Wow....This is such a coo song-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2oRqyn7ToQ
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e2oRqyn7ToQ
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Chris Brown Ft. Benny Benassi- Beautiful People
- Thread starter saradio1
- Start date
Its already charting at Hot Dance Airplay. Its also picking up spins at Rhythmic.
M
Mid West Clubber
Guest
I like it
Amazing how a mainstream artist now embraces pure dance music. It's happening all over Top 40 world. If I wasn't paying attention, I might wake up and still think I'm dreaming but a dance music revolution ala 1988-1996 era isn't just on the way, I think it's here. Never thought it would arrive. Mainstream Top 40 is like over 50% dance music now. Maybe more! How long will it last? 
Z
Z
This was one of the four or five songs with the same house beat pattern I was talking about coming soon over the next few weeks to mainstream radio. The song is great. However, unlike back in the 90's and 80's, I think we're on the verge of overdoing it with all the dance hits with identical beat patterns. Dance had a long run of mediocre coexistence with other genres of music in U.S. top 40 mainstream since the 80's through about 2002 or 2003 before it "died". Now, however, it seems like more than a coexistence these days... since unlike the past, there's a lot less hip hop and alternative rock present in the mainstream to balance things out. This may cause a crash & burn, especially with (almost) everything having the same beat. Dance coexisting with other genres over a long period of time is good, but what's going on now is almost too trendy - like something that will just blow up huge, come all at once, then die out.
I will admit that this Chris Brown song is another good song, out of the many generic, soft, light-uptempo, dance hits with somewhat poor quality lyrics. This generic quality thing is another thing I think will help to eventually kill the trend - and make it die faster than it naturally has to.
Don't get me wrong - I do love what's going on, but right now there's just way too much of it going on to expect any sort of LONG term success. All those long posts I posted in the past about the possibilities of the future of dance are now sort of outdated because too much is already going on all at once. It's better to have mediocre success over a long period of time than to hit so big all at once then burn out. My suggestion to all writers/singers/producers would be to at least sit back a bit and take time to make more quality productions that may be worthy of being more memorable in the LONG run of things - and break away from the "sea of sameness". Hip hop had a long run - UNTIL the quality of it fell apart and more and more things started sounding the same, instrumental production-wise.
I will admit that this Chris Brown song is another good song, out of the many generic, soft, light-uptempo, dance hits with somewhat poor quality lyrics. This generic quality thing is another thing I think will help to eventually kill the trend - and make it die faster than it naturally has to.
Don't get me wrong - I do love what's going on, but right now there's just way too much of it going on to expect any sort of LONG term success. All those long posts I posted in the past about the possibilities of the future of dance are now sort of outdated because too much is already going on all at once. It's better to have mediocre success over a long period of time than to hit so big all at once then burn out. My suggestion to all writers/singers/producers would be to at least sit back a bit and take time to make more quality productions that may be worthy of being more memorable in the LONG run of things - and break away from the "sea of sameness". Hip hop had a long run - UNTIL the quality of it fell apart and more and more things started sounding the same, instrumental production-wise.
DJ_Perry said:
I think I "sort of" understand what KDM is speaking about. In the late 80's/early 90's, there wasn't just one specific type of "dance" sound on the radio:
You had the Depeche Mode, Anything Box, T42, Cause & Effect, 7 Red 7, etc. sound
The Corina, Stevie B, Lisette Melendez, etc. sound
The Erasure, New Order, Yaz, Book of Love, the Other Two, etc. sound
The C&C Music Factory, Black Box, Technotronic, 49ers, Snap, etc. sound
The Deee-Lite, DNA, etc. sound
The Right Said Fred, Gary Clail, LaTour, etc. sound
The Shamen, KLF, etc. sound
The EFM, Jesus Jones, The Farm, Stereo MC's, Happy Mondays, etc. sound
Other artists like Madonna, Cathy Dennis, Crystal Waters, Clubland, CeCe Penniston, Saint Etienne, Lil Louis, Inner City, Peter Schilling, Opus III, Sunscreem, Siouxsie & The Banshees, Enigma, Bingoboys, Rozalla, Londonbeat, TKA, Jomanda, Nick Kamen, Pet Shop Boys, The Party, Will to Power, Dead or Alive, Noel, When in Rome, S'Express, Information Society, Cover Girls, Sweet Sensation, Ten City, Bomb the Bass, Camouflage, Nine Inch Nails, Rob Bass, Jimmy Somerville, etc., etc., etc...
KDM 7000 said:
We dont need mediocre, we need hits. Why does this genre always have to settle for ok songs and not great songs. Whats happening right now is great. Hip-hop and dance producers working together and pop artists working with more dance producers. We need pop hits from this genre. Last time I checked Top 40 was not filled with songs with great lyrics but catchy ones instead. If this genre starts banging out hits, it will have a good run. Martin Solveig is getting a push and is a catchy song. Be positive and enjoy the ride
Dancerev889 said:
I'll just say it...
When many of the songs start sounding similar on the radio (CHR), there's nothing exciteable about it. It's one thing for a couple of artists to try something different or outside of their usual "comfort zone", but it's another thing when they all start imitating each other. Doesn't that take away from their individuality a little bit? Don't get me wrong, I certainly understand that artists take bits and pieces of what they appreciate from other artists and incorporate it into their own style, but I'm frankly sick and tired of hearing the same artists on the radio over and over and over and over...2,3,4 songs out at the same time - and I feel like because they are played so frequently, they "become" hits...not the other way around. I'm sure there are more than the same 10-20 artists out there that are capable of hits, yet unfortunately, we only get the same few artists over and over.
Thank you 2son. You save me (or everyone else rather) from me having to redeliver a full detailed explanation version of this! As I said earlier, we need hits and should make mediocre MUSIC. However, the overall success is what is better off mediocre over a longer period of time, rather than just having a quick, full force, overboard success rate at one punch then dying completely due to going overboard.
THE MUSIC - MAKE IT MEMORABLE
BUT THE OVERALL SUCCESS ALTOGETHER, LETS NOT OVERDO IT
And lastly, let just about every hip hop song today have the same "boom, click boom click click boom click" beat sound, or any variation of that beat style pattern if they wish, but in dance we should not forget that there's more than one way to arrange beat patterns that are still dance. Does anyone remember back when hip hop (was doing extremely well, and) had a BUNCH of different songs - with DIFFERENT beat styles/patterns? (I may provide a full list of examples later if necessary.) Remember back when you could hear a hip hop mix and every song in that mix had it's own, different instrumental beat style and pattern - that wasn't arranged like every other song (rather than the current boom, click boom click click boom click stuff)? Well, just like hip hop, there was also a time when radio dance hits had a VARIETY of beat styles and patterns - rather than just one (although it didn't really reflect too much on any dance stations).
Just like the big California earthquake, a comet strike, or a massive flood eventually wiping out a coastal city, people don't like to hear it or know about it and want to pretend that it will never happen instead of accepting the fact something needs to be changed to lessen the problem that's eminent... but I'm telling you - if this dance "formula and strategy" continues the way it's currently going, it WILL back fire big time and there will be no LONG term success. People will get tired... | And what is the number one complaint and joke about "techno"? "It all has the same beat". Just heard another joke about it yesterday, on Comedy Unleashed. Dance hits in the 80's and 90's lasted a long time because it had many styles - and - coexisted with ok (mediocre) overall success amongst other genres and sounds rather than taking over all at once all at one time - with ONE production style. Everything dies eventually, but you can also give things the ingredients to make the death occur FASTER THAN NECESSARY.
THE MUSIC - MAKE IT MEMORABLE
KDM 7000 said:
BUT THE OVERALL SUCCESS ALTOGETHER, LETS NOT OVERDO IT
KDM 7000 said:
And lastly, let just about every hip hop song today have the same "boom, click boom click click boom click" beat sound, or any variation of that beat style pattern if they wish, but in dance we should not forget that there's more than one way to arrange beat patterns that are still dance. Does anyone remember back when hip hop (was doing extremely well, and) had a BUNCH of different songs - with DIFFERENT beat styles/patterns? (I may provide a full list of examples later if necessary.) Remember back when you could hear a hip hop mix and every song in that mix had it's own, different instrumental beat style and pattern - that wasn't arranged like every other song (rather than the current boom, click boom click click boom click stuff)? Well, just like hip hop, there was also a time when radio dance hits had a VARIETY of beat styles and patterns - rather than just one (although it didn't really reflect too much on any dance stations).
Just like the big California earthquake, a comet strike, or a massive flood eventually wiping out a coastal city, people don't like to hear it or know about it and want to pretend that it will never happen instead of accepting the fact something needs to be changed to lessen the problem that's eminent... but I'm telling you - if this dance "formula and strategy" continues the way it's currently going, it WILL back fire big time and there will be no LONG term success. People will get tired... | And what is the number one complaint and joke about "techno"? "It all has the same beat". Just heard another joke about it yesterday, on Comedy Unleashed. Dance hits in the 80's and 90's lasted a long time because it had many styles - and - coexisted with ok (mediocre) overall success amongst other genres and sounds rather than taking over all at once all at one time - with ONE production style. Everything dies eventually, but you can also give things the ingredients to make the death occur FASTER THAN NECESSARY.
Also, keep in mind that the U.S. musically influences other countries to a huge degree. Many of these uptempo dance hits are also flooding over into other countries - where dance is ALREADY part of the norm. With that being said, just know that any backlash that occurs this time will not only be in the U.S... (In other words, our backlash will also influence other countries to backlash as well - ESPECIALLY MORE SO IF they are being over flooded with one sound - that has been "corrupted by America" in addition to their own dance sound).
We better changed things up and get more creative before the general public begins to think that this one production sound & beat style is the only thing dance has to offer (which is a stereotype that has already been developed..). I guess we can talk about the success of the now dead disco phase, but what about the long term success of all the different styles of uptempo dance that managed to make it with other genres in top 40 - for multiple years? Yes, euro-dance died, but that sound coexisted with OTHER styles of uptempo dance and did not take over, and dance itself managed to move on and continue some radio success after that phase. I'm not exactly sure that this time there are enough other styles of dance to "move on with" if the current dance style dies or receives backlash. Now that I think of it, I probably should've said the same thing about how too many reggaeton productions having the same beat structure could hurt the sound - back when I had the chance. Too late now.
This is not positivity or negativity, this is REALITY. I'm basically just stating what will happen if nothing changes in the way things are being done, overall. No where did I mention whether I love it or hate it, personally, and I'm not saying everyone has to abide by my rules and change anything. I'm just saying that if things continue as is, ....well, enjoy the ride, NOW.
And who knows.. maybe the future of internet radio can save the day before the next terrestrial radio and mainstream media trend occurs!
We better changed things up and get more creative before the general public begins to think that this one production sound & beat style is the only thing dance has to offer (which is a stereotype that has already been developed..). I guess we can talk about the success of the now dead disco phase, but what about the long term success of all the different styles of uptempo dance that managed to make it with other genres in top 40 - for multiple years? Yes, euro-dance died, but that sound coexisted with OTHER styles of uptempo dance and did not take over, and dance itself managed to move on and continue some radio success after that phase. I'm not exactly sure that this time there are enough other styles of dance to "move on with" if the current dance style dies or receives backlash. Now that I think of it, I probably should've said the same thing about how too many reggaeton productions having the same beat structure could hurt the sound - back when I had the chance. Too late now.
This is not positivity or negativity, this is REALITY. I'm basically just stating what will happen if nothing changes in the way things are being done, overall. No where did I mention whether I love it or hate it, personally, and I'm not saying everyone has to abide by my rules and change anything. I'm just saying that if things continue as is, ....well, enjoy the ride, NOW.
And who knows.. maybe the future of internet radio can save the day before the next terrestrial radio and mainstream media trend occurs!
KDM 7000 said:
CORRECTION! Change Should to SHOULDN'T
NO mediocre music! Just well done HITS with an overall mediocre rate of success causing SOME dance hits to make it big over a long period of time, rather than a bunch of mediocre hits all hitting all at once & flooding the charts - then COMPLETELY dying in a few short years.
To clarify a bit further:
I'd rather have a non trendy 6-8 well done dance production hits make it big in a 3 month period and continue this moderate rate of success for a long time than to have 12-16+ ok mediocre hits flood the charts now, creating a trend, then have that number fall down to only 1 or 0 dance hits a month shortly down the road when the trend ends.
My mind is beginning to draw a blank so I don't think I can clarify it any more. Whatever other typos I've made earlier in my second attempts to explain above will just have to remain unclarified for now.
KDM 7000 said:
This music isnt techno! You are talking about pop artists. The average listeners is not calling it dance music they are calling it pop. We are going through a cycle right now which is becoming pro dance. The only thing that needs to change with this genre is the "dance" artists have to come out with more hits. The songs have to be catchy. People are sipping tea breaking down the lyrics, the people that are going to listen to this are jamming out in their cars on their way home from work or going out for the evening. Thats what makes these songs successful. You have a catchy hook thats what will get that song played. Look at all the songs coming out now. We have saxophones playing, an Italian vibe and an accordian playing.
Things are happening for the first time that I can remember driving to Atlantic City, I saw 5 major billboards promoting DJ's spinning like they were Frank Sinatra. Paul Van Dyk is going for syndication here in the US. The movement is happening. Is it going to stay around forever, no because programming goes in cycles. Who would ever imagine Snoop Dogg working with a dance producer?
Dancerev889 said:
Dance artists have to come out with more "hits" and they have to be "catchy"? What does that mean? Dance artists aren't capable of "hits" or "catchy" tunes? Are you suggesting that they need to sacrifice their individuality to become more popular? How about we start getting some radio airplay from some of these dance artists rather than hearing the same 10-20 "pop" artists over and over again (with 3 songs released around the same time). Like I stated earlier, in many instances, songs become "hits" because they are played to the point of annoyance. Do you really believe that there are only 10-20 artists capable of "hits"?
Judging by CHR airplay nationwide, I'd say yes their's at most about 20 artists capable of getting airplay. There's tons of great songs that get brushed off.
What makes a song a hit? The hook. Thats the catch. I did not say all dance artists do not have catchy lyrics but there quite a few that dont. We accept mediocre songs and want them to go over the top. Just think about every song that you know by heart that every time it comes on you sing along. Those are hits. Those are the songs that are needed for this genre. The lyrics need to be catchy so that the average listener will sing a long.
Programmers are looking for hits not dance, pop or hip hop records. I as a programmer am playing more pop records than I ever have and I am considered a dance station.
Programmers are looking for hits not dance, pop or hip hop records. I as a programmer am playing more pop records than I ever have and I am considered a dance station.
During the WMC, I went to a panel regarding songwriting. I wanted to do something beyond just going to the radio panels so I attended this one.
MANY good points were brought up but the basic premise is that (echoing what Brett said) you have to create that track that people will sing years down the road.
Let's bring up Crystal Waters (she was a panelist there). People will ALWAYS remember LA DA DIII LA DI DAHHHHH. Most people think that's the name of the track! Very few people EVER think of "Gypsy Woman (She's Homeless") That hook SOLD it for her! Take ANY one of your favorite songs and sing along. That's the point. That's what HAS to come back.
I'm pretty sick of the "cookie cutter" tracks that everyone seems to be doing now "Going to da club, me and my girls look hot, we got VIP, gonna get drunk"....THIS song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD2LRROpph0. If all of that represents the best talent that dance music has, then no wonder why we've been stuck in a rut. Somehow writing has to get back in there....not just a sample of someone saying three words but doing the basics of writing such a song (at least something on the "8 bars").
MANY good points were brought up but the basic premise is that (echoing what Brett said) you have to create that track that people will sing years down the road.
Let's bring up Crystal Waters (she was a panelist there). People will ALWAYS remember LA DA DIII LA DI DAHHHHH. Most people think that's the name of the track! Very few people EVER think of "Gypsy Woman (She's Homeless") That hook SOLD it for her! Take ANY one of your favorite songs and sing along. That's the point. That's what HAS to come back.
I'm pretty sick of the "cookie cutter" tracks that everyone seems to be doing now "Going to da club, me and my girls look hot, we got VIP, gonna get drunk"....THIS song http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CD2LRROpph0. If all of that represents the best talent that dance music has, then no wonder why we've been stuck in a rut. Somehow writing has to get back in there....not just a sample of someone saying three words but doing the basics of writing such a song (at least something on the "8 bars").
Dancerev889 said:
I would've never imagined it happening in actuality...or reality... but this type of idea has been something I've been "preaching hard" since about 1998 - hip hop & dance artists / producers collaborating and doing things different. I didn't ever think 11 years later it would actually start happening, but then again, in 1998 I was not yet aware that "things would change" or that there were any cycles. I had the typical "this is how it is and how it will be forever" high school mindset (and I think it's growing up with this mindset and learning that had/has everyone so shocked with either disappointment or excitement when things did change as hip hop began to fall). Also, with the amount of 80's hits still getting recognition during that time combined with the fact I was still pretty young, I didn't really notice any "change" from the 80's to the 90's as much as I would've noticed it if I were at the age I am now, back then.
Anyway, well I'm glad that the dance sound is doing well, but this new typical mediocre electro house beat with some dude rap-singing in autotune just makes the rest of it look bad.
As far as if it's "techno" (or house / dance) or not, well, I need to find that post on facebook where a well known Florida dj was saying "A lot of people don't realize that Jennifer Lopez and what's going on today is actually house music and they think it's pop...." which was followed with a bunch of comments of agreements. Just in case you were wondering, I didn't say anything.
2Son said:
I think in this case, he means dance artists have to "suck it up" a bit and appeal more to the mainstream if they truly want more overall success and recognition (not that this means we're all necessarily going to LIKE having to do this). After all, many hip hop and r&b artists also had to (willingly or unwillingly) "change their game" as well to be, or stay relevant today.
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