Car Makes & Models with No AM Band.

[landtuna]

Most places I know, there are still standards imposed by the government on how your burrito is cooked, cleanliness, temperature, storage, etc. (Despite the relentless mocking of the woman who sued McDonald's over hot coffee, it wasn't just hot, it was scalding to the point of causing major burns).

There was an online story a few days ago similar to the "hot coffee" lawsuit but it was McD's chicken nuggets and a young kid customer. Same outcome.

 

[landtuna]

Not for much longer if the state of California gets their way!

Even if CA should manage to discontinue ICE passenger cars there are a whole host of other vehicle forms, mainly trucks, that cannot be forced to become EV's due to the miserable load and towing capacities of EV trucks.

Also, the average lifetime of a typical ICE car today is 10-11 years. It will take that long to get rid of the current batch of ICE cars in CA. And, using Cuba as an example, there are plenty of ICE cars there that have been on the road over 50 years now. It could happen here.

EV's are being marketed as the "savior of the Earth" but they are far from it. Someday, someone with high visibility will call the "Greenies" on this point and EV's will collapse in a cloud of dust. Or perhaps we'll all be driving golf carts. Well, I won't but some of you might.

 

[michael hagerty]

Also, the average lifetime of a typical ICE car today is 10-11 years. It will take that long to get rid of the current batch of ICE cars in CA. And, using Cuba as an example, there are plenty of ICE cars there that have been on the road over 50 years now. It could happen here.

It went up just this week to 12.5 years.

I've done the math in other posts---if ICE cars stopped being sold TODAY, it would take 16.5 years of back-to-back record sales years to completely replace all the fossil-fuel burning passenger vehicles in the country.

We've never had two back-to-back record years. Pair that with the target being 2035 instead of today, and you're looking at 25-40 years before ICE cars slip below 10 percent of the country's fleet.

 

[davideduardo]

Also, the average lifetime of a typical ICE car today is 10-11 years.
It will take that long to get rid of the current batch of ICE cars in CA.

No, that means that half the cars are kept over 12 years (the average today). So it will take 12 years just to get rid of half of all ICE cars if new ones are banned today; it will take over 20 years to get rid of "all" of them.

And, using Cuba as an example, there are plenty of ICE cars there that have been on the road over 50 years now. It could happen here.

Actually, there are very few of those 50 year old cars on the road in Cuba. The few that exist are in the tourist areas of La Habana for show and even paid photo ops.

EV's are being marketed as the "savior of the Earth" but they are far from it. Someday, someone with high visibility will call the "Greenies" on this point and EV's will collapse in a cloud of dust. Or perhaps we'll all be driving golf carts. Well, I won't but some of you might.

All we have to do is look at the several African nations where rare earths are coming from to see the horrible environmental damage being done; then look at the battery factories in China and the opening of one major fossil fuel generating plant a week there to power the battery manufacturers.

 

[kfbkfb]

It shouldn't be that difficult to develop an AM radio IC that implements everything known about reducing the audibility of interference in AM radio and make that IC widely available to vehicle makers (perhaps the AM NR schemes could make AM radio viable with the existing Tesla designs).


Kirk Bayne

 

[kevtronics]

As late as 1984 (possibly later, but I bought an '84 new), Honda shipped its cars to the USA without radios. They "recommended" their own branded units, sold as dealer-installed options (I went for a new Alpine unit instead), but you could simply have chosen not to put one in at all, and perhaps some folks did.

In the 2000s you could still get a base model Honda Civic with no radio. But few dealers ordered that model.

The last mainstream production car in the U.S. market with no radio (and no air conditioning!) that I know of was the base model 2011-2012 VW Jetta:

Did You Know That You Can Still Buy A New VW Without A Radio? - 1A Auto

VDub2625 over on VWVortex spotted this new Jetta in a local dealer. It is the meaning of a base model, like no radio sort of "base". Why you ask? Well, because they are selling it brand new for $13K, and viola, it is posted all over the interwebs for being a strange bird. Win? Lose? I don't...

blog.1aauto.com

 

[michael hagerty]

It shouldn't be that difficult to develop an AM radio IC that implements everything known about reducing the audibility of interference in AM radio and make that IC widely available to vehicle makers (perhaps the AM NR schemes could make AM radio viable with the existing Tesla designs).


Kirk Bayne

As we've said before, several times---Tesla is the only car company not including AM that uses interference as its excuse (never mind that its cars had AM until 2018). American and Asian EVs have AM radio and no interference issues.

The move now by Ford to drop AM is more about the cost of including a feature that few buyers seem to care about.

For Tesla, whose cars do not offer Sirius XM, Apple CarPlay or Android Auto, I suspect it's Elon's desire to control and monetize the infotainment in his vehicles---a road GM seems to be heading down, as well:

Like Apple CarPlay? You Won't Be Able to Get It on Future GM EVs

 

[Michi]

In the 2000s you could still get a base model Honda Civic with no radio. But few dealers ordered that model.

I remember my spouse telling me about my father in law who once had a serious cheapskate moment. He was going to buy a new pickup truck and it had an AM/FM radio in it. He wanted to swap out the AM/FM with an AM only thinking it would be cheaper. It turned out it would have been more expensive to be AM only.

 

[michael hagerty]

I remember my spouse telling me about my father in law who once had a serious cheapskate moment. He was going to buy a new pickup truck and it had an AM/FM radio in it. He wanted to swap out the AM/FM with an AM only thinking it would be cheaper. It turned out it would have been more expensive to be AM only.

There used to be significant pricing differences in the 60s and 70s. An AM radio might be $65, where an AM/FM could be $130.

 

[michael hagerty]

Perry Michael Simon at AllAccess weighs in:

I Can Fix That by Perry Michael Simon

 

[kevtronics]

5G in every car would be great... until 6G comes along and suddenly major features of your vehicle don't work anymore.

My 2018 Jetta came with Car-Net (VW's equivalent of GM's OnStar), and by 2021 it was already non-functional because it was based on the 3G system, which has been shut down.

VW said they would offer a free upgrade to 4G, but "due to industry-wide supply chain issues", it still isn't available yet.

 

[michael hagerty]

5G in every car would be great... until 6G comes along and suddenly major features of your vehicle don't work anymore.

My 2018 Jetta came with Car-Net (VW's equivalent of GM's OnStar), and by 2021 it was already non-functional because it was based on the 3G system, which has been shut down.

VW said they would offer a free upgrade to 4G, but "due to industry-wide supply chain issues", it still isn't available yet.

Excellent point. And 6G is scheduled for rollout in just seven years.

 

[Michi]

There used to be significant pricing differences in the 60s and 70s. An AM radio might be $65, where an AM/FM could be $130.

In the case of our family, I think the big price difference was the labor charges by the dealer to make the change.

 

[landtuna]

No, that means that half the cars are kept over 12 years (the average today). So it will take 12 years just to get rid of half of all ICE cars if new ones are banned today; it will take over 20 years to get rid of "all" of them.

I was trying to keep the math simple and give a best case scenario.

One big drawback....how will future ICE car owners retro their rides to keep the fancy stuff working? Do we have kits yet to replace electric windows?

Actually, there are very few of those 50 year old cars on the road in Cuba. The few that exist are in the tourist areas of La Habana for show and even paid photo ops.

So, is Cuba stuffed with worn out Trablants?

All we have to do is look at the several African nations where rare earths are coming from to see the horrible environmental damage being done; then look at the battery factories in China and the opening of one major fossil fuel generating plant a week there to power the battery manufacturers.

Roger this! Added to the fact that these types of metals are usually found in non-USA friendly countries.

 

[TheBigA]

Here's an article with some reactions to the AM For Every Vehicle Act. One from the Hispanic Media Coalition, and the other from the Consumer Technology Association:

Groups Offer Opposing Views On ‘AM for Every Vehicle Act.’

The fight for AM radio’s survival in vehicle dashboards took a major step forward with the introduction Wednesday of the proposed AM for Every Vehicle Act, which would require carmakers

www.insideradio.com

Comparing AM radio to 8-Track misses the point. 8 track tape players are not licensed or regulated by the government. They are not required to provide emergency information. And truthfully the law doesn't "mandate" AM radio in every vehicle. There's an out if a company doesn't want to include AM. All they have to do is inform the customers that the car doesn't include AM.

Still, I really would be surprised if this gets passed. It's really low on the priority list for these folks.

 

[vchimpanzee]

Until recently I didn't know cars ever came with no radio, because I had never seen one. After a thread (not here) with someone lamenting that people spent money on things they didn't need )"why aren't you using a flip phone? Why do you have a computer? You can stop by employers and fill out paper applications!" and "why are you driving cars with radios, power brakes, power windows and power steering?" The radio part was interesting.

My parents had a '66 Ford Falcon which didn't have a radio. I remember one morning seeing this new car in the driveway. Our '62 Falcon had just quit. I remember having a radio the next place we lived so it might have been in the '63 Ford Galaxie we had to get so my mother could get to work. And we traded the Falcon for a '68 Chevy at some point.

 

[vchimpanzee]

After reading through the entire bill. I don't see anywhere that it says the AM signal must be received without any interference. So even if it's required, electric cars and people driving by them will still have problems hearing AM stations.

I find that 18-wheelers cause interference on AM but they go by pretty fast.

 

[vchimpanzee]

If radios were the only way advertisers could reach consumers (other than billboards) in the car, radios wouldn't be going away.

North Carolina may pass a law requiring trees to be cut so people can see billboards. Now this brings up the question of whether the information can be provided some other way. A small sign could say turn to 530 AM or 1710 AM. Or there might be some online way of communicating, but not everyone will have that.

Last night on "Young Sheldon" there was an amazingly realistic weather bulletin in a car. And the tornado showed up a few minutes later.

 

[kevtronics]

So, is Cuba stuffed with worn out Trablants?

No, Trabant was an East German car which ended production soon after the Berlin Wall came down.

Most of the cars in Cuba today are from Russia or China:

10 Cars You’ll See in Cuba (Surprise! They’re Not All American Classics)

A car spotter’s guide to an automotive landscape few Americans have seen.

www.autoweek.com

 

[michael hagerty]

One big drawback....how will future ICE car owners retro their rides to keep the fancy stuff working? Do we have kits yet to replace electric windows?

So, is Cuba stuffed with worn out Trablants?

Updating old tech in ICE cars is already problematic. Try replacing a '98 Lexus nav system.

Trabants? No. More contemporary Russian cars based on old Fiat platforms, yes. Plus, when most countries lifted their trade bans and Cuba its import bans ten-ish years ago, new Chinese cars, South Korean Kias and French Peugeots became available. Most, however, are priced out of the means of a typical Cuban.