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AM 970 “The Answer”
- Thread starter wadio
- Start date
970 AM and 94.7 FM were once WAAT AM & FM Newark. That would be ironic if they were joined once again! What goes around comes around!
If that did happen, however, WNYM would not really be increasing its reach into the five boroughs of NYC and on Long Island. It would still be serving mostly Northern NJ.
If that did happen, however, WNYM would not really be increasing its reach into the five boroughs of NYC and on Long Island. It would still be serving mostly Northern NJ.
If Salem were to be considering a purchase of WFME, it would be to carry a Christian Music format aimed at younger demos than its talk format.
However, there have been several reports that Harold Camping will not sell WFME to any other religious broadcaster, and that makes sense from his perspective. Even though Salem is a for-profit corporation, they often carry religious programming that might conflict with Camping's theology.
That said, there are likely bigger organizations, with deeper pockets, bigger target audiences and bigger plans for WFME's signal who would outbid Salem.
This is a no-brainer. Of course if this station became available I would want to do it. Getting a newstalker on FM is an idea that will come to NYC at some point. It is a great format, proven to work on FM where 80% of the 25-54's go. Many of them no longer come to the AM band meaning those of us on AM have to fight for the remainder. I am always gonna be an AM guy, but getting an FM would be awesome.
I am looking for possibilities, so thanks for all the suggestions here.
Phil
I am looking for possibilities, so thanks for all the suggestions here.
Phil
Talk of putting the format on FM is amusing. It's well known that WNYM on 970 is highly directional and at night, especially so. But if people think that by virtue of being on FM, younger listeners will be automatically attracted to the radio station and the ratings will quadruple, they're mistaken. Spare us the Radio 101 about all the younger listeners available and the success radio stations like WTOP have had. Different market. All news isn't news-talk. We know that. If the same 55 year old gasbags are hackin' 'n yackin' about the same topics (Dems = Devils, GOP = Saviors of the World ... or vice versa), putting the format on FM won't automatically attract hordes of new listeners. And it's going to take more than spiffy imaging to make this dog hunt. Good luck. WNYM sure ain't a 50k clear like WJR and WABC.
Element9 said:
I guess you can call the night pattern highly directional, but the 50-kW day pattern, while not loose, is hardly what most engineers would call highly directional. It is scarcely more directional than the patterns of several other Class B AMs that are licensed to the New York metro area and transmit from north Jersey. The principal determinant of the daytime pattern shape is first-adjacent WELI. The day signal toward WELI is equivalent to ~1.5 kW ND.
If a religious broadcaster is interested in Camping's FM, all that has to happen is for some broker to buy it, LMA it to the religious broadcaster then flip it to the religious broadcaster.
Except for the fact that Camping has lawyers who are paid to know how to avoid that scenario. They would just have to put a clause in the sale contract that prohibited the station from being used for "any" religious broadcasting for X-number of years. If the buyer didn't agree to that he couldn't buy the station, and the clause could be imposed on any future buyers for X-number of years.
Basically, the way Camping probably sees it, Family Radio built a religious tradition on that frequency for half a century, and he doesn't want that audience to be sold on a conflicting theology after Family's exit. Among those he would really not want to be heard on that frequency are the "prophet's for profit" who make big financial scores for themselves on commercial block time religious stations. Say whatever you will about Camping, but IRS records show he didn't take any kind of salary or payment for what he did at Family. It was donated charity work on his part. Some "prophets for profit" take million dollar salaries, own multi-million dollar mansions, and even jet around in private jets that cost millions of dollars a year to operate. One even claims that is needed so he can avoid the wasted time of airport security. You can't blame Camping for not wanting these guys to benefit from Family's legacy.
TimeIsTight said:
OK, but the issue that remains is that if 94.7's stick cannot move to Manhattan and become a full-market class B FM, what bigger operator would want it? Without the ability to access all those listeners east of the Hudson, it doesn't seem so attractive. Of course, these people have their lawyers to address those issues. Again, just MHO.
Anybody not understanding the NYC market would derive that 94.7 has no signal east of the Hudson. Although, it would be impeded by the buildings in Manhattan and 14 miles, 94.7 still has signal East of the City, it is just not as good as the rest on a competitive level.radioguy39nj said:TimeIsTight said:
OK, but the issue that remains is that if 94.7's stick cannot move to Manhattan and become a full-market class B FM, what bigger operator would want it? Without the ability to access all those listeners east of the Hudson, it doesn't seem so attractive. Of course, these people have their lawyers to address those issues. Again, just MHO.
You can see Empire from its current location. So it is not that impaired. You are talking almost twice the height which is not possible from where they are. There is a general aviation airport only a few miles to the North that would come into play plus building penetration at the lower power level into New York would be an issue.
As far as Family Radio was concerned, 94.7 was just a big translator from Oakland, California. So, they didn't want the expense of Empire rent. Electric Bill and property taxes and a few salaries while sitting on a cash cow for Family and the knowledge of a very valuable asset.
It was very short-sighted. But no more short-sighted than our WQYK and WRBQ. When they were number one and number two, they had the option of moving to a bigger stick, but they, too, didn't want to spend the money. Now they can't, but they cover the market. So does 94.7.
We haven't heard much about 107.5 lately. That is the bigger hampering in the price of 94.7 since it is already a "turn key" full market signal. No paint or carpet necessary. This couldn't have come at a worse time for the Camping gang.
I think this needed clarification.
Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!
The 107.5 situation is this:
An investor group reportedly bought $250-million face value of Inner City's debt for about $60-million, and then used that debt to set a minimum bid of $180-million for all 17 Inner City stations., and won the bankruptcy auction because nobody else bid. A station in San Fran was sold separately, and one in the South will also be sold.
From all indications, the investors, which include Magic Johnson, plan to keep WBLS and run it essentially as is. The latest is they are in the process of leasing new, and far cheaper, office and studio space while waiting for FCC approval of the station sale.
So, it was kind of an inside deal that didn't impact the WFME transaction at all.
Looking quickly at the numbers, there are 15.6-million people in the NY Radio market, with 8-million in NYC, and depending on where you draw the lines, between five and six-million in North Jersey. That gives WFME a coverage area with more than 13-million people.
That is still a bigger population than any station in Radio Market-2, which is Los Angeles, and twice the population of Radio Market-4 which is San Francisco.
So while WFME from West Orange, might not have a perfect Empire State Building signal, it still reaches more people than most radio stations in the country and is therefore a valuable property. And there are probably quite a few potential buyers who are interested.
We have mostly discussed a potential ESPN bid, but there are likely many other radio broadcasters who would like a signal in the New York market. We know CBS and Clear Channel are maxed out, but Cumulus is not, and there are too many other companies to list which own stations in other big markets but not NYC that would be interested.
No doubt, WFME would be more valuable if it could transmit from NYC, but it's still probably worth a large fraction of that top number from West Orange. It's just missing the part of Long Island that is in the official NY Market.
No doubt that a number of organizations have had their consulting engineers and other consultants checking out all the possibilities for WFME. It's may not be perfect but it is still a rare jewel.
As far as Camping turning down a bid from a religious broadcaster, that kind of sale isn't very likely anyway, this is the kind of a license for a commercial broadcaster who has big plans and can pay big dollars. Religious broadcasters usually are outbid in these situations. Family Radio has already sold two major market stations, one in DC to CBS, and the other in Philly to Merlin, the WFME sale will be to a buyer on that kind of financial scale.
And as with everything I post here, it is all IMHO
TimeIsTight said:
Looking quickly at the numbers, there are 15.6-million people in the NY Radio market, with 8-million in NYC, and depending on where you draw the lines, between five and six-million in North Jersey. That gives WFME a coverage area with more than 13-million people.
That is still a bigger population than any station in Radio Market-2, which is Los Angeles, and twice the population of Radio Market-4 which is San Francisco.
So while WFME from West Orange, might not have a perfect Empire State Building signal, it still reaches more people than most radio stations in the country and is therefore a valuable property. And there are probably quite a few potential buyers who are interested.
We have mostly discussed a potential ESPN bid, but there are likely many other radio broadcasters who would like a signal in the New York market. We know CBS and Clear Channel are maxed out, but Cumulus is not, and there are too many other companies to list which own stations in other big markets but not NYC that would be interested.
No doubt, WFME would be more valuable if it could transmit from NYC, but it's still probably worth a large fraction of that top number from West Orange. It's just missing the part of Long Island that is in the official NY Market.
No doubt that a number of organizations have had their consulting engineers and other consultants checking out all the possibilities for WFME. It's may not be perfect but it is still a rare jewel.
As far as Camping turning down a bid from a religious broadcaster, that kind of sale isn't very likely anyway, this is the kind of a license for a commercial broadcaster who has big plans and can pay big dollars. Religious broadcasters usually are outbid in these situations. Family Radio has already sold two major market stations, one in DC to CBS, and the other in Philly to Merlin, the WFME sale will be to a buyer on that kind of financial scale.
And as with everything I post here, it is all IMHO
You are correct, except this is New York.
Any place else, a broadcaster would die for 13 Million potential pairs of ears. In New York, #8 (formerly #4 market) Philadelphia is "that town down the street".
The relativity is that 13 Million isn't enough, when that potential of 15.6 Million is so much more.
New York is the exception to all rules.
As I've stated before, Family didn't care about upgrading the signal in the past as it was sufficient as a translator for Oakland.
But their finances have changed. Like the guy who used to make $100/hour finds himself out of work and then at McDonalds at $8/hour, perspectives, again, change. I wouldn't doubt for a moment that what I know about Family over the years has changed. All of a sudden, when the donations stop rolling in like thunder, 94.7's worth becomes more clear to them. Time to look at selling the cash cow while it still has value. (remember the internet listening is breathing down the necks of all OTA radio)
Step one: request a change to commercial to their license, just in case.
Step two: experiment with a higher antenna, since it is right next door.
Step three: ?
It is next.
Jeff in Sa-ra-so-ta!
I presume WFME broadcasts in stereo.
Would dropping the stereo pilot help increase coverage in Manhattan and points east? They could easily do this right now for a few hours to prove the potential to an interested party who might want to do a talk, news or sports format.
I know that Scott Fybush and others have confirmed that a 94.7 move to the ESB is probably not possible without a lot of juggling, but what about at reduced power like WQXR?
And 4 Times Square is out? WBGO squeezed in there with a directional pattern, and aren't they hemmed in pretty bad?
Would dropping the stereo pilot help increase coverage in Manhattan and points east? They could easily do this right now for a few hours to prove the potential to an interested party who might want to do a talk, news or sports format.
I know that Scott Fybush and others have confirmed that a 94.7 move to the ESB is probably not possible without a lot of juggling, but what about at reduced power like WQXR?
And 4 Times Square is out? WBGO squeezed in there with a directional pattern, and aren't they hemmed in pretty bad?
If "upgrading" means moving to Manhattan, the co-and-adjacent frequency stations in Springfield, Mass, and Smithtown, Long Island, that create a short-spaced problem have both been there for a very long time. The move to NYC was probably NEVER possible.
It's not a donations flow problem, its a debt problem caused by buying advertising for the Rapture that didn't happen. Camping was also spending a lot of money on international shortwave broadcasting because he saw his "mission" as spreading the "word," like many a credit card holder he just ran the balance too high and that forced the station sales. But Family is not bankrupt so he is still free to sell WFME to whomever he wants at whatever price he is willing to accept.
No "just in case" about it, the switch to a commercial license was so the station could be sold. It was announced that the station was for sale.
The experiment with the higher antenna is probably for the benefit of a potential buyer who wanted to test maxed out signal coverage from that location, and may not want to buy Family's real estate on the mountain, and Family may have reasons to want to sell it separately. Example: Let's say a big non-broadcast communications company wants the Family building, tower and location all to itself to relay data signals.
Yup, at a New York fashion show if she isn't a "top super model" regular "runway strutters" aren't even worth looking at.
Would 970's The Answer's programming work on 94.7?
TimeIsTight said:No doubt, WFME would be more valuable if it could transmit from NYC, but it's still probably worth a large fraction of that top number from West Orange. It's just missing the part of Long Island that is in the official NY Market.
And as with everything I post here, it is all IMHO
That part of Long Island you're referring to has demos that advertisers are looking for. It's one of the highest income areas in the country. Those 2.5 million potential listeners cannot be discounted. If 94.7 can't reach those consumers, it's value will be compromised.
badjef said:
What is step three, Jeff? From what I've gathered, a higher antenna in NJ will not solve the issue of reaching Long Island. Perhaps step three is where an operator with very deep pockets and shrewd lawyers comes along to move 94.7's stick to Manhattan. Again, just MHO.
Your turn, Jeff!
secondchoice said:
The problem here is that Salem's a religious broadcaster with some secular stations--for profit, but still a religious broadcaster. Family has said that they will not sell to a religious broadcaster. Unless Salem could promise that they will not flip to their "The Fish" CCM format or a teaching format if The Answer doesn't work, Family is not going to sell to Salem.
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