Cable systems carrying three stations of the same network

[justpassingthough]

Arizona's DMAs are huge, so the answer is no in most all cases. Only area that might be like that is the Fredonia-Beaver Dam area on the AZ Strip with connections to Utah, Las Vegas, and Phoenix. Not sure. Page's lineup is all-AZ.

Casa Grande once had two of some affiliates (2004 channel lineup). They've gone to all Phoenix now, sadly.

I own a second place in Lake Havasu City, AZ, which is in the Phoenix DMA. Surprisingly, only Phoenix stations appear on the cable system, even though Las Vegas is closer in distance by about 40 miles.

 

[KML0224]

According to the distance calculator I use at indo.com, Lake Havasu City is 128 air miles from Las Vegas and 145 air miles to Phoenix. It's 127 air miles to Yuma. I take it that your cable doesn't carry KYMA-TV (NBC) channel 11 from there either?

 

[fybush]

Yuma-El Centro is its own little TV island that doesn't really overlap with anything else. There's hours of flat desert nothing between Yuma and Phoenix/Tucson going east, slightly fewer hours of mountainous desert nothing between Yuma and San Diego going west, and hours of very sparsely populated Colorado River valley between Yuma and Lake Havasu going north.

The only overlap I can find in that direction is in Parker, which gets all of Phoenix and KYMA from Yuma on cable. If there's a cable provider in Quartzsite, the next town of any size south of Parker, I can't find it - but then with most of Quartzsite being RVs parked for the winter, cable would be an iffy proposition. 20 miles to the west in Blythe, CA, Suddenlink offers a weird mix of the three big Yuma stations, a nearly-complete roster of Phoenix stations (with KNXV notably absent), and KTLA/KABC/KCAL/KTTV from LA. I'm guessing they get the Yuma stations over the air, with LA and Phoenix arriving by microwave or cable, and I'm guessing they used to get more LA TV than they do now. That area, and up the river into Lake Havasu and Needles and Laughlin/Bullhead, gets essentially no OTA TV from anyone's full-power signals...it's all translators or cable/satellite.

The only direction in which the Yuma/El Centro market is geographically close enough to another US TV market for overlap is to the northwest, where it fades into the Palm Springs market over the Salton Sea. Anyone who's ever been there knows it's one of the weirdest, most desolate parts of the country that exists. There's actually a cable system (Cable USA) in Salton City, serving whatever population still remains there, and it's as weird as the area itself: KMIR, KESQ and KDFX-CA (but not CBS affiliate KPSP-LP) from Palm Springs for NBC/ABC/Fox, KFMB and KPBS from San Diego for CBS/PBS, KAJB from nearby Calipatria (Yuma-El Centro market) for Telefutura...but instead of KAJB's sister Univision station, KVYE channel 7 El Centro, the system apparently takes the Univision satellite feed. No doubt people with OTA antennas get a rather different mix of channels there, probably mostly Yuma-El Centro at the south end of the lake, mostly Palm Springs to the north.

And then there's the border factor...there are a bunch of signals from Mexicali (especially the high-powered XHBC channel 3) that are easily viewed in El Centro and probably pretty well up the Imperial Valley into the south end of the Salton Sea. XHBC is on cable in El Centro, and the lower-powered channel 66 from Mexicali is on cable in both El Centro and Yuma.

 

[firepoint525]

This would have been in the early 70's but I vaguely remember the cable system in Dyersburg, TN carrying KAIT along with WHBQ 13, which was ABC at the time, and WBBJ ABC 7 in Jackson, TN. Later KAIT was dropped.
One factor that probably contributed to 3 ABC stations on the Forrest City cable system, and also Dyersburg at one time, is that ABC has affiliates in Jackson and Jonesboro, but CBS and NBC has only had affiliates in Memphis and Little Rock for Forrest City, and Memphis and the Paducah, KY/Cape Girardeau, MO area for Dyersburg, and the Paducah/Cape stations have dropped from Dyersburg's cable system in recent years.

You had Jonesboro on the Dyersburg cable system? We never did, as far as I know, but maybe Jonesboro is just too far from Union City.

KFVS and WPSD have always been weak on Tennessee news coverage, but WPSD made up for that, in part, with their Tennessee bureau. Not sure if they still have that or not. Seems like it was based in Dyersburg. Meanwhile, KFVS would be more likely to give the temps in Dyersburg than in Union City, which didn't make sense, since UC is closer to Cape than Dyersburg is.

 

[justpassingthough]

According to the distance calculator I use at indo.com, Lake Havasu City is 128 air miles from Las Vegas and 145 air miles to Phoenix. It's 127 air miles to Yuma. I take it that your cable doesn't carry KYMA-TV (NBC) channel 11 from there either?

We only get the Phoenix stations, which I thought was odd. The whole town is odd in that respect, though, because while its technically in Arizona, its obviously on the border and is influenced by the influx of people from Southern California there every weekend.

I was there during the NBA playoffs last year, and the bar I was at had an equal number of Suns and Lakers fans- so its allegiance to any one area is questionable. I always figured it was due to Arizona's lack of participation in daylight time. If they picked up Vegas stations then primetime would be skewed during the bulk of the TV season.

 

[vchimpanzee]

In the late '60s/early '70s Cocoa, FL had three NBC
affiliates on its cable system:

2 WESH Daytona Beach/Orlando
5 WPTV West Palm Beach
8 WFLA Tampa

Of course they did! "I Dream of Jeannie" featured the town!

 

[vchimpanzee]

In SC, this mainly happened in the Myrtle Beach area. Pawleys Island, Murrells Inlet, Surfside Beach and a couple other towns carried three NBCs all the way till 2008. They carried WCBD, WECT and WIS. When Myrtle Beach got a new NBC, WMBF, WIS and WECT were dropped, but WCBD stayed on. WIS's syndicated programming was blacked out, because almost all of it aired on Myrtle Beach stations or WECT. They kept it for local news for the vacationers from the Columbia area.

They had two CBSs (WBTW and WCSC), two ABCs (WCIV and WPDE), and two Fox (WFXB and WTAT), but 3 NBCs.

You're forgetting WWAY in Wilmington (ABC).

Now that I think of it, WWAY might have been dropped after WPDE was added.

And WCBD and WCIV traded places at some point.

 

[vchimpanzee]

With its transmitter on Beaucatcher Mountain, WLOS put a signal into six states: North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee,
Kentucky, Virginia, and Georgia; it was the de facto ABC affiliate for Bristol/Kingsport/Johnson City before WKPT signed on in 1969, and many viewers in Knoxville watched it instead of WTVK/26, ABC at the time. Even without cable in Athens, you could usually pick up a snowy but viewable picture, even though there was a station on Ch. 13 much closer: Macon's WMAZ.

Beaucatcher Mountain is not a big mountain. It is known for having a tunnel put through it early in the 20th century, and then they built a new highway through in the 70s, pretty much wrecking the mountain.

Mount Pisgah is where WLOS has its tower. Nearly 6000 feet tall southwest of the city.

 

[Kent]

I recently was in NW Arkansas and found the network stations on cable in Fayetteville to be all over the place. Some truely local, (Fayetteville and environs), one from Springfield, MO, and one, KTUL, from Tulsa, OK! What a weird hodge-podge, and quite a few duplicate network signals on the system.

In the mid-90's, cable in Fayetteville/Springdale had the local channels plus ABC and CBS from Tulsa and NBC from Little Rock. I'm not sure when it changed, but I know KYTV and KOLR used to be significantly viewed in Washington County as did KTUL. I'm thinking KODE and KOAM from Joplin were also significantly viewed there. Because they're significantly viewed, they can't be blacked out, and I'm sure Nexstar loves having KOLR on cable since they also own NBC and Fox in NWA. I'm just kinda surprised they haven't forced KODE onto cable there as part of their compensation package from the cable company!

When I lived there, I had very little trouble getting KYTV/KOLR plus KOAM/KODE, and that was just with rabbit ears. Of course, I was on the second floor, which probably helped a great deal, too. The local stations I could get were KHOG 29, KFAA 51 and KPOM 24. KFSM 5 was available on a local translator, and there was an LPTV that carried Fox, I believe on 46 in Ft. Smith and 15 in Fayetteville. I usually watched Fox NFL games on KODE, which had a secondary affiliation with Fox. Although it aired Fox programming in the overnights most of the time, it bumped ABC programming on NFL Sundays and playoff Saturdays.

My neighbor in the apartment next to me, by the way, could get KOTV and KTUL from Tulsa plus KHOG but that was about it. OTA reception in that area was always weird in the analog world. I'm sure it's even weirder in today's digital world!

 

[mysticnitekatt]

There has to be areas of the country where there are systems that are within the must-carry limits of 3 markets.

There are quiet a few 2 market areas in the country.

NOW, are there any FOUR or more?

 

[anotherguyTN]

This would have been in the early 70's but I vaguely remember the cable system in Dyersburg, TN carrying KAIT along with WHBQ 13, which was ABC at the time, and WBBJ ABC 7 in Jackson, TN. Later KAIT was dropped.
One factor that probably contributed to 3 ABC stations on the Forrest City cable system, and also Dyersburg at one time, is that ABC has affiliates in Jackson and Jonesboro, but CBS and NBC has only had affiliates in Memphis and Little Rock for Forrest City, and Memphis and the Paducah, KY/Cape Girardeau, MO area for Dyersburg, and the Paducah/Cape stations have dropped from Dyersburg's cable system in recent years.

You had Jonesboro on the Dyersburg cable system? We never did, as far as I know, but maybe Jonesboro is just too far from Union City.

KFVS and WPSD have always been weak on Tennessee news coverage, but WPSD made up for that, in part, with their Tennessee bureau. Not sure if they still have that or not. Seems like it was based in Dyersburg. Meanwhile, KFVS would be more likely to give the temps in Dyersburg than in Union City, which didn't make sense, since UC is closer to Cape than Dyersburg is.

Like I said, the memory of KAIT being on Dyersburg's cable is kind of vague. My grandmother had cable since the early 70's, but we lived South of Dyersburg outside of the cable system's coverage. It actually may not have been for very long, like in the early 70's, before networks like HBO or WTBS came in. My parents had a big antenna with a rotor, and we could get KAIT, WPSD, and KFVS, although their signals were more snowy at times than the Memphis stations or WBBJ in Jackson.

I'm really not sure what kind of news coverage WPSD or KFVS are giving Dyersburg now. They probably gave more coverage for them beacuse of being on the cable system there. Cable One dropped them both a few months before the digital conversion in 2009, and I wouldn't be surprised if they cut it out as a result. I get to see them occasionally when my wife and I are visiting her sister in the Marion/Carbondale, IL area, and it seems like Dyersburg is still on the weather map, but I haven't noticed any news coverage.

 

[rgseark2009]

Eureka Springs AR (Cox Cable)

Eureka Springs is in the Springfield MO TV market but borders Fort Smith-Fayetteville market just a few miles over. In fact the transmitter for KNWA (NBC HD, FOX SDTV on the -2) is close enough for rabbit ear reception in most of the town. However, KNWA isn't carried on Cox (Eureka Springs), but sister station KARK (NBC Little Rock) is as well as KYTV (NBC Springfield M0).

ES Cox customers get three ABC stations though (as of October 2010). ABC is represented by KSPR (Springfield MO), KHOG (Fayetteville AR), and KATV (Little Rock AR).

 

[trapper12]

Several systems in the border area's of Kentucky carry 3 networks. In Southeastern Kentucky WYMT, WKYT, and WVLT. All three CBS and granted all three owned by the same company. WTVQ, WATE,and WKPT, all ABC, are also carried on some of these systems. NBC is also on three channels on one system that I know of, WCYB, WLEX, and WBIR.

 

[Ultimajock]

...just remembered my one year (1998-99) living in Walworth, Wisconsin, where the TCI system carried:
ABC: WLS-TV/7 Chicago, WISN-TV/12 Milwaukee, WTVO/17 Rockford
CBS: WBBM-TV/2 Chicago, WIFR/23 Freeport, WDJT/58 Milwaukee
NBC: WTMJ-TV/4 Milwaukee, WMAQ-TV/5 Chicago, WREX/13 Rockford

...as I recall, TCI was fixing to sell the system just as I left in September 1999, so I don't know if the system still has its head end in McHenry, Illinois, but I know Walworth is within must-carry distance of all three markets. (Rather surprised that Madison wasn't on the system, as I'm positive Walworth is within the must-carry distance of that market as well)...

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Until the early 90s, what was then TCI in Columbia MO has PBS from Kansas City (KCPT) St Louis (KETC) and the in market PBS station KMOS from Warrensburg that could not be received OTA due to interference from KCOU 88.1. KETC was still on what became the Mediacom system until just before the original analog shutoff date when they also dropped NBC from St Louis (KSDK, blacked out most of the time). Pre syndex, the Columbia cable system also had the big 3 from St. Louis and KSHB from Kansas City (then Indy/Fox). Don't exactly know when they dropped KSHB but I think it was around when they switched to NBC. What is the most distant network station you're seen or heard of on a cable system?

 

[nomadcowatbk]

Fidelity Communications in Rolla, MO has the CBS stations from Springfield, Columbia/Jefferson City, and St Louis in SD, but just CBS from St. Louis in HD. Don't know how syndex rules are applied there. I think they once had the ABC and NBC stations from those three markets. I think Rolla in the Columbia/Jefferson City Market, (KOMU NBC has an LP translator near there I think) but they only have one Columbia/Jefferson City station on there. Since DTV, how difficult is it to import out of market stations to cable systems?

http://www.fidelitycommunications.com/cabletv/db_lineup.php?townid=6&submenu_id=7

 

[ssetta]

I am surprised nobody has mentioned Charter cable of Worcester county, Mass.

Up until around 2000, when WYDN signed on, Charter carried 3 NBC affiliates in much of the market: WHDH-7 (Boston), WJAR-10 (Providence), and WWLP-22 (Springfield). WWLP had to be dropped in favor of WYDN, but what I don't understand is that the entire Worcester county STILL receives WJAR to this day (but no HD). If you lived in Sturbridge or West Brookfield, I think it would probably make more sense to have WWLP than WJAR, because I think Sturbridge is about 30 miles away from Springfield, but 40 miles away from Providence. I also know that Charlton and the rest of the Brookfields used to be on a cable system called Pegasus Cable. I seem to remember that they carried both WWLP and WGGB (and WGBY), but they also carried CBS WPRI from Providence. What was really cool is that they carried 3 channels that carried Wheel of Fortune and Jeopardy! (WHDH, WWLP, and WPRI), but only one channel that carried the Oprah Winfrey show (WCVB). WPRI has since been dropped from pretty much everywhere in Massachusetts (except for the Douglas, Millville, Sutton and Uxbridge system for some reason), but I know the former Pegasus communities still have WGBY, while I don't think the rest of Worcester county ever had it. I think the Barre/Hubbardston/Oakham/Rutland system also carried both WPRI and WJAR from Providence, as well as WWLP and WGGB (and WGBY).

It always seems like the more rural areas have multiple network affiliates, because it's not really close to either city.

 

[BRNout]

Rather surprised that Madison wasn't on the system, as I'm positive Walworth is within the must-carry distance of that market as well...

And you'd be mistaken on that. As of now, Charter in Walworth carries major network channels (ABC, CBS, NBC and Fox) from Chicago and Milwaukee ONLY. I do not believe that they even carry WTTW from Chicago, just WMVT and WMVS from Milwaukee.

Nothing from Rockford and nothing from Madison. To get Rockford and Madison channels, you need to go farther west to the Beloit and Janesville areas. But once there you lose the Chicago/Milwaukee affiliates. Delavan, which is between Walworth and the Rock River Valley, appears to be the odd man out, with only Milwaukee affiliates offered.

 

[ShawnHill1]

Rather surprised that Madison wasn't on the system, as I'm positive Walworth is within the must-carry distance of that market as well...

And you'd be mistaken on that. As of now, Charter in Walworth carries major network channels (ABC, CBS, NBC and Fox) from Chicago and Milwaukee ONLY. I do not believe that they even carry WTTW from Chicago, just WMVT and WMVS from Milwaukee.

Nothing from Rockford and nothing from Madison. To get Rockford and Madison channels, you need to go farther west to the Beloit and Janesville areas. But once there you lose the Chicago/Milwaukee affiliates. Delavan, which is between Walworth and the Rock River Valley, appears to be the odd man out, with only Milwaukee affiliates offered.

I remember, at least during the mid-to-late 80s, the Beloit cable systems carried stations from Rockford and Madison, plus WVTV from Milwaukee during its "Super 18: Wisconsin's Superstation" days. Beloit's closer to Rockford, but it's in the Madison DMA, and if I also remember right, South Beloit also shared the same cable system as its big sister across the Stateline. Presently, the Madison stations are carried in both SD and HD, as well as the subchannels (This TV, MyMadisonTV, WMTV's Accuweather, etc.), but the Rockford stations are only offered in standard-def, with no subchannels (there's so some duplicating between the cities' sets of subchannels anyways).

You get into Rockford proper, the only out-of-town stations offered are WTTW and WHA, and if you want to count it, WGN America. I was always puzzled why Rockford Cablevision (now a Comcast territory) never offered WFLD, WVTV, or at least one other out-of-town station (maybe one of the PBSs from Milwaukee, or WCGV and/or WPWR and so forth). They could also done what the Columbus (Ohio) and San Diego cable systems did early on, in setting aside a channel or two for pre-empted network shows...with Rockford's proximity to Chicago, it would have been feasible.

 

[bpatrick]

With its transmitter on Beaucatcher Mountain, WLOS put a signal into six states: North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee,
Kentucky, Virginia, and Georgia; it was the de facto ABC affiliate for Bristol/Kingsport/Johnson City before WKPT signed on in 1969, and many viewers in Knoxville watched it instead of WTVK/26, ABC at the time. Even without cable in Athens, you could usually pick up a snowy but viewable picture, even though there was a station on Ch. 13 much closer: Macon's WMAZ.

Beaucatcher Mountain is not a big mountain. It is known for having a tunnel put through it early in the 20th century, and then they built a new highway through in the 70s, pretty much wrecking the mountain.

Mount Pisgah is where WLOS has its tower. Nearly 6000 feet tall southwest of the city.

You're right; I don't know why I thought WLOS's tower was on Beaucatcher. But I do know that the station had a number of translator channels; I remember back in the late '60s Ch. 13 had this "Dialing For Dollars"-type thing called "The Money Man" in the afternoons, and I can recall Bob Caldwell making occasional calls to Middlesboro, KY (translator Ch. 5, IIRC). I think there was also a translator in Corbin, KY.