Has it set in for anyone else? I could care less for any radio station in this town. Same old crap that we've been forced to listen to over and over with the exception of some stations getting even worse. I didn't even know that was possible? At work I turn the speakers off in the lobby so I don't have to listen to the radio anymore. In the car I'm constantly flipping through the stations on my presets only to eventually turn the volume way down. Why is radio so freaking lame in Columbus?
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Apathy in Columbus
- Thread starter dawg4life
- Start date
Well, I don't think all hope is lost. I am certainly unhappy about some of the changes that I've observed happening. But what would get me all bent out of shape, may not be the same thing that gives you despair.
So tell us, what specifically gets you in a blue funk, and/or what would you do with a radio station?
So tell us, what specifically gets you in a blue funk, and/or what would you do with a radio station?
Because it is no longer about talent. Most of these stations do everything they can to pay people as little as possible and the end result is what we have now. Juke boxes with DJs reading what they are told or syndicated people that no one locally cares about. You also have consultants in other cities telling stations here what they should play and how they should operate even though these consultants have no clue what Columbus really wants.
We are going to get Mancow here now. Another syndicated show that I am sure 103.9 does not have to pay for. How did they come to that decision? Did they draw names out of a hat? Was there any real thought process put into it? You know they aren't spending money on research. We have no local sports show in the morning. All we get is Mike and Mike. Again, I am sure 1460 does not have to pay for it and that is probably why.
One move that is so very odd is the Shark move. They aren't firing Shark to save money because they are keeping him on from 6-7pm, but yet they are going to take the one good local show they have away from drive time. Did they even consider a local morning sports show? Gee, Dan Patrick can say "Good Morning" at 3pm now instead of 6pm. Great improvement 103.9! People in other threads have mentioned this guy Fish at 103.9 and 99.7, is this the same guy who used to be on the air on 99.7 under the name of Kingfish years ago?
We are going to get Mancow here now. Another syndicated show that I am sure 103.9 does not have to pay for. How did they come to that decision? Did they draw names out of a hat? Was there any real thought process put into it? You know they aren't spending money on research. We have no local sports show in the morning. All we get is Mike and Mike. Again, I am sure 1460 does not have to pay for it and that is probably why.
One move that is so very odd is the Shark move. They aren't firing Shark to save money because they are keeping him on from 6-7pm, but yet they are going to take the one good local show they have away from drive time. Did they even consider a local morning sports show? Gee, Dan Patrick can say "Good Morning" at 3pm now instead of 6pm. Great improvement 103.9! People in other threads have mentioned this guy Fish at 103.9 and 99.7, is this the same guy who used to be on the air on 99.7 under the name of Kingfish years ago?
I concur with dawg4life and Whodey07 (though I dont concur with their choices for football-- 
). The demise of the "progressive" format on WVKO and the sweeping changes at 103.9---especially the neutering of the "Shark on Sports" show are disturbing to me. But, unfortunately, to most of the listening public it apparently isnt--the "numbers dont lie". Both stations are at the bottom of the heap and signal and audio problems aside--most apparently like the stalwarts at TVN and the "morning zoos" of NCI and LVQ (apologies to Wags and Elliott).
). The demise of the "progressive" format on WVKO and the sweeping changes at 103.9---especially the neutering of the "Shark on Sports" show are disturbing to me. But, unfortunately, to most of the listening public it apparently isnt--the "numbers dont lie". Both stations are at the bottom of the heap and signal and audio problems aside--most apparently like the stalwarts at TVN and the "morning zoos" of NCI and LVQ (apologies to Wags and Elliott).Yes, Whodey, Hal Fish = Kingfish. Mr. Fish entered the Nabcovian Dynasty twenty years ago as PD of then-oldies 99.7, after programming an oldies station in Lansing.
I too am pretty much in "finally giving up hope" mode for Columbus radio, though I agree with V that everyone would have rather different opinions on why it's so doggedly dismal, how bad it really is, and whether there is any real hope of improvement.
I too am pretty much in "finally giving up hope" mode for Columbus radio, though I agree with V that everyone would have rather different opinions on why it's so doggedly dismal, how bad it really is, and whether there is any real hope of improvement.
K
kirkiefan
Guest
In two words...CLEAR CHANNEL!
From the same people who brought you the Kaizen Revolution and the 80/20 principle...in short... less(for the listener) is more (for the J.R.s).
A city where greed is king..where Borden got too large and lost money.Elsie the Cow remains but is farmed out to "American Dairy Farmers." Sucking up Seyfert's Snacks out of Ft. Wayne..now farmed out to a company in PA. Buying up the Meadow Gold brand when Beatrice failed at being a conglomerate...then phasing it out ......and I can go on all day.
Bank One sucked up by Chase Manhattan
The insurance industry tells our politicians what to do (Nationwide is on MY side?...AS IF!)
Apathy in Columbus?...How 'bout snobbery in Columbus!
From the same people who brought you the Kaizen Revolution and the 80/20 principle...in short... less(for the listener) is more (for the J.R.s).
A city where greed is king..where Borden got too large and lost money.Elsie the Cow remains but is farmed out to "American Dairy Farmers." Sucking up Seyfert's Snacks out of Ft. Wayne..now farmed out to a company in PA. Buying up the Meadow Gold brand when Beatrice failed at being a conglomerate...then phasing it out ......and I can go on all day.
Bank One sucked up by Chase Manhattan
The insurance industry tells our politicians what to do (Nationwide is on MY side?...AS IF!)
Apathy in Columbus?...How 'bout snobbery in Columbus!
This has been a complaint of mine for a long, long time. I grew up with a radio glued to my ear. I went to sleep with my earphone jamed into my head. I loved it... every minute of it.
Since I was in the eighth grade, I wanted to be a disk jockey. Jocks were king. Sure, they played great music, but it was the talent that carried the station. One playlist sounded pretty much like another (some things don't change), but the jocks made the difference. I could relate to them. They talked about places I was familiar with. They were clever, funny, well informed. I wanted to be like them.
Consultants consulted. They weren't the decision makers. That's what program directors were for. Then it all made a turn to the south. Management figured that you could operate a station for less money by hiring less talented people and cutting back on their "talk sets". Fewer chances to screw up, ya know. They began to think that listeners were tuning in for the music. There was some truth to that, but not the the extent that consultants (and some younger radio heads) think today. It was the talent that made the difference. A listener's loyalty was to the jock, not the station.
Then, the broadcasting industry became posessed by the demon whose name is "Voice Tracking". It grew like kudzu along a Georgia freeway. Now, there is no place for young talent to cut their teeth and hone their skills. The weekend and overnight air shifts are all but gone. The new breed of "program directors" have no idea how to bring a talent into his/her own. "Air check sessions" consist of the blind leading the clueless: "I want calls in and out and keep it to 20 seconds including the weather and a time check". It's not the PDs fault, by the way. They grew up in the same mindset and don't know any better. They've been taught that this is the way it ought to be.
There's a theory that consultants secretly work for Apple and their real purpose is to make the iPod more popular. Good job, folks. It's working. Radio sales are down, broadcast companies' stocks are in the toilet, satellite juke boxes are gaining popularity. Why listen to radio? I can get all the music I want from other sources and won't have to listen to commercials. Does that sound like the current trend is on track? Radios used to have five or six presets. Now, there are 30 or more so people can surf for their tunes. There's nothing to hold them through the spot set or a song that's not their favorite. The element that made radio great is now missing.
I'm not naive enough to think that things will ever go back to the way they were. The "Good Old Days" are gone and radio is worse off for their demise. Video didn't kill the radio star. He was murdered by a consultant.
Since I was in the eighth grade, I wanted to be a disk jockey. Jocks were king. Sure, they played great music, but it was the talent that carried the station. One playlist sounded pretty much like another (some things don't change), but the jocks made the difference. I could relate to them. They talked about places I was familiar with. They were clever, funny, well informed. I wanted to be like them.
Consultants consulted. They weren't the decision makers. That's what program directors were for. Then it all made a turn to the south. Management figured that you could operate a station for less money by hiring less talented people and cutting back on their "talk sets". Fewer chances to screw up, ya know. They began to think that listeners were tuning in for the music. There was some truth to that, but not the the extent that consultants (and some younger radio heads) think today. It was the talent that made the difference. A listener's loyalty was to the jock, not the station.
Then, the broadcasting industry became posessed by the demon whose name is "Voice Tracking". It grew like kudzu along a Georgia freeway. Now, there is no place for young talent to cut their teeth and hone their skills. The weekend and overnight air shifts are all but gone. The new breed of "program directors" have no idea how to bring a talent into his/her own. "Air check sessions" consist of the blind leading the clueless: "I want calls in and out and keep it to 20 seconds including the weather and a time check". It's not the PDs fault, by the way. They grew up in the same mindset and don't know any better. They've been taught that this is the way it ought to be.
There's a theory that consultants secretly work for Apple and their real purpose is to make the iPod more popular. Good job, folks. It's working. Radio sales are down, broadcast companies' stocks are in the toilet, satellite juke boxes are gaining popularity. Why listen to radio? I can get all the music I want from other sources and won't have to listen to commercials. Does that sound like the current trend is on track? Radios used to have five or six presets. Now, there are 30 or more so people can surf for their tunes. There's nothing to hold them through the spot set or a song that's not their favorite. The element that made radio great is now missing.
I'm not naive enough to think that things will ever go back to the way they were. The "Good Old Days" are gone and radio is worse off for their demise. Video didn't kill the radio star. He was murdered by a consultant.
All of you are right on the money with everything. But that is life I guess and things change. Radio had just always been there and had been such a big part of life for so long, it seemed indestructable I guess. As for this Fish guy, I remember Kingfish on Magic 99 and even for a time on the Blitz after they changed from Magic. Oh and classic rock is now called oldies?? Darn it I am getting old! Anyway, I guess my question is, if this Fish guy has been there for 20 years doing music radio, why the heck is he in charge of talk radio over there? Wouldn't that be like the head chef at an italian restaurant becoming head chef at a chinese restaurant?
Whodey07 said:
No, Classic Rock is not called Oldies now. WMGG really was Oldies under PD Steve Edwards (a 70's WNCI jock and now the longtime voice of Jegs commercials) from Late '86 to Mid '87, when it segued to Classic Rock. So when Fish arrived from the Lansing oldies station in '88 and took over from Edwards, 99.7 was already Classic Rock. (Sorry for my timeline error in the previous post).
Ironically, when 99.7 changed calls to WMGG and became oldies in late '86, they called themselves "Classic Hits," which back then was close kin to Classic Rock rather than an ODB-type format. (That's still true in many places). So I was expecting something Rock oriented when WMGG first came on, and was dismayed to find out that they were instead straight-ahead 50's/60's oldies despite positioning as "Classic Hits, Magic 99.7" on-air.
I was always amazed they kept a wimpy handle like "Magic" after moving to a hardish (for back then, anyway) Classic Rock format. I think it may have had some negative impact on their performance in that format.
Whodey07 said:
Good programmers can program multiple formats. And of course, that has been especially common since duopoly and then consolidation. That said, Nabco beats to a different drummer. It isn't like the large corporations, but it isn't like other Mom 'n Pops, either. Sometimes that's been a good thing, but not lately. As far as job security, Fish really lucked out by landing at an unusual environment like Nabco. Even with the big success the Blitz had for a number of years, it's unlikely he could have ended up with this kind of cemented job security anywhere else -- corporate or Mon n Pop.
K
kirkiefan
Guest
My point exactly Mr. Not Me..You hit the nail on the head!
From the time of my youth listening to CKLW,WING(WCOL's then-sister)WLS, and WCFL..this is what I wanted to do. Now forty years later I see the dark side of this biz...driven by greed...not by people...not too many years ago it was run by some good people..but mostly bad people.
Now I wish I would have stayed on the farm instead of listening to that arm twisting salesman from Career Academy who forced me (then, a Catholic high school senior back in 1972) to put my name on the dotted line...only one year later, that same school let me go after only two weeks..and NEVER got a cent of my hard saved money (and my mother's money) back...My only consolation was that the school went belly-up before the 1970s were over and was razed in the 80s to make way for what is now the Huntington Bank Tower.
The old saying "...what goes around comes around" holds true for this business as well... this biz is going down the same way Penn-Central and Enron went down..all on account of that dirty little word...greed!
My prayers go with the folks at WUCO who now run WVKO........De Colores!
From the time of my youth listening to CKLW,WING(WCOL's then-sister)WLS, and WCFL..this is what I wanted to do. Now forty years later I see the dark side of this biz...driven by greed...not by people...not too many years ago it was run by some good people..but mostly bad people.
Now I wish I would have stayed on the farm instead of listening to that arm twisting salesman from Career Academy who forced me (then, a Catholic high school senior back in 1972) to put my name on the dotted line...only one year later, that same school let me go after only two weeks..and NEVER got a cent of my hard saved money (and my mother's money) back...My only consolation was that the school went belly-up before the 1970s were over and was razed in the 80s to make way for what is now the Huntington Bank Tower.
The old saying "...what goes around comes around" holds true for this business as well... this biz is going down the same way Penn-Central and Enron went down..all on account of that dirty little word...greed!
My prayers go with the folks at WUCO who now run WVKO........De Colores!
S
SeanMGilbow
Guest
My story would parallel previous posters, so I won't bore you with it.
I would never do what I did with WVKO as a job. I was happy to be in a position where I didn't have to worry about making money at it, and I believed in the station and the format.
A rule of thumb I learned a few months after my last radio job (in 1992) was that I should be making annually $1,000 times my age.
For the first time, I exceeded that in 2008.
I'm 45.
And I bet the number of Columbus on-air radio people making that much or more can be counted on both my hands.
As the saying goes, you get what you pay for.
I would never do what I did with WVKO as a job. I was happy to be in a position where I didn't have to worry about making money at it, and I believed in the station and the format.
A rule of thumb I learned a few months after my last radio job (in 1992) was that I should be making annually $1,000 times my age.
For the first time, I exceeded that in 2008.
I'm 45.
And I bet the number of Columbus on-air radio people making that much or more can be counted on both my hands.
As the saying goes, you get what you pay for.
Sean Gilbow said:
...but the number of times you've posted about your salary can't. Enough, already! It's offensive to those who make less, and highly unimpressive to those who make more. Even if you want to talk about salaries, what's the point of becoming so specific and personal? It's kind of strange, and certainly repetitive.
S
SeanMGilbow
Guest
Nu_Roo_2 said:
No offense was intended, and it is public record. Anyone can access this information if they wanted. And it was one of the issues raised here.
I'm 58 now. My current job will disappear in the spring as Metro Networks closes its Columbus office and moves everything to Detroit. Nobody wants an on-air guy who's pushing 60. I don't have a college education to fall back on. My future possibilities are limited. Kirkiefan, don't harbor any ill feelings toward that guy from Career Acadamy. Do I regret my choices? Not for a minute! I had a great time and wouldn't trade the memories in my head for anything. It was a heck of a ride. I only got fired once. I was nearly famous in some circles. The best 40 years of my life! So, it's with a smile that I say, "Welcome to Wal-Mart!".
These days I'm listening to WAIS 770 AM out of Nelsonville Ohio. This is the only way I can listen to Ed Schultz at this time. I can put up with the static. I'm using an Terk Advantage Loop AM Antenna to pick up the station. Funny thing is that they do air the Alex Jones Show from 12PM to 3PM.
When tax return check comes I'm buying an XM radio.
Using the same AM Antenna I listen to Kim Kommando on WHIO 1290 AM Sundays out of Dayton Ohio. WHIO is a 5KW station so I can pick it up just fine.
Columbus Radio is dead. Joel is gone, Shark on Sports is one hour, and WTDA decides to air two inflammatory bomb throwers come next year. Savage didn't do anything for the often ignore 1230AM.
Yet according to today's Radio Info Newsletter that Stephanie Miller and Ed Schultz turn a profit this year. Hmm WTDA why not pick up two radio talkers that people heard of in Columbus. Plus picking up an extra 0.8 to 0.9 share wouldn't hurt your bottom line instead of hovering around 1.0 to 1.5. The signal for WTDA comes in strong on my HD100 Radio.
If I was the PD for WTDA I would do the following
Dan Patrick Live 6AM to 9AM
Stephanie Miller 9AM to 12PM
Dennis Miller 12PM to 3PM
Shark on Sports 3 to 6PM
Ed Schultz 6PM to 9PM
Savage 9PM to 12AM
Fox Sports 12AM to 1AM
Phil Hendrie 1AM to 4AM
Fox Sports 4AM to 6AM
There would have a schedule that would appeal to every one. Left, Right, Center, (Phil Hendrie) and Sports. Then again this would make too much sense and we couldn't have that.
When tax return check comes I'm buying an XM radio.
Using the same AM Antenna I listen to Kim Kommando on WHIO 1290 AM Sundays out of Dayton Ohio. WHIO is a 5KW station so I can pick it up just fine.
Columbus Radio is dead. Joel is gone, Shark on Sports is one hour, and WTDA decides to air two inflammatory bomb throwers come next year. Savage didn't do anything for the often ignore 1230AM.
Yet according to today's Radio Info Newsletter that Stephanie Miller and Ed Schultz turn a profit this year. Hmm WTDA why not pick up two radio talkers that people heard of in Columbus. Plus picking up an extra 0.8 to 0.9 share wouldn't hurt your bottom line instead of hovering around 1.0 to 1.5. The signal for WTDA comes in strong on my HD100 Radio.
If I was the PD for WTDA I would do the following
Dan Patrick Live 6AM to 9AM
Stephanie Miller 9AM to 12PM
Dennis Miller 12PM to 3PM
Shark on Sports 3 to 6PM
Ed Schultz 6PM to 9PM
Savage 9PM to 12AM
Fox Sports 12AM to 1AM
Phil Hendrie 1AM to 4AM
Fox Sports 4AM to 6AM
There would have a schedule that would appeal to every one. Left, Right, Center, (Phil Hendrie) and Sports. Then again this would make too much sense and we couldn't have that.
T
tomtomclub
Guest
You know, radio in Columbus isn't so bad. It certainly isn't worse than other markets AND a lot better than some. Think of all the choices we have in local morning shows that are all pretty damn good in their particular niche:
Wags & Elliot
PMC
Morning Zoo
Woody
Bob Conners
Dino & Shawn
Charlie & Kate
Andy Clark
Not to mention the good local talent at the top of the market such as Joe Boxer, Chris Davis, John Corby, & Mark Dancer. I agree that radio isn't in the "18 in a row" business anymore and good PD's get that. However, ownership has yet to really understand.
As far as firings go, do you really think radio will be untouched by the current economy? I feel bad for anybody who loses their job, but the economy will turn and hopefully those jobs will come back - at least in some form.
Wags & Elliot
PMC
Morning Zoo
Woody
Bob Conners
Dino & Shawn
Charlie & Kate
Andy Clark
Not to mention the good local talent at the top of the market such as Joe Boxer, Chris Davis, John Corby, & Mark Dancer. I agree that radio isn't in the "18 in a row" business anymore and good PD's get that. However, ownership has yet to really understand.
As far as firings go, do you really think radio will be untouched by the current economy? I feel bad for anybody who loses their job, but the economy will turn and hopefully those jobs will come back - at least in some form.
TomTom
Please radio in Columbus is dying. Some people like yourself like the banal top forty radio and dull talk radio. Good thing I can pick up WAIS so I can hear The Power Hour, Alex Jones, Ed Schultz, least one hour of Stephanie Miller. (Rest of her show podcast) Plus WCRS is the only non com station to listen to these days. Morning Edition is a dinosaur and it should be replace by The Takeaway from PRI.
This is the reason why terrestrial radio is dying in Columbus. This is why I have WI FI radio so I can pick up good radio stations. Listen to good radio talkers.
Please radio in Columbus is dying. Some people like yourself like the banal top forty radio and dull talk radio. Good thing I can pick up WAIS so I can hear The Power Hour, Alex Jones, Ed Schultz, least one hour of Stephanie Miller. (Rest of her show podcast) Plus WCRS is the only non com station to listen to these days. Morning Edition is a dinosaur and it should be replace by The Takeaway from PRI.
This is the reason why terrestrial radio is dying in Columbus. This is why I have WI FI radio so I can pick up good radio stations. Listen to good radio talkers.
I dunno if you pay attention to the news, especially the last 12 years worth, because if you did you'd know this industry is dying! Are you hoping for a miracle? You don't like what is on the radio-turn on your Zune, IPod, Sirius, or maybe a CD (if you still own those).
If you're in then grab as much of the time that you can so you can pursue another career on the side.
Honestly, you are mourning because you're all grown up and the industry is in its golden years. Radio will never be like it was when you thought DJs ruled the world. Apathy? Why? This is what happens when an idustry disappears...
nothing new here..no bailout.
If you're in then grab as much of the time that you can so you can pursue another career on the side.
Honestly, you are mourning because you're all grown up and the industry is in its golden years. Radio will never be like it was when you thought DJs ruled the world. Apathy? Why? This is what happens when an idustry disappears...
nothing new here..no bailout.
tomtomclub said:
This is exactly the problem. It's the same people in the same market. In another thread, people are wondering why companies like NABCO are stagnant. They change the call letters and station name, but it's the same voices. Clear Channel takes the same names and does a shuffle every 5-7 years between their stations.
This kind of apathy in bringing in new talent makes the listener bored. The case could be made that the rest of the talent has moved on to other (presumably larger) markets. It's one thing to build brand equity with your listeners, but eventually they'll surf the dial because we're in a need-it-now environment. If they keep finding the same voices, of course they'll get bored. Columbus needs a new _local_ talent infusion to re-gain listener interest. Cut the mentality of "more music less talk" and reintroduce the listener to what sets radio apart from the iPod; personality.
I leave you with this thought (minus the mullet): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dt9JfTZHV54
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