August 2011 Ratings: The Sound, KLOS, KCBS, AMP

[flyonthewall]

The Sound is showing steady uptics all summer from a 1.8 in May to now, a 2.3 in August ppm's, which may be the station's best numbers yet! The Sound is now at # 15. KLOS tied for 12th spot with a 2.7. Cume, 1.783,200 to the Sound's 1.368.600 Cume. Pretty good showing for the Sound, not so good for KLOS. JACK is still the number one Classic Rock station with a 2.9, even if it is off from its 3.0 in July. And what a story AMP has become, beating KOST to land in the number three spot with a 4.4. Pretty spectacular for such a new format.
I am quite sure DE is going to blast me for this post, telling me to look at the demo's!

 

[LA_Guy]

Bonneville did say they were in it for the long haul and now that attitude just might pay off for them.

 

[davideduardo]

And what a story AMP has become, beating KOST to land in the number three spot with a 4.4. Pretty spectacular for such a new format.
I am quite sure DE is going to blast me for this post, telling me to look at the demo's!

Amp actually has the 0.1 less in 25-54 than it did in December, 2010. It's now 7th in the demo, while it was 6th in December.

KOST is 3rd in 25-54, moving down from second (KIIS is first) because KLVE had a TSL spike in August and moved into second.

As I've said many times: Arbitron gives away the 12+ numbers because they have no value.

 

[flyonthewall]

So DE, what are the key demos for KLOS vs The Sound and Jack vs KLOS and The Sound??

 

[davideduardo]

So DE, what are the key demos for KLOS vs The Sound and Jack vs KLOS and The Sound??

Here is the composition of each station in each of the age cells.
18-24 25-34 35-44 45-54 and 55-64
KLOS 7, 14, 14, 37, 22
KCBS 8, 21, 27, 23, 14
KSWD 4, 12, 21, 35, 22

This, the youngest average age is on Jack, while the oldest is KLOS, although KLOS and KSWD are almost too close to call.

 

[flyonthewall]

I guess the better question is what is KLOS' rating in 25-54 vs KCBS' rating in that age demo?

 

[davideduardo]

I guess the better question is what is KLOS' rating in 25-54 vs KCBS' rating in that age demo?

Jack is 6th, KLOS is 12th and KSWD is tied for 13th.

 

[justpassingthough]

We do seem to spend a lot of time on this board talking about stations (KLOS, KCBS and KSWD), that even within the demo they're trying to reach- don't do all that great.

Isn't the real story here that between KIIS and KAMP- CHR is much more dominant in 25-54 than any variety of classic hits or classic rock. I'm sure KPWR is less of a factor, but add that to KIIS and KAMP's showing in demo and they blow the combo of KCBS, KLOS and KSWD out of the water.

Its a real testament to the composition of the market and to the changes brought upon by PPM that the CHR stations are trouncing the classic rock/classic hits stations, even within their alleged demo.

 

[davideduardo]

Its a real testament to the composition of the market and to the changes brought upon by PPM that the CHR stations are trouncing the classic rock/classic hits stations, even within their alleged demo.

Demo targets are not "alleged." They are facts. Whether a station achieves their objectives is the subjective topic, not the target.

A discussion that includes a comparison of KIIS and KAMP with KLOS and KSWD and KCBS-FM must also include KROQ and KYSR and maybe the Spanish language CHR's, KXOS and KSSE. KROQ beats KCBS, and KYSR generally ties or beats KSWD.

CHR's are targeted at women 18-34. They have spillage into men and 35-44 and 12-17, but do very well in the younger half of 25-54. Stations like KRTH, KOST and KTWV do well in the older part of 25-54, and agencies doing buys will do reach and frequency analysis so as to not overduplicate one part of the demo while not getting impressions in another. So a broad 25-54 buy will have a number of stations and will likely have younger leaning, centered, and older leaning stations, as well as male and female leaning station buys.

Amp, by the way, does so well because, with a minimum of talk and well done music, it overindexes among Hispanics and it does that by getting a very nice number of Spanish dominants; two thirds of the listening comes from Hispanics and nearly half of those Hispanics are Spanish dominant. Less than 25% of the KROQ Hispanic listeners are Spanish dominant, and less than 40% of the total KROQ listening comes from Hispanics... so the performance issues have a lot to do with ethnicity and not age. KSWD can be seen to have, as would be expected with an AAA derivitive, the least Hispanic appeal, and KAMP the most within the array that your comparison suggests.

 

[davideduardo]

Isn't the real story here that between KIIS and KAMP- CHR is much more dominant in 25-54 than any variety of classic hits or classic rock. I'm sure KPWR is less of a factor, but add that to KIIS and KAMP's showing in demo and they blow the combo of KCBS, KLOS and KSWD out of the water.

The only classic hits stations in LA are KRTH and KRCD... both are tied for 10th in 25-54 with nearly 7 shares total. Power is part of the equation, with a 9th place showing... 0.2 behind KAMP and 0.3 behind KCBS.

Of course, introducing classic hits means you have to introduce KOST, KBIG and KLVE, and about 12 1/2 shares going to them, too.

 

[Gregg]

I see my favorite station The Wave is still top 10 in the 6+ numbers. They usually place in the top 5 25-54 and almost always top 5 for Women 25-54, a lucritive demo. At one time, The Wave was in the top 10 highest earning stations in the nation.

I hope they're still doing well in those 25-54 demos, David. I know they're not your cup of tea. But it is amazing how CBS has kept this format alive when it's just about disappeared outside of LA, San Diego and Phoenix.

I still don't know why more Smooth Jazz stations across the country didn't try some of what KTWV did, rather than throwing the baby out with the bathwater. I still think radio has too much of herd mentality. Everyone bailed out of the format within a few years rather than to move to a Rhythmic Soft AC format that still plays a few jazz instrumentals as The Wave has done.


Gregg
[email protected]

 

[davideduardo]

I see my favorite station The Wave is still top 10 in the 6+ numbers. They usually place in the top 5 25-54 and almost always top 5 for Women 25-54, a lucritive demo. At one time, The Wave was in the top 10 highest earning stations in the nation.

Tied for 13th in 25-54. Since PPM began, I do not think they have ever been in the top 10 25-54, and smooth jazz had them around 17th.

 

[flyonthewall]

Just passing through has hit a bullsyeye with that post! The real story of August PPM's is KAMP blowing past KOST to become number 3!!! And, Weatherly did that with KAMP in what, less than three years? That is huge and just passing through's point that CHR trounces Classic Rock, even in it's own demo, is another part of the REAL story.

Classic Rock, though I love it, is just not as big in the LA market as it was back when KLOS mattered and back in the glory days of KMET. I would not be surprised at all if Cumulus flips KLOS to something very different than Classic Rock. As David Has even said, KLOS is NOT aging gracefully. I have been sampling KLOS again this week and, besides playing Tom Sawyer and Fly Like An Eagle, every day, zzzz, it seems they have now taken a page from JACK because I rarely hear any of the DJ's speak. I did hear Gary Moore tonight... and he is very good even in the two minutes he gets to talk.
Too bad they are silencing their DJ's right before the takeover.. it would no doubt signal to Cumulus, they do not NEED any DJ's and even more heads will be on the Cumulus chopping block. Sad what has been allowed to happen at KLOS for those of us who listened when it was a powerhouse station.

 

[davideduardo]

That is huge and just passing through's point that CHR trounces Classic Rock, even in it's(sic) own demo, is another part of the REAL story.

Classic rock's demo is pretty much defined as 35-64, while CHR is principally 18-34. CHR does NOT trounce classic rock in "its own demo" as the demo targets are different.

Classic Rock, though I love it, is just not as big in the LA market as it was back when KLOS mattered and back in the glory days of KMET.

Of course, then it was called AOR or progressive rock, and the measurement system was totally different.

I would not be surprised at all if Cumulus flips KLOS to something very different than Classic Rock.

If the billings are holding, they will likely be delicate with this... there is no rush, and the station has a considerable cash flow.

I agree that it is unfortunate that they are putting adhesive tape on the mouths of the talent. KLOS has always enjoyed a certain fame (maybe not "World Famous" like another station that isn't world famous) for its overall style. But then again, I liked Jed the Fish, and he is gone too...

 

[flyonthewall]

I agree DE and this may be a first for us! It is sad what has happened at KLOS. The ones there, rightly, who have not been silenced are M&B and Jim Ladd, well maybe he has also been told not to talk too much. The station was never World Famous but there was a lot of great talent that went through there. Sad, really. They need to get some new blood over there, fast who understands the real heritage of the station, but now with Cumulus coming in, that train has left the station. Cumulus, like the current management of KLOS will not care about the station's heritage, if so Uncle Joe would be back in drive, but it was seemingly the current management? who demoted him to weekends, again, Sad.

 

[flyonthewall]

DE, you may not agree with me, but from what I hear Delicate and Cumulus are mutually exclusive. I make a wager that it is going to get ugly for KLOS and KABC. I doubt very much either of the PD's will make the cut. Like I said when I first started posting about this, it will be interesting to see if Cumulus holds on to Bob Moore, but they will not care that he has a 30 year history in the market, or will they?

 

[flyonthewall]

But then, it is Bob Moore who has allowed all the loss to the heritage of the station to go on for some time now.

 

[ChannelFlipper]

The real issue is that because of the ethnic make-up of this town and the aging demos for classic rock, the town can really only support one to two stations, and we have had three now for several years. Someone will lose by bowing out first, and the other remaining stations will divy up the shares. This is not a new phenomenon, it was true going back to the early 90's when KLSX was battling KLOS, and eventually flipped to all-talk.

 

[justpassingthough]

The real issue is that because of the ethnic make-up of this town and the aging demos for classic rock, the town can really only support one to two stations, and we have had three now for several years. Someone will lose by bowing out first, and the other remaining stations will divy up the shares. This is not a new phenomenon, it was true going back to the early 90's when KLSX was battling KLOS, and eventually flipped to all-talk.

Thanks for making my point better than I did! Its inevitable that the demos will one day force either KLOS, KSWD or KCBS to go in a different direction- like you said though- whomever jumps first stands to lose the most as the other two will most likely split their shares and take some of their billing. Whichever company takes the risk had better have a winning and/or safe format up their sleeve to stop the loss of revenue.

 

[AM FM listener]

I say KLOS will jump first. They'll keep Mark & Brian in the morning and go all Talk for the rest of the day. Sure, we had an FM talk station before (KLSX) and it went away but FM Talk (and News) is back in vogue and you know how these trends snowball. BTW, when KLOS goes all Talk, it will wake up the folks at CC to simulcast KFI somewhere on FM.