing KYSR exactly opposite of how the listeners are reporting to Arbitron. Perhaps you might rethink your postion, as you are outnumbered.

OF COURSE he's outnumbered!! You know statistics like the back of your hand, OldGringo....

He is outnumbered by the listeners who have already begun to express thier dislike for the changes in Star.

So you THEN know that HE is in a tiny minority of people in the World who actually have more than an average intelligence and IQ.

I have a more-than-average intelligence and IQ. I like to hear songs that I know and that have memories and feelings attached to them. I have spoken with adult listeners from the brightest to the dumbest, and I have never heard anyone compalin that radio did not play enough songs they had never heard of and never heard before.

Most people (listeners) in this country I would think are not the sharpest knife in the kitchen. And THAT is why we get in any language homogenized radio with overly repetitious formats ... YES that makes a lot of money for the broadcast management teams and owners.

I do not have such an elitist, demeaning and negative view of listeners. Some are brighter, some are not, some have more money, some do not. They are just Americans, and most adult Americans like familiar songs, not one unknown song after another.

I don't want to sound like an elitest, but shooot...

You are worse than an elitist. An elitist leaves each person to their own thing, and just thinks their thing is superior. You want to put down the rest of the folks, the ones that don't agree with you.

Radio programming is about finding common threads... and that is all a "format" is: a common thread that ties a group of people together. You are about taking down to people.

Serious question for you, David G..... If people who felt as you do were around radio broadcasting companies in the 1950's, 1960's, and 1970's how might that have changed the pop music icons we are all familiar with and the sound of pop music history?

I was around the industry in the 60's and 70's. I helped to make many of the artists you mention stars in Latin America. I also helped to find mass appeal salsa, cumbia, Spanish pop and ballad stars, ranging from Ruben Blades to Maria Conchita to Menudo to Juan Luis Guerra. I just did not try to sell through 10 new songs a week.

The average iPod has around 300 songs on it.

You assume incorrectly so many times in this post that it is beyond laughable, Old gringo...

What made Star successful in the first place was it's variety and it's image as a "cutting edge" type station... they are simply getting back to what they used to do... the people that have enjoyed them in the past are coming back in droves... people such as myself kind of didn't want to hear "Don't You Forget About Me" for the 1,187th time or "The Metro" for the 998th time... it's something called burn out... Hot AC listeners don't like their songs fried to death, unlike their AC counterparts...

If you look at Star's current top 100 songs, you'll see that there is A LOT of familiarity there...

The Killers When You Were Young
Evanescence Call Me When You're Sober
Snow Patrol Chasing Cars
Nickelback Far Away
Rob Thomas Street Corner Symphony
The Fray How To Save A Life
Goo Goo Dolls Let Love In
James Blunt Goodbye My Lover
The Red Hot Chili Peppers Tell Me Baby
Mat Kearney Nothing Left To Lose
Panic! At The Disco I Write Sins Not Tragedies
Ray LaMontagne Three More Days
Hinder Lips Of An Angel
KT Tunstall Suddenly I See
The All-American Rejects Move Along
Augustana Boston
Fall Out Boy Sugar, We're Goin Down
Gorillaz Dare
Green Day Holiday
Five For Fighting World
John Mayer Waiting On The World To Change
The Red Hot Chili Peppers Dani California
Rocco DeLuca & The Burden Colorful
Lifehouse You And Me
Blue October Into The Ocean
Blue October Hate Me
Rascal Flatts What Hurts The Most
Howie Day Collide
KT Tunstall Black Horse And The Cherry Tree
The Killers Somebody Told Me
The Fray Over My Head (Cable Car)
Goo Goo Dolls Stay With You
Five For Fighting The Riddle
Evanescence Bring Me To Life (w/ Paul McCoy)
Tim McGraw When The Stars Go Blue
Gnarls Barkley Gone Daddy Gone
John Mayer Belief
Ok Go Here It Goes Again
30 Seconds To Mars The Kill
Daniel Powter Love You Lately
Christina Aguilera Hurt
Dashboard Confessional Stolen
Better Than Ezra Juicy
Michelle Branch Everywhere
Fall Out Boy Dance, Dance
The Killers Mr. Brightside
Maroon 5 This Love
New Radicals You Get What You Give
Green Day Wake Me Up When September Ends
Train Drops Of Jupiter
Lenny Kravitz It Ain't Over 'til It's Over
Gwen Stefani Hollaback Girl
Avril Lavigne Complicated
The Cranberries Dreams
No Doubt Ex-Girlfriend
Sublime Santeria
No Doubt Spiderwebs
Gin Blossoms Hey Jealousy
Gnarls Barkley Crazy
Coldplay Speed Of Sound
Dave Matthews Band What Would You Say
Kelly Clarkson Behind These Hazel Eyes
Blind Melon No Rain
Kelly Clarkson Since U Been Gone
Kelly Clarkson Miss Independent
Moby South Side
Gorillaz Feel Good Inc.
Gwen Stefani Cool
Rob Thomas Lonely No More
The Cardigans Lovefool
Beck Loser
Third Eye Blind Jumper
Puddle Of Mudd Blurry
Green Day Boulevard Of Broken Dreams
Orchestral Manoeuvres In The Dark If You Leave
Barenaked Ladies One Week
Jane's Addiction Jane Says
Nirvana Smells Like Teen Spirit
The Red Hot Chili Peppers Scar Tissue
Meredith Brooks Bitch
3 Doors Down Kryptonite
Shawn Mullins Lullaby
Lifehouse Hanging By A Moment
Linkin Park In The End
Dave Matthews Band Crash Into Me
Lenny Kravitz Are You Gonna Go My Way
Nickelback Savin' Me
U2 Beautiful Day
Fatboy Slim The Rockafeller Skank
Natasha Bedingfield Unwritten
Alanis Morissette Ironic
Sheryl Crow Soak Up The Sun
Blink-182 All The Small Things
The Red Hot Chili Peppers Other Side
Sugar Ray Every Morning
Pink Just Like A Pill
Jewel You Were Meant For Me
------------------------------

Bottom line is Star's ratings are on the way up, the listeners completed online surveys and the station actually listened and made the changes and look, the ratings are up nearly 50% in 6 months... you can't deny the facts...

 

[CHRles]

Hate to break it to all of you Star supporters, but nobody on here knows radio better then David Eduardo.

K-Rock isn't focused on 25-54 but rather on 18-34. It Since the demo 25-54 includes people ages 25-34, and since K-Rock has a lot of heritage, they pull off good ratings with the 25-54 crowd.
In addition K-rcok has
1) A morning show adults may enjoy
2) Is NOT a HOT/AC but rather a Modern Rock station. As such, it can get away with playing MORE new/unfamiliar music. It's the type of station people expect to hear something new, unfamiliar, but at the same time they usually expect a certain core sound which the audience perceives as cool/hip.

Adult formats that can get away with unfamilar music are Triple A since they dig deep into albums their audience enjoys, and Smooth Jazz stations b/c the overall sound is familiar.

Modern A/C? being an A/C type of station is a different format with different demands. The people on this board don't represent the typical listener for ANY format. That's why you have people on here that will slam K-Rock even though they like Modern Rock, slam Power 106 even if they like Hip Hop, and slam KOST even if they like A/C.
On the other hand, take a person that works 10 hours a day, has kids, hangs out with friends, watches tv, works out, goes to stores, maybe goes to nightclasses, has certain hobbies that take up part of their week (yoga, coaching, bowling, knitting, politically active, etc.) and you'll realize most of the listeners are not like you. They want to be entertained with the music or sounds they love, or that their friends and family enjoy.

We are lucky to be living in a time where we have the option to listen to lots of radio stations and virtual stations webcasting online, or we have the option to purchase satellite radio.
Music geeks like us have options that didn't exist several years ago. With these options we drift further and further apart from the mainstream audience and we expect way more then our local radio can give us. Radio will only start paying attention to your needs once we become the norm, not the exception. They're starting to do so with HD Radio. We all need to just deal with the fact that we expect MORE than what local radio can service to us, without alienating most of the radio audience.

 

[OldGringo]

What made Star successful in the first place was it's variety and it's image as a "cutting edge" type station... they are simply getting back to what they used to do... the people that have enjoyed them in the past are coming back in droves... people such as myself kind of didn't want to hear "Don't You Forget About Me" for the 1,187th time or "The Metro" for the 998th time... it's something called burn out... Hot AC listeners don't like their songs fried to death, unlike their AC counterparts...

Star was set up to be link two in Clear Channel's "wall of women." Kiss for 12-29, KYSR for 25-39, KBIG for 25-44 and Hispanic females, and KOST for 35+ women.

Star was designed to be a hot AC without the rhythmic, emphasizing the alternative stuff that was not as edgy or hard as KROQ played for its 60% male core, and aiming for 25-39 vs. 18-34. In other words, an alternative flavor for women who found late-90's KROQ to be harder than they liked, and KIIS to pop and KBIG to rhythmic and KOST to old. A perfect fit, and those were the instructions Ken C. was given when he helped put the original Star success formula together.

Unfortunately, Star's billings are off by over 50% from two years ago, as the staiton has not been working like it used to. Blame part of that on the changing ethnicity of LA, especially after the 2000 Census and also the loss of Seacreast, who propped up afternoons while the music dayparts were dying.

Bottom line is Star's ratings are on the way up, the listeners completed online surveys and the station actually listened and made the changes and look, the ratings are up nearly 50% in 6 months... you can't deny the facts...

I have told you about three times that in 25-54 and 18-34, Star is declining in each of the last three months. THEY ARE NOT GOING UP. They are going down.

Online surveys are used to make the listener think they are involved. They are never used, alone, for music decisions except by idiots. They did AMTs and call out, and used that... not some web poll that can easily be influenced by competitors, record promoters and fans. You really aren't so naive you believe this tripe, are you?

The ratings are lower than before the change in 18-34 and 25-54. Not a lot, overall, but then again, the station was down about as low as a full B could get before the genious from Denver arrived. They had one fluky good month in Summer, which helped a bit, but no other month since then has been going anywhere but down. In fact, the 12+ Summer 2006 number is identical to the 12+ Summer 2005 number, but way under the numbers from previous years.

Again: ratings are not up 50%. They are flat to down, and way below where they were a couple of years ago.

 

[OldGringo]

Very well put, David at USC... even the part about Jamie... she's been the worst part of the station for a long time... I've been saying for a very long time at many other places that their morning show has to go...
you can definitely be funny without being crude...

That is funny. Jamie has better numbers than either of the other two prime dayparts, 10-3 and 3-7. Nice try, but Jamie is holding the station away, in mornings, from the hole the strasight music shifts have been sucking it into.

 

[OldGringo]

Hate to break it to all of you Star supporters, but nobody on here knows radio better then David Eduardo.

Thanks for the vote, although I fear you exaggerate considerably. I'd love others who can see the numbers, like radioresearcher, to weigh in on this one, as our new poster seems to have a mistaken idea that ratings are read from right to left, instead of from left to right.

 

[john77]

Hate to break it to all of you Star supporters, but nobody on here knows radio better then David Eduardo.

Thanks for the vote, although I fear you exaggerate considerably. I'd love others who can see the numbers, like radioresearcher, to weigh in on this one, as our new poster seems to have a mistaken idea that ratings are read from right to left, instead of from left to right.

That was a VERY cheap shot.

 

[OldGringo]

Thanks for the vote, although I fear you exaggerate considerably. I'd love others who can see the numbers, like radioresearcher, to weigh in on this one, as our new poster seems to have a mistaken idea that ratings are read from right to left, instead of from left to right.

That was a VERY cheap shot.
[/quote]

Not really. After going to the wall in trying to inform you, within the limits of board policy, that KBIG was up HUGELY in October, and KYSR is on a 3-month down trend, you insist just the opposite is true. In fact, all your reads on the book, including the survey dates, KYSR's numbers a year ago, the overindexing of mornings, etc., etc., are wrong.

 

[Marv-L.A.]

Okay folks--so which station is CC going to flip to country---KYSR or KBIG?????

 

[davideduardo]

Okay folks--so which station is CC going to flip to country---KYSR or KBIG?????

Star just had its best month in several years in November. KBIG is billing extremely well.

The answer is, "unilikely." I doubt either will change.

 

[Marv-L.A.]

Given the amount of 'defensive' radio programming which has become the norm since consolidation started, it's no wonder that having a sub 5.0 rating can get you a top three rating in tons of cities, and do LOTS of harm to formats that should be doing MUCH better, such as Smooth Jazz.

 

[john77]

Okay folks--so which station is CC going to flip to country---KYSR or KBIG?????

Star just had its best month in several years in November.

;D