Anybody got a working single channel CBS Audimax, Inovonics MAP3, or a Dorrough DAP etc. they can part with for some cash, or voice barter? I do station imaging for over 30 small to large markets all over the country as well as national TV spots..Can do a trade deal, or some cash and trade etc. As a sideline, and for free, we run a small community LPAM station as a service to the local chamber and would like to up the audio chain a bit with a piece of gear that you might not want or need. I can do a months worth of spots, or station imaging for your stations, or we can do a cash deal. clearly we don't want to part with too much $$... so see what you might have in the back room and PM me.
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Audimax or DAP?
- Thread starter jefflaurence
- Start date
Jeff, an Audimax is a much different box than the DAP or MAP. The Audimax is a gentle gain rider while the DAP and MAP are multiband audio processors. Depending on what they already have and need the Audimax may be less useful. Also, I assume you mean Map II as I don't believe Inovonics ever made a MAP 3.
Do they have any audio processing gear in use right now?
Do they have any audio processing gear in use right now?
Bill..the only processing now is part of the Zara Radio leveling system in the software. We are really only trying to increase the density, and overall perceived loudness. As you have said in your awesome article/blog on the Audimax, I may just be "remembering" how strong the Audimax sound is. Its not a big deal, just thought I would toss a feeler out and see if anyone had an old working unit they were letting collect dust.
BTW you are correct of course about the MAP 2. But I swore that Inovonics made a triband unit that was 2 rack spaces..older perhaps than the 8 band processor?
BTW you are correct of course about the MAP 2. But I swore that Inovonics made a triband unit that was 2 rack spaces..older perhaps than the 8 band processor?
Jeff,
Roll your own.Get Breakaway Broadcast processor software.199.00, i'm sure you can find an extra computer laying around. you'll be rockin and rolling soon..ray
Roll your own.Get Breakaway Broadcast processor software.199.00, i'm sure you can find an extra computer laying around. you'll be rockin and rolling soon..ray
You are correct, Jeff. Inovonics did make a tri-band unit.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYmhZGOaIDQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYmhZGOaIDQ
Is this "LPAM" station Part 15 (100 mW unlicensed) or a 10-watt TIS? With a Part 15 transmitter you have free reign to do whatever you want with the audio (up to and including AM Stereo!) but TIS stations are restricted to telephone-like 3 kHz audio bandwidth.
I assume TIS transmitters come with this low-pass filter built in, however, it may cause modulation overshoots when you attempt to use it together with aggressive audio processing. Nonetheless, I have heard some TIS stations with good, loud audio, so it certainly is possible to achieve high average modulation levels even with the 3 kHz filter in use.
The most common choice for low-budget AM audio processing is the Inovonics 222. It gives you the necessary limiting and clipping to achieve +125% positive modulation without exceeding -100% negative modulation, and provides NRSC pre-emphasis and 10 kHz brickwall filtering (neither of which is particularly applicable to a TIS station, but will be of great advantage on a Part 15 station). The 222 is available at a price that won't break the bank, especially when compared to the outrageous prices some sellers are asking for vintage Audimaxes and Volumaxes, even in "as-is, untested" condition.
I assume TIS transmitters come with this low-pass filter built in, however, it may cause modulation overshoots when you attempt to use it together with aggressive audio processing. Nonetheless, I have heard some TIS stations with good, loud audio, so it certainly is possible to achieve high average modulation levels even with the 3 kHz filter in use.
The most common choice for low-budget AM audio processing is the Inovonics 222. It gives you the necessary limiting and clipping to achieve +125% positive modulation without exceeding -100% negative modulation, and provides NRSC pre-emphasis and 10 kHz brickwall filtering (neither of which is particularly applicable to a TIS station, but will be of great advantage on a Part 15 station). The 222 is available at a price that won't break the bank, especially when compared to the outrageous prices some sellers are asking for vintage Audimaxes and Volumaxes, even in "as-is, untested" condition.
And if it's a pt 15, the money spent on Breakaway broadcasat is unbeatable.
The auto level in Zara is an atrocity.
Please turn it off as soon as you get something better.
Love the automation but that AGC is awful.
I've had no trouble running Zara/Breakaway 24/7 for a couple years now.
The sound I get is like the old enormous WABC CKLW WLS, etc.
It's huge AND yet the needle don't wiggle.
I love hardware but recognized right away how incredibly good Breakaway was and I
almost couldn't buy it fast enough to suit me. I have been impressed and happy for years.
If your tranmitter will do 150% pos modulation, Breakaway will run it right up to there, and it's hard to describe
just how enormous and larger than life music sounds at 150% modualtion.
When adjusted right, canned studio versions of music sound somehow more like live events.
The auto level in Zara is an atrocity.
Please turn it off as soon as you get something better.
Love the automation but that AGC is awful.
I've had no trouble running Zara/Breakaway 24/7 for a couple years now.
The sound I get is like the old enormous WABC CKLW WLS, etc.
It's huge AND yet the needle don't wiggle.
I love hardware but recognized right away how incredibly good Breakaway was and I
almost couldn't buy it fast enough to suit me. I have been impressed and happy for years.
If your tranmitter will do 150% pos modulation, Breakaway will run it right up to there, and it's hard to describe
just how enormous and larger than life music sounds at 150% modualtion.
When adjusted right, canned studio versions of music sound somehow more like live events.
@frankberry: Thanks for the link. While it wasn't called a MAP3 I forgot about the 255. I have a couple of pieces of Inovonics gear in my lab, including a 520 mod monitor and a 222 audio processor. Near had any hands-on with the 255
@Jeff: I think it was the combination of Audimax AND Volumax that made the pair memorable as far as loudness. You may be able to find them on the bay or elsewhere but if they need maintenance or refurb you may be investing more money into them than you planned.
@Jeff: I think it was the combination of Audimax AND Volumax that made the pair memorable as far as loudness. You may be able to find them on the bay or elsewhere but if they need maintenance or refurb you may be investing more money into them than you planned.
Tom Wells' setup does sound like the glory days of AM (it's better tho, really, "we have the technology", hehe), and... was part of what I used to model the sound of Omnia.9's "Big Iron" preset upon.
Breakaway takes care of the density and spectral balancing, but otherwise gets out of the way of a few "secret" sauces he's using, iron being one of em. So expect that you still might need to add some other stuff, if you don't want a clean transparent sound, which is not what the old stations were. But... to me it sounds like AM should sound. His imaging is also awesome. Reminds me of Dave Rabbit.
Anyways... just wanted to say that Breakaway only plays a part in getting a truly unique old-school big AM sound.
Breakaway takes care of the density and spectral balancing, but otherwise gets out of the way of a few "secret" sauces he's using, iron being one of em. So expect that you still might need to add some other stuff, if you don't want a clean transparent sound, which is not what the old stations were. But... to me it sounds like AM should sound. His imaging is also awesome. Reminds me of Dave Rabbit.
Anyways... just wanted to say that Breakaway only plays a part in getting a truly unique old-school big AM sound.
So I can run Breakaway as a stand alone, by taking the output of the Zara computer and going into the Breakaway computer..then t to the transmitter? If that's the case..sounds sweet.
@Chuck: Any way you can share a picture of that? I've always seen the broadcast-labed units but have yet to see any of the "recording" pieces. Are they labeled differently to differentiate it from the broadcast version?
There are a couple of pictures of it on this page: http://www.chalkhillmedia.org/Museum/virtual audio museum.htm Scroll down towards the bottom of the page. We're doing some remodeling right now and there is a huge wall of "constructuion stuff" in front of the shelf where it resides. As soon as I can get to it, I'll take a look, but I'm pretty sure it says "Recording Audimax" on it.
This unit came out of a private studio in Detroit and was in a rack that fed a Scully recording lathe. In the signal path, it was right in front of the two Westrex cutting amplifiers and right after a Pultec EQ. (And no, I don't have the lathe, amplifiers or EQ. They are long gone to a new home.)
As far as I know it is essentially the same as the broadcast versions, but without pre-empahsis.
This unit came out of a private studio in Detroit and was in a rack that fed a Scully recording lathe. In the signal path, it was right in front of the two Westrex cutting amplifiers and right after a Pultec EQ. (And no, I don't have the lathe, amplifiers or EQ. They are long gone to a new home.)
As far as I know it is essentially the same as the broadcast versions, but without pre-empahsis.
Recording Volumax. It did use some form of pre- and de-emphasis. Would love to find one, or a manual.
For some reason, CBS manuals are really scarce.
Chuck, didn't I fix you up with that Raytheon mixer??
For some reason, CBS manuals are really scarce.
Chuck, didn't I fix you up with that Raytheon mixer??
IIRC the Volumax never had pre-emphasis - you had to get that in the stereo generator or exciter.HadYourPhil said:
Dale H. Cook, Market Chief Engineer, Centennial Broadcasting, Roanoke/Lynchburg, VA
http://plymouthcolony.net/starcityeng/index.html
The FM Volumax did use pre-emphasis internally in its processing, but its output was de-emphasized. The Gates Solid Statesman FM limiter was the same way. But this redundant chain of de- and (re-)pre-emphasis, as well as the 15 kHz lowpass filter in the stereo generator, created significant overshoots, which it took the Optimod 8000 to solve once and for all.Dale H. Cook said:
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