Car Makes & Models with No AM Band.

[davideduardo]

As long as they are trying to force obsolete tech onto people, why doesn't Congress make cassette decks and CD players mandatory equipment while they're at it?

Both of those technologies have been superseded. But AM radio is still used by over 20% of all people, so it is not obsolete... yet.

 

[michael hagerty]

Both of those technologies have been superseded. But AM radio is still used by over 20% of all people, so it is not obsolete... yet.

Factor in how many of those people have already bought their last car and it gets a lot grimmer.

 

[davideduardo]

Factor in how many of those people have already bought their last car and it gets a lot grimmer.

"It's gonna' be my last car and its going to be a good one!"

My grandmother said that when she moved up to a nicer car... she ended up buying two more of them at long intervals.

 

[landtuna]

There is no valid argument. Just nostalgic memories from Boomer's, who probably aren't buying EV's anyway.

Damn right we're not! We're spending our retirement fortunes on things old folks usually buy: girlfriends tennis bracelets, expensive dinners out, vacation cruises to Pago Pago and whiskey......lots of whiskey. Oh, and that '57 Chevy I've been trying to rebuild for the past 40 years.

 

[michael hagerty]

"It's gonna' be my last car and its going to be a good one!"

My grandmother said that when she moved up to a nicer car... she ended up buying two more of them at long intervals.

Yeah, but statistically...

If you're over 65 and a current listener to AM radio, and used cars outsell new 3-to-1....and of new cars sold, only 27.8% sell to buyers over 65....

 

[landtuna]

Factor in how many of those people have already bought their last car and it gets a lot grimmer.

I had my "last car" 27 years. Had so much trouble getting in and out of it I sold it to a guy who turned it into a street racer. No AM (or anything) radio, no CD, no A/C, no amenities of any kind. Now it's a show car and you CA guys might be seeing it on display at car shows every now and then. '87 Isuzu Impulse. Guy from Reno owns it.

 

[michael hagerty]

I had my "last car" 27 years. Had so much trouble getting in and out of it I sold it to a guy who turned it into a street racer. No AM (or anything) radio, no CD, no A/C, no amenities of any kind. Now it's a show car and you CA guys might be seeing it on display at car shows every now and then. '87 Isuzu Impulse. Guy from Reno owns it.

You're saying he pulled that stuff out turning into a street racer, right? It had those amenities when you owned it?

 

[Theater of My Mind]

As long as they are trying to force obsolete tech onto people, why doesn't Congress make cassette decks and CD players mandatory equipment while they're at it?

Both of those technologies have been superseded. But AM radio is still used by over 20% of all people, so it is not obsolete... yet.

In fact AM radio IS in the process of being being superseded by streaming. Just like cassettes were in the process of being superseded by CDs, and CDs were in the process of being superseded by MP3 players when the auto industry made their calls to drop those technologies.

I'm old enough to remember when each of those previous technologies started getting removed from new vehicles. People complained then too, but it didn't take long to see that the automakers were right about where entertainment tech was headed, and the complaints faded.

David, you are the one who constantly preaches on this site about research driving corporate decisions. The automotive industry has way more money to spend on research than the radio industry. Do you think they have not done their homework?

 

[landtuna]

Both of those technologies have been superseded. But AM radio is still used by over 20% of all people, so it is not obsolete... yet.

About 5 years ago I made my 'last' coast to coast drive. The truck had AM and FM so thought I'd be great for some tunes between cities. Boy was I disappointed! Ten miles outside Jasper Junction the FM usually died so I kept searching for a worthwhile AM to bide my time. Nada! Squat! Nothing but static! Once in a while I got a dollar a hollar Bible Banger or a farm report but it was almost a complete void. Five years before that the nighttime seemed alive with hundreds of politicos bleating their time worn jingles or the various conspiracy nutballs but now, nothing. Even the very few local stations were drowned out by the neon lights of the 90+ pump truck stops I used to refuel. Funny thing though, I thought dedications had died long ago. Not so out in the Boonies!

 

[landtuna]

You're saying he pulled that stuff out turning into a street racer, right? It had those amenities when you owned it?

Yup. When I had it you could not see the ground thru the engine bay. The other major thing he got rid of was all the smog equipment. He had plans to remove the power window actuators too but decided it wasn't worth the effort. Front engine, rear drive, no anti skid. That thing was FUN to drive!

 

[michael hagerty]

Yup. When I had it you could not see the ground thru the engine bay. The other major thing he got rid of was all the smog equipment. He had plans to remove the power window actuators too but decided it wasn't worth the effort. Front engine, rear drive, no anti skid. That thing was FUN to drive!

I test drove one back in the day (before I started writing about cars). I liked it. Wasn't in the market at the time.

 

[boombox4]

This article by the NAB president touches on many of the issues we were discussing here. I didn't realize that 47 million Americans listened to AM radio. That's a bigger number of listeners than I would have thought possible, especially with all the entertainment offerings on the FM band.

Preserving AM radio in cars

"All the entertainment offerings on the FM band" = 4-5 formats, often with multiple stations in each market for each format, all playing the same heavily researched short playlists.

Like you, though, I wasn't aware of the 47 million figure. Last I heard, AM has roughly 16% of the listening audience, and I think that figure was from 2016 or so.

 

[boombox4]

That leaves 284.9 million Americans who don't listen to AM radio.

And therein lies the problem.

True, but how many of those 280 million, non-AM listeners (and many of them probably switch between AM and FM) are in prime demos? Maybe 130 million people out of the US population total?

It's just slicing and dicing. The US has 330 million people total, and according to the demographic breakdown stats I could find, age 20-49 adds up to 130-135 million. Versus 47 million who listen to AM radio. The raw numbers don't matter.

Stations and networks target different demos. They don't all target the entire population. They don't even target the entire population that listens to FM.

 

[boombox4]

Being pretty familiar with media consumption of Arabic language programming in the U.S., most are listening to programming from streaming, mainly sources from their home countries. As with a lot of foreign language programming carried on radio, much is block/paid by an individual, or group in that community trying to reach, successfully or no, that audience. This is especially true, considering 99% of people in the U.S. who are from MENA, own and use smartphones for not just consumption of media and entertainment, but communication back to their countries of origin.

But the fact is, just because it's on an AM station, doesn't mean any majority know it's even there, let alone listen.

There are maybe 2-3 million Arab Americans in the entire country, and a lot of them are English speaking, 2nd-3rd generation. Probably not enough first or second generation Arabic speakers in most markets to support an Arabic language station.

That said, there are maybe 5 million Americans whose ancestry is from the Indian Subcontinent, and they seem to support a lot more radio stations. So obviously different immigrant ethnicities consume audio content differently.

 

[boombox4]

When you think about it, there's probably easily that number which is mostly made up of male, white, Boomer's.

You keep harping on "male, white Boomers" when a lot of older women listen to AM religious and talk radio, and a lot of older blacks listen to AM stations that either play old school R&B (like KYIZ in Seattle, KBMS in Portland) or religious AM stations (over half the popular preachers / teachers I've heard on protestant, religious talk radio are African American) and Black Gospel stations in the south. Plus BIN has maybe 10-20K listeners in any metro there is an outlet, for whatever that is worth.

And in my market it seems at least 1/3 to 1/2 of the stations cater to foreign language broadcasting. So the audience for AM is more diverse than over 55, white men.

 

[Kelly A]

You keep harping on "male, white Boomers" when a lot of older women listen to AM religious and talk radio, and a lot of older blacks listen to AM stations that either play old school R&B (like KYIZ in Seattle, KBMS in Portland) or religious AM stations (over half the popular preachers / teachers I've heard on protestant, religious talk radio are African American) and Black Gospel stations in the south. Plus BIN has maybe 10-20K listeners in any metro there is an outlet, for whatever that is worth.

Your comments that "a lot of": represent your personal anecdotal beliefs more than actual data. There's a reason the majority of right wing talk programming is on AM, because older white males are accustomed to listening there. Is there other programming? Sure, but the numbers of other particular demographics do not come close to approaching senior white males listening to talk radio.

And in my market it seems at least 1/3 to 1/2 of the stations cater to foreign language broadcasting. So the audience for AM is more diverse than over 55, white men.

Again, your personal anecdotal belief, not representative of a national audience.

 

[PTBoardOp94]

Plus BIN has maybe 10-20K listeners in any metro there is an outlet, for whatever that is worth.

Practically nothing. The 14k cume listeners to KHHO in Seattle represents 0.3% of the market. You could reach that many people in a week marching outside a Safeway with a bullhorn.

 

[michael hagerty]

Like you, though, I wasn't aware of the 47 million figure. Last I heard, AM has roughly 16% of the listening audience, and I think that figure was from 2016 or so.

U.S. population is 331 million. 16% of that is 52 million. So we're in the rough ballpark here.

 

[michael hagerty]

True, but how many of those 280 million, non-AM listeners (and many of them probably switch between AM and FM)

Gonna stop you right there. IF they switched between AM and FM, they'd be counted among the 47 million AM listeners. That was not 47 million Americans who listen exclusively to AM (I think we'd be scared by how small that number is).

are in prime demos? Maybe 130 million people out of the US population total?

Yeah. 127 million 25-54. There's money in 18-24, too---that's another 30 million, so there's 157 million advertisers care about.

It's just slicing and dicing. The US has 330 million people total, and according to the demographic breakdown stats I could find, age 20-49 adds up to 130-135 million. Versus 47 million who listen to AM radio. The raw numbers don't matter.

Stations and networks target different demos. They don't all target the entire population. They don't even target the entire population that listens to FM.

What you're missing here---and this is a discussion about the future of AM radio, in cars and elsewhere---is that 47 million Americans is 15% of the population, meaning 85% of Americans don't listen to AM.

 

[michael hagerty]

"All the entertainment offerings on the FM band" = 4-5 formats, often with multiple stations in each market for each format, all playing the same heavily researched short playlists.

Depends on the market.