April PPM's

[MikeShannon914]

http://www.radiodailynews.com/5-19-10-dallas-fortworth.htm

I know it's 6+ and all, but go figure:

KVIL, KPLX and KLTY lost a few tenths (half a point in KLTY's case,) but KLUV and their new Classic Hits effort jumps from a 4.3 to a 5.2?? WOW. KLNO did even better than that. So here's my interpretation: A few folks lost their religion, started hating Delilah and Keith Urban, and decided they like Spanish music after all. ;D Oh, and they now hate KRLD as well (2.1 to a 1.7.)

And what's the error with WBAP-FM? They got no credit for April, their first full month on the air. Survey says, "No reportable exposure to this outlet was received for one or more days during the selected survey. The outlet may have been off-air, not encoded, or reported under Arbitron's Total Line Reporting procedure, with reportable exposures reported under the..." Bet someone's head will roll for not flipping a switch over there when they should have.

 

[Huff]

And what's the error with WBAP-FM? They got no credit for April, their first full month on the air. Survey says, "No reportable exposure to this outlet was received for one or more days during the selected survey. The outlet may have been off-air, not encoded, or reported under Arbitron's Total Line Reporting procedure, with reportable exposures reported under the..." Bet someone's head will roll for not flipping a switch over there when they should have.

WBAP AM & FM are now reported as a total line simulcast, they will not be listed as individual stations any more.

 

[MikeShannon914]

Ahhhhh, ok. I didn't realize that. That really doesn't help them, looks like...the March combined was a 5.2, whereas April is only a 4.5. I know Platinum didn't leave until March 12, but THAT much difference? Especially with WBAP sounding so good (audio quality-wise, of course) over FM, but then again, we'll never know the breakdown anymore between how many defected to FM and how many stuck with the AM side, and how that may change in the future. Or can the station look at that kind of breakdown still?

 

[dfaulkner]

KVIL is # 2. I'll have to listen for a bit & see what they're doing now. It's interesting (to me, at least) how the radio audience becomes more fragmented over the years. They're # 2 with a 4.6 share. (Kiss is # 1 with a 6.1) In the mid 80's KVIL was having # 1's with 10-11 shares. In the late 1960's KLIF had some # 1's with 30 + shares.

 

[little1]

KVIL is # 2. I'll have to listen for a bit & see what they're doing now. It's interesting (to me, at least) how the radio audience becomes more fragmented over the years. They're # 2 with a 4.6 share. (Kiss is # 1 with a 6.1) In the mid 80's KVIL was having # 1's with 10-11 shares. In the late 1960's KLIF had some # 1's with 30 + shares.

that's why I laugh when people say there's no variety on radio. Look at historic archioves, and there were a few stations getting HUGE numbers. (like your KLIF and KVIL examples). Now there's a lot more stations, a lot more options, a lot more variety.

Used to be none, then maybe 1 hispanic station. Now there's 10. Used to be 1 news/talker. Now there's half a dozen. No sports stations then, now there's 3. Couple of CHR's couple of urbans, 5 rock stations, etc

People may not like the variety, but there's definitely a lot more variety now then there were 30 years ago...

 

[satradio]

Now there's a lot more stations, a lot more options, a lot more variety.

And with ipods, satellite, internet, cd burning, and phone apps...a lot fewer listeners to pull from.

 

[little1]

And with ipods, satellite, internet, cd burning, and phone apps...a lot fewer listeners to pull from.

You sure about that? You want to compare the population of the 70's to the population of today? Without checking, I'm pretty sure the USA has gotten bigger. Ergo, there's more possible listeners today than there was 30 years ago. More competition yes, but (throwing out numbers in a very general sense, since this doesn't take into account the formula: Cume+tsl=ratings) ) a 10% share of 2 million DFW listeners would be 200K, while a 5% share of 5 million would be 250K...

And posessing an ipod, satellite, interent, etc doesn't bar you from also listening to the radio. Does it give you an alternative, sure. Might it cut into your TSL, sure. But it's not a zero sum game. Having an ipod or an internet connection doesn't mean you'll listen to the radio less.

 

[little1]

Having an ipod or an internet connection doesn't mean you'll listen to the radio less.

And the link that Mike posted above has this.
42t KTCK-AM Stream All Sports Mo-Su 6A-12A Share% ~~ 0.3 0.3

Looks like having that internet connection has given Ticket listeners a way to listen to their station in places where they couldn't get it before (at work, under bridges, or behind hills ).

(And how would you like to be one of the 15-20 stations who are having their on-air signal getting lower ratings than KTCK's stream...)

 

[satradio]

Well I guess it depends on what you read. I read several years ago that people under 30 were abandoning radio. And all I know is, I have young neices and nephews, and work with several people 20+. I know for a fact my neices and nephews pretty much don't listen to the radio for music very often. And many of the younger folks at work have said they don't listen to the radio for music at all. I'm 37 and stopped listening to terrestrial radio for music about five years ago. I only listened for talk, and now with the current state of DFW talk radio, I barely listen at all And judging from the entries on this forum, not many folks here are spring chickens either. Since stations like KISS and the hip hop stations here pretty much cater to kids, it would be silly for me to say young people don't listen to the radio. I'm just saying it's very safe to assume radio isn't garnering the number of listeners it did 20 years ago.

 

[davideduardo]

Since stations like KISS and the hip hop stations here pretty much cater to kids, it would be silly for me to say young people don't listen to the radio. I'm just saying it's very safe to assume radio isn't garnering the number of listeners it did 20 years ago.

Radio reaches the same percentage of people it did 20 yearts ago, although, as mentioned before, the amount of time spent listening has decreased.

Kiss targets women 18-34 and urban stations tend to target men and women 18-34. Nobody targets teens as there is no ad money spent on radio for teens and there hasn't been for decades.

 

[little1]

Since stations like KISS and the hip hop stations here pretty much cater to kids, it would be silly for me to say young people don't listen to the radio. I'm just saying it's very safe to assume radio isn't garnering the number of listeners it did 20 years ago.

DE just made a couple of my points, but here's a few more...
According to this...
http://www.city-data.com/us-cities/The-South/Dallas-Population-Profile.html
The metro area has gone from ~2million people in 1980 to ~5mil in 2000. So while ratings may have dropped, the population has increased and the number of alternatives have gone up. So where top 40 may have gotten 10 shares in the past, you know have (frim link above) Kiss getting a 6.1, K104 with a 3.2, Beat with a 3.1, Edge with a 2.6, and i93 with a 1.4. And that doesn't even count any hispanic stations, and they represent what, 40% of the area population now? Throw Mega 107 into that mix, and youth oriented stations probably approach a 20 share in this town...

 

[satradio]

And that doesn't even count any hispanic stations, and they represent what, 40% of the area population now? Throw Mega 107 into that mix, and youth oriented stations probably approach a 20 share in this town...

That may be true, but lets hypothetically say DFW had the population it does now in 1983, what would the share be?? You can throw around numbers all you like, but the current state of radio and comments from the higher ups in the radio industry back up what I'm saying...radio has lost and continues to lose listeners, lots of them.

 

[little1]

Well I guess it depends on what you read. I read several years ago that people under 30 were abandoning radio.

And I read 20 years ago that AM was dead. But funny how WBAP and KTCK outbill 45 other stations in this market. I'm not going to defend radio as a whole, we've got plenty of problems, but it's also entirely possible that our demise has been oversold (like a lot of stations ;D).
As I've said here before, it's about delivering content- Sirius/XM is still struggling to deliver content and make money. Pandora is looking at adding more ads to help subsidize their costs. At some point, depending on what they have to do to make money, they lose what differntiates themsleves from radio...

But you may be right, kids may be abandoning radio. But my daughter's school group did a car wash fundraiser last week. And I was called and ordered to bring up a boombox so they had a radio to listen to while they worked. Indicative of the whole age group? of course not. Which is why I try not to make broad generalizations...

 

[Huff]

You sure about that? You want to compare the population of the 70's to the population of today? Without checking, I'm pretty sure the USA has gotten bigger. Ergo, there's more possible listeners today than there was 30 years ago. More competition yes, but (throwing out numbers in a very general sense, since this doesn't take into account the formula: Cume+tsl=ratings) ) a 10% share of 2 million DFW listeners would be 200K, while a 5% share of 5 million would be 250K...

The population of this market exploded throughout the 70s and 80s, and is evidenced by looking back at how cume has grown accordingly.

In 1966, KLIF/1190, with its double-digit shares, had a cume of 317,400. Throughout the 70s, the top cuming station in the market (usually WBAP or KRLD) averaged just under 500,000. In 1991, KSCS was the first station to break the 750K mark. And Kiss was averging just over 800K in the last diary books.

 

[little1]

That may be true, but lets hypothetically say DFW had the population it does now in 1983, what would the share be?? You can throw around numbers all you like, but the current state of radio and comments from the higher ups in the radio industry back up what I'm saying...radio has lost and continues to lose listeners, lots of them.

http://www.dfwradioarchives.com/1983.htm
12+ Ratings for Fall 1983
Call Letters Frequency Format Sp 1983 Fa 1983
KVIL-A/F 1150/103.7 Adult Contemporary 8.3 11.8
KRLD 1080 News/Talk 6.5 7.7
KMEZ-A/F 1480/100.3 Easy Listening 7.0 6.6
KSCS 96.3 Country 7.4 6.0
KKDA-FM 104.5 Urban 5.6 5.6
KPLX 99.5 Country 5.9 5.5
WBAP 820 Country 6.0 5.4
KZEW 97.9 Rock 5.0 4.9
KEGL 97.1 Top 40/Rock 5.4 4.7
KAFM 92.5 Top 40 4.5 4.6
KNOK-FM 107.5 Urban 3.7 4.6
The thing to look at here is how those 10 stations account for about 65% of the market shares. Now it's just much more spread out with 50 (ish) stations getting some rating...

 

[davideduardo]

That may be true, but lets hypothetically say DFW had the population it does now in 1983, what would the share be??

The sum of the shares of all stations will always be 100. "Share" means the percentage of radio listening each station has.

You can throw around numbers all you like, but the current state of radio and comments from the higher ups in the radio industry back up what I'm saying...radio has lost and continues to lose listeners, lots of them.

Percentage of the total 12+ population that uses radio in average PPM survey... a little over 95. Percentage in 1988, the peak year for diary-based PUR (Persons using radio) was, I believe, 1988... when in Dallas it was just under 96.

Most other comparisons beyond PUR are not valid, as the PPM is a different methodology and TSL, AQH persons, etc. are not comparable... but reach is.

 

[davideduardo]

while a 5% share of 5 million would be 250K...

With almost exactly 5 million 12+ in the market, a 5 share is around 27,000 persons, not 250,000 persons.

 

[davideduardo]

And Kiss was averging just over 800K in the last diary books.

And seems to be bubbling right at 1.5 million 12+ in the PPM.

 

[little1]

while a 5% share of 5 million would be 250K...

With almost exactly 5 million 12+ in the market, a 5 share is around 27,000 persons, not 250,000 persons.

How are you getting that? I was going off of rough math that in a market of 5mil, 10% would be 500K, so 5% would be 250K listeners.

 

[davideduardo]

while a 5% share of 5 million would be 250K...

With almost exactly 5 million 12+ in the market, a 5 share is around 27,000 persons, not 250,000 persons.

How are you getting that? I was going off of rough math that in a market of 5mil, 10% would be 500K, so 5% would be 250K listeners.

That is "rating" and not "share."

Rating is the % of the universe that is using a station (or group of stations or radio in general, as in PUR, which is a rating) while share is the % of radio listeners that are tuned to a specific station.