Another Reason Voicetracking is the Pits

[iused2bsomebody]

Man you guys get your panties in a wad easy. Just so you know, I still work in the business full-time, voice track from time to time and love my job very much. I take a lot of pride in what I do and if for instance I make a mistake while voice tracking, I go back and redo it to make sure it sounds right. I listen to each break after it is recorded and don't leave the studio until I'm satisfied with the finished product and if I do say so myself, I do a great job and doubt that any of you could tell the difference between me being live or voice tracked. There now saying that, I simply tried to point out that alot in the business just go through the motions of doing what they have to do so they can go home and don't care about the final product because they have a negative attitude and are upset that they have to voice track and blame it on the suits. My God guys, calm down and be open minded to these posts rather than trying to tear someone apart for simply getting in the conversation. It's really getting to the point where I'm about ready to give up on putting my 2 cents in and just let the rest of you vent. Your starting to act like a bunch of old men at the diner complaing about everything. Try to be more open minded. After all this is a forum to express your opinion the last time I checked.

 

[FilioScotia]

You're the one whose panties are in a wad. You are clearly younger than many of the veteran radio people who hang around these pages, and you don't realize how offensive it was to even suggest that a professional radio person would deliberately do a bad job just to prove a point to the people paying his salary.

To answer your original question, NO I don't think paid talent ever deliberately drops the ball to show managment how much voice tracking sucks. Yes there are people out there with lousy attitudes who don't care enough about their jobs to make sure it's done right all the time, and they deserve to be fired and replaced. That's not the same thing as deliberate sabotage.

Here's something every person in this business should commit to memory and remember whenever they start thinking about how stupid voice tracking is, how stupid their format is, how stupid their PD is, how stupid their owner is and how their jobs and lives generally suck.

Here it is. Carve it in stone: For every one of us, who are paid to come in and do this job every day, there are at least a thousand others out there pounding the sidewalks who would gladly come in and do the same job at least as well as you and do it for less than you're getting. Many would do it for nothing.

The only thing worse than working in a job you hate is not having a job to hate.

 

[oaktree]

Let us hear how YOU do it, then.

If you have the kind of "pride" you say you do, then, I bet you do a great job. So, share with us and show us how it's done.

The point certainly wasn't about what kind of job you do, it was about your attitude which if you are as good as you say you are, was either exactly how you feel about radio, how you sound in it and nobody calls themself what you name yourself. You have some issues.

So, the call letters and shift time are what?

Thanks, I'll gladly listen. I'd like to hear that "pride" you spoke of. Your attitude sucks. The betting pool begins right here as to if you really are in radio, let alone that good to talk down to people like you do. If your audience, no matter the format, catches on as we did, you're better off in another career, I'm afraid, "Used2besomebody."

Get your shorts unwadded, my friend.

 

[iused2bsomebody]

The comment had nothing to do with my attitude. I was simply adding to the conversation as they do on alot of shows with a pro/con back and forth point of view. What really gets me about this post is that it all started out as "why voice-tracking is the pits" and has now turned into a chance to insult me for simply trying to make a point/counter point remark. My name on this site is aimed at a comment that an old radio pro said to me one time when I asked him who he was. He said,"I used to be somebody". I thought it was funny and decided to use it, but here I go trying again to defend myself for you. Why, I'm sure you'll just have more negative things to say. It's ok, your radio brothers and sisters and I love you no matter what. Go back to the bashing now and God bless all of you.

 

[soloflyr1]

I can attest to used2be's credentials, professionalism & honesty.

He has been in the industry for years, worked in big markets & was successful in them, is just as broken hearted as anybody else about the state of radio as we know it now.

I don't think he was posing the question as an accusation against anyone, just questioning the possibility.

He's ugly as hell (not many in radio aren't), but a damn good guy (not as many in radio are).

 

[ChuckTiller]

The fact here none of us really like voicetracking. However, it is here to stay. As such, whether it is minimum wage over an overblown salary, the job should be done professionally. When you hear your voice on the radio, you know you want it to be right. Therefore, do it right!

I have noticed the work ethic seems to be different from those who have been on the air for years than those who have recently arrived. Some feel they are entitled to immediate large salaries, full time and part time, even though they have NO on hands experience. They also expect the equipment to work flawlessly. With today's complicated technical advances, there will be errors. When something goes wrong, I have witnessed the panic of the inexperienced who quickly demand that it should work properly. Welcome to radio, baby!

By the way, I can attest to FilioScotia's credentials, professionalism & honesty, too. This cat was on the radio when I was a teenager hoping and wishing that I could be on the radio!

Ladies and gentlemen, let's end this argument and end this thread. Again, we don't like it, BUT voice tracking is here; it's not going away. Do it right or get a gig elsewhere.

 

[FilioScotia]

Couldn't agree more Chuck. I agree that this thread has drifted a bit from where it started, and iusedtobesomebody has the right to feel that he's been put upon because of the question he posed.

I just hope he can understand that the way he posed his question carried a faint hint that maybe he thinks it's OK to do what he asked about, or has even done it himself.

It's clear that some people, me included, caught that faint whiff and reacted to it rather strongly. I now see that I overreacted in my questioning of his credentials, and I apologize for that.

Hey folks we're all in this together -- young and old -- and I think we can agree that radio ain't the fun business it used to be, but, for now at least, it still pays my bills.

Chuck is right. Let's shake hands and close out this thread. OK?

 

[aunti-terrestrial]

One last thing, Filio. You mentioned that there are people who will do the job for nothing. Unfortunately, that's what voicetracked hours pay. When I left a certain building, it was up to the parttimers to write in only 29.5 hours per week on their timesheets, regardless of whether or not the rest of the building was sick or vacationing and more than 29.5 (or 50) hours were worked. That means that if you go over hours one week, you must voicetrack the hours the station isn't paying for next week, or your job pays you exactly nothing for your time. You become a volunteer, which isn't part of the deal between employer and employee. Management's attitude was, "Don't like the abuse? Go work in fast food!" Several other parttimers in the building kept spreadsheets to see how often they actually worked without pay. It was a lot. So, yeah, I can see if you've given the company two free hours already, and the weather changes, your motivation to go in there on unpaid time to fix it might not be that great. There is, after all, an old adage: you get what you pay for. If a station isn't paying for the thoughts, actions, and presence of a live jock, maybe some feel that the station deserves exactly the quality they're willing to pay for when they go with the machine.

 

[hungryhawk]

Here we are as broadcasters, promoting concepts of linear time but not at all living in the "Now".

We present material in a "That was...This is...." manner but always from a time when niether 'that' nor 'this' is actually taking place.

VT'ing is disingenuous.

That is all

 

[FilioScotia]

Aunti-terrestrial I thank God every night for giving me a life in radio that never had me working in a sweatshop like the ones you describe. Make no mistake, I've worked in a few hellholes along the way, but I always got paid for my work. I guess that was before CC came along and showed managers everywhere all the ways they can screw their air talent.

There were times when I would be in a basement control room that looked like a dungeon, saying to myself "this is how it is in radio-hell."

My heart goes out to everybody who's ever had to do the things you describe only to learn they wouldn't be paid for it.

Even so, and I know how this sounds, that's still not an excuse for doing less than your best work.

There is value in being able to quit and walk out with your head held high, and be able to say with pride that you always gave those A-holes the best you have, even though they didn't deserve to have anyone as good as you on their air.

Once in a while it feels good to burn a bridge.

 

[aunti-terrestrial]

I know of no other working situation, in any field, that breeds lower morale than not paying people for their actual time worked.

 

[oaktree]

Sorry for the "misunderstanding of attempted radio humor."

Maybe a comedy coach is needed because, in reality, apology and all ... you came off as a snarky smartass, "Iused2besomebody."

I still think hearing your work, if you're as proud of it as you want people to believe is your "best defense," since, you started it.

I apologize for misinterpretation your bad effort at humor and for questioning your anonymous credibility. And remember, no matter what you like or dislike, you (and we) ARE somebody. That's the best credential to Life.

Next time, "be yourself." Don't "try" to be funny. Good luck to you in all of your endeavors.

 

[davideduardo]

Anybody ever thought that maybe the reason the talent drops the ball is to show managment how much voice tracking sucks?

If they do that, they are not "talent."

 

[michaelshiloh]

I guess it's a well-kept secret, but frankly, just between you and me and the US Dept. of Labor's Wage and Hour division, requiring anyone to work and then not paying them is illegal under the Fair Labor Standards Act, even if it is voicetracking. Workers pulling under 30 hours are not exempt.

 

[Jay Walker]

I've been doing Radio for a loooong time starting as a teenager in the late 60's.
The one message that was always beat into my thick skull over many years as talent is/was a very simple one...

As with anything in life, radio included, "Success" is all about attention to detail.

The difference between #1 and #2 in a like format;
#1 gives the product 100% effort to the best of the talent's/team's ability.
#2 Does not and as a result gets it "almost" right.

Inattention to voice tracking or production is inexcusable as you always have a chance to re-do it and get it RIGHT before it ever hits the tower. Strive for perfection.

"We now return to our regularly scheduled programming already in progress" :

 

[TheBigA]

There is, after all, an old adage: you get what you pay for. If a station isn't paying for the thoughts, actions, and presence of a live jock, maybe some feel that the station deserves exactly the quality they're willing to pay for when they go with the machine.

And it's that mentality that doesn't belong in broadcasting.

Radio is not 9 to 5, it's not 40 hours a week with a paid lunch hour. It isn't shift work. It isn't assembly line. Those who are trying to make it that are missing the point. It's a way of life. If you don't understand, you'll never be happy, so don't get into it in the first place.

What people don't remember is that before the big radio companies, people worked at small places where there was no overtime, no benefits, no vacation, and no air conditioning. I worked at one place where the boiler blew up on the coldest day of the winter, and we worked withour coats on for 3 days until the owner could come up with the money to hire someone to fix the boiler. If we were off work, and saw news happen, we covered the story, drove into work, and filed it, even though we weren't on the clock. That's what working at a mom & pop was like. And those who are anxious for those days to return should be prepared for working more than 40 hours a week, and getting paid for 25. Because that's what small businesses pay.

 

[kendro]

You've got to be Shi**ing me.
I can understand a family owned station or personal perfection goal but not a large corporation's requirement.

What ever happened to fair wages for a fair day's work?

 

[aunti-terrestrial]

There is, after all, an old adage: you get what you pay for. If a station isn't paying for the thoughts, actions, and presence of a live jock, maybe some feel that the station deserves exactly the quality they're willing to pay for when they go with the machine.

And it's that mentality that doesn't belong in broadcasting.

Radio is not 9 to 5, it's not 40 hours a week with a paid lunch hour. It isn't shift work. It isn't assembly line. Those who are trying to make it that are missing the point. It's a way of life. If you don't understand, you'll never be happy, so don't get into it in the first place.

What people don't remember is that before the big radio companies, people worked at small places where there was no overtime, no benefits, no vacation, and no air conditioning. I worked at one place where the boiler blew up on the coldest day of the winter, and we worked withour coats on for 3 days until the owner could come up with the money to hire someone to fix the boiler. If we were off work, and saw news happen, we covered the story, drove into work, and filed it, even though we weren't on the clock. That's what working at a mom & pop was like. And those who are anxious for those days to return should be prepared for working more than 40 hours a week, and getting paid for 25. Because that's what small businesses pay.

I've never worked for a mom and pop station that didn't understand that employees got paid for the time they work. If they wanted to lowball an employee, they'd salary you. Hourly workers got paid for every hour they worked. No, sweetie, it wasn't until post-consolidation that it ever occurred to me that an honest hours' work did not guarantee an honest hours' pay. For that matter, every small place where I ever worked gave me benefits, overtime, vacation, and yeah, air conditioning.

It isn't shift work. It isn't assembly line. Those who are trying to make it that are missing the point.

Who's trying to make it shift work and assembly line? You might want to take a look at those corner offices and the Prophet installers and place that accusation where it belongs. Aren't you the one who's always tooting the "Radio is a business" horn? Again, Big A, you can't have it both ways. Yes, it's called the radio BUSINESS for a reason. It's like saying the Rolling Stones don't belong in music unless they want to do their concert tours for free, because, after all, rock 'n roll is a way of life.

Kendro, I've long learned that there are people, like The Big A, who have a personal antagonism for on-air jocks and believe them to be the bane of radio. It's all there in the post histories. A quick look back and you'll be repeating:

You've got to be Shi**ing me.

 

[TheBigA]

I've never worked for a mom and pop station that didn't understand that employees got paid for the time they work.

Maybe you never worked for a REAL mom & pop. But I'm talking about employee dedication to the AUDIENCE. The day the heat went out, no one complained or threated a lawsuit. The show must go on. I don't know if that would be the case now. I've had "pop" come to me on pay day saying there's not enough money in the account to cash my check, and asking me to wait a few days. And I had no company retirement plan until I got to the big company. That's why I left!

Aren't you the one who's always tooting the "Radio is a business" horn? Again, Big A, you can't have it both ways.

Once again, it's not a "one or the other" thing. And you clearly don't know how I feel about jocks.

 

[aunti-terrestrial]

I've never worked for a mom and pop station that didn't understand that employees got paid for the time they work.

Maybe you never worked for a REAL mom & pop. But I'm talking about employee dedication to the AUDIENCE. The day the heat went out, no one complained or threated a lawsuit. The show must go on. I don't know if that would be the case now. I've had "pop" come to me on pay day saying there's not enough money in the account to cash my check, and asking me to wait a few days. And I had no company retirement plan until I got to the big company. That's why I left!

Aren't you the one who's always tooting the "Radio is a business" horn? Again, Big A, you can't have it both ways.

Once again, it's not a "one or the other" thing. And you clearly don't know how I feel about jocks.

Oh, it's always a "one or the other" thing when you want to goad somebody into an argument about how business owners have to make money and if that means cutting staff, so be it. I've noticed here recently that your board tactics have changed, and how now you want us all to believe that you're just a regular jock like the rest of the people you constantly troll on this board.

If you've ever been a jock, has it been in the last 30 years? I seriously doubt it. Were you ever anything more than a weekend and holiday fill-in? You worked every holiday for people who couldn't pay you and couldn't maintain their studios. Sounds pretty small-time to me. My guess is that you didn't do very well as a jock and (SURPRISE) wanted more money, so you went into sales and from there managed to convince people to pay you for consulting with your lousy advice that has been partially responsible for tanking the industry.

You yourself have tiraded against jocks and let it be known that your resentment stems from paying jocks to deliver an intangible product that you feel can and should be shortcutted by technology. Come on, it's all there in your post history.

Heck, you should know that RADIO HAPPENS ON HOLIDAYS, whether you feel like being there or not. Sorry, Big A, but you can't begin with that and then go on to tell us there's something wrong for not wanting to work (often those same holidays you're too good for) for free. Anybody who would rather voicetrack than get up and come in after Christmas dinner to do their jobs for THE AUDIENCE doesn't belong in broadcasting.


Never worked for a "real mom and pop" ??? You've gotta be Sh*tting me.