Read that the FCC has ruled ads can not be louder than surrounding programs. OK, being an old radio guy this isn't clear to me. We, in radio could modulate 100% and broke the "speed limit" a little, however, the audio equipment maintained the level. Of course there is "apparent loudness" which is a whole other topic. If TV or cable stations have an audio chain with some sort of processing equipment how can any element be louder than another? Is this simply confusing "fullness" with decibels? For example a person watching a movie on TV that has some low elements for dramatic effect and then followed with a commercial. Obvioulsy, the commercial will be louder.
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Audio Question
- Thread starter Frank Ferreri
- Start date
Frank, you're thinking in analog. The CALM Act is primarily about TV stations (and cable) complying with ATSC Recommended Practice A/85 on audio loudness, including setting proper dialnorm perimeters for Dolby AC-3. AC-3 encoding has dynamic range control built into it.
Here is the ATSC A/85 document which I think you'll find interesting:
http://www.atsc.org/cms/standards/a_85-2011a.pdf
What I find both amusing and a little disgusting about the CALM Act is the political dog and pony show surrounding it. It allowed politicians like Obama (who signed the act into law with a flourish) and Anna Eshoo appear as if they were doing something for the American public when, in fact, the standards for loudness were already in place and already being complied with. The CALM Act was totally unnecessary but has now become another layer of bureaucratic regulation.
Here is the ATSC A/85 document which I think you'll find interesting:
http://www.atsc.org/cms/standards/a_85-2011a.pdf
What I find both amusing and a little disgusting about the CALM Act is the political dog and pony show surrounding it. It allowed politicians like Obama (who signed the act into law with a flourish) and Anna Eshoo appear as if they were doing something for the American public when, in fact, the standards for loudness were already in place and already being complied with. The CALM Act was totally unnecessary but has now become another layer of bureaucratic regulation.
Last week I bought a new HD (16:9) TV. Over the weekend I have been playing carpenter rearranging (demolishing?) the furniture so it fits into my older classic "entertainment unit". I finally got the contrast/color/brightness.... all that visual stuff pretty well tweaked. But I began to worry that I had a "dud" that was going to have to go back. The sound was all over the place! Then I began to see the pattern. Everytime there was a change... a new voice, a commercial, the level would drop down abruptly and then slowly rise again. I went to the menu and went to audio and found a choice I don't understand but will look later. I turned off some kind of automatic surround sound ALS or something and.... wahoo! Rock steady sound level!
I wonder if the new law requires manufactuers of TV set to visit homes regularly and make sure the RECEIVING SET is in compliance with the law? ;D
I wonder if the new law requires manufactuers of TV set to visit homes regularly and make sure the RECEIVING SET is in compliance with the law? ;D
(no kidding!)
One thing we seem to have a bunch of trouble with... is surround sound settings. It looks like some folks are setting their TVs (or cable boxes) for surround sound but have only two speakers connected. If you do it that way, you get the left and right front surround channels -- but not the dialog channel.
Usually there's still a bit of dialog in the surround channels, so they turn up the volume so they can hear that dialog and live with the sound effects & music being too loud.
Then, a commercial comes on.
Most commercials are *not* produced with surround sound. So the dialog comes out the surround channels at full volume -- and the viewer is blasted out of their chair. And doesn't believe us when we insist nobody else is complaining.
On a vaguely related subject... I spent last night in a motel near Atlanta - where the TV was connected to a digital-only Comcast system through one of those cigarette-box analog converters. Had a bit of time to mess with it, and solved a mystery another batch of our viewers have been observing. It seems if you hit the "language" button on the remote, it still tells you you're listening to English -- but the audio disappears. Hit it again, you're still in English -- but the audio comes back.
So if you know someone who has Comcast and has lost audio on one or more channels... they may be listening in the wrong "English".
One thing we seem to have a bunch of trouble with... is surround sound settings. It looks like some folks are setting their TVs (or cable boxes) for surround sound but have only two speakers connected. If you do it that way, you get the left and right front surround channels -- but not the dialog channel.
Usually there's still a bit of dialog in the surround channels, so they turn up the volume so they can hear that dialog and live with the sound effects & music being too loud.
Then, a commercial comes on.
Most commercials are *not* produced with surround sound. So the dialog comes out the surround channels at full volume -- and the viewer is blasted out of their chair. And doesn't believe us when we insist nobody else is complaining.
On a vaguely related subject... I spent last night in a motel near Atlanta - where the TV was connected to a digital-only Comcast system through one of those cigarette-box analog converters. Had a bit of time to mess with it, and solved a mystery another batch of our viewers have been observing. It seems if you hit the "language" button on the remote, it still tells you you're listening to English -- but the audio disappears. Hit it again, you're still in English -- but the audio comes back.
So if you know someone who has Comcast and has lost audio on one or more channels... they may be listening in the wrong "English".
I live in a condominium and have to keep my finger on the remote control volume at all times as the levels between the programs and the spot breaks are
absurd, its about time they enforce this with an iron fist (just like they do with pirate radio...ha ha) This problem goes back to the beginning of NTSC
television with the formation of CBS Labs and the development of the Audimax/Volumax combo along with the CBS sound level meter. With the advent of HDTV the problem is far worse than its ever been....totally out of control.
absurd, its about time they enforce this with an iron fist (just like they do with pirate radio...ha ha) This problem goes back to the beginning of NTSC
television with the formation of CBS Labs and the development of the Audimax/Volumax combo along with the CBS sound level meter. With the advent of HDTV the problem is far worse than its ever been....totally out of control.
D
Darth_vader
Guest
Are you certain it's just a problem with HD broadcasts? I've noticed it on most ATSC broadcasts around here.....and only a small few actually go out in full HD. NBC Qubo Channel (KPXG 22-02/42-02) seems to be the worst offender for the "loud commercials", I have noticed.
Of course, commercials are a very obvious reason why almost all ATSC and stereo receivers these days have a "MUTE" function.....
Of course, commercials are a very obvious reason why almost all ATSC and stereo receivers these days have a "MUTE" function.....
I think the reason the commercials sound louder is because they pump up the commpression more on the commericals when they are recorded. A movie or TV show will have more dyanamics such as soft vocals and loud car chases etc. If a car chase seques directly into a commercial nobody notices the change in volume because both are loud. If you go from two people whispering during a love scene directly into a loud car dealership commerical it will blow you out of your seat.
Concerning the 2 speaker surround sound. Some TV sets have a "surround" button in the menu which works similar to the old "stereo wide" switch that used to be on old jam boxes. It mixes a little out of phase audio between the left and right speakers giving it a wide or surround effect. Mono material such as dialoge will actually slightly lower in volume, but music and sound effects that were recorded in stereo will sound lots louder and the dialogue can be burried in the mix. I usually turn mine to regular stereo. If you want true surround use a surround stereo system so you can adjust the rear speakers so they won't drown out the main audio. I think most people don't know how (or don't care) how to properly hook up and adjust their equipment. It shocking to see some people with expensive stereo equipment with the speakers hooked up to the wrong channels, or have dialogue coming from the rear of the room.
Concerning the 2 speaker surround sound. Some TV sets have a "surround" button in the menu which works similar to the old "stereo wide" switch that used to be on old jam boxes. It mixes a little out of phase audio between the left and right speakers giving it a wide or surround effect. Mono material such as dialoge will actually slightly lower in volume, but music and sound effects that were recorded in stereo will sound lots louder and the dialogue can be burried in the mix. I usually turn mine to regular stereo. If you want true surround use a surround stereo system so you can adjust the rear speakers so they won't drown out the main audio. I think most people don't know how (or don't care) how to properly hook up and adjust their equipment. It shocking to see some people with expensive stereo equipment with the speakers hooked up to the wrong channels, or have dialogue coming from the rear of the room.
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