Another Sign of HD Radio's impending demise

[clouseau]

http://www.ibiquity.com/hd_radio/hdradio_find_a_station

1259 total stations. I believe that's over 80 since the first of the year.

Sick a fork in it. It's done.

Cue skewed statsaholic link and insert here.

Clouseau

 

[PocketRadio]

http://www.ibiquity.com/hd_radio/hdradio_find_a_station

1259 total stations. I believe that's over 80 since the first of the year.

Sick a fork in it. It's done.

Cue skewed statsaholic link and insert here.

Clouseau

YAWN... here we go again - means little, without interest from consumers and automakers.

 

[radiopilot]

http://www.ibiquity.com/hd_radio/hdradio_find_a_station

1259 total stations. I believe that's over 80 since the first of the year.

Sick a fork in it. It's done.

Cue skewed statsaholic link and insert here.

Clouseau

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

Start the fireworks... of course that doesn't mean in all those markets 100% is listening to IBOC on HD tuners... I'd say that number would be about 0.000001%.... not much to brag about....

 

[mgpt6]

It looks like the large brodcast groups in meduim and large markets are close to finishing the build out of HD Radio. Small stations and any station in a small market will find it hard to justify the 50-100k to add HD Radio. Too Bad DRE will not get more aggresive in marketing FMXtra .Only 10-15k. Figure higher price if FM station has to be a desktop computer and SCA monitor.

 

[dbdigital]

It looks like the large brodcast groups in meduim and large markets are close to finishing the build out of HD Radio. Small stations and any station in a small market will find it hard to justify the 50-100k to add HD Radio. Too Bad DRE will not get more aggresive in marketing FMXtra .Only 10-15k. Figure higher price if FM station has to be a desktop computer and SCA monitor.

Yes, it seems FMeXtra's future lies overseas. I know that DRE has negotiated a large contract with China and the system is being tested in parts of Europe and Scandinavia. But once again we have a situation of incompatible broadcasting technologies being implemented in different parts of the world. Only this time it's radio.

What we need is a digital rosetta stone.

db

 

[clouseau]

What we need is a digital rosetta stone.

db

How true. I'll bet this one is even more elusive than the Multisystem AM stereo radio though. And that's too bad. Because with the horsepower and the compatability, FMExtra would be a nice addition to our existing system. Show me the radio that does both and I'll buy it. (Which is redundant since I already have and HD and an FMExtra radio.)

Clouseau.

 

[davideduardo]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

 

[Mike Walker]

"Interest from consumers"...you mean what you three or four guys have to come here and try to beat down with worthless links many times per day, but you just can't kill it?

 

[PocketRadio]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

1/10th of all stations are HD, HD radios are not selling, HD Radio was rejected by the Big Three, and only a few auto makers are offering HD radios as a $500 option - WOW !

 

[Mike Walker]

Oh there are statistics, and then there are statistics. There are not 20,000 radio stations in America, though there are (or will be later this year) 2,000 HD stations. More convert every day. That doesn't add up to ten percent. But even giving you the benefit of the doubt...when you count numbers of stations, you're COMPLETELY missing the point. Small market stations and large market group-owned stations aren't exactly equivalent when it comes to audience size. It's quite possible for most stations to still be analog, and for most LISTENERS to be listening to stations that are already HD. The stations that are HD are the largest ones, in the largest markets, which often have ten times or more the audience of the smaller stations. HD penetration is HUGE already, and growing daily.

There are statistics, and then there are statistics. Most Americans are already served by multiple HD stations. You kind of neglected to mention that.

 

[radiopilot]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

I guess you need to read 'thebroker's' comments on the small town take of HD implementation...

So 70% of the US radio revenue is not on board with the HD cotillion, therefore HD will succeed by it's own merit on the 30% share of those top 10 markets... WOW you're better than I thought David...

So out of the 1280+/- stations that converted to HD represent the top twenty markets sort of... that would equate to anywhere between 64 stations concentrated in each of those major markets, and of course all those major markets would have to be saturated with the listeners listening on HD tuners for those markets to be 'viable' and I'm willing to stake one of my salary checks to say that this isn't happening.. not in one single market of all those markets are people listening to the HD broadcasts on HD radios exclusively, either the main HD or HD2 channels... They might be listening but on regular analog tuners.

Radiopilot

 

[R.F. Burns]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

I guess you need to read 'thebroker's' comments on the small town take of HD implementation...

So 70% of the US radio revenue is not on board with the HD cotillion, therefore HD will succeed by it's own merit on the 30% share of those top 10 markets... WOW you're better than I thought David...

So out of the 1280+/- stations that converted to HD represent the top twenty markets sort of... that would equate to anywhere between 64 stations concentrated in each of those major markets, and of course all those major markets would have to be saturated with the listeners listening on HD tuners for those markets to be 'viable' and I'm willing to stake one of my salary checks to say that this isn't happening.. not in one single market of all those markets are people listening to the HD broadcasts on HD radios exclusively, either the main HD or HD2 channels... They might be listening but on regular analog tuners.

Radiopilot

C'mon you know they mean market penetration, not current audience cume. Population wise what that means is that most of the US population has access to an HD radio station. What is so difficult about that to understand?

 

[radiopilot]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

I guess you need to read 'thebroker's' comments on the small town take of HD implementation...

So 70% of the US radio revenue is not on board with the HD cotillion, therefore HD will succeed by it's own merit on the 30% share of those top 10 markets... WOW you're better than I thought David...

So out of the 1280+/- stations that converted to HD represent the top twenty markets sort of... that would equate to anywhere between 64 stations concentrated in each of those major markets, and of course all those major markets would have to be saturated with the listeners listening on HD tuners for those markets to be 'viable' and I'm willing to stake one of my salary checks to say that this isn't happening.. not in one single market of all those markets are people listening to the HD broadcasts on HD radios exclusively, either the main HD or HD2 channels... They might be listening but on regular analog tuners.

Radiopilot

C'mon you know they mean market penetration, not current audience cume. Population wise what that means is that most of the US population has access to an HD radio station. What is so difficult about that to understand?

Really most of the US population? In my area say from north of Jacksonville, FL. to south ofCharleston, S.C. there is no HD signals... From Savannah, GA. you'd have to drive close to Atlanta, GA. to sart recieving the HD signal... now that represents alot of real estate without HD radio.. that includes some heavyweight areas in terms of $$$$, Hilton Head/Savannah alone
should be worth something in the eyes of some major broadcaster (CC's, Cumulus, Infinity, etc.).

So what does 'population wise' means for access? What is so difficult for you to understand?

Radiopilot

 

[R.F. Burns]

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

I guess you need to read 'thebroker's' comments on the small town take of HD implementation...

So 70% of the US radio revenue is not on board with the HD cotillion, therefore HD will succeed by it's own merit on the 30% share of those top 10 markets... WOW you're better than I thought David...

So out of the 1280+/- stations that converted to HD represent the top twenty markets sort of... that would equate to anywhere between 64 stations concentrated in each of those major markets, and of course all those major markets would have to be saturated with the listeners listening on HD tuners for those markets to be 'viable' and I'm willing to stake one of my salary checks to say that this isn't happening.. not in one single market of all those markets are people listening to the HD broadcasts on HD radios exclusively, either the main HD or HD2 channels... They might be listening but on regular analog tuners.

Radiopilot

C'mon you know they mean market penetration, not current audience cume. Population wise what that means is that most of the US population has access to an HD radio station. What is so difficult about that to understand?

Really most of the US population? In my area say from north of Jacksonville, FL. to south ofCharleston, S.C. there is no HD signals... From Savannah, GA. you'd have to drive close to Atlanta, GA. to sart recieving the HD signal... now that represents alot of real estate without HD radio.. that includes some heavyweight areas in terms of $$$$, Hilton Head/Savannah alone
should be worth something in the eyes of some major broadcaster (CC's, Cumulus, Infinity, etc.).

So what does 'population wise' means for access? What is so difficult for you to understand?

Radiopilot

OK, let's see what you don't understand. Charleston, SC population; 511,500 people; Jacksonville 1,083,700 ; Savannah, 265,300. Now let's look at the population for NYC. 15,291,100, hmmm. I guess the 15 million in NYC alone is a tad larger then the nearly 2 million when you add the total population numbers for those 3 cities. Those are small and medium markets at best and it will take years for the technology to become common place there. Right now the major markets are where you'll hear HD radio. The major markets are also the population centers for this country. Even Philadelphia (market #7)with over 4 million people is double the size of that 3 city region with no IBOC facilities. At this time Nassau-Suffolk, NY (#18) only has a handful of HD stations and not only is it a suburb of NYC but it has a slightly larger population then those 3 cities combined(By about half a million people). Talk about income level, even with all the poor who live in my region I'd have no problem saying that gross income in the NY metro area outpaces the region you are talking about. The cost of living in NY is amongst the highest in the United States.

CHeck this out;

http://www.zillow.com/search/Search.htm?addrstrthood=&citystatezip=10019&GOButton=<SPAN>GO</SPAN>

It's a zillow search for available NYC apartments. You'll notice the prices of $700,000 and up are for apartments, not houses. I know I don't live in your region but I think it's myopic to believe that relatively speaking, the region you speak of isn't all that impressive numbers wise when compared with real major markets where most Americans live.

 

[davideduardo]

I guess you need to read 'thebroker's' comments on the small town take of HD implementation...

I read them. And I am fascinated to know that there are over 360 stations in Kentucky, with about 4.2 million in population. In LA, 4.2 million is a whole million less than the Hispanic population in LA metro, served by 16 signals. All the FMs are or will be HD; the only viable AM in Spanish is alsoo HD.

My point: HD is being promoted and installed in virtually every single viable station in th etop 100 markets, where over two-thirds of the US population resides. This is all that is really needed at the very beginning for HD to be highly successful.

[/quote]So 70% of the US radio revenue is not on board with the HD cotillion, [/quote]

Actually, the top 100 markets represent nearly 70% of US radio revenue... just the top 10 markets represent 30% of it. Less than a third of both revenue and audience is outside these 100 cities, and divided among 10,000 stations (4600 are in the top 100 markets, but only abpout half are viable and make any difference in revenue or listening)

therefore HD will succeed by it's own merit on the 30% share of those top 10 markets... WOW you're better than I thought David...

You can't even read in English. We know from your posts in the never-read PR board that your Spanish is incoherent... but that is not what I said.

Two thirds the US populatin is in the top 100 markets. And virtually every viable station is in HD or committed to be soon. That is all that is needed.

So out of the 1280+/- stations that converted to HD represent the top twenty markets sort of...

No, they represent the viable signals in the TOP 100 MARKETS, not top 10 or top 20. Reread my post.

As to "viable" tha tis an industry term for stations with signals and facilities that can comepte. For example, in LA, with 36 AMs in the metro, only between 5 and 6 are viable... the rest have such significant coverage deficiencies that they can not compete successfully in the market, and, as a result, get very little listening. Same on FM... of 39 in the metro, only 26 are viable. And essentially all are in HD.

 

[clouseau]

OK, let's see what you don't understand. Charleston, SC population; 511,500 people; Jacksonville 1,083,700 ; Savannah, 265,300. Now let's look at the population for NYC. 15,291,100, hmmm. I guess the 15 million in NYC alone is a tad larger then the nearly 2 million when you add the total population numbers for those 3 cities. Those are small and medium markets at best and it will take years for the technology to become common place there. Right now the major markets are where you'll hear HD radio. The major markets are also the population centers for this country. Even Philadelphia (market #7)with over 4 million people is double the size of that 3 city region with no IBOC facilities. At this time Nassau-Suffolk, NY (#18) only has a handful of HD stations and not only is it a suburb of NYC but it has a slightly larger population then those 3 cities combined (By about half a million people).

This is that whole "Where the population is concentrated," thing. It's why in a presidential election, the whole country is red except the coasts, but the election is "Too close to call". And there is a good deal of affluence in parts of S. Georgia. Still it's not New York. (Thank goodness for the GA Folks.)

Clouseau

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

One thing that wouldn't hurt is having a substantially reduced rate for smaller market stations, and maybe even the "easy payment" plan where the whole fee thing can be spread out. It would benifit Ibiquity to have smaller stations on-board so it's not just a "big-boys" game, but the costs are quite prohibitive for small market. Small market stations could really benefit if they could run mulitiple local sports and go sell that.

WOW.... out of 13,500 +/- radio stations 1259 went HD... WOW...

That figure represents pretty near 95% of the viable AMs and FMs in the top 100 markets. 2/3 of the US population is in these markets, and the stations in HD represent nearly all the measured listening in them.

Keep in mind, also, that just the top 10 markets, were essentially all the viable stations are in HD, represent 30% of all US radio revenue.

Eventually, smaller markets will come on board. Costs will be lower, and there will be more radios. For the moment, the number of stations vastly exceeds thenumber needed for critical mass at the broadcasting end.

 

[R.F. Burns]

OK, let's see what you don't understand. Charleston, SC population; 511,500 people; Jacksonville 1,083,700 ; Savannah, 265,300. Now let's look at the population for NYC. 15,291,100, hmmm. I guess the 15 million in NYC alone is a tad larger then the nearly 2 million when you add the total population numbers for those 3 cities. Those are small and medium markets at best and it will take years for the technology to become common place there. Right now the major markets are where you'll hear HD radio. The major markets are also the population centers for this country. Even Philadelphia (market #7)with over 4 million people is double the size of that 3 city region with no IBOC facilities. At this time Nassau-Suffolk, NY (#18) only has a handful of HD stations and not only is it a suburb of NYC but it has a slightly larger population then those 3 cities combined (By about half a million people).

This is that whole "Where the population is concentrated," thing. It's why in a presidential election, the whole country is red except the coasts, but the election is "Too close to call". And there is a good deal of affluence in parts of S. Georgia. Still it's not New York. (Thank goodness for the GA Folks.)

Clouseau

Actually due to the electoral college a better response would have been, that's why while more red states voted for our current president he lost in the actual vote count (which didn't matter) due to the fact that there are greater population numbers in the blue states.

 

[Mike Walker]

Put another way, if an earthquake caused every red state (and I live in one!) to sink into a giant crater, killing everyone who lived there, the majority of Americans would still be alive.

Red states are great. Some of the most beautiful areas in the US are red states. And they're mostly empty...ESPECIALLY between the Mississippi and California. Anybody who says "America is over-crowded" ought to fly over some of the western states...they're EMPTY. From the air, virtually no signs of humanity. More people live in Manhattan than North Carolina! And North Carolina ain't a small state (geographically, anyway). There are BUILDINGS in New York with more residents than some of our counties. There's a reason the blue states are so important in elections, and in terms of concentration of HD stations...MORE PEOPLE LIVE THERE! The majority of the American population lives within a hundred miles or so of A coast...largely centered around those cities with huge populations (New York, LA, San Francisco). Having the top three or four stations in New York go HD will result in more people hearing HD than if EVERY station in West Virginia converted.

As I said before...there are statistics, and then there are statistics. The number of STATIONS is largely unimportant. It's the number of WARM BODIES being served by one or more HD. THAT NUMBER IS HUGE!

 

[thebroker]

As I said before...there are statistics, and then there are statistics. The number of STATIONS is largely unimportant. It's the number of WARM BODIES being served by one or more HD. THAT NUMBER IS HUGE!

Or, let's look at it a slightly different way. Sure, there are plenty of warm bodies who have the potential to hear an HD signal. However, are any except the ones who acutally have an HD receiver actually being "served"? Can you really say somebody is being served by a signal when they can't hear it?

Also, out of the entire 15M-plus population of NYC, how many of them can even afford two hundred bucks for an HD Radio? Just my opinion, but I really think the whole key to HD Radio succeeding is getting radios in homes and cars. Unless the price drops dramatically (say, 85%) I do not ever personally envision a situation where every household with the potential to hear an HD signal will actually hear one.