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A CHALLENGE FOR AIR AMERICA

Jayson, your post here says it all. Who cares if their right or left or in the middle. Put on good talk show hosts and it will work. I keep going back to Bob Grant. I do not agree with Bob on everything. Having said that you want to hear great talk radio? Go back and listen to Grant doing afternoons on WABC. I worked for Disney at WLS when he was let go. I was heartbroken when it happened. I haven't heard him on WABC now. But three cheers for Phil Boyce and WABC for giving Bob a shot again. We need more Bob Grants and more Neil Rogers not more Lou Dobbs and Tom Hartmans.
 
jaymarvin said:
Jayson, your post here says it all. Who cares if their right or left or in the middle. Put on good talk show hosts and it will work. I keep going back to Bob Grant. I do not agree with Bob on everything. Having said that you want to hear great talk radio? Go back and listen to Grant doing afternoons on WABC. I worked for Disney at WLS when he was let go. I was heartbroken when it happened. I haven't heard him on WABC now. But three cheers for Phil Boyce and WABC for giving Bob a shot again. We need more Bob Grants and more Neil Rogers not more Lou Dobbs and Tom Hartmans.

Sorry, Jay. I was with you and now you've lost me. I don't know Bob Grant personally, but his on-air personna was mean-spirited, nasty and pandering to the worst in his listeners. Joe Pyne told a listener to "gargle with razor blades;" Grant acted like he had just done so. These two are the guys most responsible for putting talk radio on the low road.

On the other hand, I don't understand your comment about Thom Hartmann. A radio guy since college and the closest in the current crop of syndicated hosts to Michael Jackson; informed, articulate and always civil.
 
Sure Hartman may be all that but he has no numbers and is boring as hell. Grant could be very mean, and so could Joe Pyne. But they were clever about it and you just had to listen. Neil Rogers is the same way. The kind of talk you want is also on the dial. It's called NPR. Talk radio is not about high or low road. It's about drama and entertainment. If you support Air America than you ought to start telling the truth about it. In the major markets it's in (exception Portland and a couple of others) it has no numbers and is bleeding to death. The best people on there are Lionel and Rhandy Rhodes. They get it. Same thing with Salem. Bad hosts, no numbers, and God knows how they make money. Progressive radio can work if it's done right. Right now that's not the case.
 
Actually, I agree with the comments you've been making about Air America. I admit there's something I can't put my finger on that separates Hartmann from Michael Jackson but I wouldn't move him into the "Boring As Hell" column. On Salem, I don't think Praeger and Medved are good, although not great.

When Rush started (not now), I didn't agree but I had to listen. I wouldn't say that about Pyne or Grant. Insult-driven talk radio is the audio equivalent if it bleeds, it leads in TV news. It's trash broadcasting. I don't hear you stooping to it. The time you write about when broadcasting was about good radio was also about a time when broadcasting had standards. Sure you can dump a turd on the table and everybody will look at it but that doesn't make it entertainment.

The problem with liberal talk is they've tried to copy the "style" of Rush, Grant and Pyne and just plug in liberal opinions.
 
I use to do it. I was very combative and insulting. I just stopped doing it because I got tired of it. Grant and Pyne are just two examples of what was out there at one time. You also had guys like Neil Rogers and a guy who did all nights on the old WCAU who had the "Rascal Club" along with all kinds of other folks. Michael Jackson was OK in his time, but the kind of talk he does when out long ago. Let me ask you this: when was the last time you listen to someone and you went oh wow! When was the last time you listened to someone and just when they had you so mad you swore you'd never come back they said something funny or touching? Not many can do that anymore. Their too busy going after the other side. Like it or not guys like Pyne and Grant use to do what I'm talking about. So did Al Jazzbo Collins, Les Crane, and you know who does it today? Jim Rome. I'm not into sports, but he is the BEST talk show host on the radio in this town. Why? Because he knows how to give the core the red meat of sports they want, and for the rest of us he's entertaining and funny to the point you want to hang out with him.
 
jaymarvin said:
I use to do it. I was very combative and insulting. I just stopped doing it because I got tired of it. Grant and Pyne are just two examples of what was out there at one time. You also had guys like Neil Rogers and a guy who did all nights on the old WCAU who had the "Rascal Club" along with all kinds of other folks. Michael Jackson was OK in his time, but the kind of talk he does when out long ago. Let me ask you this: when was the last time you listen to someone and you went oh wow! When was the last time you listened to someone and just when they had you so mad you swore you'd never come back they said something funny or touching? Not many can do that anymore. Their too busy going after the other side. Like it or not guys like Pyne and Grant use to do what I'm talking about. So did Al Jazzbo Collins, Les Crane, and you know who does it today? Jim Rome. I'm not into sports, but he is the BEST talk show host on the radio in this town. Why? Because he knows how to give the core the red meat of sports they want, and for the rest of us he's entertaining and funny to the point you want to hang out with him.

I think the "want to hang out with him" test is key. As an early PD of mine said, "they've got to like you." He also told me I always should come off as the good guy. His view may not be fashionable now but I still think it's valid. Even nasty hosts like Grant or Mike Gallagher are heroes to angry, middle-aged White guys who listen to them. I'm just not sure it's good business to target the Archie Bunker demo.

Sorry, I wouldn't want to hang out with Bob Grant. I wouldn't even want to go to the kind of bar I picture him going to.

Beyond the hosts, the great radio stations were all ensembles. It wasn't just about the individual hosts but about the family of hosts/DJs. They talked about each other. They popped up on each other's show. The ensemble was always a presence. NJ 101.5 still does it. WCFL in the late 60s did this extremely well. The jock/host was part of a team/family and the listener wanted to be part of it, too.

Best talk show host I ever heard (IMHO) was Brad Crandall. Never nasty. Actually listened to callers. Never gave a conventional wisdom opinion. Always made you think. Like Michael Jackson but with more edge. Great pipes.

Funny you mention Les Crane. I noticed earlier he was missing from their list of ABC Late night hosts (he was the first, as I recall). After he and Tina Louise divorced, he married a woman named "Ginger."
 
The best talk show hosts I have ever heard are Wally Phillips from WGN, "Chicago" Eddie Shwartz (WGN,WIND,WLUP) and Jay
Marvin and while I'm at it Roe Conn on weekdays on WLS. They can talk politics, sports ,history, current events they can be funny and
entertaining but can also be serious and very informative. In other words there smart,real talk show hosts.
 
Finn said:
Jason Roberts said:
But, that having been said, it always seemed as though the liberal host, while popular, had, more often that the other hosts, times when he was ratings-challenged. Don't know why...that's just the way it was.

It might not be obvious, but did your gut tell you something different? A different feel to the conversation? Do you think liberal audiences want different things than conservative ones, or do you think the hosts were different performers?

What was the lineup/time slots?

First of all, my apologies for taking so much time to respond to you...I had some computer issues at home this week.

I'm not truly sure of what the answer would be. But, as I remember the liberal host, I do remember he had a very dry, ascerbic wit. Don't get me wrong, he was outright funny at times...but I thing the dry wit may have rubbed some listeners the wrong way. He was sometimes sarcastic, but all talk hosts can be that way at times.

Here are what my impressions were of the station I mentioned. It's News and Telephone Talk format came on the air in the very early part of the 1970's. I was working there about 7 years later. I was a news anchor there at the time. It was a daytimer. It's morning host was a conservative who was almost libertarian. (Think, just slightly to the left of Neal Boortz.) Quite frankly, he was capable of creating a "3 ring circus" atmosphere with his show with him as Ringmaster and he did that quite often. I think that was what was entertaining about him. You never knew what rant he would go on...or which caller he would "go after". I think that unpredictability was a factor in his success.

The longest running mid-day guy was the liberal I mentioned. He had the dry wit, seemed in person like he could have been a bit vain (elitist, maybe?). But, having said that, he was also a compassionate person, a "stand up for the little guy" type of man and could be funny and entertaining once you "figured him out". Maybe it was that point (that one had to "acquire the taste" for his personality) that brought about the occasional ratings challenge I mentioned. Even so, he had some good books, too. I'm not going to take that away from him.

Afternoons ran both directions as the station went through a couple of different hosts. There were conservatives to moderates. Even a liberal here or there. (And most were normally Program Directors of the station.) It was the morning and mid-day hosts who were around the longest, though and received the most local notoriety. Weekend hosts also ran the gamut. There were people of all political persuasions plugged in there. The station also dabbled with specialty talk on weekends (ask the experts type of stuff), and even debuted what I believe was the first specialty talk show aimed at home computer users in 1982. (Yep...talking about Atari's and Radio Shack TRS-80's as well as the more sophisticated computers for the day.)

Another point about this station (which was on the air in the talk format well into the 1980's.) There was national political talk...there was local talk (both political and non-political) and sometimes talk that might have been "off the wall" for its' day. (You'd have celebrity interviews...interviews and conversation with military people...even interviews and conversation with people supporting more radical issues of the times, for instance legalization of marijuana.)

The station was locally owned and operated by a man who was a staunch conservative Republican. And, just like about any other talk station, we had looney callers, bomb threats, an occasional death threat or two. It was all part of life inside this place. That's why I said if a day came when we didn't have a complaint about something that was said, we checked the transmitter.

For the record, the station was WAVI in Dayton, Ohio. And, regardless of your take on him as a talk host or his politics, it is where talker Mike Gallagher got his start. (I remember Mike just barely out of his teenage years.) It was an interesting time...and a truly unique radio station...it was WOR, WLS and WKRP all rolled up into one.
 
WAVI was a station that was well ahead of its time. Bob Kwessell, the morning host I remember, landed briefly at WIBC in Indianapolis in the early 90s. I can remember guys like Brad Clay and Dr. Frank Hhenninger (both liberal, the latter a University of Dayton professor) and a former WHIO-TV news anchor who was into Garner Ted Armstrong. The local owner also owned FM soul station WDAO, which survives as a shadow of its former selve at that same 1210 AM spot.
 
I think air america hosts are dull and predictable. They need someone who thinks out of the box and doesn't fit the mold. I think the LION of the Left Big Bernie Ward would be a great addition to the air america "line-up". He was heard on KGO in San Francisco, but now he's looking for a job. And like Rush says "you can trust him with your kid in a room at motel 6."
 
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