CJRN?

[JohnW]

While scanning the car radio AM dial in Henrietta, waiting for my wife to shop, I heard a foreign language on 710 CJRN. Last I heard, it was a Niagara area travel info format. Has the format changed? Is it still CJRN?

 

[JakeLongwell]

As far as I know, CJRN is sitll mostly a TIS station. However, I wouldn't be surprised if they broker some time to ethnic programming, as so many smaller AMs are doing these days. I'm sure the leased time programming brings in more money than the tourist info ever will.

 

[fybush]

For a few years now, they've had Arabic-language programming during Ramadan, and I know they lease time for Canisus College sports, aimed across the river at Buffalo.

 

[Bob1370]

If you go a few miles east of Monroe County, either into Wayne or Ontario counties, you find CJRN gets swamped or obliterated at night by WOR out of New York. This didn't happen a few years ago. It happens every night now, with WOR on a typical car radio now coming in at night almost as strongly as WFAN and WABC at either side of it on the dial. You don't lose 'OR until you get pretty close to Rochester.

Leaving aside how CJRN was ever permitted to go on 710 in the first place, you have to wonder if WOR's recent rebuild on a new north Jersey transmitter site, also loosened its directional pattern and put its signal deeper into central and western NY State at night than it used to. And that has to be affecting CJRN's coverage after dark as well, even in areas where it's supposed to be the primary signal.

 

[Yeziknoradio]

you have to wonder if WOR's recent rebuild on a new north Jersey transmitter site, also loosened its directional pattern and put its signal deeper into central and western NY State at night than it used to. And that has to be affecting CJRN's coverage after dark as well, even in areas where it's supposed to be the primary signal.

The strangest thing:

Stay at the Travel Lodge on Clifton Hill in one of their rooms at the back parking lot.
AM 740 is loud and clear, but CJRN 710 sounds very far away-as if it were the Oakville station!

 

[fybush]

Leaving aside how CJRN was ever permitted to go on 710 in the first place, you have to wonder if WOR's recent rebuild on a new north Jersey transmitter site, also loosened its directional pattern and put its signal deeper into central and western NY State at night than it used to. And that has to be affecting CJRN's coverage after dark as well, even in areas where it's supposed to be the primary signal.

It certainly does - and it doesn't help matters that CJRN's own transmitter site has reportedly deteriorated significantly in recent years, too. Keeping 12 towers in tune isn't an easy task under the best of circumstances.

 

[DXingRadio]

Well 710's non-English and non-tourist programing has landed CJRN without a license. The CRTC has ordered them off the air at the end of November. Whoops!

http://www.crtc.gc.ca/eng/archive/2012/2012-550.htm

 

[chas108]

Did I read that correctly...that CJRN was licensed as to only broadcast "pre-recorded tourist information to visitors of Niagara Falls" as a non-com?

Scott, did they have 12 towers back when they were broadcasting at 1600? (IOW when I lived on Stanley Ave and attended Princess Margaret in 7th grade in 1969?)

 

[Bob1370]

At this point will WOR (which had always formally objected to CJRN's presence on 710 from the beginning) now be able to file with the FCC to go non-directional, given that the only remaining full time stations licensed on that channel appear to be KDIS/Radio Disney in Los Angeles, KIRO SportsRadio 710 in Seattle, and the sharply directional KCMO in Kansas City?

 

[JustPastBuffalo]

At this point will WOR (which had always formally objected to CJRN's presence on 710 from the beginning) now be able to file with the FCC to go non-directional, given that the only remaining full time stations licensed on that channel appear to be KDIS/Radio Disney in Los Angeles, KIRO SportsRadio 710 in Seattle, and the sharply directional KCMO in Kansas City?

Probably not, given WOR's directional pattern was restricted long before CJRN occupied 710 and to continue protecting the stations in LA, Seattle and KC. First adjacent 720 WGN likely requires protection to some extent.

Did I read that correctly...that CJRN was licensed as to only broadcast "pre-recorded tourist information to visitors of Niagara Falls" as a non-com? Scott, did they have 12 towers back when they were broadcasting at 1600? (IOW when I lived on Stanley Ave and attended Princess Margaret in 7th grade in 1969?)

Although the question is directed to Scott, CJRN when operating on 1600 protected WWRL NYC and IIRC (it's been a while) utilized a four tower array. The present 710 CJRN 12 tower array in Fort Erie is quite a site. No doubt there's 'some value' to the land on which it's located.

 

[Bob1370]

"Probably not, given WOR's directional pattern was restricted long before CJRN occupied 710 and to continue protecting the stations in LA, Seattle and KC. First adjacent 720 WGN likely requires protection to some extent."

Protection rules even for class A (wide coverage) AMs have been loosened a lot. KCMO is the only possible block to a nondirectional WOR since the west coast stations are at least 2800 miles away, which even under the old NARBA treaty rules meant no protection required.

The WOR pattern as we know it was not designed for protection of any signal, but back in the early 1940s it was designed to increase field strength into NYC and the Hudson Valley compared with the nondirectional WEAF, WJZ and WCBS, all three of which had different transmitter locations pre-war than they do now. WOR back then nulled out some chunks of north Jersey and out into the Atlantic Ocean that it didn'f care about, as well as tossing a weaker signal onto Staten Island than the others. Since then a lot of population has moved into north Jersey and the island, and WOR is missing some of it now.

 

[fybush]

As with any other Canadian AM that goes away, CJRN will be deleted only domestically (assuming it doesn't challenge the license cancellation, that is!)

For international purposes, the former CJRN facility will continue to be "notified" to the FCC and will have to continue to be protected by US stations just as if it were still on the air.

CJRN wasn't getting much, if any, protection from WOR. WOR's signal does, even now, protect CKVM 710 Ville-Marie, Quebec, even though CKVM long ago moved to FM. In addition to protecting CKVM and 710 in Kansas City, WOR also protects WLW and WGN at night, and by day it would be limited in a signal increase by other daytime-only stations such as 720 in Shiremanstown PA.

 

[JakeLongwell]

Given that the courts upheld the CRTC's decision to revoke the license of another AM signal in the Niagara region (CHSC), any attempt to challenge CJRN's license revocation would be futile.

This leaves one AM station still on the air on the Canadian side of the falls, I believe. That station being CKTB (610).

 

[jefflaurence]

Does WOR not have to protect 710 in Miami?

 

[fybush]

Does WOR not have to protect 710 in Miami?

For the most part, no. WOR was there first, and in fact could have been a nondirectional 50 kW signal if it had wanted to be. It chose to go directional in the early 1930s to concentrate its signal into NYC and Philadelphia while putting less signal to the northwest (into then sparsely-populated north Jersey) and the southeast (over the ocean).

With the exception of CKVM, everything else that went on 710 came along later and had to protect WOR, not the other way around.

Having said that: each time WOR has moved since then (Carteret to Lyndhurst in 1967, Lyndhurst to East Rutherford in 2006), it has had to take newer signals into account as it has adjusted its pattern; it can't cause any new interference to newer stations like Miami or Kansas City. But that's not the same thing, exactly, as "protecting" those stations in the first place.

 

[Yeziknoradio]

What a bunch of Dummies!
How much does Tourist information cost to run?
Didn't it offer a nice tax break for the company?
Or was it not that simple?

 

[cd637299]

710 in Miami sure ain't, um, "protected." DXers know what I mean.

And certainly WOR doesn't have the coverage it used to have....for the same reason.

cd