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AM Band in Rochester market
- Thread starter dustintv
- Start date
Check out Radio-Locator and you'll see why...all the low-dial stations are in a ring roughly 75-100 miles away from Rochester. From a technical standpoint, it'd be virtually impossible to fit a new low-dial station in Rochester. As for politically? I can only guess that it's probably related to several low-dial stations being in New York City and being in Canada. Assuming that most of those stations are very old, it probably meant the only places to fit new low-dial stations were in areas more centrally located between NYC and Montreal/Toronto...Albany, Syracuse, etc.
There is also the class designation by the FCC for various AM frequencies. It sets 550-630 as regionals (not local) and 640-890 (except 790) as "clear". So by definition for a lot of the low band there's only going to be two or three stations in the entire USA (and often one of them is in Alaska).
That's all just a uneducated guess, though. I imagine our esteemed Mr. Fybush could speak more on the subject when he returns from DC/Baltimore.
There is also the class designation by the FCC for various AM frequencies. It sets 550-630 as regionals (not local) and 640-890 (except 790) as "clear". So by definition for a lot of the low band there's only going to be two or three stations in the entire USA (and often one of them is in Alaska).
That's all just a uneducated guess, though. I imagine our esteemed Mr. Fybush could speak more on the subject when he returns from DC/Baltimore.
B
Bob1370
Guest
Scott Fybush is indeed the expert on this and undoubtedly will have more (and more accurate) comments on this. A couple things I can share...
A lot of the allocation of radio stations dates back to the late 1920s as the Federal Radio Commission (predecessor of the FCC) tried to bring order to a chaotic AM band. Back then, stations applied for licenses and, under the 1912 radiotelephone laws and 1922 Commerce Department regs, put their stations wherever the hell they wanted and ran whatever power they pleased or could afford on whatever schedule they could afford to run (anything from a few hours a week, up to a few pioneers in big cities running 24/7). They just picked channels that allowed them (they thought) to dodge interference from anybody else.
Needless to say, it didn't work.
So Congress created the FRC to allocate stations to specific channels, and hours of operation in many cases, so the band wouldn't become a cacophany. They gave broad powers, and the FRC used them to shut dozens of stations down completely and force others to share time on a frequency. They went on to classify stations according not only to their hours (letting some operate only sunrise to sunset, others around the clock) but their coverage area. Bigger and more spread-out population centers got bigger coverage stations, smaller and more compact towns found their stations were usually licensed for smaller coverage areas through lower power. There were four classes; wide coverage stations with 5,000 to 50,000 watts and either a monopoly on their channel or limited sharing with one or two widely spaced stations giving each other minimal interference on the channel; regional stations given 500 or 1000 watts to cover a midsized metro area, and a few hundred miles of spacing between stations on the regional channels; local coverage stations able only to cover a single city or county and given 100 or 250 watts by day, 100 watts at night; and daytimers that had to shut down completely at sunset. They allocated channels so that the middle of the band got most of the high power stations (although some were put at the bottom and top of the dial as well), the bottom end got mostly 500 or 1000 watt signals which still gave decent coverage at longer wavelengths, and the higher frequency channels were a mix of regional and local stations with just a few channels (1460 to 1490) playing host to a handful of 5,000 and 10,000 watt stations. That setup was in place by 1928 and stayed in place almost until World War II...with modifications, it stayed in place even after the band expanded from 550-1500 to 540-1600 in 1941. Stations on regional channels were allowed to raise power to 5,000 watts, either fulltime or during the daylight hours, after directional antennas came along and proved themselves in the early 1930s.
How did this affect Rochester? We got only one really high power station because only Stromberg-Carlson, which bought WHAM from the U of R, had the foresight to pick an otherwise unused channel in the middle of the band (1150 in 1928, moving to 1180 in 1941) and had the resources to equip and build out a high power transmitter for itself. There was only one other station in town (WHEC) before 1936, and Frank Gannett only wanted to use it to serve the immediate area, so he didn't try for a better allocation or more than 1000 watts of power in the pre-directional antenna days. The third station, WSAY, came along late enough that there wasn't room for more than a local channel station under the old, stricter allocation rules until after the AM band expanded in 1941, so it started as a 250 watt peanut-whistle. The directional antenna liberated it, and WHEC, after the war. But Syracuse, Buffalo and NYC had beaten Rochester to the punch when it came to claiming the best regional frequencies and (in New York's case) the clears. They all had multiple stations on the air several years before Rochester even got its second fulltime station (WHEC) in 1925.
Bottom line? Federal restrictions gradually tightened, while Rochester was slower in starting up radio facilities than other communities around it.
A lot of the allocation of radio stations dates back to the late 1920s as the Federal Radio Commission (predecessor of the FCC) tried to bring order to a chaotic AM band. Back then, stations applied for licenses and, under the 1912 radiotelephone laws and 1922 Commerce Department regs, put their stations wherever the hell they wanted and ran whatever power they pleased or could afford on whatever schedule they could afford to run (anything from a few hours a week, up to a few pioneers in big cities running 24/7). They just picked channels that allowed them (they thought) to dodge interference from anybody else.
Needless to say, it didn't work.
So Congress created the FRC to allocate stations to specific channels, and hours of operation in many cases, so the band wouldn't become a cacophany. They gave broad powers, and the FRC used them to shut dozens of stations down completely and force others to share time on a frequency. They went on to classify stations according not only to their hours (letting some operate only sunrise to sunset, others around the clock) but their coverage area. Bigger and more spread-out population centers got bigger coverage stations, smaller and more compact towns found their stations were usually licensed for smaller coverage areas through lower power. There were four classes; wide coverage stations with 5,000 to 50,000 watts and either a monopoly on their channel or limited sharing with one or two widely spaced stations giving each other minimal interference on the channel; regional stations given 500 or 1000 watts to cover a midsized metro area, and a few hundred miles of spacing between stations on the regional channels; local coverage stations able only to cover a single city or county and given 100 or 250 watts by day, 100 watts at night; and daytimers that had to shut down completely at sunset. They allocated channels so that the middle of the band got most of the high power stations (although some were put at the bottom and top of the dial as well), the bottom end got mostly 500 or 1000 watt signals which still gave decent coverage at longer wavelengths, and the higher frequency channels were a mix of regional and local stations with just a few channels (1460 to 1490) playing host to a handful of 5,000 and 10,000 watt stations. That setup was in place by 1928 and stayed in place almost until World War II...with modifications, it stayed in place even after the band expanded from 550-1500 to 540-1600 in 1941. Stations on regional channels were allowed to raise power to 5,000 watts, either fulltime or during the daylight hours, after directional antennas came along and proved themselves in the early 1930s.
How did this affect Rochester? We got only one really high power station because only Stromberg-Carlson, which bought WHAM from the U of R, had the foresight to pick an otherwise unused channel in the middle of the band (1150 in 1928, moving to 1180 in 1941) and had the resources to equip and build out a high power transmitter for itself. There was only one other station in town (WHEC) before 1936, and Frank Gannett only wanted to use it to serve the immediate area, so he didn't try for a better allocation or more than 1000 watts of power in the pre-directional antenna days. The third station, WSAY, came along late enough that there wasn't room for more than a local channel station under the old, stricter allocation rules until after the AM band expanded in 1941, so it started as a 250 watt peanut-whistle. The directional antenna liberated it, and WHEC, after the war. But Syracuse, Buffalo and NYC had beaten Rochester to the punch when it came to claiming the best regional frequencies and (in New York's case) the clears. They all had multiple stations on the air several years before Rochester even got its second fulltime station (WHEC) in 1925.
Bottom line? Federal restrictions gradually tightened, while Rochester was slower in starting up radio facilities than other communities around it.
It's a "luck of the draw" situation, and stations wound up on various frequencies as a matter of happenstance. Circumstances simply left Rochester with only one low-dial-position station, which was daytimer WRNY, then WRVM, then WNYR, with 250 watts nondirectional on 680. That station migrated to 990 through a settlement with Rogers Communications of Toronto when CFTR's power-up to 50kw on 680 created unacceptable co-channel interference in the late 70s.
Another nearby example: WENY Elmira signed on as a share-timer co-channel WESG with WHCU Ithaca on 850 kHz in the 1930s, then migrated to graveyard 1230 where WENY sits today. The Elmira station still has its monster 850 quarter-wave free-standing stick, a 405-footer. I always wondered if any RF actually made it to the top when the station used to power down to 250 watts at night. WESG stood for "Elmira Star-Gazette," Gannett's first paper, BTW.
There are two graveyarders (you call 'em Class C, but broadcasters of my generation will forever refer to the 6 graveyard channels as "Class IV.") There's WBTA 1490 in Batavia and WDNY 1400 in Dansville. From what I hear if Tony Brandon had had his way, we could potentially have had a 1450 in Rochester, if WWWG had gotten permission to tear down its 3-tower array and move over one channel. That obviously never happened.
Another nearby example: WENY Elmira signed on as a share-timer co-channel WESG with WHCU Ithaca on 850 kHz in the 1930s, then migrated to graveyard 1230 where WENY sits today. The Elmira station still has its monster 850 quarter-wave free-standing stick, a 405-footer. I always wondered if any RF actually made it to the top when the station used to power down to 250 watts at night. WESG stood for "Elmira Star-Gazette," Gannett's first paper, BTW.
There are two graveyarders (you call 'em Class C, but broadcasters of my generation will forever refer to the 6 graveyard channels as "Class IV.") There's WBTA 1490 in Batavia and WDNY 1400 in Dansville. From what I hear if Tony Brandon had had his way, we could potentially have had a 1450 in Rochester, if WWWG had gotten permission to tear down its 3-tower array and move over one channel. That obviously never happened.
Savage said:It's a "luck of the draw" situation, and stations wound up on various frequencies as a matter of happenstance.
How true. Why did WFBL in Syracuse end up on 1390 if it was the "First Broadcast License" in the market? You'd think they could have landed a better choice.
When WOLF signed on in 1940, WSYR and WFBL were the only other stations in town. As the story goes, founder T. Sherman Marshall was prompted to build a new station in Syracuse because it was the largest market in the country with only two stations. But he was initially assigned 250 watts on 1500, only to have WAGE put that great signal on 620 several years later. He sold WOLF for $500k in 1957 -- a sum that would nearly equal 4 million today. We'll soon see if WOLF's former sister FM in DeRuyter sells above that price.
There are two graveyarders (you call 'em Class C, but broadcasters of my generation will forever refer to the 6 graveyard channels as "Class IV.") There's WBTA 1490 in Batavia and WDNY 1400 in Dansville. From what I hear if Tony Brandon had had his way, we could potentially have had a 1450 in Rochester, if WWWG had gotten permission to tear down its 3-tower array and move over one channel. That obviously never happened.
By the current market definition, we could also include WGVA 1240 in Ontario County.
J
JustPastBuffalo
Guest
One very important consideration as it relates to applications and assigments of AM radio stations was the population of Buffalo and Rochester before and immediately after World War 2. At the time, Buffalo was a large, major-market city on the brink of a slow, continuous decline which began around 1958. Curiously, a review of the FM table of allocations in the early 60s shows Buffalo being viewed, by the FCC at least, as a major population base.
As to AM stations that were handicapped by highly directional patterns or low power despite being one of the first few to sign on in a market, one of the worst belongs to KQV-AM 1410, one of the first AM radio stations in Pittsburgh.
As to AM stations that were handicapped by highly directional patterns or low power despite being one of the first few to sign on in a market, one of the worst belongs to KQV-AM 1410, one of the first AM radio stations in Pittsburgh.
JustPastBuffalo said:One very important consideration as it relates to applications and assigments of AM radio stations was the population of Buffalo and Rochester before and immediately after World War 2. At the time, Buffalo was a large, major-market city on the brink of a slow, continuous decline which began around 1958. Curiously, a review of the FM table of allocations in the early 60s shows Buffalo being viewed, by the FCC at least, as a major population base.
Good observation. My 1967 copy of the FM allocations table shows Buffalo tied with Dallas at nine channels each (not counting the two designated for Niagara Falls and Depew.)
But Cincinnati was assigned only seven, Atlanta got only six (!), and at that time, Orlando had only four.
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