Can The AM Band Be Saved?

[Darth_vader]

And even *if* light bulbs become "illegal" to vend in the USA, they're not going to be illegal to *own*. I can see this becoming a windfall of economic opportunity for Canada. Even though Gummint can stop people from manufacturing and selling them within the country, under the N.A.F.T.A. they can't keep them out of the country either.

[size=8pt]Of course, barring that, there's always the black market!

 

[davideduardo]

And even *if* light bulbs become "illegal" to vend in the USA, they're not going to be illegal to *own*. I can see this becoming a windfall of economic opportunity for Canada. Even though Gummint can stop people from manufacturing and selling them within the country, under the N.A.F.T.A. they can't keep them out of the country either.

After two CFLs flamed out just this week, one of them smoking enough to trigger the fire alarm, and the other with a flash-bang grenade like explosion, I gave some money to a relative to bring me a big box of incandescent bulbs from Mexicali. I'm putting some nice Samsung dimmable LEDs in areas that have a log of usage and going back to incandescents everywhere else.

 

[borderblaster]

We have the illegal drug trade, and now we'll have the illegal lightbulb trade! "Officer, I didn'tknow those incandescent light bulbs were in my trunk!"

 

[landtuna]

What will the media call the light bulb mules? "Incandescent Hispanics"? "Lightbulb Latinos?"

Will the taco vendor downtown have a "secret" drawer to stash his bulbs?

And what about the servers at my favorite Mexican restaurant? Do I have to know the secret password to gain access to their stash?

"UP AGAINST THE WALL LONGHAIR!!!"

"Yes, of course, Officer. I was merely buying roasted chilis. I have no idea where these bulbs came from!"

;D ;D

 

[kenglish]

I remember there was an exemption for such things as "tower lights". So, I guess we can still give them a "burn-in" session indoors.

 

[kenglish]

Noticed this morning that the AM band was about useless on my car radio for 33 blocks (5 miles), between two power substations. Never heard it that bad before. I wonder if anyone else noticed.

 

[davideduardo]

Noticed this morning that the AM band was about useless on my car radio for 33 blocks (5 miles), between two power substations. Never heard it that bad before. I wonder if anyone else noticed.

I have found ultra-noisy areas in a number of markets. In LA, for example, for many years a segment of Hollywood Way in Burbank that is about 5 miles long has so much power line noise that even the best signals, like KFI, are useless.

 

[kenglish]

We got a few inches of snow last night, so virtually everything is bad this morning.
I also verified what I've been suspecting...
Salt Lake City does not repair or replace bad streetlights (this was also mentioned in last week's news articles about charging a "Streetlight Fee" on peoples' electric bills), to save money. As you drive in on a cold or wet morning, there is usually at least one streetlight that is not illuminated, or is very dim, on nearly every block. The noise is horrendous. A few moments later, you'll hear a loud "pop" in the radio, and the noise will go away, as you see the light come back on in the mirror.

I called in the other problem last night. The noise was very, very bad near one substation. Hope it's not another defective HV switch. One blew almost all the way across the street (different sub) when it went up in flames last year. One of the line guys called me back at home, but didn't have the equipment to look for noise.

 

[Nostalgia]

Last week I enjoyed a taste of the good old days (pre-IBOC) on our beaten and battered AM band. Our local 10,000 watt 1250 signal had shut its IBOC off for some reason and there, lo and behold, was 1000 watt 1240 and the True Oldies Channel coming into my car radio from 125 miles away! Yes, this was over a mostly salt water path, and yes there was some upper sideband splatter, but still this clearly illustrates how much hash is being generated by this terrible technology. Sadly IBOC returned a few days later

 

[Bud50]

But if you can come up with some way to loosen the directional patterns that stations like WIND have, you might have a shot at keeping things alive.

But the real problem is the huge noise level in urban areas, caused by flourescents, computers, CFLs and all manner of electronic and microprocessor based devices ranging from dimmers to computer controlled refrigerators.

Where a 2 to 5 mV/m signal could be heard in homes and the workplace, it takes 10 to 15 mV/m to get listening today.

Loosening directional patterns won't make any difference. The tired "rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic" analogy comes to mind.

Oh, and add in the horrible decline in the AM section of radios in the last three decades... and the radio-containing devices with no AM at all, and what we need is a hearse, not a bunch of NAB meetings.

Not to mention the horrible hiss from IBOC crapping things up, as well.

 

[Bud50]

A few years ago, when WLVV was up for sale (1410, Mobile, AL), it could have been had for pennies. Several Ham radio operators here in the area begged the local Ham club to invest in it, as, by being in a brackish-water marsh, it would make a dynamite 160-meter (1.8-2.0 MHz) station! They snubbed the idea (seemingly, since it wasn't theirs) and a Catholic organization bought it. This organization immediately started going door-to-door asking for donations to get the station going again.

A couple of years later, WMOB obtained the ex-WLVV location, when it sold its grounds to Austel. Don't readily know where the Catholic organization took off for (I'll have to check), but they had refurbed the ex-WLVV facilities before WMOB got them.

Yes, it would have been a great Ham radio location....

And, I can't remember the Ham who related the story to me (I think he's a Silent Key now), but when WKRG-AM (now WNTM) would go dark at midnight years ago, he got permission to work stations on 160 meters; he just had to be off the air and ready for WKRG to be back on the air at 6 AM. He said he had a GREAT time. BTW, the three towers of (WKRG)WNTM are also in a marsh....

We Hams can dream, can't we? ;D ;D ;D

Bud, KC4HGH

 

[K6JHU]

I seem to remember that some hams got a chance to use the VOA barrage antennas before one of the US facilities was torn down. I believe they had to dial the power way down

 

[MickeyD]

IMHO the AM band cannot be saved, because the only technical solution is politically impossible.


There are simply far too many AM stations.

The vast majority of stations are not technically viable. They don't cover their entire market, at least at night. And, the need to protect them from additional interference limits the powers/patterns of other stations that might have a shot at full-market coverage.

If I were "dictator of the FCC" I would start by modifying the license of each AM station to specify the facilities it was using on Dec. 31, 1945. (yes, that means if your station was licensed after 1945, it goes away)

That decision would last a couple of weeks until they all took you to court.

 

[w9wi]

If I'm dictator, I don't have to answer to any lousy court

Absolutely, that solution is not legally viable. And for that reason, the AM band cannot be saved.

 

[TomZ]

There is a difference between being a dictator and a commentator.

Think about it

 

[Tom Wells]

Then there's someone's old joke about just being a common 'tater.

 

[KeithE4]

Then there's someone's old joke about just being a common 'tater.

That's why Mr. & Mrs. Potato Head wouldn't let their daughter marry Bill O'Reilly. ;D

 

[KeithE4]

IMHO the AM band cannot be saved, because the only technical solution is politically impossible.


There are simply far too many AM stations.

The vast majority of stations are not technically viable. They don't cover their entire market, at least at night. And, the need to protect them from additional interference limits the powers/patterns of other stations that might have a shot at full-market coverage.

If I were "dictator of the FCC" I would start by modifying the license of each AM station to specify the facilities it was using on Dec. 31, 1945. (yes, that means if your station was licensed after 1945, it goes away)

That decision would last a couple of weeks until they all took you to court.

I'd love to see the FCC attempt what the FRC did in 1928 - turned off a couple hundred or so stations and drastically changed the frequencies of most of the rest. It'd end up in court long before it would be published in the Federal Register.

 

[spunker88]

We got a few inches of snow last night, so virtually everything is bad this morning.
I also verified what I've been suspecting...
Salt Lake City does not repair or replace bad streetlights (this was also mentioned in last week's news articles about charging a "Streetlight Fee" on peoples' electric bills), to save money. As you drive in on a cold or wet morning, there is usually at least one streetlight that is not illuminated, or is very dim, on nearly every block. The noise is horrendous. A few moments later, you'll hear a loud "pop" in the radio, and the noise will go away, as you see the light come back on in the mirror.

I called in the other problem last night. The noise was very, very bad near one substation. Hope it's not another defective HV switch. One blew almost all the way across the street (different sub) when it went up in flames last year. One of the line guys called me back at home, but didn't have the equipment to look for noise.

I was always under the impression that its bad for these types of fixtures to run a failing bulb and replacing it will be cheaper in the long run one the bulb begins to fail. I know with older fluorescent ballasts they will keep trying to strike an arc across the failing bulb using more energy and shortening the life of the ballasts. The constant large discharges of trying to light a failing bulb is terrible for AM radios. Street lights are either sodium (orange) or mercury (white) based bulbs and I believe the ballasts work in a similar way to fluorescent ones.

 

[trojanrabbit]

In the 5 meter radiated emissions chamber I'm used to using, the lights are metal halide. While they're starting there's much noise up through the 100's of MHz. Once in a while one (or more) won't start and the noise never goes away, until I turn the offending bank of lights off.

Their Open Area Test Site was having similar issues at different times during the day. Traced down to a faulty fixture outside the building, made more difficult to find because the timer running the lights was off by a few hours.

There have been times when the outdoor site was unusable because of electrical noise coming from a mile or so away. We were able to triangulate from our site and pinpoint the noise source to a faulty power pole insulator.