6+ helping "Radio Disney"?

[johnbasalla]

Has having new ratings measuring 6+ (instead of the 12+) helped "Radio Disney" and other child-focused stations/formats (if there are any)?

 

[davideduardo]

Has having new ratings measuring 6+ (instead of the 12+) helped "Radio Disney" and other child-focused stations/formats (if there are any)?

In a word, "no."

There are really no ad buys against teens and pre-teens in the radio world... so, just as doing well in 55+ does not help a station much, neither does the 6-11.

When 6+ was added to the customary 12+ was when the PPM was being developed jointly with Nielsen. Youth demos are relevant in TV, and the demo stuck when Nielsen and Arbitron split. In quite a few of the discussions with Arbitron regarding sample, radio people have requested that 6-11 be dropped as it is not really of any value.

 

[non-radio guru]

"There are really no ad buys against teens and pre-teens in the radio world..."

Are you serious? Companies don't spend money advertising their clothes, DVD's and music, games, cereal, food, electronics and even vehicles (think cool stuff) to kids and pre-teens? Anyone with kids know that they (the kids) are the real decision makers and guess what, so do the ad agencies and companies.

As far as ratings go, some of the 'numbers' may not be relevant, especially since kids won't fill diaries or even wear PPM and their parents probably are listening to their station of choice when with their kids, but trust me... a lot of money has been and continues to be made from advertisers looking to get their message to kids and pre-teens, hot AC, pop, urban and yes, both local and national Radio Disney included.

 

[TVradioguru]

Radio Disney ran under the same assumption as you, plus adding in the potential for promotion of their products and theme parks. In reality, with the RD stable of third rate AM stations and lack of advertiser interest has proven that the under 12 set aren't interesting nor influence their parents to buy products or services.

Radio Disney is buried in the corporate asset list struggling to find relevancy. One of these days the big cheese will be doing an audit and cut the RD fat off the bottom line.

 

[davideduardo]

"There are really no ad buys against teens and pre-teens in the radio world..."

Are you serious? Companies don't spend money advertising their clothes, DVD's and music, games, cereal, food, electronics and even vehicles (think cool stuff) to kids and pre-teens?

No, not on radio. And that is why we seldom if ever see a buy come up against 12-17.

I don't think the must industry spends any money on radio for any demo now, and about the only thing on TV is for compilations. DVDs are visual, and use visual media, the web and TV. Same with games. Package goods are generally bought against adult women on radio... and so on..

Anyone with kids know that they (the kids) are the real decision makers and guess what, so do the ad agencies and companies.

Ad agencies generally don't pick the demos. And teens and kids are no the target of agency radio buys. This is why CHRs target Women 18-34 and not teens, for example.

As far as ratings go, some of the 'numbers' may not be relevant, especially since kids won't fill diaries or even wear PPM...

The PPM panel has quotas for every demo, and the entire household will get removed from the panel if any member, including teens and sub-teens does not participate, as indicated by docking and motion..

Kids are reported to have better PPM compliance than many of the adult groups.

and their parents probably are listening to their station of choice when with their kids, but trust me... a lot of money has been and continues to be made from advertisers looking to get their message to kids and pre-teens, hot AC, pop, urban and yes, both local and national Radio Disney included.

Radio Disney is a brand promotion device for Disney corporate. As the format moves more to the web, expect more and more stations to be sold... as has already happened in smaller markets.

AC and pop and urban station don't get teen buys because there are essentially none of those in radio.

 

[non-radio guru]

If Radio Disney is struggling to find relevancy, then they have been doing it since 1998 when they first started and survived a sell off by Disney of its ABC radio stations to Citadel over the past couple of years. (and I guarantee you 'the big cheese has been doing audits for 12 years now'). Yes, they are dropping some of their smaller markets but name me one company today that is NOT doing that in this economy. Disney may sell off all the AM's it has at some point, but they have been more consistent than most bigger market stations that have been flipping every 2-4 years, trying to find their niche after the oldies went away.

You say clients don't spend money on radio or targeting kids? I am telling you they do, maybe not as much today though. I have worked recently with some of the biggest, most well known agencies in the country and THEY have bought for their client specifically targeting moms and yes, kids. Even on stations geared towards kids. Hook the kid, you'll hook the mom.

If the 6-16 yr. old market is not interesting nor viable, then why produce & market products (not music) with Hannah Montana/Miley Cirus , American Idol, the Jonas Bros., Justin Bieber? Why promote the new games, new toys, new treats? Why describe how cool the new sound and DVD system is in new cars, both on air and with localized promotions? It's because kids hear & see those messages and bug their parents. The nag factor.

I get the feeling from the posts that you folks have been in the industry for a while, either stuck in Account Exec. position or management. Renew your relationships with you audience, your agency reps and your clients. Reach out to some of the non-traditional revenue streams. Create promotions and not advertising campaigns and gear it tastefully and ethically towards the kids. You'll be surprised. Look, I don't get lost in the fact that the AM's and some FM's have few active young listener's, but sometimes the bigger, localized promotional opportunity is more important to advertisers and listeners.

Thanks for the great chat and good luck.

 

[davideduardo]

If Radio Disney is struggling to find relevancy, then they have been doing it since 1998 when they first started and survived a sell off by Disney of its ABC radio stations to Citadel over the past couple of years. (and I guarantee you 'the big cheese has been doing audits for 12 years now'). Yes, they are dropping some of their smaller markets but name me one company today that is NOT doing that in this economy. Disney may sell off all the AM's it has at some point, but they have been more consistent than most bigger market stations that have been flipping every 2-4 years, trying to find their niche after the oldies went away.

They are consistent because they don't need to monetize the format by ad sales, although they do try to sell, just as XM Sirius do...

ESPN radio is also first a brand enhancement for the big money producers for ESPN, and second an ad supported medium.

You say clients don't spend money on radio or targeting kids? I am telling you they do, maybe not as much today though. I have worked recently with some of the biggest, most well known agencies in the country and THEY have bought for their client specifically targeting moms and yes, kids. Even on stations geared towards kids. Hook the kid, you'll hook the mom.

There simply are no buys for 12-17. Ask any rep firm seller who calls on agencies at any buying center.

If the 6-16 yr. old market is not interesting nor viable, then why produce & market products (not music) with Hannah Montana/Miley Cirus , American Idol, the Jonas Bros., Justin Bieber? Why promote the new games, new toys, new treats? Why describe how cool the new sound and DVD system is in new cars, both on air and with localized promotions? It's because kids hear & see those messages and bug their parents. The nag factor.

But campaigns against kids and teens do not use radio. They use visual media, TV and the web mostly.

I get the feeling from the posts that you folks have been in the industry for a while, either stuck in Account Exec. position or management. Renew your relationships with you audience, your agency reps and your clients. Reach out to some of the non-traditional revenue streams. Create promotions and not advertising campaigns and gear it tastefully and ethically towards the kids. You'll be surprised. Look, I don't get lost in the fact that the AM's and some FM's have few active young listener's, but sometimes the bigger, localized promotional opportunity is more important to advertisers and listeners.

Had you really been at large agencies, you would know that the demo decisions are made at the client level, and media allocations are not made at the time buyer level.

Radio stations could take a new opportunity or promotion every day to an agency, buyer and if there is no money for radio, they are going to get zero percent of zero for their efforts.

 

[TVradioguru]

I get the feeling from the posts that you folks have been in the industry for a while, either stuck in Account Exec. position or management. Renew your relationships with you audience, your agency reps and your clients. Reach out to some of the non-traditional revenue streams. Create promotions and not advertising campaigns and gear it tastefully and ethically towards the kids. You'll be surprised. Look, I don't get lost in the fact that the AM's and some FM's have few active young listener's, but sometimes the bigger, localized promotional opportunity is more important to advertisers and listeners.

With all due respect, your advice is pretty cliche'. David is spot on when he says zero percent of zero always equals zero.

Very few of us in the industry now days have the option of chasing a tiny potential looking for scraps. We're busy trying to grab share back now that there are signs the economy is turning around. The 80/20 rule doesn't apply when it comes to the teen or less market. Its actually closer to .2% and I for one don't think it would be worthwhile for my sales and marketing staff to spend 80% of their time, chasing .2% of the 'potential' business.