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At What Point Will 94.7 WFME Be Sold?
- Thread starter DToTheJ
- Start date
secondchoice said:
Arbitron publishes data for every station that meets the minimum reporting standard. Advertisers and stations that subscribe get data on all stations, including WCNN.
It bills more like $700 k a month, not $1,000,000.
Try $300,000 to $325,000 a month. Maybe with a BCF of $500 k to $1 million a year, not a month.
DavidEduardo said:
Are you saying 790 out bills 680?
As for positive cash at a major sports talk station (without seeing a financial statement) I estimated 35% sales expense, 30% programming cost (live and local maximum) and 15% other expenses (rent, electric etc.) around 75% leaving around 20% for debt which I doubt the WCNN has.
taylorengineer said:
I assume WCNN which last year out rated 790 6+ (when both were published) would bill as much. Even using your low $700K a month that is around $140,000 cash for someone's pocket.
From today' edition of InsideRadio.com:
"Meanwhile CBS Radio could announce in the coming weeks that it will have a new FM to simulcast 'Sports Radio 66' WFAN, New York. Sources say the company appears to be the winner for Family Radio’s WFME (94.7) in what is believed to be a brewing three-way deal involving at least one other station. CBS hasn’t confirmed those rumors."
Naturally if it is true that it is buying WFME, CBS Radio would have to spin off one of its stations to be within ownership caps. That may be the reason for a possible "three-way deal."
Link (last paragraph of article): http://www.insideradio.com//Article.asp?id=2523712&spid=32061#.UED-M8FlQUo
"Meanwhile CBS Radio could announce in the coming weeks that it will have a new FM to simulcast 'Sports Radio 66' WFAN, New York. Sources say the company appears to be the winner for Family Radio’s WFME (94.7) in what is believed to be a brewing three-way deal involving at least one other station. CBS hasn’t confirmed those rumors."
Naturally if it is true that it is buying WFME, CBS Radio would have to spin off one of its stations to be within ownership caps. That may be the reason for a possible "three-way deal."
Link (last paragraph of article): http://www.insideradio.com//Article.asp?id=2523712&spid=32061#.UED-M8FlQUo
It'll start as a simulcast, but I think CBS wants 660 as flagship for the new CBS Sports Radio Network. 94.7 may be involved, but there's going to be a swap somewhere to put WFAN on a full-market ESB B. No way does WFAN get left on 94.7 FM.
What station will CBS get rid of? It won't be WLNY-TV, which was only acquired about a year ago. It won't be one of the FMs since CBS is looking for a 4th FM in NY. It could be 1010.
One of CBS' current FMs is going to be blown up for WFAN. That's a certainty. CBS probably wants the 4th FM for news or news/talk.
Stay tuned! This is going to get interesting!
What station will CBS get rid of? It won't be WLNY-TV, which was only acquired about a year ago. It won't be one of the FMs since CBS is looking for a 4th FM in NY. It could be 1010.
One of CBS' current FMs is going to be blown up for WFAN. That's a certainty. CBS probably wants the 4th FM for news or news/talk.
Stay tuned! This is going to get interesting!
IF it's true, what CBS did in LA is put the weakest AM in a trust, rather than sell it.
CBS is partners with Cumulus in CBS Sports Network, so have Cumulus buy the FM (since they're under the FCC limit) and use it as the flagship for CBS Sports Radio, also airing WFAN content. That's my theory, anyway.
What CBS is waiting for is a loosening of the ownership caps, especially with regards to AM. So the thinking is that any sale is temporary.
CBS is partners with Cumulus in CBS Sports Network, so have Cumulus buy the FM (since they're under the FCC limit) and use it as the flagship for CBS Sports Radio, also airing WFAN content. That's my theory, anyway.
What CBS is waiting for is a loosening of the ownership caps, especially with regards to AM. So the thinking is that any sale is temporary.
Mike said:
CBS doesn't need a 4th FM to put WFAN on 92.3 or 102.7. Not sure when FAN goes to FM, but I doubt this weekend. Perhaps by Jan 2, 2013, the day CBS Sports Radio Network goes 24/7.
In Philly, WIP 610 AM & 94.1 FM are currently simulcasting but on 1/2/13, 610 AM will air CBS SR 24/7 while 94.1 remains live and local. I'm sure CBS wants to duplicate that model in NY, CBS SR on 50 kW non-D 660 AM, WFAN live and local on FM.
No.Mike said:
But since this talk is heating up, I am going to offer my speculation of how this could all unfold:
660 - WFAN (same ownership, but used for CBS Sports Radio Network and overflow events)
880 - WCBS (same ownership, programming)
1010 - WINS (under shill trust ownership, same programming)
92.3 - WXRK (same ownership, programming)
94.7 - WWFS (new acquisition by CBS Radio, moved call-sign, CBS programming moved from 102.7FM)
101.1 - WCBS-FM (same ownership, programming)
102.7 - WFAN-FM (same ownership, changed call-sign, CBS programming moved from 660AM)
This possible station lineup provides CBS with the New York full-market FM signal it desires for WFAN programming. It also moves WWFS, the female-oriented AC station, to a New Jersey signal for better suburban penetration, and the jingle wouldn't even have to be modified much as 94 and 102 have the same syllables.
For Family Stations Inc., they would sell 94.7FM and sacrifice the station and its programming. The WFME call-sign, however, would be retained and moved to another station it owns, displacing that stations call-sign to the FCC call-sign reserve.
This is a possible scenario. HOWEVER, CBS is at its ownership cap in the New York market and this DOES include LMAs. I am thinking that CBS will have to sacrifice something (a radio station or programming) if they come to acquire 94.7 or any other FM property. I cannot see how they could legally justify duplicating the WFAN programming on either a full-time or part-time basis while over the station limit.
Ultimately, if CBS is insistent on bringing the CBS Sports Radio Network to New York, CBS will have to sacrifice programming. That sacrifice would likely be Now FM.
But the bigger questions are: If the speculation is correct, and CBS gets their way and maintains control of all six signals plus one more in an acquisition, what precedents does this set? And, Doesn't such an arrangement risk placing the control of the public airwaves into a small handful of mega conglomerate corporations? Perhaps the view from regulators and industry observers is, "Hey, no big deal." But I think that response is grossly oversimplifying a complex matter and ignoring the original intent and purpose of the public airwaves. That risk is not worth taking simply to augment a corporation's bottom line.
My speculation:
1010 is sold outright. I don't think CBS could get away with a trust ownership scheme. So I'm thinking Cumulus gets that. Cumulus will keep "All News. All The Time" as that's a money-maker.
I think Giacomo is on to something about possibly swapping WWFS for WFAN on FM.
Another possibility is Cumulus buying the Fresh programming rights, along with 94.7. The Fan goes to 102.7. 1010 stays in the CBS stable. Cumulus might then swap 'PLJ with Fresh or keep Fresh on 94.7 and moving the 103.9 stick into the city from Westchester. CBS could also buy some stations from Cumulus outside the city as part of the deal.
So you'd get this lineup:
660 - WCRN (for "CBS Radio Network"; otherwise WFAN-AM)
880 - WCBS (better AM station; would be very hard to sacrifice)
1010 - WINS (keep it for now until AMs no longer worth the price)
92.3 - WXRK (they'll need to improve the presentation because competing with Z100 is not going to plan)
101.1 - WCBS-FM (heritage, no need to explain)
102.7 - WFAN-FM (new home of The Fan)
Cumulus would end up with:
770 - WABC (news/talk)
94.7/103.9 - I could see 'PLJ there or another NJ-centric format
95.5 - Another format could go here (news/talk, an urban format or dance; otherwise 'PLJ stays where it is)
1010 is sold outright. I don't think CBS could get away with a trust ownership scheme. So I'm thinking Cumulus gets that. Cumulus will keep "All News. All The Time" as that's a money-maker.
I think Giacomo is on to something about possibly swapping WWFS for WFAN on FM.
Another possibility is Cumulus buying the Fresh programming rights, along with 94.7. The Fan goes to 102.7. 1010 stays in the CBS stable. Cumulus might then swap 'PLJ with Fresh or keep Fresh on 94.7 and moving the 103.9 stick into the city from Westchester. CBS could also buy some stations from Cumulus outside the city as part of the deal.
So you'd get this lineup:
660 - WCRN (for "CBS Radio Network"; otherwise WFAN-AM)
880 - WCBS (better AM station; would be very hard to sacrifice)
1010 - WINS (keep it for now until AMs no longer worth the price)
92.3 - WXRK (they'll need to improve the presentation because competing with Z100 is not going to plan)
101.1 - WCBS-FM (heritage, no need to explain)
102.7 - WFAN-FM (new home of The Fan)
Cumulus would end up with:
770 - WABC (news/talk)
94.7/103.9 - I could see 'PLJ there or another NJ-centric format
95.5 - Another format could go here (news/talk, an urban format or dance; otherwise 'PLJ stays where it is)
I just can't see CBS unloading either of its long legacy and top billing NYC all news brands. If it does decide to unload the 1010 license, the WINS news brand will go to another frequency. In a three way swap, WINS would go to 660, WFAN would go to FM, and somebody new would own 1010.
Remember CBS is, and has been for a long time, the national leader in all news radio.
As to the new CBS Sports Network, to make money on the New York market, the programs don't have to clear, but the spots do. CBS can offer national advertisers the top sports talk audience in NYC by running the spots on WFAN. It doesn't have to clear the national programming in NYC to do that. Most of the time the advertisers only care about the quantity and quality of the audience that hears their spots.
The NY sports talk audience and advertising dollars allocated to it are finite, why go out of your way to fragment it into more pieces if you already own the format's dominant station in the market?
Possibly, a couple of suburban AMs, or even one of the less than 50-kw NYC AMs that don't cover the entire market might be interested in being sports network affiliates. In Philly, CBS has an extra AM to use for network sports, in NYC it doesn't and won't.
If Cumulus were to acquire WFME, it would be wise to offer NJ soccer moms a better signal for the WPLJ format, or a format with a similar demo target. The 95.5 signal in the market core could be put to better use doing something different.
Remember CBS is, and has been for a long time, the national leader in all news radio.
As to the new CBS Sports Network, to make money on the New York market, the programs don't have to clear, but the spots do. CBS can offer national advertisers the top sports talk audience in NYC by running the spots on WFAN. It doesn't have to clear the national programming in NYC to do that. Most of the time the advertisers only care about the quantity and quality of the audience that hears their spots.
The NY sports talk audience and advertising dollars allocated to it are finite, why go out of your way to fragment it into more pieces if you already own the format's dominant station in the market?
Possibly, a couple of suburban AMs, or even one of the less than 50-kw NYC AMs that don't cover the entire market might be interested in being sports network affiliates. In Philly, CBS has an extra AM to use for network sports, in NYC it doesn't and won't.
If Cumulus were to acquire WFME, it would be wise to offer NJ soccer moms a better signal for the WPLJ format, or a format with a similar demo target. The 95.5 signal in the market core could be put to better use doing something different.
That is also what I find particularly difficult to contemplate, yet if we accept what David Eduardo and others with the same viewpoint have repeatedly said, this is exactly what could be happening very soon. This is why my scenario had the 1010 license placed into a shill trust after extraordinarily high-paid attorneys and other buddies negotiated the pesky nuisance details.TimeIsTight said:
On air, WINS refers to itself equally as "1010 WINS" and "WINS News". It could transition to another frequency, but doing so it would have to lose the "1010" references including the logo. Where else would those two bad-ass globes go? :'( In fact, Google the phrase "1010" and look what pops up under the search bar
WINS is an historic New York news station. It is an institution in New York City and the entire market. It is the golden standard for how radio news formats should be executed. It will survive at any location on the dial.
However, it would prove very hard to drop what has become such a significant part of it's on air identity. And, what might prove even harder, would be for CBS to let it go. Either the license or the programming. Regardless of the price. CBS Radio as a corporation is unique in that, in most cases, it preserves heritage stations, adapting them to burgeoning generations and growing their brands. This is why I and perhaps others have a hard time imagining the New York AM dial without 660 WFAN, 880 WCBS, and 1010 WINS, all owned by CBS Radio.
If Cumulus acquires another FM signal in this market, you can bet your bottom dollar the WABC programming is simulcasted or outright moves to FM, and the WABC-FM call-sign would be returned to the market. Guaranteed. An FM signal is exactly what Cumulus needs to combat ClearChannel, especially in light of CC's recent acquisition of WOR.TimeIsTight said:
From an historical perspective, 95.5FM might be the logical destination for WABC-FM. From a 2012 practical perspective, it would make no sense to risk injuring the golden goose which is 95.5 PLJ, even if it meant moving the signal to a New Jersey signal just Three Doors Down (had to get an AC song reference into this discussion
).TheBigA said:
IIRC the AM has first use of call letters on multiple band usage.(AM/FM/TV) But Disney sold WABC AM to Citadel, and it safe to assume Disney made Citadel "sign away" these rights. But Citadel when Bankrupt, during bankruptcy, the judge and the trustee (of the bankruptcy) or the bankrupt companies management (if the judge allows them to stay, which usually happens if you hire good lawyers) get to "pick" which contrasts they want to keep in force*. It is possible that provision of Disney's sale or the radio division could have been voided by the Court. If so Cumulus (via the Citadel bankruptcy and owning 770 WABC) might have first usage of WABC.
* IIRC Disney got cash for the ABC Radio division so they did not have as strong of a "case" or right as the folks that were owed money from Citadel (bond holders etc.)
stationless listener said:
Don't think so and here's why. Fresh is a direct competitor with 'PLJ. I doubt that Cumulus or any other operator is going to own two stations that would end up pirating each other.
Recall when Emmis purchased 98.7 KISS-FM, they already owned Hot 97. The two stations were direct competitors. Emmis moved 98.7 to a classic soul format, targeting a different audience form Hot 97.
Someone made an interesting point that may or may not be rooted in reality.
Cumulus has 95.5 in both New York and LA.
Would they mount some kind of format (talk, news, sports, etc?) that would actually be a simulcast, marketed as "95.5 news" or something bouncing between NY and LA origination? Less expense? Not sure.
Kind of wild, I know, but interesting that both #1 and #2 markets have co-owned 95.5s which may be currently under examination for format re-positioning.
Cumulus has 95.5 in both New York and LA.
Would they mount some kind of format (talk, news, sports, etc?) that would actually be a simulcast, marketed as "95.5 news" or something bouncing between NY and LA origination? Less expense? Not sure.
Kind of wild, I know, but interesting that both #1 and #2 markets have co-owned 95.5s which may be currently under examination for format re-positioning.
secondchoice said:
Therefore, Disney was not a creditor in the proceedings, thus the contract remains in force, and Disney still owns all the call letter rights. That's why they were able to keep those call letters, and Disney can use those same letters for the TVs.
Let's assume that the Disney contract was not voided, since I have no reason to believe it was. Cumulus is still paying Disney for the use of ABC News Radio, and several other aspects of the Citadel deal are still in force. So my question is can Cumulus make any call letter changes without getting permission from Disney?
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