Arbitron commercializes PPM two days early

[djmimi]

Arbitron announced on Monday (Oct. 6) that it has commercialized its Portable People Meter radio ratings services in eight new markets. Arbitron has released radio audience estimates for the September 2008 PPM survey month (August 21-September 17) to its subscribers in New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, San Francisco, Nassau-Suffolk, Middlesex-Somerset-Union, Riverside-San Bernardino and San Jose.

Reaction please.

 

[SandyG]

Good. The diary method is sooooo 1970's!

 

[davideduardo]

Good. The diary method is sooooo 1970's!

That's of course why about 250 markets will continue to use the diary for the forseeable future.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

Let the fair competition begin!!

No more writing in the diary what one "wants to support" even though they don't actually listen

No more exagerrating time spent listening.

No more pretending to listen to something that wasn't listened to.

The game is on. The ones who are complaining are the ones who fear real competition on an even playing field - and do they fear it!!

Here's to a measuring method that is clearly more accurate without the threats and attorney generals!!

 

[djmimi]

Actually, I was trying to get reaction on the ratings for LA, any major changes? Observations??

 

[davideduardo]

Here's to a measuring method that is clearly more accurate without the threats and attorney generals!!

If the PPM were so good, explain why the MRC has not accredited any market except Houston (where a totally different system is used for sample and recruiting).

 

[davideduardo]

Actually, I was trying to get reaction on the ratings for LA, any major changes? Observations??

Only minor changes from the June book, the July Book and the August book. Jack is off a bit, otherwise pretty much the same thing in all four books.

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Actually, I was trying to get reaction on the ratings for LA, any major changes? Observations??

Well all I can say is a certain newer station lost listeners... more were listening (cume) in July than in September. Hmmmmm -- could it be CRBOS ??? (classic rock burn out syndrome). Yes I'm pissed....besides the fact that the Angels season just ended so I'm really pissed

 

[djmimi]

Thanks David. Some of us don't get to see the particulars in the book. So all I see is what's online.

Meanwhile, SRF, don't be too po'd. d'ya like football??

 

[goriajk]

John, I feel your pain... I wonder how Meems and other Sound-o-philes are thinking, as I personally was hoping for a better result with the book. Let's Keep the Faith. JG

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Thanks David. Some of us don't get to see the particulars in the book. So all I see is what's online.

Meanwhile, SRF, don't be too po'd. d'ya like football??

YEH I do.. I'm a Giants fan so I had a good February and the Jints are one of two undefeated teams!!

 

[SuperRadioFan]

John, I feel your pain... I wonder how Meems and other Sound-o-philes are thinking, as I personally was hoping for a better result with the book. Let's Keep the Faith. JG

B4 I forget, Joe, THANKS a bunch for the pics!! Cool!

Far as the other "Sound-O-Philes" are concerned,
1) Most are probably totally unaware about The Sound's #s unlike us here RadioGeeks

2) There aren't many left if ya noticed... Even PT's pot shots are MIA lately. And Mr Kinsley made a cameo appearance after the Dodgers' sweep...He requested "I Love L.A." And I understand he got it. Had the Halos survived tonight, I was going to request Pearl Jam's "I'm Still Alive". But Mr Kinsley pretty much gave up posting a while back (he's a big Wilco fan)

If the Red Sox make it to another World Series, I sure hope it'll be The Dodgers they'll face... I hate the Phillies (Mets are my NL team)

 

[SuperRadioFan]

Oh and as far as "Keep the Faith" is concerned, how's this for a recent playlist from tonight? .....

8:00 PM U2 With Or Without You The Joshua Tree
8:04 PM Augustana I Still Ain't Over You Can't Love, Can't Hurt
8:15 PM R.E.M. Drive Automatic For The People
8:19 PM Lifehouse Whatever It Takes Who We Are
8:23 PM Spoon Don't You Evah Ga Ga Ga Ga Ga
8:26 PM Dire Straits Calling Elvis On Every Street
8:30 PM Donavon Frankenreiter Life Love & Laughter Pass It Around
8:33 PM Marvin Gaye Trouble Man Trouble Man
8:37 PM Robert Plant & Alison Krauss Please Read The Letter Raising Sand
8:41 PM Sneaker Pimps 6 Underground Becoming X
8:44 PM *Susan Tedeschi True Back To The River
8:54 PM The Call The Walls Came Down The Call

CD titles are underlined and No It's not The Sound's playlist

12 songs including a classic underplayed Marvin Gaye... and not one typical classic rock song (I don't count the U2 song)

 

[radioresearcher]

I am excited about the PPM currency as well... Arbitron still has some issues to work out but I believe they will get them handled. I just think the protests do nothing but set us back. For Inner City to complain in NY when their morning show is No. 1 25-54 is insane.

Everyone should work together to help make it a better system.

One thing I love about PPM is that it is unforgiving. You need to play hits to win and the clutter - in most cases - needs to be kept to a minimum.

There is still room for great personalities (see Piolin, Kevin & Bean, Seacrest, or even Mark & Brian).

 

[davideduardo]

I am excited about the PPM currency as well... Arbitron still has some issues to work out but I believe they will get them handled. I just think the protests do nothing but set us back. For Inner City to complain in NY when their morning show is No. 1 25-54 is insane.

The fact that there is no MRC accreditation anywhere for the methodology used in LA or NY or Chicago or Philly or SF indicates real issues, particularly at the cell level, in the sample. The product shoulld not have been commercialized until it could be accredited.

 

[harvealan]

I find this circus terribly troubling--not the back and forth between Arbitron and its clients; but the legal and public nature of the situation. I believe both the FCC and AG offices should not be involved in this dispute, but rather behind closed doors with the vendor and the client figuring it out. Bring the lawyers if necessary but keep it behind the scenes for the sake of the health and public perception of our industry.

Check out my blog for an interesting story and additional comment on this topic.

http://harvealan.blogspot.com/2008/10/tale-of-two-arbitron-diaires.html

 

[SandyG]

David,

If you weren't involved in Hispanic radio you would agree that the PPM is WAY better than diary. Yes, they still use diary in 250+ markets, but a lot of companies (like Cumulus) have unsubscribed in their 100+ markets. A better system is needed. Diary is voting, PPM is actual listening.

The bottom line is this...if stations get results, ratings don't matter anyway. I know people that ran ads on the #1 station and got ZERO response, yet ran ads on the #19 station and got great results. Those are the real numbers, and if a service came out that published results, THAT service would be the industry standard....of course unless your station never got results, then you would sue them.

 

[mtg]

You can find the money trail supporting this one ending at the front door of SBS corporate in Miami.

 

[davideduardo]

David,

If you weren't involved in Hispanic radio you would agree that the PPM is WAY better than diary. Yes, they still use diary in 250+ markets, but a lot of companies (like Cumulus) have unsubscribed in their 100+ markets. A better system is needed. Diary is voting, PPM is actual listening.

I've been reviewing diaries since 1970 for everything from beautiful music stations for EZ Communications to Top 40's for Lotus and, of course, Spanish language stations. The diary shows no indication of voting; the differences are mostly attributed to rounding, not voting.

The PPM has as many defects as the diary, particularly in the area of daily usage compliance. But the real issue right now is that, except for one market where a different methodology is used, no PPM report or market is MRC accredited. That means the system does not pass the tests of research and statistics professionals. The diary survey is accredited in all but one market.

The bottom line is this...if stations get results, ratings don't matter anyway.

In large markets where buys are multimedia and multistation, there is no way to measure results by station. Ratings establish price per set of ears, while results depend mostly on the client

I know people that ran ads on the #1 station and got ZERO response, yet ran ads on the #19 station and got great results. Those are the real numbers, and if a service came out that published results, THAT service would be the industry standard....of course unless your station never got results, then you would sue them.

The station is the carrier, the medium. It does not control the message, the pricing, the distribution or anything else. Blaming a station for a campaign where they copy may have been wrong for the listeners or any of a dozen other possible defects is ingenuous.

 

[SandyG]

I still have to disagree with you on the "voting" vs. "rounding" method. How else do you explain when people are rabid fans of a show (Like Tom Leykis for example) they say they listen from 3p-7p EVERY DAY. This is why he's gone from #1 to #19 in his prime demo. However, when he does a live event the place is packed. His show get's results. He didn't get any less audience because the PPM came out, he just got a real gauge of who is listening. In the Hispanic and Urban market, people are more loyal to their station and culture and when they get a diary, they "vote" for their favorite station.

You are right on national and regional buys that the results are hard to track, but on local it certainly is, and if you are an advertiser and not tracking what works and what doesn't, you are wasting your money.