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Audition vs. Pro Tools

D

DoogieDown

Guest
I've worked with both and appreciate the pros (which BOTH have) and am frustrated by the cons (which BOTH have).

Audition trounces Pro Tools with it's ability to save mp3's quickly. Bouncing to disk in Pro Tools is a real drag.

Audition's use of the two-button mouse is superior to the one-button environment of Pro Tools on a Mac.

But one of the greatest things about Pro Tools is that it gives you lots of incentive to buy a Mac. The damned-near-zero-sound latency of a Mac trumps the heck out of sound delays of PC's--especially the discount PC's that most corporate radio stations are willing to buy. And Mac towers always arrive with high quality parts inside. Not so with bargain priced PC's.

Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it. Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time Compression is horrible.

In the message string below I noticed a complaint about crashes. My advice to EVERYONE on this board is to learn how to maintain your own computer. Don't depend on the I.T. Dept. to do it. It's been five years (and four I.T. people) since I've worked with someone who knew something about maintaining a computer whose primary function was digital editing. When a radio station interviews an I.T. person for a job, they make sure the person can maintain a Network and an e-mail server. But digital editing software is way beyond most I.T. peoples' expertise. We in the prod department pay the price.

You should run frequent disk error checks and disk de-frags when running PC Audition. And Disk Warrior is your best friend when running Pro Tools on a Mac. There's no reason for computer crashes and freezes to be a part of your existence.
 
Well stated Doogie.

You said "Audition's price continues to rise and the Time Compression is horrible. " I'm very much an Audition guy, but I have to agree with you here. Our crappy ass automation system has a built in time compression and it works much better than what's in Audition.
 
> But one of the greatest things about Pro Tools is that it
> gives you lots of incentive to buy a Mac. The
> damned-near-zero-sound latency of a Mac trumps the heck out
> of sound delays of PC's--especially the discount PC's that
> most corporate radio stations are willing to buy. And Mac
> towers always arrive with high quality parts inside. Not so
> with bargain priced PC's.

Very true, but Audition's 2.0 mixing engine is much better than previous versions. Latency is much less of an issue in this version. And while I agree that a Mac is better than a budget PC, a really good PC can be built for less money than a Mac. It's one of those, "You get what you pay for" instances. A $2000 PC designed specifically for audio can blow the doors off a $2000 Mac...But, at the same time, it's not easy to convince a station to spend 2k on a PC when they can find one for $400.


> Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression
> plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it.
> Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
> Compression is horrible.

Audition's time compressor isn't as bad as everyone thinks. ProTools' time compressor is better, no doubt about it...But Audition's is capable of producing very good results. The problem with Audition's is the interface. Manually setting the splicing frequency, precision setting and overlapping percentage isn't exactly convenient for most users. It's possible to get results comparable to Sound Forge's time stretcher, using Audition...But it does take time. Also, high precision sucks...Medium sounds much more natural, which throws off users. I use the WAVES time compressor, which is better than Audition or ProTools' anyway.

As far as price, Syntrillium was charging $399 for Cool Edit 1.2a, so the price still hasn't risen back to that level.
 
> > But one of the greatest things about Pro Tools is that it
> > gives you lots of incentive to buy a Mac. The
> > damned-near-zero-sound latency of a Mac trumps the heck
> out
> > of sound delays of PC's--especially the discount PC's that
>
> > most corporate radio stations are willing to buy. And Mac
>
> > towers always arrive with high quality parts inside. Not
> so
> > with bargain priced PC's.
>
> Very true, but Audition's 2.0 mixing engine is much better
> than previous versions. Latency is much less of an issue in
> this version. And while I agree that a Mac is better than a
> budget PC, a really good PC can be built for less money than
> a Mac. It's one of those, "You get what you pay for"
> instances. A $2000 PC designed specifically for audio can
> blow the doors off a $2000 Mac...But, at the same time, it's
> not easy to convince a station to spend 2k on a PC when they
> can find one for $400.
>
>
> > Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression
> > plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it.
> > Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
>
> > Compression is horrible.
>
> Audition's time compressor isn't as bad as everyone thinks.
> ProTools' time compressor is better, no doubt about it...But
> Audition's is capable of producing very good results. The
> problem with Audition's is the interface. Manually setting
> the splicing frequency, precision setting and overlapping
> percentage isn't exactly convenient for most users. It's
> possible to get results comparable to Sound Forge's time
> stretcher, using Audition...But it does take time. Also,
> high precision sucks...Medium sounds much more natural,
> which throws off users. I use the WAVES time compressor,
> which is better than Audition or ProTools' anyway.
>
> As far as price, Syntrillium was charging $399 for Cool Edit
> 1.2a, so the price still hasn't risen back to that level.
>


Audition's time compression is FANTASTIC if you take the time to learn how to make it work properly.
 
> Well stated Doogie.
>
> You said "Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
> Compression is horrible. " I'm very much an Audition guy,
> but I have to agree with you here. Our crappy ass
> automation system has a built in time compression and it
> works much better than what's in Audition.
>
Personally, I never warmed to Cool Edit. However, for radio production, I would stake Vegas against Pro tools anyday. I've used both, and in a windows environement, Vegas is far more intuitive than either program.
 
> Personally, I never warmed to Cool Edit. However, for radio
> production, I would stake Vegas against Pro tools anyday.
> I've used both, and in a windows environement, Vegas is far
> more intuitive than either program.

I like Vegas for video and I could use it for a quick, simple spot...But I can't imagine doing complex promos or sweepers on Vegas...Even combined with Sound Forge, I think it would make me go crazy. It comes in about fourth in my list of Audio Programs, behind Audition, ProTools and WaveLab.

I liked Vegas a lot around (Vegas Audio) version 2, but then it seemed to skew much closer to a video program...Now it just doesn't do anything for me.
 
A $2000 PC designed specifically for audio can
> blow the doors off a $2000 Mac...But, at the same time, it's
> not easy to convince a station to spend 2k on a PC when they
> can find one for $400.

Yeah, that's the problem. Oddly, I bet you're more likely to convince a station to get the bottom of the line Mac tower ($1700-2000?) than to start piecing together a custom PC for the same money. But most stations are going buy a $400 PC and throw Audition into it. Then you've just got to hope they budgeted a RAM upgrade!


> Audition's time compressor isn't as bad as everyone thinks.
> ProTools' time compressor is better, no doubt about it...But
> Audition's is capable of producing very good results.

I've tinkered with it, but have never approached the kind of results I get with Pro Tools. I'm open to suggestions...
 
> Audition's time compression is FANTASTIC if you take the
> time to learn how to make it work properly.


My main complaint with it is that, even when the compressed audio is smooth, Audition likes to add phantom double consonants. When you're cranking out spots, you don't like to have to stop everything and zoom in on all the words that start with hard consonants... and then delete phantom audio that was created by the crunch.

Pro Tools also has a knack for making a read sound like the person REALLY did just read it faster. Too often, Audition leaves digital artifacts.
 
> Yeah, that's the problem. Oddly, I bet you're more likely
> to convince a station to get the bottom of the line Mac
> tower ($1700-2000?) than to start piecing together a custom
> PC for the same money. But most stations are going buy a
> $400 PC and throw Audition into it. Then you've just got to
> hope they budgeted a RAM upgrade!

You're absolutely right. There's no "corner-cutting" when buying a Mac. If stations have the option to cut a corner, they'll do it. As a home user, though, it's a little different. Our PCs here at the station are pretty decent, but not one of them cost as much as the Mac G5 with Digi002 that sits and collects dust...Probably none cost as much as the old G3 with the Digi 882 I/O interface that also collects dust. Oddly enough, I prefer the old PT machine over the newer one, should I need to use PT for something.

> I've tinkered with it, but have never approached the kind of
> results I get with Pro Tools. I'm open to suggestions...
>

And you probably won't. Until I got the WAVES bundle, I used to record my VO into ProTools, use the time compressor, and then transfer it into Audition. Just because it was faster than finding the right settings in AA.

Audition's seems to work better on a full mix than a single VO...So if I'm in another studio, I build the commercial first, then stretch. Medium Precision with the "choose appropriate defaults" setting activated is a good place to start.
 
> I've worked with both and appreciate the pros (which BOTH
> have) and am frustrated by the cons (which BOTH have).
>
> Audition trounces Pro Tools with it's ability to save mp3's
> quickly. Bouncing to disk in Pro Tools is a real drag.
>
> Audition's use of the two-button mouse is superior to the
> one-button environment of Pro Tools on a Mac.
>
> But one of the greatest things about Pro Tools is that it
> gives you lots of incentive to buy a Mac. The
> damned-near-zero-sound latency of a Mac trumps the heck out
> of sound delays of PC's--especially the discount PC's that
> most corporate radio stations are willing to buy. And Mac
> towers always arrive with high quality parts inside. Not so
> with bargain priced PC's.
>
> Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression
> plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it.
> Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
> Compression is horrible.
>
> In the message string below I noticed a complaint about
> crashes. My advice to EVERYONE on this board is to learn
> how to maintain your own computer. Don't depend on the I.T.
> Dept. to do it. It's been five years (and four I.T. people)
> since I've worked with someone who knew something about
> maintaining a computer whose primary function was digital
> editing. When a radio station interviews an I.T. person for
> a job, they make sure the person can maintain a Network and
> an e-mail server. But digital editing software is way
> beyond most I.T. peoples' expertise. We in the prod
> department pay the price.
>
> You should run frequent disk error checks and disk de-frags
> when running PC Audition. And Disk Warrior is your best
> friend when running Pro Tools on a Mac. There's no reason
> for computer crashes and freezes to be a part of your
> existence.
>

I hear ya on the mp3 issue...however, I like to create a single Stereo file within the session, and then export to mp3.

I realize it's time consuming...but I really feel like it sounds pretty good...

Also, bouncing to disk direct to an mp3 can sometimes be buggy within pro tools.
 
>
>
> > Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression
> > plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it.
> > Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
>
> > Compression is horrible.
>
> Audition's time compressor isn't as bad as everyone thinks.
> ProTools' time compressor is better, no doubt about it...But
> Audition's is capable of producing very good results. The
> problem with Audition's is the interface. Manually setting
> the splicing frequency, precision setting and overlapping
> percentage isn't exactly convenient for most users. It's
> possible to get results comparable to Sound Forge's time
> stretcher, using Audition...But it does take time. Also,
> high precision sucks...Medium sounds much more natural,
> which throws off users. I use the WAVES time compressor,
> which is better than Audition or ProTools' anyway.

You can buy Sonic's Direct X bundle with the time comp for about $50. It's a great time comp plug.

One of the best time comp plug's is with the Orban Audicy, as well as compression (Orban). Hard to beat. Except as we all know, the Audicy is a dinosaur that still costs $16k! Orban (AKG) needs to wise up.
 
> Audition trounces Pro Tools with it's ability to save mp3's quickly.
Bouncing to disk in Pro Tools is a real drag.

Agreed. And strangely, earlier versions of PT allowed for a fast bounce
like AA/CEP. I never bothered to get the Digi mp3 option; I just drag 'em to
iTunes (which I hear sounds better than PTs mp3 codec anyway).

> Audition's use of the two-button mouse is superior to the one-button environment of Pro Tools on a Mac.

Macs have supported two-button mouses for a long time now, and I know someone
who uses a five-button mouse for Pro Tools. (Why are you using a mouse! Learn
the keyboard shortcuts!)

> Oddly, I bet you're more likely to convince a station to get the bottom of
the line Mac tower ($1700-2000?) than to start piecing together a custom PC
for the same money. But most stations are going buy a $400 PC and throw Audition into it.

Try convincing them to get the bottom of the line Mac - the decked-out Mac Mini
goes for $600; all they'll need are the keyboards, mouses and monitors from the
crappy PCs they'd be throwing away anyway.
 
Re: Audition vs. Pro Tools*****

This may sound strange, but I'll swear by it to my demise. When I use Audition time compression I always insert a 10 seconds of silence per 60 of audio. Then I'll do my time stretch/compress and make it fit. For some reason, it seems like the effect creates "ripples" in the piece of audio and will distort at certain areas. Inserting the silence (which you'll delete later anyways) seems to give it something to chew on instead of your audio.

It seems like the best way to go (for me at least) is to record to CD-RW, play it back in a CD with pitch control, slow it down, then speed it up to fit your time constraints in Audition. Stretching audio longer just sounds horrendous...

-Samich
 
> I've worked with both and appreciate the pros (which BOTH
> have) and am frustrated by the cons (which BOTH have).
>
> Audition trounces Pro Tools with it's ability to save mp3's
> quickly. Bouncing to disk in Pro Tools is a real drag.
>
> Audition's use of the two-button mouse is superior to the
> one-button environment of Pro Tools on a Mac.
>
> But one of the greatest things about Pro Tools is that it
> gives you lots of incentive to buy a Mac. The
> damned-near-zero-sound latency of a Mac trumps the heck out
> of sound delays of PC's--especially the discount PC's that
> most corporate radio stations are willing to buy. And Mac
> towers always arrive with high quality parts inside. Not so
> with bargain priced PC's.
>
> Another tip of the hat to Pro Tools: Its Time Compression
> plug-in is GREAT. Even Pro Tools FREE came with it.
> Meanwhile, Audition's price continues to rise and the Time
> Compression is horrible.
>
> In the message string below I noticed a complaint about
> crashes. My advice to EVERYONE on this board is to learn
> how to maintain your own computer. Don't depend on the I.T.
> Dept. to do it. It's been five years (and four I.T. people)
> since I've worked with someone who knew something about
> maintaining a computer whose primary function was digital
> editing. When a radio station interviews an I.T. person for
> a job, they make sure the person can maintain a Network and
> an e-mail server. But digital editing software is way
> beyond most I.T. peoples' expertise. We in the prod
> department pay the price.
>
> You should run frequent disk error checks and disk de-frags
> when running PC Audition. And Disk Warrior is your best
> friend when running Pro Tools on a Mac. There's no reason
> for computer crashes and freezes to be a part of your
> existence.
>



I love Pro tools, I own an Mbox at my home and I run it on a really high end PC, never had any problems with it. However, Pro tools wasn't designed to use for radio prodution, it was designed to be used in a recording studio. IE, recording and mixing msuic. The reason you have to bounce to disk in pro tools is because it gives recording engineers the option to plug in different hardware, IE, compressors, reverb units or whatever. Obvisouly if you are using hardware effects and not software, (hardware effects are so much better then sofware), then you can't just save a file, you have to play the entire song. What pro tools should do is come out with a "radio production" version of pro tools, it uses the same interface as pro tools, but its a little easier to use,and lets you save files directly without having to bounce to disk if they charge about the same price as audition, I think pro tools could own the market.


I use audition at the radio station, and I think its a great program, although I do wish it had some of the editing capabilities that pro tools has. The thing I hate the most is working on audition all day then going home and mixing some music in protools, i always hit all the wrong keys haha.
 
"i always hit all the wrong keys haha."

Kinda like switching back and forth between a mac and a PC. I always get messed up on that whole tab vs. enter thing.
 
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