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A serious question and idea

R

RadioGuy22

Hey all!

I figured I'd post this here, because I'm likely to get lit up on BCR. I'd like to have a serious discussion about this...

With all the talk about the Hog and the Brew, I was thinking...remember when WLUM tweaked their format and went more "alternative?" I remember a lot of people saying they like the change...that the station was on their radio a lot...but this recent ratings book doesn't bode well for the station.

I'm wondering this...what do you all think of LUM right now? Personally, I find the playlist to be too narrow and repetitive. While they do break a good amount of new music, I compare them with a station like 105.5 MMM out of Madison, and think that the station would sound better with more of a focus, and a deeper library.

To me, it seems like LUM is still confused about its identity. They are straddling the active rock/alternative line, and going after a younger crowd. I think much younger than they'd like to. With bands like Linkin Park, Nickelback, Fall Out Boy, and the Gorillaz, I can see them getting a lot of attention from folks under 25 then say, if they featured more music from bands like REM, U2, some 90's stuff that they play, and newer music like Wilco, Paul Weller, and Trey Anastasio. Heck, even a shot of some older stuff like Peter Gabriel, Elvis Costello, and Bob Marley. I think a deeper rotation with "older" music combined with some new music may help to push the station into a good spot with the 18-35 year old demo.

I envision a more "cosmopolitan" 102.1. Strangely enough, the calls WMKE are not taken by any station in the country (according to www.radio-locator.com.) Picutre this..."102.1MKE: Milwaukee's Alternative Station." More toned down imaging (a la 93XRT or 105.5MMM) a healthy mix of older alternative and newer music with a looser rotation. They station would push the "cool and happening" things to do in town, like pumping up new restaurants, maybe doing 1st Friday kind of stuff at the art museum, strongly promoting the local music scene, and being a part of as many local festivals as possible. They can keep the 50 minutes of tunes per hour as well. If this was a "cool and happening" station for Milwaukee playing some music that music lovers might get into and get turned on to, do you think this could fly?

As if THAT wasn't enough...what about this sample 50 minute sweep?

Green Day: Wake Me Up When September Ends
R.E.M.: The One I Love
Mike Doughty: Looking At The World From The Bottom Of A Well
The Stone Roses: Love Spreads
Wilco: Theologians
Coldplay: Speed Of Sound
Elvis Costello: Monkey To Man
U2: Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
Soul Asylum: Black Gold
Trey Anastasio: Shine
Jane's Addiction: Moutain Song

Thoughts? Questions? I can't organize all my thoughts here...or it'd take too long and too much space. Thanks for taking the time to read this. I look forward to your responses.
 
> Hey all!
>
> I figured I'd post this here, because I'm likely to get lit
> up on BCR. I'd like to have a serious discussion about
> this...
>
> With all the talk about the Hog and the Brew, I was
> thinking...remember when WLUM tweaked their format and went
> more "alternative?" I remember a lot of people saying they
> like the change...that the station was on their radio a
> lot...but this recent ratings book doesn't bode well for the
> station.
>
> I'm wondering this...what do you all think of LUM right now?
> Personally, I find the playlist to be too narrow and
> repetitive. While they do break a good amount of new music,
> I compare them with a station like 105.5 MMM out of Madison,
> and think that the station would sound better with more of a
> focus, and a deeper library.
>
> To me, it seems like LUM is still confused about its
> identity. They are straddling the active rock/alternative
> line, and going after a younger crowd. I think much younger
> than they'd like to. With bands like Linkin Park,
> Nickelback, Fall Out Boy, and the Gorillaz, I can see them
> getting a lot of attention from folks under 25 then say, if
> they featured more music from bands like REM, U2, some 90's
> stuff that they play, and newer music like Wilco, Paul
> Weller, and Trey Anastasio. Heck, even a shot of some older
> stuff like Peter Gabriel, Elvis Costello, and Bob Marley. I
> think a deeper rotation with "older" music combined with
> some new music may help to push the station into a good spot
> with the 18-35 year old demo.
>
> I envision a more "cosmopolitan" 102.1. Strangely enough,
> the calls WMKE are not taken by any station in the country
> (according to www.radio-locator.com.) Picutre
> this..."102.1MKE: Milwaukee's Alternative Station." More
> toned down imaging (a la 93XRT or 105.5MMM) a healthy mix of
> older alternative and newer music with a looser rotation.
> They station would push the "cool and happening" things to
> do in town, like pumping up new restaurants, maybe doing 1st
> Friday kind of stuff at the art museum, strongly promoting
> the local music scene, and being a part of as many local
> festivals as possible. They can keep the 50 minutes of tunes
> per hour as well. If this was a "cool and happening" station
> for Milwaukee playing some music that music lovers might get
> into and get turned on to, do you think this could fly?
>
> As if THAT wasn't enough...what about this sample 50 minute
> sweep?
>
> Green Day: Wake Me Up When September Ends
> R.E.M.: The One I Love
> Mike Doughty: Looking At The World From The Bottom Of A Well
>
> The Stone Roses: Love Spreads
> Wilco: Theologians
> Coldplay: Speed Of Sound
> Elvis Costello: Monkey To Man
> U2: Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
> Soul Asylum: Black Gold
> Trey Anastasio: Shine
> Jane's Addiction: Moutain Song
>
> Thoughts? Questions? I can't organize all my thoughts
> here...or it'd take too long and too much space. Thanks for
> taking the time to read this. I look forward to your
> responses.
>
WLUM currently is my favorite Milwaukee station. The music mix can at times be narrow but they still play plenty of decent music as well as new music. Its the only place in town to hear most of the new rock/alternative now that WLZR is done and WXSS is rhythmic leaning. As for older music, I often hear 80s Depeche Mode, occational U2 and sometimes I hear Police - Every Breath You Take, Basically important alternative staples. I heard part of the reason why alternative stations have poor ratings is because much of their target audience doesn't have a land line (home phone) and can't participate in the Arbitron ratings because of it.

I also enjoy they're imaging. Its upbeat and perfect for the format.

The station itself reminds me of the old Mad Radio 92.1 WMAD (Madison) musically and Mix 92.1 WXXM imaging wise. Sounds kinda like how WMAD sounded before they flipped to Hot AC in 2003.

I don't know if going gold heavy/AAA will really help. It really didn't do anything for WKQX or KNDD.


The fact that a lot of popular artists/songs are exclusive in Milwaukee to WLUM makes it even better for them probably, since its they're the only source on the FM dial for them. Also the fact that they have broke a good amount of major hits to Milwaukee this year. Weezer, Gorillaz, Green Day etc

Gorillaz - Dare (They also had Feel Good Inc WAY before WXSS)

311 - Don't Tread On Me (None of the Hot ACs or CHRs are playing it)

Foo Fighters - DOA

Death Cab For Cutie - Soul Meets Body

The Fray - Over My Head (None of the Hot ACs are playing it)

Weezer - Beverly Hills (They've been playing it since Rock 102-1)

The Killers - Somebody Told Me, All The Things I've Done, Mr Brightside (No play for any of these except for a short waltz with Mr. Brightside on WXSS or any of the Hot ACs)

Franz Ferdinand

Nine Inch Nails

are examples
<P ID="signature">______________

</P>
 
> Hey all!
>
> I figured I'd post this here, because I'm likely to get lit
> up on BCR. I'd like to have a serious discussion about
> this...
>
> With all the talk about the Hog and the Brew, I was
> thinking...remember when WLUM tweaked their format and went
> more "alternative?" I remember a lot of people saying they
> like the change...that the station was on their radio a
> lot...but this recent ratings book doesn't bode well for the
> station.
>
> I'm wondering this...what do you all think of LUM right now?
> Personally, I find the playlist to be too narrow and
> repetitive. While they do break a good amount of new music,
> I compare them with a station like 105.5 MMM out of Madison,
> and think that the station would sound better with more of a
> focus, and a deeper library.
>
> To me, it seems like LUM is still confused about its
> identity. They are straddling the active rock/alternative
> line, and going after a younger crowd. I think much younger
> than they'd like to. With bands like Linkin Park,
> Nickelback, Fall Out Boy, and the Gorillaz, I can see them
> getting a lot of attention from folks under 25 then say, if
> they featured more music from bands like REM, U2, some 90's
> stuff that they play, and newer music like Wilco, Paul
> Weller, and Trey Anastasio. Heck, even a shot of some older
> stuff like Peter Gabriel, Elvis Costello, and Bob Marley. I
> think a deeper rotation with "older" music combined with
> some new music may help to push the station into a good spot
> with the 18-35 year old demo.
>
> I envision a more "cosmopolitan" 102.1. Strangely enough,
> the calls WMKE are not taken by any station in the country
> (according to www.radio-locator.com.) Picutre
> this..."102.1MKE: Milwaukee's Alternative Station." More
> toned down imaging (a la 93XRT or 105.5MMM) a healthy mix of
> older alternative and newer music with a looser rotation.
> They station would push the "cool and happening" things to
> do in town, like pumping up new restaurants, maybe doing 1st
> Friday kind of stuff at the art museum, strongly promoting
> the local music scene, and being a part of as many local
> festivals as possible. They can keep the 50 minutes of tunes
> per hour as well. If this was a "cool and happening" station
> for Milwaukee playing some music that music lovers might get
> into and get turned on to, do you think this could fly?
>
> As if THAT wasn't enough...what about this sample 50 minute
> sweep?
>
> Green Day: Wake Me Up When September Ends
> R.E.M.: The One I Love
> Mike Doughty: Looking At The World From The Bottom Of A Well
>
> The Stone Roses: Love Spreads
> Wilco: Theologians
> Coldplay: Speed Of Sound
> Elvis Costello: Monkey To Man
> U2: Sometimes You Can't Make It On Your Own
> Soul Asylum: Black Gold
> Trey Anastasio: Shine
> Jane's Addiction: Moutain Song
>
> Thoughts? Questions? I can't organize all my thoughts
> here...or it'd take too long and too much space. Thanks for
> taking the time to read this. I look forward to your
> responses.
>

I 100% agree with you. The 'alternative' format has a pretty deep library now, with roughly 30+ years of music to choose from. Yet most of today's alternative stations can barely remember anything before Pearl Jam.

WLUM is a decent station as far as Milwaukee goes, but they sound like almost every other alternative station in the country (many of them go through the same consultant as WLUM). The playlist is too tight, and the repetition is ridiculous (ex: "Only" by Nine Inch Nails is a good song, but that doesn't mean I want to hear it every 2 hours). Q101 in Chicago retooled their format and got rid of the active stuff. Their moniker is "Everything Alternative", and they even admit in their promos that they no longer suck.

WLUM needs to open up the library. I'd love to hear more Cure, Smiths, XTC, Costello, Phish, New Order, etc. Why program to 20-year olds? Hell, most of the people that like alternative are 25-45. I always wondered why more alternative stations don't skew older. The product was better in the 70's, 80's and 90's. Plus, the newer bands like Franz Ferdinand, Green Day, etc. would fit in very well. And I like the idea of new imaging. Their current imaging sounds no different than any other alternative station. I'd make it a bit lower-key.

I've had many thoughts in my head about what I'd do if I programmed 102.1. What you described is pretty close to what I was thinking.
<P ID="signature">______________
The Liberal Talk Radio Update</P>
 
> WLUM needs to open up the library. I'd love to hear more
> Cure, Smiths, XTC, Costello, Phish, New Order, etc. Why
> program to 20-year olds? Hell, most of the people that like
> alternative are 25-45. I always wondered why more
> alternative stations don't skew older. The product was
> better in the 70's, 80's and 90's. Plus, the newer bands
> like Franz Ferdinand, Green Day, etc. would fit in very
> well. And I like the idea of new imaging. Their current
> imaging sounds no different than any other alternative
> station. I'd make it a bit lower-key.
>
> I've had many thoughts in my head about what I'd do if I
> programmed 102.1. What you described is pretty close to
> what I was thinking.
>
Like I said in my post below, stations have tried the classic skew but it didn't really help the ratings.

KNDD Seattle
KRQI Seattle (Now Jack FM)
WKQX Chicago

they never really took off ratings wise.

I got to hear KRQI and a really liked it. They have a very good variety of 80s and 90s alternative. Its too bad it didn't last more then a year. I'm glad KNDD left the classic skew on.<P ID="signature">______________

</P>
 
> Like I said in my post below, stations have tried the
> classic skew but it didn't really help the ratings.
>
> KNDD Seattle
> KRQI Seattle (Now Jack FM)
> WKQX Chicago
>
> they never really took off ratings wise.
>
> I got to hear KRQI and a really liked it. They have a very
> good variety of 80s and 90s alternative. Its too bad it
> didn't last more then a year. I'm glad KNDD left the classic
> skew on.
>

The Seattle stations were involved in a war with each other at the time. And Q101 was duking it out with Zone as well.

Plus, many stations do a real half-hearted attempt at it. WLUM tried it, but all they did is play a lot of Nirvana and Soundgarden. In short, all 90's grunge. That won't work.<P ID="signature">______________
The Liberal Talk Radio Update</P>
 
> I heard part of the reason why
> alternative stations have poor ratings is because much of
> their target audience doesn't have a land line (home phone)
> and can't participate in the Arbitron ratings because of it.
>
It's a national trend. Most people born in the 1980's as well as some from the late 1970's have dropped their land lines for cellphones exclusively. I dropped mine because I had major billing disputes with SBC as soon as they bought out Ameritech and customer service went to hell. As it stands right now, also with the Do-Not-Call list, that has also affected Arbitrons' efforts to reach their targeted demos for many stations, not just alternative stations.
Arbitron will have to find a new way to reach those demos. I don't know how the PPL Meter works, but hopefully it works. If Arbitron & telemarketers in general get their way, they'll be able to call cellphone numbers, except in states where the Do-Not-Call List applies, and Indiana has their own, and it covers cellphone numbers, while I believe the federal list does not. I don't know if Wisconsin revised their Do-Not-Call list to include cellphone numbers.
But back to cellphones; if telemarketers in general (I consider Arbitron a telemarketer in a way, but in a good way) get their way, cellphone users will get hit with calls from them and unless you're a US Cellular user, then it'll cost you to talk to a telemarketer. Also with the E411 directory, they'll have an easier time getting your number unless you're a Verizon Wireless number, which decided to keep their numbers out of the directory, but not immune to the future of telemarketing. Arbitron would be the only ones I'd be willing to call me on a cellphone to rate stations.
 
> while I believe
> the federal list does not.

From the national registry's FAQ:

10. Can I register my cell phone on the National Do Not Call Registry?

Yes, you may place your personal cell phone number on the National Do Not Call Registry. The registry has accepted cell phone numbers since it opened for registrations in June 2003. There is no deadline to register a home or cell phone number on the Registry.

You may have received an email telling you that your cell phone is about to be assaulted by telemarketing calls as a result of a new cell phone number database; however, that is not the case. FCC regulations prohibit telemarketers from using automated dialers to call cell phone numbers. Automated dialers are standard in the industry, so most telemarketers don’t call consumers on their cell phones without their consent.

Source: <a target="_blank" href=http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/dncalrt.htm>http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/dncalrt.htm</a>

So yes... It does cover cell phones.

-A<P ID="signature">______________

</P>
 
Hey everyone!

Thanks for the responses! I appreciate the feedback. I completely agree with the post that said that the audience who really, truly remembers what alternative music was (and probably still is) is the 25-54 year olds. I think that there's a distinct difference between genuine new, alternative music and "kiddie rock" like Fall Out Boy and Blink 182. Fall Out Boy doesn't pass as alternative in my book, but Wilco, Phish, Franz Ferdinand, and Peter Gabriel do.

I talked with other people about this, and they're concerned that the station would be too "cool" for Milwaukee. Does anyone buy that arguement?
 
> Hey everyone!
>
> Thanks for the responses! I appreciate the feedback. I
> completely agree with the post that said that the audience
> who really, truly remembers what alternative music was (and
> probably still is) is the 25-54 year olds. I think that
> there's a distinct difference between genuine new,
> alternative music and "kiddie rock" like Fall Out Boy and
> Blink 182. Fall Out Boy doesn't pass as alternative in my
> book, but Wilco, Phish, Franz Ferdinand, and Peter Gabriel
> do.
>
> I talked with other people about this, and they're concerned
> that the station would be too "cool" for Milwaukee. Does
> anyone buy that arguement?
>

People rip on Milwaukee about not being COOL enough. Milwaukee does just fine thank you. Go around to different markets and you will see this.

Milwaukee, to its benefit, has some conserative values. Milwaukees art and culture is just fine. I say LUM, bring it on!
 
> > while I believe
> > the federal list does not.
>
> From the national registry's FAQ:
>
> 10. Can I register my cell phone on the National Do Not Call
> Registry?
>
> Yes, you may place your personal cell phone number on the
> National Do Not Call Registry. The registry has accepted
> cell phone numbers since it opened for registrations in June
> 2003. There is no deadline to register a home or cell phone
> number on the Registry.
>
> You may have received an email telling you that your cell
> phone is about to be assaulted by telemarketing calls as a
> result of a new cell phone number database; however, that is
> not the case. FCC regulations prohibit telemarketers from
> using automated dialers to call cell phone numbers.
> Automated dialers are standard in the industry, so most
> telemarketers don’t call consumers on their cell phones
> without their consent.
>
> Source:
> http://www.ftc.gov/bcp/conline/pubs/alerts/dncalrt.htm
>
> So yes... It does cover cell phones.
>
> -A
>
I wasn't sure about the federal Do-Not-Call list, but as far as state level, Wisconsin didn't include that in their own do-not-call list, like Indiana did. I don't know if Wisconsin changed it to include cellphone numbers. I only know because a year ago the Milwaukee Journal Sentinal had a story that the state forgot to include cellphone numbers protection in their do-not call-list.
 
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