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94.7 is changing formats today

Then again, there's John Catsimatidis. Maybe he'll flip WABC to country. :)
I believe this is probably tongue-in-cheek, and in any event I believe any consideration of a succession of the WNSH format is theoretical at this point. I have read that several of the DJ's have moved on to other gigs. But for the sake of discussion, and bearing in mind that missing DJ's could be replaced, I think a valuable experiment could be conducted. Not with WFAS, which is too small and not even broadcasting in analog, but with 660 which has the reach and ownership that could do the test with little out of pocket expense.

WNSH got decent ratings in north Jersey, and even had something within NYC. It was not a failing format; it was failing in being viable on an FM signal. Moving an intact audience to AM could test what the viability is in 2021. I often hear that "it won't work" or "it has been tried already," to which I would respond when and where? Not in the last 20 years I would bet. The most recent stab at music on AM that I can think of was Z-Rock, which was a chancy idea from the outset. Raucous Rock-N-Roll was already available on FM, and when two similar formats are available FM will nearly always win. Same situation existed to a lesser degree with Radio Disney - similar music (though not the kid friendly presentation) was available on FM.

In the case of Country in New York, there is no viable radio competition, so it is a perfect lab to see what a unique format could do on AM. Audacy already owns the 660 facilities and (was) paying the DJ's. Daytime sports radio listening I suspect has long left 660, so there was no real sports audience being compromised. Evening games could be carried on 660, and nobody would be worse for the wear.

If 660 Country WNSH succeeded, or at least retained a decent saleable portion of the audience, then that could force broadcasters to reassess what could be done with some of their moribund AM properties. I don't think the future of AM radio is music. I don't even think AM has much of a future, as I think whatever is developed will eventually be needed to replace faltering music-only formats on FM. But I don't think anybody will want to experiment with FM signals as they are still (somehow) bringing in money.- in many cases lots of it.

If AM can be shown to be able to get listeners with a serious attempt at real programming - 660 WNSH would be run just like 94.7 was, maybe improved with more local focus and visibility, then the door might be open for REALLY "trying" something(s) on other underused AM's across the country. My suggestions would be for female friendly sports talk, non-political general talk, WCBS/WTOP/KYW based news radio that would have local news insertions where New York, Washington and Philadelphia weather and traffic would be. If there were a willingness to invest some significant money, maybe a resurrection of radio sitcoms could be a possibility. And this is from an amateur listener - I am sure real radio people could come up with ideas to try, if they had a ubiquitous place to try them. HD radio in theory would be the place to try things, but since nobody has HD, it is a lot like trying something on an internet station, which is not a realistic test of the local marketplace.
 
If 660 Country WNSH succeeded, or at least retained a decent saleable portion of the audience, then that could force broadcasters to reassess what could be done with some of their moribund AM properties.

Not going to happen. WFAN needs the AM for conflicts on the main channel, especially now. Plus Audacy has already made their decision, and moved on. I believe the NY office was never really committed to the country format, and had every intention to flip to something else at the first opportunity. The money they billed at WNSH was not much of enticement. They seem perfectly satisfied to let that audience walk away.
 
Not going to happen. WFAN needs the AM for conflicts on the main channel, especially now. Plus Audacy has already made their decision, and moved on. I believe the NY office was never really committed to the country format, and had every intention to flip to something else at the first opportunity. The money they billed at WNSH was not much of enticement. They seem perfectly satisfied to let that audience walk away.
To add to BigA's assertion: what makes you believe that a country format would do any better on 660 AM than any FM signal?

Also, I know many people (of varying ages) who still listen to WFAN on 660, so it's unlikely Audacy will break that simulcast--even if it meant BetQL being cleared in #1-- any time soon. None of those alternate ideas sound viable either. Why would Audacy add a third news station to their cluster?
 
Even KFI’s toplines are not what they were back in the day. Management, to their credit, moved Rush to a lesser AM facility years ago and it probably saved their demos from further erosion.
And in 25 to 54 it barely Makes the top 20.
 
Oh my…seriously, a mainstream music format on AM in a top market in 2021? This is a serious proposition?
Does that oldies station on the 740 blowtorch in Toronto (ex-CBL) have an FM signal in the local market? If not, how does 740 do, billing-wise? Do any of our omniscient radio insiders/observers have Canadian rating/advertising data at their fingertips?
 
From what I see at a glance they have a translator. But even still, reaching up across the border seems to be a case of the exception proving the rule. 🤣

If the argument is people would stream it (setting aside if that is a reasonable assertion) then just stream it. There is figuratively no one who’s going to listen to it on AM.
 
Does that oldies station on the 740 blowtorch in Toronto (ex-CBL) have an FM signal in the local market? If not, how does 740 do, billing-wise? Do any of our omniscient radio insiders/observers have Canadian rating/advertising data at their fingertips?
CFZM is owned by Moses Znamier, founder of CityTV and a legendary media mogul. It and classical outlet CFMZ-FM are run as hobbies.
 
Randy Michaels "taught the Grand Old Lady to dance" when he took over WLW in the 80s, blew off the legacy audience and brought in younger demos with a hip mostly talk format. They haven't done much to "de-age" since then and still have hosts who were hired in their 30s in the 80s.
WTAM really didn’t “de-age” either and they just lost their lead personality Mike Trivisonno to a heart attack yesterday at age 74. Morning hosts Bill Wills and Mike Snyder are in their late 60s, Geraldo Rivera is 78, etc.
 
To add to BigA's assertion: what makes you believe that a country format would do any better on 660 AM than any FM signal?

Also, I know many people (of varying ages) who still listen to WFAN on 660, so it's unlikely Audacy will break that simulcast--even if it meant BetQL being cleared in #1-- any time soon. None of those alternate ideas sound viable either. Why would Audacy add a third news station to their cluster?
As the warden said to Cool Hand Luke, "What we have here is a failure to communicate." My comment is NOT about getting "music on AM" or putting a "third News station on in NYC." Rather it is trying to take a unique situation in market 1 and attempt to confirm or deny a long held conviction by radio insiders that AM is a lost hope. (The newsradio idea was for regionally nearby cities outside the reach of 880 that might be able to support newsradio, but don't have the resources to start from scratch).

A decently performing format no longer could hold a spot on the FM dial. A desirable demo audience was already in place that was set to be abandoned. An underutilized AM facility was available that just happened to be owned by the company dropping the format from its FM cluster. A scenario like that does not happen everyday. Had radio insiders been looking forward imaginatively, I submit they could have turned the situation to their advantage, at virtually no cost.

Unless someone with insider knowledge could say with a straight face that the billing of WFAN depended on there being a daytime AM signal as part of their package, it could be acknowledged that 660 is a very good candidate for experimentation. I think an orphaned Country audience would have been larger and more attractive to advertisers than a daytime simulcast Sports audience. It would follow that Audacy could have made more money, which is ultimately the point.

I am challenging the idea that "people won't listen to AM." Industry insiders "knew" that a national daytime show would never fly. This was so much the gospel that I believe the only way Rush could get access to the remains of the ABC Talk network was to do a New York local show for free. As we all know that gamble paid off handsomely. Sometime you have to take risks to get someplace.

If there is similar gospel that under 45's will never listen to AM, let's see some evidence. I suspect that the only "proof" is that top 40 music audiences shifted away 40 years ago and angry political talk and Z-Rock didn't grab them, so nothing will. How about transporting a decently successful FM format to a decently powered AM and see what happens? Such an opportunity never comes up (except in this instance in NY), and had Audacy done so, they would have been risking very little and either proven for real or disproven the gospel.

If the conventional wisdom were shown to be bull, then all of a sudden there are many properties that might have some potential and thus opportunity for revenue, IF a new format could be found, and I'll admit that is a big problem, and ultimately what could kill AM - no programming. In most cases it wouldn't be music, as most markets already have the popular genres on FM. I made some suggestions for new formats, to which someone said they all stink. That may be true, but then the question ought to be turned to radio professionals: what ideas are there for new programming? And if the answer is "we'll spin records better" I would suggest that they ain't got no ideas for something new or something for the future, which is a whole 'nother issue.
 
Zoomer Radio [AM 740] in Toronto has an FM translator that basically covers downtown Toronto. It's only 82 watts.Here's the coverage area: CFZM-1-FM Radio Station Coverage Map

For what it's worth, it's one of three AM stations I listen to OTA. Most nights it booms right into NE Ohio. Their music mix is excellent and much wider playlist than what AM or FM stations play in the USA. And for what it's worth, if WFAN did ever go back to music [highly doubtful], I'd switch the call letters back to WNBC asap.
 
If there is similar gospel that under 45's will never listen to AM, let's see some evidence. I suspect that the only "proof" is that top 40 music audiences shifted away 40 years ago and angry political talk and Z-Rock didn't grab them, so nothing will. How about transporting a decently successful FM format to a decently powered AM and see what happens? Such an opportunity never comes up (except in this instance in NY), and had Audacy done so, they would have been risking very little and either proven for real or disproven the gospel.
Look at any roster of AM stations in any given market and the answer immediately comes into view. It’s either narrowcasting to niche audiences or spoken word that targets really old people.
 
And for what it's worth, if WFAN did ever go back to music [highly doubtful], I'd switch the call letters back to WNBC asap.
The NBC owned-and-operated TV station in New York has had the call sign WNBC without the -TV suffix since 1992; therefore, no radio station will ever have that call sign again.
 
Figuratively, outside of spoken word formats (and even that’s dicey), and some religious and speciality formats, the reality in location upon location is simple. AM is not now and is not ever going to be a viable music destination. Experimentation? Let’s experiment again to show the earth really is round, and be forward thinking scientists while we’re at it.

Even if it’s turn off the AM frequency or put country on it, the choice is turn off the power. The body is cold and long since dead. Nothing is bringing it back to life for that purpose.m
 
Does that oldies station on the 740 blowtorch in Toronto (ex-CBL) have an FM signal in the local market? If not, how does 740 do, billing-wise? Do any of our omniscient radio insiders/observers have Canadian rating/advertising data at their fingertips?
Yes, it has an FM translator that serves downtown Toronto. Anecdotally, I hear they bill fairly decently.
 
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Yes, it has an FM translator that serves downtown Toronto. Anecdotally, I hear they bill fairly decently.
Need something more concrete than that, considering the difficulty 55+ music formats have in the US attracting advertisers. Since neither BigA nor David E. have chimed in on this yet, I assume that info on billings is being kept behind tight lips north of the border.
 
I am challenging the idea that "people won't listen to AM."

But that's NOT the problem in NYC. People in NYC listen to AM station. The problem with your idea is that 660 is owned by Audacy, and that company has already determined that they can't sell the country format to advertisers in NYC. That's why they shut down WNSH, why they released the employees, and why they sent the station's audience to HD-2. That's their decision. They're not putting country on 660, regardless of what you say.

There are lots of other AMs around NYC, but most are owned by companies with vested interests in ethnic formats. Some of them, by the way, play music.
 
Look at any roster of AM stations in any given market and the answer immediately comes into view. It’s either narrowcasting to niche audiences or spoken word that targets really old people.
And I think it is that way because broadcasters and advertisers have bought into the gospel that no one under 50 will listen to AM, and therefore will attempt no programming that fits the more desirable demos. That's why my fantasy football idea of 660 WNSH had merit, especially if it were marketed right, because the demo friendly programming was already there. But the iorn had to be struck at the right time, namely the moment 94.7 was switching over. The DJ's would not be saying goodbye, but saying join us at our new "more powerful" home at 660, and push the apps and Echo for audio clarity, and get busy making 660 WNSH a part of the north Jersey landscape with remotes, contests, t-shirts and all the other promotional stuff radio pros know how to do.

If, in some alternate universe, someone like Howard Stern or Mike Francesca were to be enticed to do a well-produced show on AM, I would bet there would be a decent number of listeners who would go to wherever they popped up. However, one show does not make a station's schedule, so there would need to be at least 12 hours of additional demo friendly programming to make a kick-start like that viable. That would be expensive to do and there would be no guarantee of success. Money is tight in radio now, so no attempt is made. But I submit somewhere, be it on AM, FM or HD, attempts are going to need to be made. I think revenue for music radio is declining, and I think that's because advertisers know the music radio audience is getting smaller. I would bet that music-only radio stations are eventually going to be low profit operations, because they are fighting the commercial free internet.
 
And I think it is that way because broadcasters and advertisers have bought into the gospel that no one under 50 will listen to AM, and therefore will attempt no programming that fits the more desirable demos.

Not exactly true since we have documented evidence of people under 50 listening to play by play sports on AM.

The issue here is we also have documented evidence that NY advertisers won't buy country, even when it's on FM.
 
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