Bellavia's New Show on WBEN

[fybush]

Would you have put Rush Limbaugh on WWKB between Alan Colmes and Randi Rhodes? Why were there no local left leaning hosts on that station?

Because, as has been beaten to death here, WWKB isn't a "radio station" as we typically understand it. Since the moment the oldies stopped playing, it has functioned purely and exclusively as a blocker. As long as Entercom has it and is doing something minimal with it, nobody else can use it to compete against the big guns, WBEN and now WGR. The object is not to get ratings, and it's certainly not to spend any money doing anything local on the air or investing in any promotion. Any revenue that does show up, mainly from leasing time for Bisons games, is gravy. What makes WWKB "a success" is simply that it's not being used by someone else to draw listeners or revenue away from WBEN and WGR.

 

[flybynight]

Because, as has been beaten to death here, WWKB isn't a "radio station" as we typically understand it. Since the moment the oldies stopped playing, it has functioned purely and exclusively as a blocker. As long as Entercom has it and is doing something minimal with it, nobody else can use it to compete against the big guns, WBEN and now WGR. The object is not to get ratings, and it's certainly not to spend any money doing anything local on the air or investing in any promotion. Any revenue that does show up, mainly from leasing time for Bisons games, is gravy. What makes WWKB "a success" is simply that it's not being used by someone else to draw listeners or revenue away from WBEN and WGR.

Thanks for explaining that. I was literally halfway through a similar explanation when I finally just closed the browser out of frustration in having to explain, for the 1,000th time, why these superficial notions of why talk radio sounds the way it does today are so misguided.

I don't know if it's motivated by partisan bias or just a lack of historical knowledge of the evolution of the format, but it's amazing how many people are simply looking at talkradio the way it is today---and apparently just guessing as to how it got that way. In a nutshell, it gives us a look at how unlikely it is to change, considering how many of today's programmers think the same way as that poster.

Turning a radio station into a political/ideological echo chamber is short-sighted. Many programmers knew that 10-15 years ago, but did it anyway.

 

[SirRoxalot]

Turning a radio station into a political/ideological echo chamber is short-sighted. Many programmers knew that 10-15 years ago, but did it anyway.

I'm not a fan of WBEN. They've decimated their news department, and are a mere shadow of what they once were. That being said, I have to point out that over 15 years in the same format - successfully - is a pretty good run in radio these days. It's pretty hard to label that as "short-sighted".

 

[flybynight]

I'm not a fan of WBEN. They've decimated their news department, and are a mere shadow of what they once were. That being said, I have to point out that over 15 years in the same format - successfully - is a pretty good run in radio these days. It's pretty hard to label that as "short-sighted".

Many of these stations have done okay IN SPITE of the echo chamber, not because of it. Many, like myself, listen for news and other service elements and struggle to find something listenable amongst all the ideological swill. Again, let's not confuse ratings victory due to great programming and ratings victory because of a post-Telecom manipulation of all viable AM signals in the market. WBEN wouldn't be getting the credit you so generously give them if WGR had remained an actual competitor. This is anything but a demonstration of the free marketplace.

And there's a reason the format is in decline ratings-wise, and it ain't all because of the AM band either. That's where the short-sightedness comes in. These type stations didn't have to blow off or alienate average newstalk listeners. They made a lazy miscalculation that has the format hurtling toward sellable demographic oblivion because the image that precedes talkradio now is godawful...deservedly so.

 

[TheBigA]

And there's a reason the format is in decline ratings-wise, and it ain't all because of the AM band either. That's where the short-sightedness comes in.

I think if you look fairly at every market in this country, most cities can only support a couple of AM stations. In fact there are lots of big cities like DC that don't have any AM stations in the Top 10. I have no reason to believe if Entercom sold WWKB to another owner it would spend the money to hire a full local staff, and attempt to compete with either WBEN or WGR. The only other company spending money on staff now is CBS, and they already left Buffalo. My view is Buffalonians should be happy these stations are owned by Entercom and not Clear Channel or Cumulus.

 

[flybynight]

My view is Buffalonians should be happy these stations are owned by Entercom and not Clear Channel or Cumulus.

There it is. The post-Telecom rationalization:

Be happy with a ridiculous situation because it could've been even worse.

 

[TheBigA]

There it is. The post-Telecom rationalization:

Be happy with a ridiculous situation because it could've been even worse.

As I said earlier in the thread, we live in the real world, not the past. If you want to live in the past, you need to ask yourself what happened to all the people who used to live in Buffalo. Why isn't it as big a city as it once was? That population, that industry, and that money once made radio as it was then possible. Now it's gone. Why should radio operate now as though Buffalo is still a major market?

 

[flybynight]

As I said earlier in the thread, we live in the real world, not the past. If you want to live in the past, you need to ask yourself what happened to all the people who used to live in Buffalo. Why isn't it as big a city as it once was? That population, that industry, and that money once made radio as it was then possible. Now it's gone. Why should radio operate now as though Buffalo is still a major market?

So only poor, shrinking radio cities are experiencing this kind of circumvention of the free market?

 

[umtrr-author]

...and non-partisan listeners wouldn't listen to ANY of it.

I resemble that remark...

 

[TheBigA]

So only poor, shrinking radio cities are experiencing this kind of circumvention of the free market?

Since when has the free market been circumvented?

My point is that Buffalo is not the same city it was 25 years ago. Lots of things have changed, in Buffalo and the entire media landscape. So to tell me how radio was then doesn't matter. As I said earlier, I have no reason to believe things would be any different even if Entercom sold KB to someone else. Because there's no reason to believe the new owner would hire a live & local staff of talk hosts who'd do "interesting conversation."

 

[flybynight]

Since when has the free market been circumvented?

My point is that Buffalo is not the same city it was 25 years ago. Lots of things have changed, in Buffalo and the entire media landscape. So to tell me how radio was then doesn't matter. As I said earlier, I have no reason to believe things would be any different even if Entercom sold KB to someone else. Because there's no reason to believe the new owner would hire a live & local staff of talk hosts who'd do "interesting conversation."

Can you turn the clock back 15-17 years and use a crystal ball to see what might've been had there not been total manipulation post-Telecom? That's the only way your post has any veracity.

The fact is, you cannot honestly say things would've worked out the same way, because during that timeframe, that frequency was killed off permanently by being used as a radio pylon.

 

[TheBigA]

Can you turn the clock back 15-17 years and use a crystal ball to see what might've been had there not been total manipulation post-Telecom? That's the only way your post has any veracity.

I don't care about "what might have been." I was in radio in the 90s, and things were going to change regardless. The changes began in the 80s.

Let me ask you this: Was anyone in Buffalo doing 24/7 sports talk in 1995? Do you really think, given what we see with aging demos in talk and the amount of money to be made with sports that an owner would rather compete against WBEN with talk than sports?

 

[flybynight]

I don't care about "what might have been." I was in radio in the 90s, and things were going to change regardless. The changes began in the 80s.

Let me ask you this: Was anyone in Buffalo doing 24/7 sports talk in 1995? Do you really think, given what we see with aging demos in talk and the amount of money to be made with sports that an owner would rather compete against WBEN with talk than sports?

Had anyone bothered to try and appeal to listeners who weren't stuffy old white guys, we likely wouldn't see such a dire situation for the future of talk. Instead, they niched it even further: stuffy, old, far-right-wing white guys.

A format so eagerly surrendered to an oncoming demo apocalypse.

 

[TheBigA]

Had anyone bothered to try and appeal to listeners who weren't stuffy old white guys, we likely wouldn't see such a dire situation for the future of talk.

Lots of people have tried to appeal to other folks. Ever hear Howard Stern? Nothing old or stuffy about him.

 

[flybynight]

Lots of people have tried to appeal to other folks. Ever hear Howard Stern? Nothing old or stuffy about him.

And he had a massive audience on OTA radio, crossing all demos. Stern is interesting and engaging, something you hear very little of on today's ideological talkradio echo chamber.

 

[dand5780]

David Bellavia show in progress. Excellent show. Three callers so far and no stuffy old men. A woman, young man, and middle age man.

 

[dand5780]

Great show so far. Three callers and no stuffy old men. A woman, middle aged man, and young man.

 

[TheBigA]

And he had a massive audience on OTA radio, crossing all demos. Stern is interesting and engaging, something you hear very little of on today's ideological talkradio echo chamber.

Then again, he wasn't on AM radio. Have you ever listened to talk on FM? Have you tried Sirius? Public radio? Have you looked beyond ancient modulation? Tried tuning in stations via web streams from other cities? There's a lot going on out there.

 

[flybynight]

Then again, he wasn't on AM radio. Have you ever listened to talk on FM? Have you tried Sirius? Public radio? Have you looked beyond ancient modulation? Tried tuning in stations via web streams from other cities? There's a lot going on out there.

As a matter of fact, Stern was on KB (AM radio) into the mid 90's and was the last person to get respectable numbers there before ETM killed it for good. Know your history before spouting off.

Sure there are plenty of other options---ALL of them more of a hassle (or expense) to access compared to the easy-as-pie, over-the-air radio, which is what we're discussing. Don't deflect.

 

[TheBigA]

Sure there are plenty of other options---ALL of them more of a hassle (or expense) to access compared to the easy-as-pie, over-the-air radio, which is what we're discussing. Don't deflect.

Public radio is more of an expense or hassle? Really?