Browns Seek New Radio Deal

[DToTheJ]

Despite "an excellent relationship" with Clear Channel, the Browns are exploring their options, which means games could move to 92.3 The Fan or WKNR.
http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20121015/SUB1/310159969

 

[vjm]

Despite "an excellent relationship" with Clear Channel, the Browns are exploring their options, which means games could move to 92.3 The Fan or WKNR.
http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20121015/SUB1/310159969

Forget KNR, the Browns would want an FM to go along with them, and CC and CBS (the 2 main players in the mix) own most of the major FMs in town anyway.

I can't see Radio One (WZAK/WENZ), Ideastream (WCPN/WCLV), or Salem (WFHM) wanting to pony up and throw KNR a lifeline.

92.3 The Fan will throw everything against the wall to snag them, but CC will go down swinging to keep them...they mean too much to WMMS especially.

And I don't give a flying fidoodle if Levdr1lostpassword comes in and throws minutiae and micro-details at me (for some reason he makes it his goal in life to try to "school" me on the ins and outs of radio), 100.7 got the ball rolling on their mancave format by having the Browns as a key pillar, and CC doesn't want to lose what it took them nearly a decade to build.

 

[Levdr1lostpassword]

"... but CC will go down swinging to keep [the Browns]...they mean too much to WMMS especially."

You overstate the team's importance to WMMS. The average WMMS PPM for January through July 2012 was 4.66. The average since August, when the Browns preseason began, is 4.95. The average for August through Holiday 2011 was 4.74. WMMS, as a rock/talk hybrid, has built a loyal following completely separate from its role as the Browns' FM flagship. Rover, Alan Cox, and Maxwell have accounted for nearly all the station's growth in the last five years. Before Rover, the station routinely failed to crack the top 15. Then the Spring 2008 diary came along, and WMMS found itself at #8.

Clear Channel has more to lose than gain here. WMMS itself will remain largely unaffected. WMMS in 2012 is not the same as WMMS in 2002, a time when the station actually needed the Browns to stay afloat. Interestingly, Mr. Hammond's article quotes an "industry source" who reminds us that Clear Channel does indeed have other stations in its Cleveland cluster.

 

[chrocket87]

"... but CC will go down swinging to keep [the Browns]...they mean too much to WMMS especially."

You overstate the team's importance to WMMS. The average WMMS PPM for January through July 2012 was 4.66. The average since August, when the Browns preseason began, is 4.95. The average for August through Holiday 2011 was 4.74. WMMS, as a rock/talk hybrid, has built a loyal following completely separate from its role as the Browns' FM flagship. Rover, Alan Cox, and Maxwell have accounted for nearly all the station's growth in the last five years. Before Rover, the station routinely failed to crack the top 15. Then the Spring 2008 diary came along, and WMMS found itself at #8.

Clear Channel has more to lose than gain here. WMMS itself will remain largely unaffected. WMMS in 2012 is not the same as WMMS in 2002, a time when the station actually needed the Browns to stay afloat. Interestingly, Mr. Hammond's article quotes an "industry source" who reminds us that Clear Channel does indeed have other stations in its Cleveland cluster.

There is more to this than useless 6+ numbers. With the Browns comes BILLING and they bill very well with the Browns on board. Take away the Browns and WMMS isn't far away from becoming WTAM-FM.

 

[Levdr1lostpassword]

There is more to this than useless 6+ numbers. With the Browns comes BILLING and they bill very well with the Browns on board. Take away the Browns and WMMS isn't far away from becoming WTAM-FM.

AQH 6+ PPM ratings are less useless than unsupported assertions in CAPS LOCK. As I have said repeatedly, the NFL is the top professional sports league in the country, so it should go without saying that play-by-play rights come with advantages in the market. However, my point is that WMMS itself is not going to suffer appreciably without the Browns. The station performs well enough during the off season (most of the calendar year). Moreover, and as noted in Hammond's article, the Browns actual schedule accounts for relatively little programming: 16 regular season games, compared to 160+ regular season Indians games.

As for "WTAM-FM"... right. Because dumping rock from WMMS worked so well the last time they tried it.

 

[nsa1]

Despite "an excellent relationship" with Clear Channel, the Browns are exploring their options, which means games could move to 92.3 The Fan or WKNR.
http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20121015/SUB1/310159969

Forget KNR, the Browns would want an FM to go along with them...

Not to mention that horrible WKNR night signal for any 4PM games in November/December or prime-time games.

 

[vjm]

There is more to this than useless 6+ numbers. With the Browns comes BILLING and they bill very well with the Browns on board. Take away the Browns and WMMS isn't far away from becoming WTAM-FM.

AQH 6+ PPM ratings are less useless than unsupported assertions in CAPS LOCK. As I have said repeatedly, the NFL is the top professional sports league in the country, so it should go without saying that play-by-play rights come with advantages in the market. However, my point is that WMMS itself is not going to suffer appreciably without the Browns. The station performs well enough during the off season (most of the calendar year). Moreover, and as noted in Hammond's article, the Browns actual schedule accounts for relatively little programming: 16 regular season games, compared to 160+ regular season Indians games.

As for "WTAM-FM"... right. Because dumping rock from WMMS worked so well the last time they tried it.

If you were running MMS, you probably would say "Go ahead WKRK, you can have them, because these numbers tell me that I don't need them."

The next day, Clear Channel brass would have 2 beefy security guys escort you to your car with all your belongings in a cardboard box.

 

[Tim]

They couldn't get the Indians. Now, if CBS is really serious about 923TheFan, they have to move heaven and earth to get the Browns.

Maybe if they do, it will force a move of sportstalk to 98.5? Or, maybe they just simulcast the Browns on 92.3 and 98.5.

 

[vjm]

They couldn't get the Indians. Now, if CBS is really serious about 923TheFan, they have to move heaven and earth to get the Browns.

Maybe if they do, it will force a move of sportstalk to 98.5? Or, maybe they just simulcast the Browns on 92.3 and 98.5.

Well, up until this year the Buffalo Bills had a double FM flagship (they since moved back to WGR AM 550 prior to the 2012 season), so it's not that unheard of.

If CBS snags the Browns, a WKRK/WNCX flagship arrangement is very feasible.

 

[CleveRadioInsider]

I hope that CBS gets them. I am sick and tired of listening to Browns games and at the end of every break it is listen to Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover. At least with 92.3 or 98.5 we would get a wide variety of show promos.

 

[SonoSational18]

Despite "an excellent relationship" with Clear Channel, the Browns are exploring their options, which means games could move to 92.3 The Fan or WKNR.
http://www.crainscleveland.com/article/20121015/SUB1/310159969

In other words.... they want to see how much they can squeeze out of CC by pitting CBS against them. WKNR? No way. They don't have the signal and they don't have an FM. Losing the Browns won't kill WMMS in the ratings, but would be bad for bragging rights. CC also has a vested interest in keeping KRK from getting traction which a Browns deal could help them get.

 

[AllMightyVoice]

I know that eventually it of course all comes down to the money, but honestly I don't see how the Browns could be any happier than they are with their current CC arrangement. They have their games on the 50,000 watt AM stick of one of the highest rated stations in town as well as on the very strong FM signal of the "man-cave" station in the city. Plus neither of those stations have any personalities that are really all that critical of the team.

Seems like CBS will really have to blow away the Browns with a deal to get them to move from CC, and in the year 2012 is it really worth it to overpay to carry Browns games on the radio? The Fan being able to call themselves the "Home of the Browns" would still certainly not put them in the same ratings ballpark as WTAM....would it even score them any kind of ratings advantage over KNR??

 

[Levdr1lostpassword]

If you were running MMS, you probably would say "Go ahead WKRK, you can have them, because these numbers tell me that I don't need them."

If I were running WMMS, I would do everything in my power to keep the Browns. That said, WMMS will continue on in its current form whether or not the Browns return in 2013.

Losing the Browns won't kill WMMS in the ratings, but would be bad for bragging rights.

Exactly.

 

[1sttimecaller]

Perhaps we can get those creative TWOFER tuesday promos and Hi it's Michael Stanley sitting in the air chair on <Insert Day Here> promos.

Insert Quote
I hope that CBS gets them. I am sick and tired of listening to Browns games and at the end of every break it is listen to Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover. At least with 92.3 or 98.5 we would get a wide variety of show promos.

 

[DrC]

I hope that CBS gets them. I am sick and tired of listening to Browns games and at the end of every break it is listen to Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover. At least with 92.3 or 98.5 we would get a wide variety of show promos.

They do promote Rover and Alan Cox pretty extensively, but bo be fair, 'MMS played a wider variety of show promos during the 1995-2008 era when they changed morning shows seemingly four times a year. Now that they have not one, but two consistently well-performing talk shows, I guess they're not inclined to hold back about promoting them...

 

[vjm]

I hope that CBS gets them. I am sick and tired of listening to Browns games and at the end of every break it is listen to Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover, Alan Cox, Rover. At least with 92.3 or 98.5 we would get a wide variety of show promos.

They do promote Rover and Alan Cox pretty extensively, but bo be fair, 'MMS played a wider variety of show promos during the 1995-2008 era when they changed morning shows seemingly four times a year. Now that they have not one, but two consistently well-performing talk shows, I guess they're not inclined to hold back about promoting them...

Rover and Cox get promoted during Browns games, the Browns get promoted during Rover and Cox.

One hand washes the other.

It's a very simple formula that MMS has stumbled on and it works--rock/talk (Rover and Cox)/sports (Browns and some Tribe)...a little bit of everything guys like, which is why I call it "man-cave" radio.

Losing the Browns would be a punch in the gut for the Buzzard...it looks bad, plus it would make the wallet a little lighter with all that ad $$ going bye-bye.

 

[CleveFan]

If WMMS loses the Browns, wouldn't the Indians (or even the Cavs) help pick up some of the slack, and still help them maintain their "mancave" programming? Plus, the station would still have their year-round programming too, unless they want to tweak their rock playlist.

 

[vjm]

If WMMS loses the Browns, wouldn't the Indians (or even the Cavs) help pick up some of the slack, and still help them maintain their "mancave" programming? Plus, the station would still have their year-round programming too, unless they want to tweak their rock playlist.

I think CC wants to give the Tribe more of a presence on 100.7 regardless (which those Friday simulcasts may have been a dry run for).

Bottom line, CC's gonna fight to the death to keep the Browns...they really do mean a lot to the company (remember, it'll hurt 1100 too if the Browns leave, as they'll no longer be able to say they have "all the balls").

MMS has the mancave thing going, and TAM has the "we have all 3 teams (all the balls)" deal.

They don't wanna lose that--no way, no how.

 

[SonoSational18]

Right now we have two stellarly mediocre sports talk stations duking it out for a 2-share, while WTAM really has the street cred when it comes to sports. Getting the Browns would give WKRK (isn't it time to get some call letters that hint at "Fan"?) a tremenous leg up over WKNR. Sports sales has a highly emotional component and being able to say "Home of The Browns" would be a great book to the upstart sports talker. I agree that with WTAM and a whole stable of highly-rated FM's staying with CC would make much sense for the Browns, but if CBS has more to gain than CC has to lose. If CBS starts throwing "stupid" money at the Browns there's a point where I think CC will throw in the towel and let them have it. Having the Browns is about bragging rights more than anything else. They're not the constant cume driver that baseball provides. It's just one game per week, 16 weeks out of the year.

 

[Levdr1lostpassword]

Rover and Cox get promoted during Browns games, the Browns get promoted during Rover and Cox. ... It's a very simple formula that MMS has stumbled on and it works...

The only changes at WMMS since 2002, when the station began to air the Browns, were the shift to talk during afternoons, and the signing of a strong morning personality in 2008. Everything else remains the same: talk in the morning; rock during middays, evenings, overnights, and weekends; the Browns; and conflict games if/when necessary. Around 2007, Maxwell ignored management, stopped playing music, and brought in Stansbury. Then the station scored a major coup: signing Rover away from K-Rock. That's what the station "stumbled" on: a hybrid of talk during drive time, rock at all others. FM flagship rights to the Browns and conflict games did little for WMMS prior to its firm commitment to personality-driven drive time talk and rock.

One other point to revisit. WMJI, with Browns rights, was still oldies from 1999 to 2001. WDOK, with Browns rights, was still soft rock from 1994 to 1995. WMMS was still rock from 2002 until Maxwell moved to all talk, and WMMS has remained a mix of talk and rock ever since. All four AFC North FM flagships remain rock. Just because a station picks up play-by-play rights does not mean that station's format has changed. For a non-sports-talk station, play-by-play is specialty programming, nothing else.

Having the Browns is about bragging rights more than anything else. They're not the constant cume driver that baseball provides. It's just one game per week, 16 weeks out of the year.

Agreed.