Breakaway hardware box

[oldiesstation]

I got the Marian trace alpha card for $209.00 total,from Germany to the usa.Now that's a deal..

 

[LA_Guy]

All the Orban Optimods are now contract manufactured in Germany, so it makes sense that they use this chipset.

 

[BobOnTheJob]

I got the Marian trace alpha card for $209.00 total,from Germany to the usa.Now that's a deal..

Mine was a little higher than that, but I bought two of them as the shipping cost was almost the same for 1 or 2 cards. Agreed, $209 including shipping for a card of that caliber is well within the comfort zone.

 

[gtomas]

With all this talk about DC coupled sound cards that just keeps going, it makes me wonder is this the Engineering board it claims to be?

If the output is not DC coupled, make it so! Re-design the output stage. For an engineer, this shouldn't be a problem.

Then again, an engineer probably wouldn't go down this route (other than for fun)...


Regards,
Goran Tomas

 

[rrsounds]

With all this talk about DC coupled sound cards that just keeps going, it makes me wonder is this the Engineering board it claims to be?

If the output is not DC coupled, make it so! Re-design the output stage. For an engineer, this shouldn't be a problem.

Then again, an engineer probably wouldn't go down this route (other than for fun)...


Regards,
Goran Tomas

Good point, Goran, and one that I thought I would be happy to follow. I actually bought a 192kHz-capable USB box with the expectation of making it DC-coupled, but went away scratching my head after disassembling it and having little luck following the circuit paths.

1) The schematics to most sound cards or USB boxes are simply not available;
2) Tracing components over what is, in some cases, a four-layer circuit board is really tedious.
3) You cannot depend upon a manufacturer following exactly the chips' datasheet's suggested circuitry.
4) Wisdom seems to have come to me in direct proportion to reduced eyesight, BOTH of which are very important when working with SMDs, LOL!

So, yes it can be done, but it is more work than most would be willing to put forth. Myself included, at this point. Maybe I'll come back to it later.

Your mileage may vary!

David

 

[oldiesstation]

DITTO David,

That $209.00 was well spent money to me.Goran probably has alot better eyesight.One needs that and plenty of PC board experience.I don't enjoy soldering any more,use to be fun;-).

 

[gtomas]

Admittedly the boards are quite elaborate these days then they used to be :-\ and David I guess you just had a bad luck with the complexity of the soundcard you bought. Couldn't you trace the path using the scope and probing the signals around the non-DC coupled components? The manufacturer most likely has different circuitry than in the data sheet but perhaps it's similar enough so you can get an idea of where the DC decoupling was inserted? Just throwing suggestions here...


Regards,
Goran Tomas

 

[SRP]

In today's "get it done yesterday" world it's worth spending a few extra bucks to buy the item you need rather than getting something else and having to adapt it to your application.

That's not a lack of "engineering" - it's called "being smart".

 

[oldiesstation]

That $209.00 was well spent money to me,Goran;-) Back in the day I did many a "Heathkit",remember those? Even built the solid state ignition for the auto,worked very well. SRP is on to something here. I got out of the mod business along time ago. Had to replace the heater in my hot tub,that was fun enough for me.But we can share a Bud-Lite 6 pack and you can mod on...Cheers

 

[gtomas]

In today's "get it done yesterday" world it's worth spending a few extra bucks to buy the item you need rather than getting something else and having to adapt it to your application.

That's not a lack of "engineering" - it's called "being smart".

Couldn't agree more! That's why you go and buy a processor in a box ;D


Regards,
Goran Tomas

 

[OKCRadioGuy]

Why re-invent the wheel? I'd rather take on more contract work or something like that if it was bored. In theory you are right about being able to modify, but the question is why, when there's a reasonable other option that's quicker and likely much better. The card suggested probably sounds better anyway. There are some differences other that coupling ya know.

 

[ChiefOperator]

Regarding the Breakaway hardware box, my guess is that the released product will be quite similiar to a box you could now build yourself.

The software as written is for a computer platform. The Breakaway hardware box will probably be an Windows XP embedded OS, an industrial motherboard and other rugged parts placed inside a case customized for it's function. From what I've been reading here, that's how a Linear Acoustics processor is built and doesn't that box run Breakaway as it's core?

Interestingly, many Industrial devices that don't look like computers (medical devices and others) actually are. Open the box and you'll find a motherboard, a hard drive, and other parts--not unlike any other computer.

I say grab a custom case, a drill and get to work! ;D It would be fun to build your own and would offer alot of satisfation to hear your project on the air. Broadcast engineers have been building quality projects for years. No reason to stop now.

My guess is that your finished project won't be too far off the actual hardware box once it's released.

 

[satech]

The software as written is for a computer platform. The Breakaway hardware box will probably be an Windows XP embedded OS, an industrial motherboard and other rugged parts placed inside a case customized for it's function. From what I've been reading here, that's how a Linear Acoustics processor is built and doesn't that box run Breakaway as its core?

It has been done before. The Inovonics Omega FM processor was essentially an Intel x86-based single-board computer, with a really nice sound card, in a big metal box.

 

[gtomas]

It has been done before. The Inovonics Omega FM processor was essentially an Intel x86-based single-board computer, with a really nice sound card, in a big metal box.

Interesting you bring that up. I had an opportunity to talk to some people who were dealers for Inovonics and sold quite a few Omegas in the UK. The guy told me they had nothing but trouble with that unit. Not with the software, but with the hardware. Apparently it failed quite a lot.

Granted things have improved since then in the computer industry... Or have they? ;D

Still, I think you can build a reliable PC platform, but with such rapidly short-life of parts in the IT and constant new releases, it's more like trial and error. That tends to be become expensive. In the end, you may find you need to buy tried and verified parts but by then it'll probably costs you like an Orban and Omnia. There's also the question of sound and performance... Your mileage may vary.


Regards,
Goran Tomas

 

[Tom Wells]

You buy a hardware box knowing hardware does degrade and fail as components age.
You hope you get good life out of it, and sometimes things run darn near forever.

You buy a computer knowing it will die one day, and be prepared in advance for that actually or mentally.
It has been getting better with computers over time.

I'm not ready to go to a solid state hard drive yet, but I'm still quite amazed and pleased that I can let
Zara and Breakaway Broadcast run for months at a time on one HP laptop without glitch or hiccup.
As a laptop, it doesn't care if the power goes off for 5 minutes, it will still be there running when the filaments warm back up...
I wouldn't be afraid to run software for processing, it's everywhere else already.
Just have a hot swap setup with auto switchover.
I would expect a Breakaway hardware box to have some kind of auto-self bypass in case of signal chain loss.

For me a separate box would be silly, as the simplicity of having everything in one device is ideal.
Oh, there's plenty of complication downstream with the mike, another box and reverb, to be sure.

 

[FFoti1]

There's little distinction between a hardware box and a PC platform. Basically, ALL of these devices are 'audio computers.' The distinguishing factors come down to the grade of components used. Just as debates occur over audio I/O cards, and the degree of quality they offer, based on components used. Same applies here.

If you wish to debate, then look closer at the OS employed, the H/W platform, firmware, etc. There's a big difference between an industrial grade PC, and what you get off-the-shelf at the local PC house.

Chances are the law of averages is what separates the good, from the not-so-good. You get what you pay for. Example: As most of you know, I'm a model train enthusiast. Those well-crafted HO locomotives that cost a pretty penny, look and perform much better than the lower cost stuff that's available to be used around the Christmas Tree. (Not politically correct here, it's still "Christmas" in my house, and I fully respect whatever you call this glorious Holiday in yours!)

-Frank Foti

 

[BobOnTheJob]

The Inovonics Omega FM processor was essentially an Intel x86-based single-board computer, with a really nice sound card, in a big metal box.

Interesting you bring that up. I had an opportunity to talk to some people who were dealers for Inovonics and sold quite a few Omegas in the UK. The guy told me they had nothing but trouble with that unit. Not with the software, but with the hardware. Apparently it failed quite a lot.

Goran Tomas

Goran...I'm on the front lines for a broadcast chain that used many Omegas. With some tweaking, they don't sound bad. At one time the stations I care for in this group had 4 or 5 of them. There's now 1 left. In the words of their Eastern Engineering Manager, they are "dropping like flies".

 

[Shay O Boyle]

Cheers for all the posts guys

Thanks for the help on the sound cards,and I hear what your saying about making your own PC with breakaway on it. But if Im honest, I just would really like to hold on and see what Breakway in a box would be like. To be honest as has been said before theres nothing like looking at your broadcast gear with a audio processor box next to it. I really hope Breakway in a box will be out within the next few months to a year as I can wait to get my hands on one. After all, if Leif can work his magic with software I can only imagine it combined with his choice of hardware. Plus he'll have the components he feels best for the job. But for me Its all about having a audio processor box,and I can't wait! ;D

 

[BobOnTheJob]

Cheers for all the posts guys

Thanks for the help on the sound cards,and I hear what your saying about making your own PC with breakaway on it. But if Im honest, I just would really like to hold on and see what Breakway in a box would be like. To be honest as has been said before theres nothing like looking at your broadcast gear with a audio processor box next to it. I really hope Breakway in a box will be out within the next few months to a year as I can wait to get my hands on one. After all, if Leif can work his magic with software I can only imagine it combined with his choice of hardware. Plus he'll have the components he feels best for the job. But for me Its all about having a audio processor box,and I can't wait! ;D

While the current Breakaway Broadcast sounds GREAT, the number of presets, while substantial, are limited and there are perhaps a half dozen parameters that can be tweaked on each preset. From what I understand, the 'box' model will have much greater 'tweakability'. That alone makes it worth waiting for. Pricing will be interesting to watch...if this thing is below $5K, it's going to be a game changer. If it's in 5 digits, the FM dial won't be dominated by it in the near to mid term...there's too many stations with $10K investments that aren't going to spring for another $10K+ box no matter how good it is.

 

[LA_Guy]

Try a DSPX MiniFM SE

For 1500 bucks, what do you have to lose?