BEST PROCESSED ***AM*** MUSIC STATIONS IN DFW

[Jay Walker]

BEST PROCESSED AM MUSIC STATIONS

Music on AM is such a rarity these days I thought I'd do a little critical listening around the DFW dial and see who I felt had the best sounding AM audio processing.
Audio processing is my field of study and I have played with pretty much every broadcast processor around for the last 40 years on AM and FM. That said...

My favorites in order and why are:

Soul 73:
Nice tight dense processing. Not too bright, or too fat just right for the format.
Has that classic 70's AM sound minus the heavy clipping of the era. Cuts well through the power line noise.

KGAF Gainsville:
Nice fat full sound, dense but not crunched handles transitions well and a wide variety of music styles. Just a hint of reverb for seasoning. Talent mixes well over the ramps and transitions are smooth.

KPYK Terrill:
Full dense, sometimes a little bassy on some songs but real loud. Makes that 250w transmitter sound as loud as some of the 50k AMs. The processing handles the extreme range of musical styles they play from the 30's through today.

KGVL Greenville:
A little too light for my taste. Does not seem to handle wide volume errors by board ops and has a tendency to "fall off the dial" at times. It is clean and has a nice EQ curve but at the expense of loudness and ease of listening. The bandwidth is nice, but to my ear it could use an extra 3db of compression and get a little deeper into the limiter to keep the audio above the power line noise.


KFXR Dallas:
Sad to say it is wimpy and weak whether from the 50K in Irving or the 5K in Rockwall. It's a shame too as when I had it, both as a talker and as KLUV oldies it sounded pretty competitive even though we only had an Optimod 9100B. The addition of a DBX at the studio to protect the telco lines made a nice improvement on the signal and gave it that AM fullness it needed.
It could use a little TLC...

KAAM Garland:
Used to be pretty good, a little light at times but during the McCoy programming era it sound pretty competitive. Now not so much...

I listen on a wide range of receivers from the Hammerlund HQ-120/129, National NC240, Kenwood R-1000 and Kenwood R-2000. Antennas are 160m loops, shielded loops, and long wires.

What do you hear?

Jay Walker

 

[metroneck]

Short of the big 3 (bap/klif/KRLD) winning the best sound of this conversation, I very much conquer with your assessment. I hear KAAM has better clarity than you're reporting, but 1190 sounds more like a RIM than a local 50kW. 1310 has good depth, but obviously a static problem. KKDA gets out there for what it is, they don't thin it out too much, but just enough to get the reach out of the min power. I figure with Beck and Savage, 1190 would get their stuff together, and make a presence. I grew up on that signal, hard to believe no one has been able to make it gin since the Scotsman left the helm.

 

[Jay Walker]

Short of the big 3 (bap/klif/KRLD) winning the best sound of this conversation, I very much conquer with your assessment. I hear KAAM has better clarity than you're reporting, but 1190 sounds more like a RIM than a local 50kW. 1310 has good depth, but obviously a static problem. KKDA gets out there for what it is, they don't thin it out too much, but just enough to get the reach out of the min power. I figure with Beck and Savage, 1190 would get their stuff together, and make a presence. I grew up on that signal, hard to believe no one has been able to make it gin since the Scotsman left the helm.

I did not include the news/talkers in my dial scan but of the news/talk stations I like KRLD-AM. KRLD has a nice EQ curve even with the bandwidth reduction on the analog signal due to the needs of IBOC. WBAP seems to me, since the move, to have lost their unique sonic signature they had from back in the Gary McNamara days..even with the bandwidth setting back to pre-IBOC

 

[unclepudd]

Some long time listeners might remember KRLD 1080 in the 70's when they programmed morning/afternoon news blocks and "The Gentle Sound" of music mid-days. They utilized eleven different processors/equalizers,etc. to get the sound. Only problem was the CE who set it up kept no notes and KRLD later discovered if any one of the pieces of equipment was removed the sound was lost. It gave both voice and music a presence I have not heard since which, at the time, was as good or better than a lot of FM's.

 

[RADIO TRUTH]

BEST PROCESSED AM MUSIC STATIONS

Music on AM is such a rarity these days I thought I'd do a little critical listening around the DFW dial and see who I felt had the best sounding AM audio processing.
Audio processing is my field of study and I have played with pretty much every broadcast processor around for the last 40 years on AM and FM. That said...

My favorites in order and why are:

Soul 73:
Nice tight dense processing. Not too bright, or too fat just right for the format.
Has that classic 70's AM sound minus the heavy clipping of the era. Cuts well through the power line noise.

KGAF Gainsville:
Nice fat full sound, dense but not crunched handles transitions well and a wide variety of music styles. Just a hint of reverb for seasoning. Talent mixes well over the ramps and transitions are smooth.

KPYK Terrill:
Full dense, sometimes a little bassy on some songs but real loud. Makes that 250w transmitter sound as loud as some of the 50k AMs. The processing handles the extreme range of musical styles they play from the 30's through today.

KGVL Greenville:
A little too light for my taste. Does not seem to handle wide volume errors by board ops and has a tendency to "fall off the dial" at times. It is clean and has a nice EQ curve but at the expense of loudness and ease of listening. The bandwidth is nice, but to my ear it could use an extra 3db of compression and get a little deeper into the limiter to keep the audio above the power line noise.


KFXR Dallas:
Sad to say it is wimpy and weak whether from the 50K in Irving or the 5K in Rockwall. It's a shame too as when I had it, both as a talker and as KLUV oldies it sounded pretty competitive even though we only had an Optimod 9100B. The addition of a DBX at the studio to protect the telco lines made a nice improvement on the signal and gave it that AM fullness it needed.
It could use a little TLC...

KAAM Garland:
Used to be pretty good, a little light at times but during the McCoy programming era it sound pretty competitive. Now not so much...

I listen on a wide range of receivers from the Hammerlund HQ-120/129, National NC240, Kenwood R-1000 and Kenwood R-2000. Antennas are 160m loops, shielded loops, and long wires.

What do you hear?

Jay Walker

You're basically talking about various grades of shit. KGVL sounds like they have no processing at all and is just a play toy for puker McCoy. KAAM obviously spends no money on anything...audio processing included. Just listen to that clown on Saturday night. These A. M. stations have no audience. Who in his right mind would listen to music on A. M. in 2012? No audience=no money=no money spent on programming=no money spent on audio processing

 

[metroneck]

MUSIC STATIONS---MUSIC STATIONS

Good point, I should read the title of thread before opening mouth. Very interesting topic though. Jay, you seem to have as strong of grip on these subjects as any of us here. Speaking of WBAP, what do you think the future holds for this heritage stronghold stick. Did you ever think you'd see the day that BAP (with an FM simulcast) would be losing it's footing like this.

 

[rbrucecarter5]

You left out KMKI Plano. In the pre-IBOC days, they had very good sound, in C-Quam stereo. HD ruined the audio chain.

Pretty much the same story with KAAM, the audio was amazing pre-HD. Post HD it sounds terrible.

I have to give points to KNTX Bowie - it was pretty weak over Plano, but the audio was crisp, clear, and frequency range was good.

I'm not generally a country fan, but KAND Corsicana had very good audio, and was an excellent example of localism. Amazingly strong in Plano. I was a fan.

KSEO Durant had pretty good audio when it was music, but the low end was pretty weak. It was destroyed by KAAM HD when they converted.

Another station that had amazingly good audio was not a DFW market station, but had a strong signal over Plano - KOMA Oklahoma City. I was very appreciative that they returned to their heritage music format for a time - the frequency response was excellent and crisp.

 

[Jay Walker]

MUSIC STATIONS---MUSIC STATIONS

Good point, I should read the title of thread before opening mouth. Very interesting topic though. Jay, you seem to have as strong of grip on these subjects as any of us here. Speaking of WBAP, what do you think the future holds for this heritage stronghold stick. Did you ever think you'd see the day that BAP (with an FM simulcast) would be losing it's footing like this.

As David Eduardo points out frequently and which I tend to agree the AM band is pretty much a victim of aging demos. The last group of people that actively used the band for entertainment are the boomers and we are in our mid 50's on the young side. Talk radio "saved" the band after music transitioned to FM, but now the talk format on AM is suffering as the audience ages out of the money demo. I am a firm believer that all formats have a "shelve life". It is quite possible that "topic driven/political" talk radio is near it's expiration date.

As an outside observer, I believe the ratings slide at 820 is caused in part, by the loss of the local element they were known for. Now it is just another Satellite repeater. The lack of a ratings bump with the addition of the FM simulcast was not surprising to me since the local programming 820 was known for is no longer available.

I don't know the future of AM, there are some Mom and Pop operators locally who seem to be making enough to keep the lights on and eat regular. They accomplish this by niche programming whether ethnic, or music formats not available elsewhere. The ones running a healthy amount of local spots seem to be the ones "super serving" their communities.

For a major facility such as 820, it's hard to see how it can reconnect with the audience without offering local content...

But what do I know ;D

 

[Bob E. Nelson]

BEST PROCESSED AM MUSIC STATIONS

KFXR Dallas:
Sad to say it is wimpy and weak whether from the 50K in Irving or the 5K in Rockwall. It's a shame too as when I had it, both as a talker and as KLUV oldies it sounded pretty competitive even though we only had an Optimod 9100B. The addition of a DBX at the studio to protect the telco lines made a nice improvement on the signal and gave it that AM fullness it needed.
It could use a little TLC...

What magic was being done around spring 2005 on "The Mighty 1190"? I think the best sounding AM music station of all time was WCFL before the flip to B/EZ. Jim Loupas had things on AM 1000 tweaked just right.

I had never heard an AM sounding that good except for those few memorable months when KFXR evidently took things seriously and tweaked the airchain. It was loud, sharp, crisp and had spectacular bass. For that all too brief period of time, the audio on 1190 sounded like what Gordon would have liked.

That was during the period of First Broadcasting operation. Was all that done with just a 9100B?

 

[bturner]

I can attest to KSEO in Durant, Oklahoma's great sound. For the power and distance, they sure sounded good in Mesquite and generally held up well on the car radio on my ride to work in Richardson back in the mid-1970s. To my untechnical ears at the time, KIKM sounded great too.

Off topic: I visited KSEO back in 1978 and met Bill Coxsey, the PD back then. We talked about my little 100 mw. I was running and he tossed me behind the board for almost an hour. I was scared to death but it was my first time on commercial radio. Still have that on cassette somewhere and it surely would make me blush today. I thought they were a great full service small market station back then.

 

[metroneck]

BEST PROCESSED AM MUSIC STATIONS

KFXR Dallas:
Sad to say it is wimpy and weak whether from the 50K in Irving or the 5K in Rockwall. It's a shame too as when I had it, both as a talker and as KLUV oldies it sounded pretty competitive even though we only had an Optimod 9100B. The addition of a DBX at the studio to protect the telco lines made a nice improvement on the signal and gave it that AM fullness it needed.
It could use a little TLC...

What magic was being done around spring 2005 on "The Mighty 1190"? I think the best sounding AM music station of all time was WCFL before the flip to B/EZ. Jim Loupas had things on AM 1000 tweaked just right.

I had never heard an AM sounding that good except for those few memorable months when KFXR evidently took things seriously and tweaked the airchain. It was loud, sharp, crisp and had spectacular bass. For that all too brief period of time, the audio on 1190 sounded like what Gordon would have liked.

That was during the period of First Broadcasting operation. Was all that done with just a 9100B?

Sounds like a properly tuned Orban indeed. Most operators that spend the 10k to purchase the processor, don't pay an EXPERIENCED engineer $500 to dial it in. If their local tech 'thinks he can do it', he's right...he can, but odds are he'll leave 1/3 of that deep/rich sound on the table, not knowing how to tweak an Orban, and most importantly not knowing how to set it to HOLD that sound over time.

 

[Jay Walker]

When I worked at WLS there was an interesting store room on the fifth floor that I would have loved to clean out. It contained pretty much every processor ever used on WLS. Gates Sta-Levels, the legendary General Electric BA7A limiter (used on KLIF in it's heyday I've been told) RCA BA-6A limiter, Audimax/Volumax, Inovonics MAP II, CRL, AM Optimods, in other words the "who's who" of AM processing from tube to microprocessor.

(as a side note one of my favorites in my little collection is the Dorrough 210 Stereo AM Limiter used on KTNQ back in the Top 40 days.)

WCFL and WLS really set the standard for AM processing in Chicago during the 70's. It may sound blasphemous to some but I never was that impressed with the "east coast" AM sound in the late 60's and 70's. WABC always seemed to me to be just a little too "tin can" sounding because of the way the plate reverb rang out (my flame suit is on so fire away)

The best of the best in the west was KFRC and pretty much any of the RKO top-40 stations. RKO Audio Director Bob Kanner at KHJ/KRTH and his variations of the "Kanner box" created legendary sound.

Here's a link to pictures of some of the RKO processor racks from back in the day: http://www.w3am.com/audiocha.html

 

[salemjedi54]

What about KHVN/KGGR?

 

[Jay Walker]

What about KHVN/KGGR?

When I've checked out Heaven 97 they've usually been in talk programming. KGGR is pretty weak in far north Collin county. So I can't give a fair listen....

 

[JRZFM100]

Hi Jay-

Have you ever observed the difference in AM audio quality relative to the modulation scheme of a particular AM transmitter.

For example, the audio quality produced by single phase PWM type (ie: Contenintal Power Rock, 1990's vintage BE solid state xmitters) -vs- Poly Phase PDM Pulse Duration Modulation (ie: Harris SX and GATES series) -vs- PCM type (Harris original DX series 10kW and 50kW)? I've spent a lot of time using the same broadcast transmission processor with each type of transmitter and found the audio quality to be highly dependent on the transmitter's said modulation type. This is w/o giving any consideration to the antenna system.

Also, curious if you have ever observed or compared the quality of FM mono transmission by comparing the audio quality for FM mono by using the (a) the mono terminal strip inputs on the rear of an FM analog exciter versus feeding mono through the BNC composite input?

My experience is that feeding a mono through the rear terminal strip inputs produced superior sound versus feeding the mono through the BNC connector.

Here again, the type of analog exciter and amplification scheme of the FM transmitter used also seems to effect the audio quality. I had an old grounded grid tridode xmitter that always sounded better then a much newer newer model BE transitter with a BE cylindrical tuned cavity and a tetrode.

All transmitters were in DFW market!

 

[Steve Eberhart]

The key to any success at all on a local AM station is providing what they can't get elsewhere.
At KGAF in Gainesville, that is our mantra. Local news, weather, sports and talk in the morning...and by the way, you might be surprised how many locals do indeed listen!
We program a gold based AC format, essentially when we don't have anything better to do (outside of morning, midday and afternoon news blocks). There is a strong loyal listenership!
We carry Friday night football to the fullest extent - all locally produced in house.
We run a Saturday Mornings Sportstalk show and are Texas Tech and Dallas Cowboy affiliates.
We are active in the community and dedicate a quarter hour every morning to local civic public service interviews which are not only very locally informative, but a perfect way to embed ourselves into the community and its leaders.
We put ourselves out in the community as often as possible at local events with appearances or remote broadcasts with our live van.
Our call in Swap program is an hour each morning, and despite its homespun, perhaps unsophisticated sound - it is the most listened to program on the station!
We run tons of promo's - I believe we must be our own best advertiser and it also lets air talent concentrate on content vs promo's. I actually encourage talk!
We have Dave Scott's automated weather twice an hour, which is outstanding, and a must for being dead center of "tornado alley". We carry TSN news on the hour.

Our station imaging is done by Charlie Van Dyke and we feature Ben Freedman jingles.

As far as our air chain - it's console to Aphex Compellor to Aphex Dominator to Orban Optimod 9200 straight into the transmitter. Jim Loupus himself instructed me on this setup including the tuning of the Optimod.
It sounds amazing for a measly 250 watts. It is LOUD, but clean and dynamic with a broad footprint, as he suggested.

We use EV RE-20 mic's in all mic positions in the studio, each with a DBX 286 mic processor. They do punch through nicely.

...and we do sell a few spots too!

 

[RADIO TRUTH]

What magic was being done around spring 2005 on "The Mighty 1190"? I think the best sounding AM music station of all time was WCFL before the flip to B/EZ. Jim Loupas had things on AM 1000 tweaked just right.

I was in WCFL in 1967 with Jim Loupas. I saw the modulation monitors. Both WCFL and WLS used almost no processing at the time and had, flat dead audio compared to WABC or WMCA.

 

[Jay Walker]

Hi Jay-

Have you ever observed the difference in AM audio quality relative to the modulation scheme of a particular AM transmitter.

For example, the audio quality produced by single phase PWM type (ie: Contenintal Power Rock, 1990's vintage BE solid state xmitters) -vs- Poly Phase PDM Pulse Duration Modulation (ie: Harris SX and GATES series) -vs- PCM type (Harris original DX series 10kW and 50kW)? I've spent a lot of time using the same broadcast transmission processor with each type of transmitter and found the audio quality to be highly dependent on the transmitter's said modulation type. This is w/o giving any consideration to the antenna system.

Also, curious if you have ever observed or compared the quality of FM mono transmission by comparing the audio quality for FM mono by using the (a) the mono terminal strip inputs on the rear of an FM analog exciter versus feeding mono through the BNC composite input?

My experience is that feeding a mono through the rear terminal strip inputs produced superior sound versus feeding the mono through the BNC connector.

Here again, the type of analog exciter and amplification scheme of the FM transmitter used also seems to effect the audio quality. I had an old grounded grid tridode xmitter that always sounded better then a much newer newer model BE transitter with a BE cylindrical tuned cavity and a tetrode.

All transmitters were in DFW market!

There is a difference between the various types of PCM/PDM/PWM modulation and fidelity. Sometimes it is very slight but it does exist to my ears. I know of one instance where a DX-50 sounds down right gritty compared to the new Nautel. You would think that this would not be the case but it is.

In the 70's when I went from Plate modulation to PDM I was astounded by the quality as well as the incredible loudness we were able to achieve with the Continental Power Rock on KQAM in Wichita. Part of the loudness of course was the ability to use asymmetrical modulation.

Most of my FM experience has been with transmitters that are solid state through the driver with a tube final in the last 30 years. I didn't have to mess with 4cx250 tube drivers that often. AM/Incidental noise was the biggest culprit to deal with.

As with anything, when you are seeking to maximize a signal you have to attend to every detail. It's not as simple as adding a box and tweaking.

Jay Walker

 

[easttxtv]

The key to any success at all on a local AM station is providing what they can't get elsewhere.
At KGAF in Gainesville, that is our mantra. Local news, weather, sports and talk in the morning...and by the way, you might be surprised how many locals do indeed listen!
We program a gold based AC format, essentially when we don't have anything better to do (outside of morning, midday and afternoon news blocks). There is a strong loyal listenership!
We carry Friday night football to the fullest extent - all locally produced in house.
We run a Saturday Mornings Sportstalk show and are Texas Tech and Dallas Cowboy affiliates.
We are active in the community and dedicate a quarter hour every morning to local civic public service interviews which are not only very locally informative, but a perfect way to embed ourselves into the community and its leaders.
We put ourselves out in the community as often as possible at local events with appearances or remote broadcasts with our live van.
Our call in Swap program is an hour each morning, and despite its homespun, perhaps unsophisticated sound - it is the most listened to program on the station!
We run tons of promo's - I believe we must be our own best advertiser and it also lets air talent concentrate on content vs promo's. I actually encourage talk!
We have Dave Scott's automated weather twice an hour, which is outstanding, and a must for being dead center of "tornado alley". We carry TSN news on the hour.

Our station imaging is done by Charlie Van Dyke and we feature Ben Freedman jingles.

Sounds like a great setup, Steve... too bad more radio stations out there aren't like yours.

 

[Megapsycle]

You left out KMKI Plano. In the pre-IBOC days, they had very good sound, in C-Quam stereo. HD ruined the audio chain.

Yes they sounded good then. Kinda miss tuning across 620 and catching the occasional ping-ponging stereo on Who Let The Dogs Out. Now sounds terribly undermodulated and weak.

KGVL Greenville:
A little too light for my taste. Does not seem to handle wide volume errors by board ops and has a tendency to "fall off the dial" at times. It is clean and has a nice EQ curve but at the expense of loudness and ease of listening. The bandwidth is nice, but to my ear it could use an extra 3db of compression and get a little deeper into the limiter to keep the audio above the power line noise.

Only station left I can receive that's in AM Stereo. Other than the noise it sounds pretty good. I wish it was stronger in NW Dallas. I like the format and music. Don't like having to download and run a proprietary player to listen to them on the computer, so I don't do that.