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BARIX AND STL

C

ChiefOperator

Folks,

Recently, I read the Radio-Guide article, as well as previous posts, regarding Barix boxes used for an STL. Now that these boxes are becoming more common, Im curious how many are using these as the PRIMARY STL. I'm especially interested in the reliability as well the ability of processors to handle the MP3 feed.

Finally, If one uses the same provider (such as AT&T) for DSL at both the studio and transmitter sites, would the feed remain off the public Internet? Would this be considered *almost* a QoS configuration?

I ask because an AM is looking at alternatives to its equalized program loop.

Thanks!
 
From the hands-on I've seen with one station, it works from fair to not-too-good. No fault of the Barix hardware as it's more of a crap shoot on the path you get from your internet service provider. Net congestion will absolutely ruin your day. Unless your ISP can give you a dedicated connection between your studio and transmitter I would say it's only really good as a backup solution unless you have a stellar ISP with little to no congestion.
 
Generally speaking if both lines are from the same provider you will avoid the internet, though there is no guarantee.

However since this ISP bandwidth is still shared with many other users there is still significant contention. A far cry from a link with QoS.

For more on IP audio check out our guide, here:

http://www.aptx.com/Admin/Editor/Assets/PDF/IP Audio Networking.pdf

Best regards,

Rolf Taylor

APT North America

www.aptx.com

ChiefOperator said:
Folks,

Recently, I read the Radio-Guide article, as well as previous posts, regarding Barix boxes used for an STL. Now that these boxes are becoming more common, Im curious how many are using these as the PRIMARY STL. I'm especially interested in the reliability as well the ability of processors to handle the MP3 feed.

Finally, If one uses the same provider (such as AT&T) for DSL at both the studio and transmitter sites, would the feed remain off the public Internet? Would this be considered *almost* a QoS configuration?

I ask because an AM is looking at alternatives to its equalized program loop.

Thanks!
Click to expand...
 
It varies...

For best results, you really need to have the same ISP on both ends. You also have to have at least TWICE the cable or DSL speed that the circuit claims to have. Remember that USA Internet is GROSSLY assymetrical (5:1 or worse), and at the send end it's the UPLOAD bandwidth that matters (one cable provider has 8 megs down, but only 384 k up). Remember that cable or DSL is a best effort service-the stated speeds are NOT guaranteed! Low packet loss is essential too.

If you follow the rules you will have a great sounding, stable circuit. If you don't, you will fail miserably. My experience is that about 98% of the problems we have encountered are Internet or network ones, 1% are failures during firmware updates, and 1% are the units themselves.

I just cut a large radio on TV network over to Barix. They had six 15kHz analog lines to their uplink (20 miles from their studio). Since their studio is in Verizon land and their uplink in AT&T country, the lines all went to the TOC in Hollywood, a HUGE dog leg-and a service nightmare. We put in Covad T1 lines at both locations and eight Barix Instreamers and Exstreamers. Not only did the quality go way up (and they went stereo), but their costs dropped by over 4000 dollars a month. Also, we now have a single point of contact (Covad) who monitors the T1s 24/7 for us (it costs an extra 200 dollars a month, and the savings stated above has its cost built into it). They also now have two spare circuits for expansion.

T1s by themselves are really cheap now-under 400 dollars a month. If your circuit is mission critical, this is the way to go.
 
That first sentance should have read: You need to have twice the speed that the Barix claims to need, In other words if you are streaming out at 192 kBps, you need a 384 kBps upload MINIMUM. This Internet connection should not be shared-it should only be used by the Barix-unless you want your station to go off the air because the DJ is running a p2p program.
 
I'm running Barix as my main STL/TSL from my studio in Alabama to my transmitter site about 25 miles away in Georgia. There are different internet companies at both locations. So far, I have excellent sounding audio both ways with no problems. I do have back-up programming at the transmitter site that will kick in if the net goes down and switch back to the studio feed when the link is re-established.

I plan to use Barix to replace the STL at a couple of other stations I contract for when I can.

Tom Smith, OM/CE
WCOQ-FM
Colquitt, GA
 
We were looking at the Barix units for a UK project, but the documentation doesn't really answer a question I've had for a while: Does the RS232 data appear in-sync with the audio - Can you actually send data alongside the audio so if a remote studio wanted to control our playout software without sub-aubile/DTMF tones, could we do it with a Barix ?
 
It sounds like LA Guy and Tom have had some great luck with the Barix units. I like them as well even though it didn't work out at the station I saw them at (a non-comm FM feeding an aux site). While both sites were on the same ISP they were using upper-end DSL service at both ends I would have to assume it was the traffic on their circuits. There was talk about separating the station's circuit onto it's own sub-network but from what I was told it never panned out. I don't know if they resolved these problems or they went back to a telco circuit.
 
We use Barix at WXXY radio in Delaware and New Jersey. We have Comcast on one end and Verizon on the other and they work fine at 128kb stereo feed.
 
All--Thanks for the replies.

For an AM, would the Barix at MP3 give significant better sound quality than an equalized program loop? Also, how do the audio processors handle the MP3 streams. I've heard that they don't process MP3 well. Any truth to that?

THANKS!
 
ChiefOperator said:
All--Thanks for the replies.

For an AM, would the Barix at MP3 give significant better sound quality than an equalized program loop? Also, how do the audio processors handle the MP3 streams. I've heard that they don't process MP3 well. Any truth to that?

THANKS!
Click to expand...

I've been using Barix boxes for well over two years in a variety of applications. They sound very good. Obviously, higher bitrates sound better than lower ones. I suspect that for AM, even a 64 kbs mono stream would be adequate. Like most digital encode/decode systems, artifacts are more noticeable on human voice than they are on music, so some of your sonic success will depend on format. They do require at least twice the bandwidth of the audio stream to be reliable. That means if you use a 64 kbs stream, you will need at least 128 kbs uplink capabilities. If you have enough bandwidth, you can run them "wide open" and I think you will be more than pleased with the results.

Since you are talking about using them for AM, you might want to take the first step of rolling off anything over 9 KHz before it hits the Instreamer. There is no point in asking it to process audio that will be discarded later.

In my experience, the problem (if any) is not with sonic quality, but with the two units talking to each other over a public Internet connection. That is a variable that is hard to predict. I have used them on a private 5.6 GHz link and they worked well beyond my expectations. Of course, there was no other traffic on the connection. The first time somebody who is sharing your bandwidth decides to download "Debbie Does Dallas," all bets are off. I suspect that would be the same with any codec, not just the Barix units.

For the money, they are hard to beat.
 
We have several unlicensed IP Radios (orthogon) connected using Axia Analog nodes. Works great. Getting 8 stereo channels bidirectionally. Check out
www.axiaaudio.com
 
ChiefOperator said:
All--Thanks for the replies.

For an AM, would the Barix at MP3 give significant better sound quality than an equalized program loop? Also, how do the audio processors handle the MP3 streams. I've heard that they don't process MP3 well. Any truth to that?

THANKS!
Click to expand...


At a Cable radio network, I just replaced six 15 kHz loops with two T1s and Barixes. We are running 80 kbps mono MPEG-2 streams. The network's owner reports that they are receiving compliments on how much better things sound from listeners. Not to mention that their line charges dropped from $5600.00 a month to under a grand-including 200 dollars a month for 24/7 proactive monitoring of the t1s by the ISP (Covad). He also has the bandwidth to go stereo on all 6 networks once he upgrades some studio equipment (digital delays, etc.) from mono.
 
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