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Alternative Rock Radio in Cleveland

A

AllMightySting

Guest
Did it really fail....or was it just not given a fair chance? I know that it has not been on the commercial side of the dial ever since The End flipped to Hip Hop, but was it ever really given a fair shot. The End had no ratings, but it also had a very sketchy signal plagued by damaged equipment. WMMS was a strong sounding station, but was flipped back to rock after just three years if I remember correctly, right around the time ownership changed. Was the billing/ratings that low, or was the new management just eager to go in a different direction. (Can't remember if it was Jacor that bought them from Nationwide, or the other way around). Is the format just doomed to never succeed on the north coast?
 
As far as the ownership change of MMS around, what, 1994? I think it was Nationwide buying from Omnimedia. To be honest, keeping track of all the ownership changes for MMS, MJI, TAM...whew...can't ever keep it staight.
I really wish someone would just timeline the whole thing for all the stations...
ANYWAY, you know, this isn't the first time I've heard that THE END didn't have any ratings...funny thing is, I was in high school from 90-94 and in college from 94-99 and THE END is all anyone ever listened to...and when MMS went alternative too, it was GREAT! To this day, my friends and I talk about THE END and a little about MMS during the alt. era and how that music and those two stations really mark a great time in our lives. They truely provided the soundtrack for some unforgetable years!
I imagine it would be hard to sell a station that plays music targeted at 18-25, esp. alternative music which, I'm sure, many people associated with a negative element.
To this day I remember when the end flipped to Urban. I remember the afternoon jock (was it Rock-O The Rockdog?) more or less signing off...saying things like he loves Cleveland, it's his home, thanks for the good times, etc., etc.
I can honestly say that when I heard that and when they explained what was happening, first of all, I couldn't believe it. Then what I felt was something kind-a like getting dumped by your girlfriend, completely outta nowhere...sad.
Long Live The End.

> Did it really fail....or was it just not given a fair
> chance? I know that it has not been on the commercial side
> of the dial ever since The End flipped to Hip Hop, but was
> it ever really given a fair shot. The End had no ratings,
> but it also had a very sketchy signal plagued by damaged
> equipment. WMMS was a strong sounding station, but was
> flipped back to rock after just three years if I remember
> correctly, right around the time ownership changed. Was the
> billing/ratings that low, or was the new management just
> eager to go in a different direction. (Can't remember if it
> was Jacor that bought them from Nationwide, or the other way
> around). Is the format just doomed to never succeed on the
> north coast?
>
 
> As far as the ownership change of MMS around, what, 1994? I
> think it was Nationwide buying from Omnimedia. To be
> honest, keeping track of all the ownership changes for MMS,
> MJI, TAM...whew...can't ever keep it staight.
> I really wish someone would just timeline the whole thing
> for all the stations...

No problem, I'd be glad to:

WMJI:
1990--Legacy Broadcasting (from Jacor)
April 15, 1994--OmniAmerica (from Legacy, same company)
April 1996--Nationwide (from OmniAmerica)
Aug 1998--Jacor (from Nationwide)
Feb 1999--CC (merge with Jacor)

WMMS:
1993--Shamrock (from Malrite)
April 15, 1994--OmniAmerica (from Shamrock)--goes alt rock
April 1996--Nationwide (from OmniAmerica)
Feb 1997--WMMS drops alternative rock
Aug 1998--Jacor (from Nationwide)
Feb 1999--CC (merge with Jacor)


WTAM:
1990--Booth American (from Independent Group--Embrescia Wilson Pollock)
1994--Secret (Booth changes names)
Aug 1998--Jacor (from Secret)
Feb 1999--CC (merge with Jacor)

n.b. Some of the dates are tenative--let me have a look at the Radio Daze book for some more definites about the Omni to Nationwide sale. Will update Monday.
 
> As far as the ownership change of MMS around, what, 1994? I
> think it was Nationwide buying from Omnimedia. To be
> honest, keeping track of all the ownership changes for MMS,
> MJI, TAM...whew...can't ever keep it staight.
> I really wish someone would just timeline the whole thing
> for all the stations...
> ANYWAY, you know, this isn't the first time I've heard that
> THE END didn't have any ratings...funny thing is, I was in
> high school from 90-94 and in college from 94-99 and THE END
> is all anyone ever listened to...and when MMS went
> alternative too, it was GREAT! To this day, my friends and
> I talk about THE END and a little about MMS during the alt.
> era and how that music and those two stations really mark a
> great time in our lives. They truely provided the
> soundtrack for some unforgetable years!
> I imagine it would be hard to sell a station that plays
> music targeted at 18-25, esp. alternative music which, I'm
> sure, many people associated with a negative element.
> To this day I remember when the end flipped to Urban. I
> remember the afternoon jock (was it Rock-O The Rockdog?)
> more or less signing off...saying things like he loves
> Cleveland, it's his home, thanks for the good times, etc.,
> etc.
> I can honestly say that when I heard that and when they
> explained what was happening, first of all, I couldn't
> believe it. Then what I felt was something kind-a like
> getting dumped by your girlfriend, completely outta
> nowhere...sad.
> Long Live The End.

Perhaps it was the format. 107.9, with R&B/Hip Hop, has 3x the ratings the End ever had - same signal.


IMHO WMMS "Next Generation" was an overall better station than The End. Better personalities, imaging, promotions, etc. Musically End was more...adventurous, but radio is a business, meant to bring the most people in to hear a station so they in turn can hear...the commercials. Like it or not that's the reality of radio. Wasn't The End owned by Clear Channel for most of it's existence? <P ID="signature">______________
Everyone is entitled to my opinion.</P>
 
> Did it really fail....or was it just not given a fair
> chance? I know that it has not been on the commercial side
> of the dial ever since The End flipped to Hip Hop, but was
> it ever really given a fair shot. The End had no ratings,
> but it also had a very sketchy signal plagued by damaged
> equipment. WMMS was a strong sounding station, but was
> flipped back to rock after just three years if I remember
> correctly, right around the time ownership changed. Was the
> billing/ratings that low, or was the new management just
> eager to go in a different direction. (Can't remember if it
> was Jacor that bought them from Nationwide, or the other way
> around). Is the format just doomed to never succeed on the
> north coast?
>


I seem to recall that The End (107.9) did pretty well in certain zip codes where
their signal was competative, but the station was never a full-market success, primarilly due to their grade b--or worse-- signal in the western suburbs, Lorain and Medina county, and along major stretches of 1-77 near Rockside and 480. Also, very poor promotion. They do well today, because their Urban format is targeted right at their strong signal areas like Warrensville Heights, Bedford, East Cleveland, etc.

I also seem to remember that the WMMS alternative format was very competitive,
but not a runaway hit. 18-34, at that time, was pretty much a three-way tie with WNCX, WMMS and WZAK. Should Nationwide have dropped the full alt format at WMMS the way that they did? Probably not. Their replacement format of straight rock was poorly done, badly programmed, and the talent was several notches below the alt format lineup. However, remember that alt formats on the commercial dial are inconsistant ratings pullers at best. Here and there you find consistent successes, but more often they are up and down and up and down. Eventually, the format pretty much dried up or morphed into a broader rock format, like in New York at K-Rock.
 
> Perhaps it was the format. 107.9, with R&B/Hip Hop, has 3x
> the ratings the End ever had - same signal.


Radio One made a smart purchase. They really didn't need to spend bigger bucks
on a full-market signal to establish a hip-hop station, when most of the black population is in concentrated pockets within 107.9's limited grade-A coverage area.

This, more than anything else, is why they have 3x the numbers of their previous format.
 
Yeah, I remember all those guys from The End and WMMS. Rocco, Number 1 Son, and Howie Green. Also Lou Santini, Spaceman, Jen Wilde, BLF Bash at WMMS.....good times.

Radio One does have the perfect signal for their target demo...however I also remember them replacing a piece of equipment that led to their signal sounding 100% better....something The End's previous owners were too cheap to do.

I don't necessarily agree that an alt. rock station has to target only 18-25 year olds, at least in this day and age. Keeping a good variety of music I think is key in stretching that target demo well past the 34 year old mark. We've also been pleasantly surprised at WBWC with the amount of positive feedback we get from some of our listeners who are in their 40s and enjoy tracks from bands like Alkaline Trio and Motion City Soundtrack.....artists mainly directed towards people under 25. I really believe that if done correctly, an alt. rock station could really have some success in the stale radio market of Cleveland.
 
> > Perhaps it was the format. 107.9, with R&B/Hip Hop, has 3x
>
> > the ratings the End ever had - same signal.
>
>
> Radio One made a smart purchase. They really didn't need to
> spend bigger bucks
> on a full-market signal to establish a hip-hop station, when
> most of the black population is in concentrated pockets
> within 107.9's limited grade-A coverage area.
>
> This, more than anything else, is why they have 3x the
> numbers of their previous format.

Excellent point HHH.

Format was never the issue! Rolling Stone once called The End the second most influential Alt Rock station behind 107.7 in Seattle.
 
> > > Perhaps it was the format. 107.9, with R&B/Hip Hop, has
> 3x
> >
> > > the ratings the End ever had - same signal.
> >
> >
> > Radio One made a smart purchase. They really didn't need
> to
> > spend bigger bucks
> > on a full-market signal to establish a hip-hop station,
> when
> > most of the black population is in concentrated pockets
> > within 107.9's limited grade-A coverage area.
> >
> > This, more than anything else, is why they have 3x the
> > numbers of their previous format.
>
> Excellent point HHH.
>
> Format was never the issue! Rolling Stone once called The
> End the second most influential Alt Rock station behind
> 107.7 in Seattle.
>

What about KROQ or 99X ATL?<P ID="signature">______________
Everyone is entitled to my opinion.</P>
 
> Yeah, I remember all those guys from The End and WMMS.
> Rocco, Number 1 Son, and Howie Green. Also Lou Santini,
> Spaceman, Jen Wilde, BLF Bash at WMMS.....good times.
>
> Radio One does have the perfect signal for their target
> demo...however I also remember them replacing a piece of
> equipment that led to their signal sounding 100%
> better....something The End's previous owners were too cheap
> to do.
>
> I don't necessarily agree that an alt. rock station has to
> target only 18-25 year olds, at least in this day and age.
> Keeping a good variety of music I think is key in stretching
> that target demo well past the 34 year old mark. We've
> also been pleasantly surprised at WBWC with the amount of
> positive feedback we get from some of our listeners who are
> in their 40s and enjoy tracks from bands like Alkaline Trio
> and Motion City Soundtrack.....artists mainly directed
> towards people under 25. I really believe that if done
> correctly, an alt. rock station could really have some
> success in the stale radio market of Cleveland.
>
I'll agree with that. Also, consider this...those kids that were listening to Pearl Jam, Soundgarden, Nirvana, and the countless one-hit-wonders, are in their late 20s/early 30s now and they're the son's and daughter's of the baby-boomer generation. That's a HUGE demographic. Hearing the popular alt. bands like the aforementioned, it's like a trip down memory lane. In a way, it's my version of my parent's oldies. Sounds like-a strange to say that.
 
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