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B105 weird music

Rob...Do you listen to the radio with only one ear? Bon Jovi and Jennifer Nettles (from Sugarland) had a huge country hit "Who Says You Can't Go Home" that was on all of the country stations. Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow were on Country radio a couple years ago and he has a new song "All Summer Long" that samples "Sweet Home Alabama" and "Werewolves of London" just now hitting the Country charts. Jessica Simpson's now a Country singer, and by the way, former Hootie & the Blowfish leader Darius Rucker has a song on the Country chart called "Don't Think I Don't Think About It."

Rob, maybe you should start listening to the radio like a listener instead of a guy in his basement over analyzing everything. It might also help to read some radio and entertainment web sites once in a while to keep up on what's happening in the world.
 
Elephant said:
Rob...Do you listen to the radio with only one ear? Bon Jovi and Jennifer Nettles (from Sugarland) had a huge country hit "Who Says You Can't Go Home" that was on all of the country stations. Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow were on Country radio a couple years ago and he has a new song "All Summer Long" that samples "Sweet Home Alabama" and "Werewolves of London" just now hitting the Country charts. Jessica Simpson's now a Country singer, and by the way, former Hootie & the Blowfish leader Darius Rucker has a song on the Country chart called "Don't Think I Don't Think About It."

Rob, maybe you should start listening to the radio like a listener instead of a guy in his basement over analyzing everything. It might also help to read some radio and entertainment web sites once in a while to keep up on what's happening in the world.

Germaine Jackson sang on the "Opry" last Saturday! The world is going to hell in the proverbial handbasket. The purists don't like cross overs from other genre's going "country", remember the flap over Olivia Newton John? On the other hand country artists who bridge the gap into pop like Eddy Arnold and Ray Price for example are forgiven. A lot of early rock performers were previously country or others went into country like Jerry Lee Lewis. Myself I prefer to judge the material and performance before passing judgment and I still like pre-80's rock and almost any kind of country (Dixie Chicks excepted).
 
The "flap" over Olivia Newton John's crossover to the country charts in the 70's has nothing to do with what's happening today. People who listened to country music back then are WAY out of the demographic today. Heck, country radio will never be like it was in the 70's and earlier. The music evolved like the demographics did.

Sometimes the purists make me laugh. ::) I think B105 actually sounds better than ever and not because of Bon Jovi and Jennifer Nettles or Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow. The station sounds hip and fun right now even without 'em.
 
Elephant said:
Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow were on Country radio a couple years ago and he has a new song "All Summer Long" that samples "Sweet Home Alabama" and "Werewolves of London" just now hitting the Country charts. Jessica Simpson's now a Country singer.

"Picture" by Sheryl and Kid was a piece of crap then (it tested well which is why we spun it then and still do), and "All Summer Long" is just as big a pile today. He's getting play on country radio because...that's a good question. I've asked around and it's being blamed on MD's following the flock that got something free out of the spins (yes, that's still going on). As for Jessica Simpson, that's another pile of steam from someone's ____! It's a name the young demo recognizes (hello Juilanne Hough who is the breader of another crap song I might add). But, with B's core being 40+ for the last few years they're making an effort to build their audience again, which is easy now that they own their only competition and can dictate what they play on each and rationalize why to Nashville and not get "penalized" for it.

Now, don't accuse me of being out of touch. I get what's played and why and I have also followed the flock when it comes to playing hit songs. We all do. I just wish country wouldn't keep adopting these artists that have been on TV or have been in the tabs a lot. It used to be the steak not the sizzle that mattered in Nashville, now it's the other way around. Country music's superstars aren't getting younger and some (hello Toby, Brooks and Dunn, Faith and Tim) are far crys from where they once were. Nashville has done a horrible job at trying to bring up a new crop of superstars. This is like Top 40 in the late 80s-early 90s, but with "reality" TV fueling it.
 
ChipHilton said:
The "flap" over Olivia Newton John's crossover to the country charts in the 70's has nothing to do with what's happening today. People who listened to country music back then are WAY out of the demographic today. Heck, country radio will never be like it was in the 70's and earlier. The music evolved like the demographics did.

Sometimes the purists make me laugh. ::) I think B105 actually sounds better than ever and not because of Bon Jovi and Jennifer Nettles or Kid Rock and Sheryl Crow. The station sounds hip and fun right now even without 'em.

It was the same thing just a different time with the same song. Each generation has what they believe is "true" country, for me it's Lefty and Hank Sr., Red Foley, Ernest Tubb, and so on. How much of those guys do you hear now? I also enjoy some more recent stuff and my point was in response to the original comments that started this thread. I am willing to listen to anything but I don't have to enjoy it, however what I personally enjoy is not driving the playlists of country radio. I do happen to be on the survey group for a local station so if enough people like me were to turn thumbs down, then we could make an impression but it takes a lot to do it effectively. If the purists are just grumpy old men then they are peeing into the wind, not gonna make a difference, except they'll be wetter. There should be room for all tastes sometime someplace.

The problem for purists is that there are people out there performing their music but getting it onto records and on the air is difficult. There are a few good classic country stations and DJ's so I get what I want in that vein on the web. You people there in Ohio are lucky to have some right in your backyard so turn off B105 and spin the dial or click that link to hear what you want.
 
cold_coffee said:
Willie Nelson recently made a new recording with Snoop Dogg. Should this be added too?

There are lines that will not be crossed.
 
You know, I've been in and out of country radio since 1974, so I think I can speak on this from a historical perspective.

A lot of people were extremely critical of Eddy Arnold when he recorded "Make The World Go Away" in 1965. Why? It had strings, instead of a steel guitar on it. It was too "pop", too "cosmopolitan". The same brush painted Glen Campbell when he released "By The Time I Get To Phoenix". Anne Murray's "Snowbird" was questioned by hard-core country partisans as to why country radio should play it, because of it's orchestration.

I was told in 1980 that Alabama would be "the death of country music". Why? "They're a rock group", said the listeners..."they're not country". How much criticism did Hank Williams, Jr. get when he started adding ZZ Top songs to his live sets? "Why doesn't he play his daddy's music?", they said.

Country music tends to act like a pendulum...it swings contemporary...then eventually swings traditional and back again.

Usually, country gets real popular during a contemporary swing...especially so now that Pop Music is basically brain dead, having been co-opted by MTV and it's desire to make everything "edgy". Mostly hip hop and/or hard rock. It doesn't surprise me that many pop songwriters have moved to Nashville. Record sales have tended, historically speaking to fall off during a swing to "traditional". (The last swing backward I can recall was pre-1989 when the country music industry was reported by the New York Times to have been at death's door. I think that overstated it a bit, but not a lot of albums were being sold then.)

Why don't you hear "legends" on mainstream country stations today? Why are traditional oldies stations going away? The legend acts tend to appeal, primarily, to 50 plusers. (Yeah, I know you can find me a 17 year old somewhere with Haggard blaring out his pickup speakers...but they are the exceptions and, generally, not the rule.) Also, (and perhaps more important), country radio has swung from being a male dominated format to a female dominated format..that too, has caused there to be "less twang" and a greater emphasis on youth, songwriting and production values. (Guys...you can blame the estrogen there if you want.)

Bon Jovi's record with Jennifer Nettles from Sugarland? It was #1 on every country chart I saw. Why wouldn't a station that finds their audience likes such a song play it?

Sure...be on the survey group for your local station. But, remember, they're focused on demographics, too.
100 percent of, say (and I'm only using this as an example) 50 plus men say they don't like today's music.
Guess what? You're not "in demo"...and your survey is likely to be deleted from the sample.

Who do you blame for this? The advertisers...most of whom use mediums other than radio to advertise to that audience.

Should there be "room for all tastes"? There already is. They're called CD players, i-Pods, satellite radio (around now, but still nowhere close to profitablity, even after the merger), and (if it gets off the ground) maybe some HD-2 channels.

You guys are making the same arguments 1950's fanatics are making when they complain about traditional oldies going away. What radio programs is in response to the audience advertisers tell them they want. If you are not part of the audience the advertisers want, don't expect radio to program to your tastes.

That is, admittedly, the problem with radio being a "for profit" enterprise. And, I've stated before on these boards I do not, and will not apologize for radio being a business.

By the way, I do agree reality TV's effect on the music business so far is touch and go with developing artists with staying power. Carrie Underwood is, of course, one such exception. We'll just have to see.

Everything has it's day. And for some acts, those days have passed. That doesn't mean those great artists still with us can't go on doing their shows and singing their hits. I hope they do for many years to come. But, if they can't garner the appeal of the audience radio needs to make money, the rest is elementary.
 
Here's my question: what makes it "country"? If it's not the artist, the subject matter, the demo listening, the SOUND -- what makes a song a country song? Is it that the artist puts a cowboy hat on when he sings a song?

I contend there is no authentic "country" music any more, that it's all in the marketing (and the hat).
 
BobointheH20 said:
Here's my question: what makes it "country"? If it's not the artist, the subject matter, the demo listening, the SOUND -- what makes a song a country song? Is it that the artist puts a cowboy hat on when he sings a song?

I contend there is no authentic "country" music any more, that it's all in the marketing (and the hat).

Country is: life. A story to tell. Well written lyrics and music. Feeling. That's why songs like "The Dance" or "Live Like You Were Dying" were hits. Songs the listener can relate to. That's what differentiates country from the crap that's called pop today. Frankly, whether it's "authentic" or not, is not for us to say. You have your definition. Others have theirs.

At the end of day: country is what the listeners who buy the music and listen to the radio say it is. It's not for DJ's or programmers to determine.
 
Jason Roberts said:
BobointheH20 said:
Here's my question: what makes it "country"? If it's not the artist, the subject matter, the demo listening, the SOUND -- what makes a song a country song? Is it that the artist puts a cowboy hat on when he sings a song?

I contend there is no authentic "country" music any more, that it's all in the marketing (and the hat).

Country is: life. A story to tell. Well written lyrics and music. Feeling. That's why songs like "The Dance" or "Live Like You Were Dying" were hits. Songs the listener can relate to. That's what differentiates country from the crap that's called pop today. Frankly, whether it's "authentic" or not, is not for us to say. You have your definition. Others have theirs.

At the end of day: country is what the listeners who buy the music and listen to the radio say it is. It's not for DJ's or programmers to determine.

Thanks Jason, somebody gets it!

Like I said though there are some Classic Country and "Legends" stations out there which stream and in your area are a couple of good ones. I believe that in fact Classic Country may be a bit better represented than Classic Rock or Golden Oldies and we know that Adult Standards is nearly gone. That may also be the reason for the move by real adults to Country and the fact that the music is changing away from the puristic tastes. New ears equals new expectations.
 
WBZI/WKFI/WEDI do a good job with the Classic Country format. I guess WPFB (AM) is running it again too, but I'm not sure if they stream.
 
Jason Roberts makes reading this site worthwhile.

If R-I ever does a "best post ever" contest this will be my nomination...


Jason Roberts said:
You know, I've been in and out of country radio since 1974, so I think I can speak on this from a historical perspective.

A lot of people were extremely critical of Eddy Arnold when he recorded "Make The World Go Away" in 1965. Why? It had strings, instead of a steel guitar on it. It was too "pop", too "cosmopolitan". The same brush painted Glen Campbell when he released "By The Time I Get To Phoenix". Anne Murray's "Snowbird" was questioned by hard-core country partisans as to why country radio should play it, because of it's orchestration.

I was told in 1980 that Alabama would be "the death of country music". Why? "They're a rock group", said the listeners..."they're not country". How much criticism did Hank Williams, Jr. get when he started adding ZZ Top songs to his live sets? "Why doesn't he play his daddy's music?", they said.

Country music tends to act like a pendulum...it swings contemporary...then eventually swings traditional and back again.

Usually, country gets real popular during a contemporary swing...especially so now that Pop Music is basically brain dead, having been co-opted by MTV and it's desire to make everything "edgy". Mostly hip hop and/or hard rock. It doesn't surprise me that many pop songwriters have moved to Nashville. Record sales have tended, historically speaking to fall off during a swing to "traditional". (The last swing backward I can recall was pre-1989 when the country music industry was reported by the New York Times to have been at death's door. I think that overstated it a bit, but not a lot of albums were being sold then.)

Why don't you hear "legends" on mainstream country stations today? Why are traditional oldies stations going away? The legend acts tend to appeal, primarily, to 50 plusers. (Yeah, I know you can find me a 17 year old somewhere with Haggard blaring out his pickup speakers...but they are the exceptions and, generally, not the rule.) Also, (and perhaps more important), country radio has swung from being a male dominated format to a female dominated format..that too, has caused there to be "less twang" and a greater emphasis on youth, songwriting and production values. (Guys...you can blame the estrogen there if you want.)

Bon Jovi's record with Jennifer Nettles from Sugarland? It was #1 on every country chart I saw. Why wouldn't a station that finds their audience likes such a song play it?

Sure...be on the survey group for your local station. But, remember, they're focused on demographics, too.
100 percent of, say (and I'm only using this as an example) 50 plus men say they don't like today's music.
Guess what? You're not "in demo"...and your survey is likely to be deleted from the sample.

Who do you blame for this? The advertisers...most of whom use mediums other than radio to advertise to that audience.

Should there be "room for all tastes"? There already is. They're called CD players, i-Pods, satellite radio (around now, but still nowhere close to profitablity, even after the merger), and (if it gets off the ground) maybe some HD-2 channels.

You guys are making the same arguments 1950's fanatics are making when they complain about traditional oldies going away. What radio programs is in response to the audience advertisers tell them they want. If you are not part of the audience the advertisers want, don't expect radio to program to your tastes.

That is, admittedly, the problem with radio being a "for profit" enterprise. And, I've stated before on these boards I do not, and will not apologize for radio being a business.

By the way, I do agree reality TV's effect on the music business so far is touch and go with developing artists with staying power. Carrie Underwood is, of course, one such exception. We'll just have to see.

Everything has it's day. And for some acts, those days have passed. That doesn't mean those great artists still with us can't go on doing their shows and singing their hits. I hope they do for many years to come. But, if they can't garner the appeal of the audience radio needs to make money, the rest is elementary.
 
tcsnrayp said:
Jason Roberts makes reading this site worthwhile.

Jason Roberts said:
I just said his post in this thread was on target with what's happening. I will never say everything he's posted found the mark, but we've all done that...don't take offense, Jason. We are an objective business, which not only makes it great, but it's also why the newbies trying to make it fail a lot of times. Mom and dad and their, "my baby is the best, most perfect person who never does anything wrong" doesn't translate into a PD's office and a swift kick in the head when something stupid is done on their station. It's almost like they all of a sudden realize they aren't special and perfect and they take their ball and go home.
 
First of all: thank you for the kind comments. I am honored.

Nope, I realize I'm not right 100% of the time. I'm lucky if I'm right, or make a valid point 50% of the time.
And I take no offense at anyone's comments here.

I guess my whole point in making the comments I made was: I've now heard this "country's not country anymore" argument for about 35 years. I respect the feelings of the people who have that viewpoint, but c'mon...as I stated, in 1965, hardcore country partisans were asking why Eddy Arnold couldn't still do songs like "that lonesome Cattle Call". So, if today's hardcore partisans are gonna slam Kenny Chesney, Sugarland, Shania Twain, Trace Adkins, Toby Keith or whoever, they need (in order to be intellectually honest here) to also be slamming Eddy Arnold, Glen Campbell, Roy Clark, Alabama and the others, all of which who have, at one time or another in their careers been painted with the "they're not truly country" brush.

On country lyrics: many of the biggest country songs have always been ones, the lyrics of which touch emotions. Examples:

"Did you ever see a robin weep? When leaves begin to die. That means he's lost the will to live. I'm so lonesome I could cry."

"I was in my early 40's, with a lot of life before me, when a moment came that stopped me on a dime. I spent most of the next days, lookin' at the X-rays, talkin' 'bout "the options" and talkin' 'bout sweet time."

Two songs that were recorded, what? 60...70 years apart? But both speak to life and things which people can relate to. That's what makes a good country song. It's the feeling. It grabs you...puts that lump in your throat. And it can be done whether the song is heavy with steel guitar or not.

I feel priveleged to know some of today's songwriters. I wish to God a little of them could rub off on me, so I could write a song that would let me retire comfortably in a decade or so...

I've often wondered what might have happened had Hank Williams not died such a young man. Had he lived to see more modern day multi-track recording techniques. As innovative a songwriter as he was...what might have happened if he could have recorded with 24 or 36 tracks?

I've also thought the same thing about Buddy Holly.

And before someone says it: I too well know country has its' novelty records. So does pop. For every "Tennesee Bird Walk" or "You're The Reason Our Kids Are Ugly", there's a "Barbie Girl".
 
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