• Get involved.
    We want your input!
    Apply for Membership and join the conversations about everything related to broadcasting.

    After we receive your registration, a moderator will review it. After your registration is approved, you will be permitted to post.
    If you use a disposable or false email address, your registration will be rejected.

    After your membership is approved, please take a minute to tell us a little bit about yourself.
    https://www.radiodiscussions.com/forums/introduce-yourself.1088/

    Thanks in advance and have fun!
    RadioDiscussions Administrators

AM DXers - Need Your Help!

> Okay, guys. Tell a virtual radio idiot what you mean, in
> English!
> Believe it or not, I AM interested in this setup!

Here is my loop antenna page:

http://www.mindspring.com/~loop_antenna

Its got a lot of information as well as construction projects (some of which work better than others).

Basically - a box loop antenna is a tuned LC resonant circuit. The inductive portion is the loop, and it intercepts the magnetic field broadcast by the station. The larger the dimensions, the more magnetic flux it intercepts - and the more sensitive the antenna. The capacitor resonates with the loop, forming a bandpass filter centered at the tuned frequency. The lower the resistance of the wire, and the higher the isolation in the tuning capacitor, the narrower the bandwidth of the antenna - and to a point that is a good thing because the box loop can enhance reception of distant stations closely spaced with locals. Given too narrow of a bandwidth - audio response can be limited.

A box loop intercepts so much signal that any radio placed in proximity to it will receive gain from it inductively - but many box loop designs include a sense winding in the same plane as the antenna, so inductive coupling between the primary (loop antenna) and secondary (sense winding) can be maximized by transformer action.

In practice, using a loop involves a two step iterative process - tuning the radio close to where the target station will be - hopefully maximize a weak signal if present. Then place the loop in proximity (or connect the sense winding to the external antenna inputs), and tune the loop to the station. If you cannot hear the target station at all until you use the loop - you might have to get close on the radio, peak a nearby station strong enough to be heard, then offset the radio. The out of band response from the loop may be enough to begin to bring in the station, but you might have to go back and forth from radio to antenna to get the station maximized.

There are small loop antennas commercially available from Terk, Select-A-Tenna, and kiwa - a few others - but they are horrendously overpriced for what you get. A pizza box, 120 feet of wire, and a junk tuning capacitor will do just as well. I can even fabricate a tuning capacitor from an old coke can if need be (an old crystal radio trick). So the raw materials are cheap - the results can be astonishing!
 
> > Okay, guys. Tell a virtual radio idiot what you mean, in
> > English!
> > Believe it or not, I AM interested in this setup!
>
> Here is my loop antenna page:
>
> http://www.mindspring.com/~loop_antenna
>
> Its got a lot of information as well as construction
> projects (some of which work better than others).
>
> Basically - a box loop antenna is a tuned LC resonant
> circuit. The inductive portion is the loop, and it
> intercepts the magnetic field broadcast by the station. The
> larger the dimensions, the more magnetic flux it intercepts
> - and the more sensitive the antenna. The capacitor
> resonates with the loop, forming a bandpass filter centered
> at the tuned frequency. The lower the resistance of the
> wire, and the higher the isolation in the tuning capacitor,
> the narrower the bandwidth of the antenna - and to a point
> that is a good thing because the box loop can enhance
> reception of distant stations closely spaced with locals.
> Given too narrow of a bandwidth - audio response can be
> limited.
>
> A box loop intercepts so much signal that any radio placed
> in proximity to it will receive gain from it inductively -
> but many box loop designs include a sense winding in the
> same plane as the antenna, so inductive coupling between the
> primary (loop antenna) and secondary (sense winding) can be
> maximized by transformer action.
>
> In practice, using a loop involves a two step iterative
> process - tuning the radio close to where the target station
> will be - hopefully maximize a weak signal if present. Then
> place the loop in proximity (or connect the sense winding to
> the external antenna inputs), and tune the loop to the
> station. If you cannot hear the target station at all until
> you use the loop - you might have to get close on the radio,
> peak a nearby station strong enough to be heard, then offset
> the radio. The out of band response from the loop may be
> enough to begin to bring in the station, but you might have
> to go back and forth from radio to antenna to get the
> station maximized.
>
> There are small loop antennas commercially available from
> Terk, Select-A-Tenna, and kiwa - a few others - but they are
> horrendously overpriced for what you get. A pizza box, 120
> feet of wire, and a junk tuning capacitor will do just as
> well. I can even fabricate a tuning capacitor from an old
> coke can if need be (an old crystal radio trick). So the
> raw materials are cheap - the results can be astonishing!
>
Bruce - Many thanks for the info, and I apologize in advance for my continuing ignorance..........

Antique Radio Supply lists a capacitor, variable, 3 section, 365 PF, 3 1/4" long frame, 1/4" x 1" shaft ($24.95). Since I don't have immediate access to a junk radio and am willing to order this capacitor, will it work?
 
> Antique Radio Supply lists a capacitor, variable, 3 section,
> 365 PF, 3 1/4" long frame, 1/4" x 1" shaft ($24.95). Since
> I don't have immediate access to a junk radio and am willing
> to order this capacitor, will it work?

Yes - this is perfect for loop antenna projects. Paralleling sections will increase your tuning range if you don't "get it right" the first time. At least it will give you more options.
 
> > Antique Radio Supply lists a capacitor, variable, 3
> section,
> > 365 PF, 3 1/4" long frame, 1/4" x 1" shaft ($24.95).
> Since
> > I don't have immediate access to a junk radio and am
> willing
> > to order this capacitor, will it work?
>
> Yes - this is perfect for loop antenna projects.
> Paralleling sections will increase your tuning range if you
> don't "get it right" the first time. At least it will give
> you more options.
>
Thanks again for all of your helpful advice.
The box is built, the wire is wound and I'm awaiting the capacitor!
 
> > Antique Radio Supply lists a capacitor, variable, 3
> section,
> > 365 PF, 3 1/4" long frame, 1/4" x 1" shaft ($24.95).
> Since
> > I don't have immediate access to a junk radio and am
> willing
> > to order this capacitor, will it work?
>
> Yes - this is perfect for loop antenna projects.
> Paralleling sections will increase your tuning range if you
> don't "get it right" the first time. At least it will give
> you more options.
>
The capacitor arrived, which of course leads me to another question. It has two points to connect wire at each end: the end where the floating plates are fully closed and the end where they are fully open. I've reviewed the instructions on your web site but they're not clear to me.
How would you suggest I make the connections to this capacitor?
This SHOULD be my last question, I hope!
 
> The capacitor arrived, which of course leads me to another
> question. It has two points to connect wire at each end:
> the end where the floating plates are fully closed and the
> end where they are fully open. I've reviewed the
> instructions on your web site but they're not clear to me.
> How would you suggest I make the connections to this
> capacitor?
> This SHOULD be my last question, I hope!

The frame connects to the moving plates - that is one side. By convention ground because it used to be screwed to the chassis. There is a terminal connecting to the stationary plates in each section.

There isn't a whole lot of difference which side you hook to the loop, since it is symmetrical.
 
> A GE Super Radio III is ordered; thanks to everyone for your advice.

I am truly sorry that I did not read and reply to your question before you bought your GE. These radios are OK, but they are cheap, consumer grade, and do not have anywhere near the guts of my favorite DX portable. You will spend more money for mine, but if you really want the best available, there is absolutely nothing that will compare with the
<a target="_blank" href=http://www.pi-usa.com/fim2241/fim2241g.htm>Patomac Instruments FIM-41.</a>
I do not mean for this to sound like an advertisement, but this is truly a case where where you get what you pay for.<P ID="signature">______________
Proud 2 B a pioneering satellite radio subs¢riber
Ai4i is always on the trailing edge of technology
_______________</P>
 
Status
This thread has been closed due to inactivity. You can create a new thread to discuss this topic.


Back
Top Bottom