540 screw up

[tanner]

Tuesday @ 3pm Shot Doctor from 740 was simulcasting on 540 for a whopping 25 minutes until someone realized they had screwed up. Way to go Cheap Channel. There have been lots of miscues on 540 lately. However that was the most blantant one.

 

[byron]

They need to rename 540 to "RUSH over to the board to fix your miscue RADIO 540, W-EFF-ELLL-A!"

One can only wonder why they aren't RUSHing to bless us with this great programming on a full 100K flamethrower.

Oh and I have one more...

If this is what a 50,000 watt front porch sounds like, watch your step because those nails sticking up out of the boards can hurt your sound.

Thanks I'll be here all week.

 

[tanner]

Garfla can you still get 540 in Tampa at night?. Before they moved their array from 4 towers in the green swamp to 6 towers near Clermont they boomed into Tampa at night. Now traveling from Tampa to Orlando at night you cannot even receive it with a lousy signal until you pass the 429 exit towards Apopka. Also, when youare traveling eastbound on SR50 you can actually see their towers and the signal is breaking up. What a stupid decision Cheap Channel made to combine with 740, it should have been the other way around. When you pull the list of 540 stations on radio locator who are they protecting to the west and why would they need directional during the day as the closest 540 is in Columbus Ga. The 540's to the west are class D low power stations. Who are they protecting?

 

[drt]

Garfla can you still get 540 in Tampa at night?. Before they moved their array from 4 towers in the green swamp to 6 towers near Clermont they boomed into Tampa at night. Now traveling from Tampa to Orlando at night you cannot even receive it with a lousy signal until you pass the 429 exit towards Apopka. Also, when youare traveling eastbound on SR50 you can actually see their towers and the signal is breaking up. What a stupid decision Cheap Channel made to combine with 740, it should have been the other way around. When you pull the list of 540 stations on radio locator who are they protecting to the west and why would they need directional during the day as the closest 540 is in Columbus Ga. The 540's to the west are class D low power stations. Who are they protecting?

I don't know about Tampa, but where I am (on the fringe of downtown St. Pete, about 3 blocks from USF Bayboro Campus) 540 is not here at all at night, except on a very good dx radio and even then it's receivable but unlistenable; 540 used to listenable here; albeit a weak signal.

I have a second listening post in eastern Hernando county .2 miles from US 301 and State Road 50 (near the edge of the Green Swamp) and there 540 used to boom in day and night; it was the strongest AM signal; now it still is the strongest AM signal during the day; but at night, it is barely listenable

At that eastern Hernando location,WDBO 580 comes in better at night.(not to mention the fact that WDBO seems to have local news and current weather after 7PM.)

drt.

 

[jmtillery]

Garfla can you still get 540 in Tampa at night?. Before they moved their array from 4 towers in the green swamp to 6 towers near Clermont they boomed into Tampa at night. Now traveling from Tampa to Orlando at night you cannot even receive it with a lousy signal until you pass the 429 exit towards Apopka. Also, when youare traveling eastbound on SR50 you can actually see their towers and the signal is breaking up. What a stupid decision Cheap Channel made to combine with 740, it should have been the other way around. When you pull the list of 540 stations on radio locator who are they protecting to the west and why would they need directional during the day as the closest 540 is in Columbus Ga. The 540's to the west are class D low power stations. Who are they protecting?

During the day WFLF is protecting first adjacent WAYR-AM 550 Orange Park (Jacksonville). There may be others that I am not aware, but for sure 540 is protecting AM 550 during the day.

Also, keep in mind 540 is a Canadian clear channel, and for years no U.S. AM station operating on 540 was permitted night authority per treaty between the United State and Canada. However, that changed in the '70s allowing U. S. 540 stations night operation provided all Canadian 540 stations were given full protection. Originally when 540 was WGTO and still a daytimer and licensed to and serving Cypress Gardens (Winter Haven), 540 was given only 1,000 watts directional night operation which occured in 1978. The night signal was highly directional, again, to protect Canada as no radiation was permitted North at night.

In 1990, when, what was then, WGTO was re-licensed to Pines Hills in an effort to target Orlando and Central Florida, as part of that move the FCC permitted 540 to increase night service to a full 50,000 watts provided nothing was sent North, again to protect Cananda. Originally, 540 used 12-towers to occomplishish its 50kw night signal, but was allowed to reduced the number of night towers when it was determined and shown this could be done while still protecting Canada.

So, to answer your question: "Who" is WFLF protecting? It's every Canadian radio station operating on 540 Khz along with a few U. S. stations the FCC has determined is in need of protection. I don't have a list of the U. S. stations, but even if there were no other stations on 540 in the U. S., Canada would still be the main issue.

 

[wondorlandohits]

It's obvious that Tillery is the brains in this outfit.

 

[drt]

I can understand the nulls to protect 550 in Orange Park/Jax and the deep nulls to the north to protect the Canadian clear channels on 540, but........... that being said, these deep nulls were in place in the former array, what I cannot understand is now at night there are deep nulls to the west as well and if I am understanding other poster's comments, these new deep nulls to the west are keeping some areas of Lake County {part of the Orlando market} from having a usable night time signal on 540; of course this would be good news for WDBO 580 as far as talk radio listeners in the Groveland and Clermont areas of Lake county.

drt

 

[tanner]

JM Tillery is right about the North, maybe David Eduardo has an answer about to the west and the change from great signal to no signal to the west. 46000 watts unlisteneable 5 miles due west of their towers.

 

[redneckriviera]

Canada AND Mexico--at least back in the old days. Had it been only Canada, they could have gotten away with a much simpler DA system merely protecting to the north, instead of having nulls to the SW as well as NW. FWIW, I don't think they ever had to provide protection to Orange Park. Instead, I believe that the pattern protecting Columbus (and Windsor & the Canadian border) allowed the guys up in Jax to slip in 550. We need one of the old GTO chiefs to chime in.

One of the twists is that Canada is in the process of shifting all the AM stations over to FM--though I think Windsor's 540 is still operating. Thus far, though, they have not renegotiated the treaty and/or regulations impacting U.S. stations. So even when Canandian clears have gone silent, American stations still have to protect them.

Don't know what's happening with the Mexican clears. Then again, the last time anyone paid any attention to a Mexican clear, Wolfman Jack was howling over North America with 250,000 watts on 800 from suburban Del Rio...

 

[drt]

I was suspecting Mexico might still have to be protected as it used to be (when WGTO 540 was a daytimer and if I recall, they were 10,000 watts during critical hours).

That being said, that explains the null to the s.w. and one would think that deep null would also extend to the w.s.w.; instead (at least according to www.radio-locator map, there is another slightly less severe null to the west to w.n.w.; which is the one that affects western Lake county. (Groveland and Clermont).

Clermont is a fast growing suburb of Orlando and night time service from 540 to portions of Clermont is now just a memory.

drt

 

[davideduardo]

JM Tillery is right about the North, maybe David Eduardo has an answer about to the west and the change from great signal to no signal to the west. 46000 watts unlisteneable 5 miles due west of their towers.

Post NARBA, Mexico was given joint rights to 540. In the 60's they licensed 150,000 XEWA, San Luis Potosí, SLP (and at the same time forcing KFMB 540 San Diego to vacate 540 for 760). So 540 Florida protects Mexico to the west, and quite severely.

 

[davideduardo]

Also, keep in mind 540 is a Canadian clear channel, and for years no U.S. AM station operating on 540 was permitted night authority per treaty between the United State and Canada. However, that changed in the '70s allowing U. S. 540 stations night operation provided all Canadian 540 stations were given full protection. Originally when 540 was WGTO and still a daytimer and licensed to and serving Cypress Gardens (Winter Haven), 540 was given only 1,000 watts directional night operation which occured in 1978. The night signal was highly directional, again, to protect Canada as no radiation was permitted North at night.

Sometime in the last half of 1958, WDAK moved from 1340 to 540 with 5 kw day and 500 watts night, so there was night use of 540 before 1970.

 

[tanner]

Before the new tower array the null towards Tampa was not as severe as there was a grade A signal over Tampa day and night, now it does not make it 5 miles from the tower site at night westbound so the protection theory does not seem to apply unless they were in violation before.

 

[davideduardo]

Before the new tower array the null towards Tampa was not as severe as there was a grade A signal over Tampa day and night, now it does not make it 5 miles from the tower site at night westbound so the protection theory does not seem to apply unless they were in violation before.

When a station moves its transmitter or makes a modification of significance at the existing one, they are subject to the protection requirements in force at the time of the filing. It may well be that the protection afforded to XEWA when the old facility was built was much less per the rules in force then; today's rules are considerably more restrictive.

I know of one station that had 5 kw Non-d nights, and due to a tiny move had to reduce to 2.3 kw because the protection requirements requiered it; the old site was licensed under older rules and was thus "grandfathered."

Another issue may be differences in ground conductivity between sites that imrprove or harm coverage despite seemingly commparable power levels.

Another possibility we often see is that the real and most critical null is to the other side (180 degrees opposite) the other. A station can use less land and fewer towers making both nulls identical (symetrical) although they are overprotecting in the "opposite" side. To open the pattern on the less critical side would require more towers, and lots more land. Sometimes it is not worth it.

IIRC, 540 is diplexed into the 740 system; it may be that the deeper null is part protection and part the fact that they could not get the 740 array to get any more signal to the west.

 

[Parttimer]

IIRC, 540 is diplexed into the 740 system; it may be that the deeper null is part protection and part the fact that they could not get the 740 array to get any more signal to the west.

That's your answer. The change in coverage coincides with the move.