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2 part question (Help) WMJQ 92.5 WHFM 98.9

Just fleshing out Lee's excellently detailed posts re: WHFM's format switch to Top 40:

My friend and mentor in getting started in radio from 1966 to his death in 1974 was Bill Givens, longtime PD, program director and voice of the Rochester Americans (Bill was a consummate hockey and big-band music fan.)

Bill confided to me in one of my periodic visits to WHAM in the fall of '67 that there was a plan to upgrade 98.9 from its then partial beautiful music, part WHAM simulcast 8300 watts ERP to full Class B status and go automated Top 40. The idea was to flank WBBF which even with its piddly 1kw directional signal had boxcar numbers and was a serious competitor to WHAM revenue-wise. Recall that this was the heyday of AM radio and Top 40 was king of a youth-dominated demographic.

The switch to Top 40 was made in March 1968. The new automation system consisting of reel machines and two Gates 55 automatic cart players, along with a rudimentary "computer" (really a logic switcher using pegs for programming) was located in a new studio carved out of part of the former huge WHAM record library at 350 East Avenue, right down the hall from Givens' office. WHFM's first jingles were PAMS Series 31, "Music is Our Middle Name." The format was not "progressive rock" as that term is commonly understood but pretty much Top 40, directly competitive with WBBF. Initially Grobe was the sole (automated) voice on the station. Tuning in the new 98.9 at my parents' home in Livonia, I recall making a congratulatory call to Givens about the new stereo signal and programming. I asked him how it was going; he proudly told me "it's right down the hall, running like a little clock."

I stayed in touch with Bill throughout various career moves while I was at Ithaca College 1968-72; I would stop by WHAM and visit at Christmas or other holidays. On snowy occasions I would give him rides home to Pittsford so Connie wouldn't have to come pick him up. Curiously, Bill Givens never learned to drive.

Bill Givens' death at age 50 in late '74 was a great loss to WHAM, and to Rochester radio. It was his plan to upgrade WHFM and take it Top 40. The project was always a nakedly one-objective plan to pull down WBBF's shares and enhance WHAM competitively. Perhaps the raison d'etre evolved post-1968, but that was the initial goal.
 
Bob (or anyone else) - do you recall when WHFM moved from 350 East Avenue next door to the second floor of 344? I know they were up at 344 by 1982 or so, when I started visiting the local radio stations.

Amazing to think how many of them there were within a couple of blocks along East Ave. back then - channel 10, WHFM, WHAM, WEZO/WNYR (and then channel 31, too) at 360, plus WSAY a few years earlier, and WPXY around the corner on Union Street a few years later.

Here's my contribution to the trivia: the building at 370 East Ave., on the corner of Alexander, next door to the Malrite stations, almost became a major Rochester broadcast facility in the fifties. Around 1957, WHEC drew up plans to move radio and TV to 370 East Ave. from the Rochester Savings Bank building on Franklin Street, but somewhere along the way WRNY decided to sell its building at 191 East Ave., which had been built big (by a builder!) in anticipation of the WRNY-TV that never materialized...and so WHEC took over WRNY's building and 370 East was left untouched.
 
Savage said:
The idea was to flank WBBF which even with its piddly 1kw directional signal had boxcar numbers and was a serious competitor to WHAM revenue-wise.  Recall that this was the heyday of AM radio and Top 40 was king of a youth-dominated demographic.

Bill Givens was truly one of the Rochester radio greats.  His plan was probably a good one, too since WBBF's piddly little signal in the mid to late 60s was delivering audience shares in the 30s and 40s - roughly double the numbers that WHAM was showing at the time.
 
Larry White's commments about WBBF's success over a 25 year period from the late 1950s through the early 1980s proved one big truth about radio...if you program a station really well, a comparatively weak signal doesn't have to kill you. BBF in its heyday, when Larry, Jack Palvino, and Ferdinand J. Smith were all part of the crew, was so good you would go out of your way to listen even if you lived in the nulls to the eastern and southern suburbs of town.

Kind of like WDKX today--its weak signal compared to its competition doesn't stop it from owning the under-35 audience, just like WBBF 40 years ago. .
 
Bill Givens was a genuine radio professional and a true gentleman. I wonder how a guy with his kind of personality would fare in today's media environment? I never knew he didn't drive a car (!)

The WHFM transmitter fire in the late '70's caused a bit of excitement. Fortunately, the company had already ordered a new Collins 831 20kw for WAEB in Allentown, PA. Even more fortunately, that transmitter had been delivered and was sitting in the crate ready to go. So off to Rochester it went. I think FM99 was only off the air for a week or so. An old truck body was salvaged to serve as the transmitter shack.

WHFM moved to 344 East Avenue in the spring of 1971. My younger brother had just been kicked out of high school (again) and was pressed into service building the studios and offices, by way of penance. Both he and I spent quite a bit of our teens and early 20's building studios and wiring transmitters.
 
In the gallop to get on the TV bandwagon, there was a flurry of CP's issued prior the television freeze 1948 to 1952. Among them was WARC-TV, later WBBF-TV, on Channel 15. Of course once the freeze was lifted and CP holders saw unreceivable, money-burning UHF stations dropping away like flies in a Raid-storm, CPs were allowed to expire, or were turned back in to the FCC.

WBBF had downtown offices in the 1950s - I believe they were in the Manger Hotel IIRC. The radio studios were still out on South Clinton Avenue at the Tx site, but I wonder if there were similar plans for TV studios at the hotel...if anyone has info?
 
Back in the day Mid 60's to Mid 70's WBBF was indeed one class act..Though it had that "piddly" signal as described it did have some "skip" ...The station was so good I listened at 3 AM in Chester County,Pa. after WPEN signed off at Midnight...I was able to get it oocasionally in West Virginia in Winter before the Directional Pattern Change around 5 PM...I remember hearing it at night north of Toronto I guess after the CKBB Powerdown...Pretty darn good radio for someone to go to these lengths to catch...WWJ was usually around where ever you were.
 
hey bob savage we met many years ago though george kimble when he just owned cgr also through the ce ken haight ken took me under his wing helping him with engineering work on the 1550 transmitter and the 102.3 transmitter and if memory serves it was about the time he sold cgr and flc to bob antonorelli and his partner i cant remember his name in which that didnt work out and every thing went back to george now that was so many years ago wernt you involed with george with somthing
 
lee rust where do i know you from lets remember i have been out of radio since 87 i worked at cq 102, wgva, wcgr,wmbo, pix 106 , 94 rock, ok 100 jog my memory i worked for a lot of owners and jocks i retired during a very bad divorce my last job was wish 95
 
maybe ive heard your name on the air sometime in my past where have you worked ? do you or anyone else remember major tom; tom messner he was at majic 92 before it changed to country i used to work with his wife in auburn she was in news lisa marrow or somthing like that the last i heard many years ago they went to watertown for a husband and wife gig
 
Hi, Gary - George and one of his brothers were multi-filers on Docket 80-90 FMs back in the 1980s. As a daytimer on 1030 WYSL had a comparative FCC preference for 93.3, which was initially assigned to Avon. A competing application against Radio Livingston was filed for 93.3 by George's brother Bill.

To counter the Avon proceeding I filed the Petition for Rulemaking and added 107.3 to Honeoye Falls. A competing application was filed against Monroe-Livingston Radio Associates by, I think, George's sister. The 107.3 actually went to hearing in Washington, and we won.

In a three-cornered transaction we transferred our CP for 107.3 to the Kimble faction and they dismissed their competing app for Avon. It was actually a little more complex than that since Honeoye Falls figured in a divorce settlement with the CP going to George through her. Then George sold it to Minturn Osborn and eventually Osborn's stations wound up with Jacor and then Clear Channel.

As we all know, 107.3 and 95.1 swapped COLs enabling the Class B to move to Baker Hill and become a real Rochester signal. But it all started with us in 1988.
 
got it i think i remember that mess so then whats going with the honeyoe site the tower still stands with the antenna's still on it earlier in the summer i stopped their and talked to the property owner who told me the mess their sba hasn't done anything with it cc hasn't done anything with it either but somebody's got to paying the bill on the beacon light what a shame to let a tower site go like that but with the market their so saturated with all the signals on baker hill it makes it hard for anybody to do anything with it unless somebody puts a translater their i used to work at 95.1 when great lakes owned itand our studio house on 332 and i used to hang with the ce can't remember his name but i remember going up that hill in the middle of winter to do maintainance on the transmitter cant remember what was in their what a scary trip that was i also used to have to go to the ski lodge one night a week in the middle of the night to run psa tapes on a radio shack mixing board and a reel to reel revox til six in the morning and they didnt even give me gas money wow what we wouldn't dobackn the day didn't i hear in the summer you wre having a problem with some spanish station interfering with 1040 running a million watts somewhere i thought i heard that on a program on wbcq shortwave it also was messin up new yorks 1010 nice chattin
 
I think you're referring to the original 107.3 site on Routes 5 & 20 in Bloomfield. If I'm not mistaken CC still owns it as an emergency backup site for the South Hill site (former/original Rural Radio Network, WMIV 95.1 site, now 107.3.) Of course 95.1 is now on the 100.5 tower in Victor.

The engineer for WYLF, back in the day, was Jerry Whitney.

The station currently interfering with WYSL isn't a foreign signal, but WBZ in Boston, which is currently occupying three channels at night when it used to use just one. Its IBOC sidebands are interfering badly with us as 1040 is first-adjacent. We've filed multiple complaints with the FCC without results. It's been a high-profile case highlighting the many problems with HD Radio industry-wide.
 
ok bob now im from the old school of engineering when the sub carrier was used for muzak is that the same theroy for digital using the subcarrier for hd ? with digital having a wider bandwidth
 
Hi Guys 'n Gals,

Peter Grobe here, straight from the horses mouth...(First station manager and sole announcer on automated WHFM). I just found a reference link to this site and wanted to say that Lee Rust was absolutely correct when he said that WHFM started out originally as wall to wall "beautiful music" played from large reel to reel tape recorders. On New Years Day 1967 I had been hired by Program Director Bill Givens to host my own evening 8-12 midnight show on Big Brother 50KW Clear Channel WHAM, but when I heard that Mr. Rust wanted to change the format and install The New Gates Tape Cartridge Automation, I volunteered to take on the task for no additional pay, for six months, while we ran the new format (progressive rock album cuts with a few top 40s thrown in for good measure) commercial free in an effort to bring the station from its number thirteen rank (out of 13 stations in the market) to something saleable. It worked! We decided to go to straight "Top 40" some time in late '69 or early '70. By the time I left in 1971, I was in the unique position to be in competition with myself in the 8-12 time slot where I had a #1 ranking and a 30% share on the WHAM side, and the WHFM station had risen from #13 to a distant #3 during that time slot with WBBF solidly in #2.

I was the only voice on the station in those early days and had to record intros to songs on cartridge, however, it wasn't always the same intro because I cleverly thought to record three different intros to the same song on the same cart. So, it was the same intro on every fourth cycle. We thought we could fool most of the people most of the time. But, if you listened 'round the clock...the jig was up! ;D
 
Hi Lee,

Boy O Boy! You got that right! I'm living in Northern Westchester County, semi-retired doing professional photography (www.petergrobephoto.com) and the occasional Voice-Over online. I hope all is well with you, and if your dad is still around give him my best.

Peter
 
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