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Classic Hits returning to Jacksonville?
- Thread starter Whiplash
- Start date
Although it is fairly standard that when an impending format change in about to occur that the effected station management will register multiple domains as a means to throw off any correct speculation, it's possible classic hits may be on the horizon at 105.3 since there is a Jacksonville market void for classic hits. Maybe JonJax will chime in with his take. I haven't seen him on here in a while. I would be very interested in reading his opinion as well as others.
So no one here considers the Eagle to be classic hits? (Or are you guys looking for a oldies format...Top 40 of the 60s, 70s, and maybe 80s?)
A quick refresher in format names...
Classic Rock.... Rock artists, mostly album cuts
Classic Hits... Hit singles by rock artists
Oldies... Top 40 hits from all genres
A quick refresher in format names...
Classic Rock.... Rock artists, mostly album cuts
Classic Hits... Hit singles by rock artists
Oldies... Top 40 hits from all genres
Ummm Classic Hits is more define what use to be called Oldies I thought. I consider Eagle to be more of a Classic Rock station than a Classic Hits station. Something that plays the hits and not just the same 200 songs on repeat. If I had the chance to program a station I would at least have 1,000 songs min on rotation. Radio in markets like Orlando, Tampa and Miami are Moe exciting than Jax. Jax is market number 50 but sounds like market number 100......just dull and boring.
I have to agree with JAWilson. To me the Eagle is more clearly defined as Classic Rock. While 96.9 does plays former Top 40 hits, the format is limited to the rock hits that appeared on the Top 40 charts. Classic Hits is what oldies morphed into when the music updated from hits from the 50s, 60s and early 70s to music from the 70s and 80s and reimaged as classic hits. In other words, Classic rock plays only the rock hits and may include select rock album cuts while classic hits plays all the Top 40 hits similar to oldies, but newer.
Nfladxer, it’s certainly good seeing you again on the board as I was getting a bit worried about you. As far as my own reduced participation goes, due to family and other circumstances I’ve been in Coral Springs, Fl (South Florida) since mid- June. I’ll be back in Jax later this week for a short time before returning to South Florida. From a radio perspective, if I could, I would just never leave. LOL.
The absence of a classic hits station in a market that is as large and diverse as Jacksonville probably represents the biggest programming hole. I must say, I have been spoiled. Obviously, I have been tuning into Magic 102.7 (WMXJ – Classic Hits) and have been enjoying it beyond what I can describe in words. They are using the same imaging guy WEJZ uses and they have paired him with an echo- enhanced futuristic sounding female voice. The contests, the jocks, the fun and then there is the music a lot of which is not heard anywhere in Jacksonville. Really, it’s a shame what has happened in Jacksonville.
I have never been a big fan of syndicated shows. However, I’ve been catching a lot of Tom Kent’s show particularly his 70’s and 80’s themed hours from 7-9 PM. My gosh, there are even songs I have forgotten that I have delighted in once again. During the July 4th holiday weekend, a couple of friends from Jax came down to visit – both in their 40’s – and when we driving around with Magic on the radio, both said why can’t Jacksonville have a good station like Magic 102.7. How does anyone really answer that question?
So I suppose it brings us to 105.3. Perhaps my answer will surprise many of you but IF 105.3 flipped to classic hits, I would not get over excited about that. History has proven that frequency has practically been format du jour for quite a long time. To do the format right, there has to be a commitment both in time and resources and programming talent to really get it off the ground. You see my points? This would amount to just settling for something and we deserve a lot more.
What is unique about Jacksonville is not only its’ land size but rather personal music tastes do change with the geography. The right signal is key and I’m afraid 105.3 is not the right signal because coverage would have to exist in all of South Duval, most of St. John’s County and even across the river, especially in the Fleming Island area. 105.3 cannot deliver that coverage. Think back to 100.7. No matter how good the old KOOL could have been, that signal would have held the format back. Just about everyone agrees, classic hits belonged on WSOS FM as the signal reached where listeners were and that never happened.
What I believe would be a better fit for 105.3 would be a niche format and to build on the previous format. Although N.E. Florida doesn’t have a substantial Hispanic population, it is still nonetheless growing and now there are displaced listeners. Perhaps Dance or something rhythmic such as a Rhythmic AC or a Rhythmic CHR would not only attract Hispanics but it could add other younger-skewing (white) demos that could help a poor signal in the billing area. It’s just my two cents.
I still believe the ball is really in CC’s court. Planet Radio listeners are pretty much in the same camp as many of us who would love to see the classic hits format return to Jacksonville. We have been loyal and we have been supportive and look at how we have been shafted. CC has two stations – RadioNow and Jack-FM. The truth is they could both go away tomorrow and outside of a few protests, most listeners couldn’t care less about either. I hope Planet gets a better signal – Planet listeners deserve that and I can only hope CC reconsiders and learns from their mistakes and brings back a much improved Magic.
Yes, I’m a dreamer. But one thing is constant. There has to be the desire, there has to be the passion, time and effort have to be expended. We’ve seen a good number of programming changes and none of them really increase the radio pie but rather it fragments and offers nothing for listeners who have no home. I’ve talked about this before but it is worth repeating. WMXJ here in S. Fla went through some very tough times. A new PD was hired and the station has never sounded better. But it took an owner and local managers to fight the fight to keep the format alive. As far as a real classic hits station goes in Jacksonville, no one really wanted to support it and give it time to make it a winner. What happened to Magic 107.3 was an absolute disgrace. WMXJ was in far worse shape - trust me. I really hope that changes do come to Jacksonville and for some of you displaced talent out there, I hope opportunity comes your way too!
The absence of a classic hits station in a market that is as large and diverse as Jacksonville probably represents the biggest programming hole. I must say, I have been spoiled. Obviously, I have been tuning into Magic 102.7 (WMXJ – Classic Hits) and have been enjoying it beyond what I can describe in words. They are using the same imaging guy WEJZ uses and they have paired him with an echo- enhanced futuristic sounding female voice. The contests, the jocks, the fun and then there is the music a lot of which is not heard anywhere in Jacksonville. Really, it’s a shame what has happened in Jacksonville.
I have never been a big fan of syndicated shows. However, I’ve been catching a lot of Tom Kent’s show particularly his 70’s and 80’s themed hours from 7-9 PM. My gosh, there are even songs I have forgotten that I have delighted in once again. During the July 4th holiday weekend, a couple of friends from Jax came down to visit – both in their 40’s – and when we driving around with Magic on the radio, both said why can’t Jacksonville have a good station like Magic 102.7. How does anyone really answer that question?
So I suppose it brings us to 105.3. Perhaps my answer will surprise many of you but IF 105.3 flipped to classic hits, I would not get over excited about that. History has proven that frequency has practically been format du jour for quite a long time. To do the format right, there has to be a commitment both in time and resources and programming talent to really get it off the ground. You see my points? This would amount to just settling for something and we deserve a lot more.
What is unique about Jacksonville is not only its’ land size but rather personal music tastes do change with the geography. The right signal is key and I’m afraid 105.3 is not the right signal because coverage would have to exist in all of South Duval, most of St. John’s County and even across the river, especially in the Fleming Island area. 105.3 cannot deliver that coverage. Think back to 100.7. No matter how good the old KOOL could have been, that signal would have held the format back. Just about everyone agrees, classic hits belonged on WSOS FM as the signal reached where listeners were and that never happened.
What I believe would be a better fit for 105.3 would be a niche format and to build on the previous format. Although N.E. Florida doesn’t have a substantial Hispanic population, it is still nonetheless growing and now there are displaced listeners. Perhaps Dance or something rhythmic such as a Rhythmic AC or a Rhythmic CHR would not only attract Hispanics but it could add other younger-skewing (white) demos that could help a poor signal in the billing area. It’s just my two cents.
I still believe the ball is really in CC’s court. Planet Radio listeners are pretty much in the same camp as many of us who would love to see the classic hits format return to Jacksonville. We have been loyal and we have been supportive and look at how we have been shafted. CC has two stations – RadioNow and Jack-FM. The truth is they could both go away tomorrow and outside of a few protests, most listeners couldn’t care less about either. I hope Planet gets a better signal – Planet listeners deserve that and I can only hope CC reconsiders and learns from their mistakes and brings back a much improved Magic.
Yes, I’m a dreamer. But one thing is constant. There has to be the desire, there has to be the passion, time and effort have to be expended. We’ve seen a good number of programming changes and none of them really increase the radio pie but rather it fragments and offers nothing for listeners who have no home. I’ve talked about this before but it is worth repeating. WMXJ here in S. Fla went through some very tough times. A new PD was hired and the station has never sounded better. But it took an owner and local managers to fight the fight to keep the format alive. As far as a real classic hits station goes in Jacksonville, no one really wanted to support it and give it time to make it a winner. What happened to Magic 107.3 was an absolute disgrace. WMXJ was in far worse shape - trust me. I really hope that changes do come to Jacksonville and for some of you displaced talent out there, I hope opportunity comes your way too!
Thank you guys but I’d like to clarify a point regarding WSOS FM @Nfladxer because I may not have been very clear. I’m not suggesting 94.1 flip to classic hits today. That time has come and gone. It’s all water under the bridge now. But to me, the logical move was Sunny 94.1 should have launched as a soft leaning/retro pop hits format from Day One back in 2005.
I don’t recall not being able to hear the station where I live (Southside) and from what I know of the signal, it covered most of the “right” areas. But more importantly, I really do have to wonder if there really was any strategic thinking or planning for the long term.
For a mom and pop operation, Renda Broadcasting was juggling lots of balls in late 2004 through a lot of 2005. It seemed liked orchestrated chaos. There was the (expensive) purchase and launch of WSOS – FM as a Soft AC. Froggy was moved from Volusia to Duval and eventually became 99.9 Gator Country. The decision was made to kill Arrow 100.7 and replace it with oldies – Kool 100.7. Arrow as not a major player for years – they should have waited for things to settle down to launch anything new there. And then, cash cow WEJZ couldn’t be neglected.
To me it would have been logical for 94.1 to have been called THE Greatest or THE Biggest Hits and not concern with location in the brand name since the frequency was eventually to move further north. Renda issued a statement announcing classic rock as the successor format on 94.1 because Sunny 94.1 was now in direct competition to WEJZ. What a mess. Had those guys – IMHO – taken a little time to think about the consequences of their decisions and actions, Jacksonville could have had the benefit of a pop oriented classic hits station all these years. It's also no wonder, both Sunny and Kool had little to no marketing budgets with the expense of moves and buys etc. It's not a way to run an airline!
Perhaps this is all a lot of speculation on my part but still it is food for thought. Some of you can say a pop oriented classic hits format is hard to sell or it doesn't work in Jax. Well, I can appreciate and understand the business side of things. But let's be honest. Listeners will be attracted to this format provided there is something in it for them and that it really rocks. It's why I am skeptical to the prospects of a 105.3 jumping in. I don't fault the listeners. It's the so called radio pros who don't always get it right.
I don’t recall not being able to hear the station where I live (Southside) and from what I know of the signal, it covered most of the “right” areas. But more importantly, I really do have to wonder if there really was any strategic thinking or planning for the long term.
For a mom and pop operation, Renda Broadcasting was juggling lots of balls in late 2004 through a lot of 2005. It seemed liked orchestrated chaos. There was the (expensive) purchase and launch of WSOS – FM as a Soft AC. Froggy was moved from Volusia to Duval and eventually became 99.9 Gator Country. The decision was made to kill Arrow 100.7 and replace it with oldies – Kool 100.7. Arrow as not a major player for years – they should have waited for things to settle down to launch anything new there. And then, cash cow WEJZ couldn’t be neglected.
To me it would have been logical for 94.1 to have been called THE Greatest or THE Biggest Hits and not concern with location in the brand name since the frequency was eventually to move further north. Renda issued a statement announcing classic rock as the successor format on 94.1 because Sunny 94.1 was now in direct competition to WEJZ. What a mess. Had those guys – IMHO – taken a little time to think about the consequences of their decisions and actions, Jacksonville could have had the benefit of a pop oriented classic hits station all these years. It's also no wonder, both Sunny and Kool had little to no marketing budgets with the expense of moves and buys etc. It's not a way to run an airline!
Perhaps this is all a lot of speculation on my part but still it is food for thought. Some of you can say a pop oriented classic hits format is hard to sell or it doesn't work in Jax. Well, I can appreciate and understand the business side of things. But let's be honest. Listeners will be attracted to this format provided there is something in it for them and that it really rocks. It's why I am skeptical to the prospects of a 105.3 jumping in. I don't fault the listeners. It's the so called radio pros who don't always get it right.
JohnJax said:
JohnJax, Yes, I made the suggestion to the OM at Renda Jax that Sunny 94.1 could evolve into a more upbeat "Sunny"... now get this, playing "Jacksonville's Greatest Hits"! This was before I left, and before W-JGH hit the air! Oh well!
IMHO the current 94.1 version of Classic Rock is a format they "parked" there, waiting for a sale.
If a new saavy owner came in, I believe 94.1 could be a player with either a Classic Hits/Oldies format or a well crafted Easy Oldies presentation, more focused than Sunny.
Given the latest format change in Jacksonville, I’d like to share a number of thoughts as this subject has taken a different turn. I will need to post a few times to adequately explain why I believe a true classic hits format has not faired well in Jacksonville. If this were Las Vegas, the odds makers would probably give 99 to 1 for a classic hits format return on a decent signal. However, over time and given certain circumstances, those odds have the potential to improve. For the classic hits fans out there, never lose hope.
I never paid much attention to this string originator’s user name – 1250WTAE. I just assumed it was a station somewhere in N.E. Florida. Well, it turns out this was a Top 40 AM station in Pittsburgh PA known as The Big 1250 WTAE. I visited their station tribute site and really enjoyed looking over their top 300 lists from the early 70’s.
,
A significant amount of time has passed since the heyday of AM music radio. Radio has changed significantly too. Simply, it had to in order to stay competitive and viable. I am on the record for embracing change and I never had an issue as it applies to a classic hits format. I understand the business part of radio. In other boards, posters constantly gripe about how the music keeps advancing in time and how favorites from their youth are now just forgotten.
I was always about reaching a good balance musically so those under the age of 54 would pull in the format too. The sweet spot always advances but there is also music that should never be forgotten either. A true classic hits format has a mass-appeal quality in a much targeted radio world. For those who do the format extremely well, that format stands out as being different from a lot of sameness. I will be the first to admit, a variety based classic hits station is probably the most challenging and difficult to pull off. Those who do it the best are able to not only feature the core songs most in the format feature but to be the sound track of the local community.
The Top 300 lists really reminded me that there once was a national music. Pittsburgh apparently wasn’t much different musically from NYC and in their Top 300 lists. It didn’t matter your race, gender or age or even where you lived. Obviously, those days are long gone. But what has remained constant for format success is the importance of picking the right songs, creating that certain vibe and having the right owners and managers with the confidence, skill set and commitment to pull it all off.
When done right, a true classic hits format can be successful given all the challenges that is the business of radio today. I always believed Jacksonville was a Top 40 town given WAPE’s longevity and success in the market. Unlike a lot of Florida cities, Jacksonville has a significant number of residents who are in their 40’s today who were born and raised in this area. Rock and country have proved popular over the years and those impressions in youthful times still exist now. One has to ask why a Retro Top 40 format remains a huge programming hole in Jacksonville. I may not have all the answers, but over the years I have witnessed business decisions. Those decisions had consequences. Stick around…
I never paid much attention to this string originator’s user name – 1250WTAE. I just assumed it was a station somewhere in N.E. Florida. Well, it turns out this was a Top 40 AM station in Pittsburgh PA known as The Big 1250 WTAE. I visited their station tribute site and really enjoyed looking over their top 300 lists from the early 70’s.
,
A significant amount of time has passed since the heyday of AM music radio. Radio has changed significantly too. Simply, it had to in order to stay competitive and viable. I am on the record for embracing change and I never had an issue as it applies to a classic hits format. I understand the business part of radio. In other boards, posters constantly gripe about how the music keeps advancing in time and how favorites from their youth are now just forgotten.
I was always about reaching a good balance musically so those under the age of 54 would pull in the format too. The sweet spot always advances but there is also music that should never be forgotten either. A true classic hits format has a mass-appeal quality in a much targeted radio world. For those who do the format extremely well, that format stands out as being different from a lot of sameness. I will be the first to admit, a variety based classic hits station is probably the most challenging and difficult to pull off. Those who do it the best are able to not only feature the core songs most in the format feature but to be the sound track of the local community.
The Top 300 lists really reminded me that there once was a national music. Pittsburgh apparently wasn’t much different musically from NYC and in their Top 300 lists. It didn’t matter your race, gender or age or even where you lived. Obviously, those days are long gone. But what has remained constant for format success is the importance of picking the right songs, creating that certain vibe and having the right owners and managers with the confidence, skill set and commitment to pull it all off.
When done right, a true classic hits format can be successful given all the challenges that is the business of radio today. I always believed Jacksonville was a Top 40 town given WAPE’s longevity and success in the market. Unlike a lot of Florida cities, Jacksonville has a significant number of residents who are in their 40’s today who were born and raised in this area. Rock and country have proved popular over the years and those impressions in youthful times still exist now. One has to ask why a Retro Top 40 format remains a huge programming hole in Jacksonville. I may not have all the answers, but over the years I have witnessed business decisions. Those decisions had consequences. Stick around…
Here’s part two of my explanation as to how business decisions have adversely affected the classic hits format in Jacksonville.
The big elephant in the room is 96.9 The Eagle. We may debate about what is a true or real classic hits station but none of that matters to the typical listener. Cox has done a masterful job in creating listener perceptions that the format indeed exists. As usual, the format was executed flawlessly, promoted effectively and a good number of listeners didn’t even need to seek them out – they were already locked on nostalgia anyway at 96.9.
From a profitability standpoint, WJGL was leaner and meaner than the predecessor format in that automation was replacing talent in certain dayparts. Personality was basically off the station and at the same time clutter had no place. Listeners responded well to that and there is no denying 96.9 The Eagle has been a highly successful station and a winner for Cox and a favorite among listeners too.
As far as the music featured on 96.9 goes, I believe history will reveal some answers. When those Top 300 music lists (WTAE and others) were prepared in the early 70’s, “current” hit music as well as songs that went back even from the 50’s were featured. There were multiple genres and it was a little of this and that – that was truly mass appeal and what defined the old Top 40 format. Music wasn’t polarizing to large numbers of people.
As the 70’s progressed, music changed and so did radio. Disco became the rage. Hit music stations played what was popular and disco dominated the charts. The late 70’s also saw a huge exodus of listeners from AM to FM. Fragmentation had begun. But from a listener perspective, they now had a place to go where they could hear music tailored to their personal tastes. There were specialized disco, rhythmic and R&B stations to name a few. But there were also contemporary and rock-oriented stations which capitalized on the “disco sucks” anthem and attracted listeners who shared that view.
I believe Cox decided to offer their version of classic hits to an audience who by and large believe disco or anything rhythmic sucks and is just not their music preferences. The playlist is tight and the music is tested. The extreme listener may complain of excessive repetition and lack of variety but there is no denying the station gets results with a few hundred hits and their listeners have remained loyal. 96.9 The Eagle is not for everybody. That brand was brought to numerous markets, almost a one size fits all approach but given the music it features, virtually any other format in those clusters would be safe.
Because there was one basic genre of music - rock leaning hits - the station would prove far easier to program by those who would invariably wear multiple hats. Also, there is considerable care taken in that a station cannot be competition to a sister station. As I consider the kind of music Hot 106.5 features, I figure at least 30% of that playlist – especially Saturday night programming – can be found on traditional classic hits stations.
Since 2005, classic hits in one form or the other has been started and stopped way too often. It is probably THE biggest reason the format has such a tough time in Jax. Listener bonds/ties have been broken so many times so that the demand and the emotion are just not there. Listeners move on to something else. Like yesterday, I remember Cox mentioning they were getting ahead of the power curve when they brought The Eagle to market. That infers there was still time to evolve what already existed but they chose a different course. Other companies may not have done that. It was an unfortunate blow to the format and it is the reality that is Jacksonville.
Perhaps, it will take a different approach, maybe a different company or even a tweaking of something that already exists to bring a pop-oriented 70's and 80's station, or even soft leaning format to Jax. But then I look at the clock. 1980 is already 33 years ago. Most of the format offers music from around that time give or take 5-7 years in each direction. There's a lot of overlap but there's also songs no one really features. But speaking of time, there has been a lot of time lost and a lot of momentum and demand gone too.
The format found a new home in 2005 but that didn't last long. Looking back, there were a number of things that were done very well. Some things made no sense and proved very costly. I'm sure a Part 3 will follow down the road. I'm tuckered out for now. Still, decisions have consequences, don't they?
The big elephant in the room is 96.9 The Eagle. We may debate about what is a true or real classic hits station but none of that matters to the typical listener. Cox has done a masterful job in creating listener perceptions that the format indeed exists. As usual, the format was executed flawlessly, promoted effectively and a good number of listeners didn’t even need to seek them out – they were already locked on nostalgia anyway at 96.9.
From a profitability standpoint, WJGL was leaner and meaner than the predecessor format in that automation was replacing talent in certain dayparts. Personality was basically off the station and at the same time clutter had no place. Listeners responded well to that and there is no denying 96.9 The Eagle has been a highly successful station and a winner for Cox and a favorite among listeners too.
As far as the music featured on 96.9 goes, I believe history will reveal some answers. When those Top 300 music lists (WTAE and others) were prepared in the early 70’s, “current” hit music as well as songs that went back even from the 50’s were featured. There were multiple genres and it was a little of this and that – that was truly mass appeal and what defined the old Top 40 format. Music wasn’t polarizing to large numbers of people.
As the 70’s progressed, music changed and so did radio. Disco became the rage. Hit music stations played what was popular and disco dominated the charts. The late 70’s also saw a huge exodus of listeners from AM to FM. Fragmentation had begun. But from a listener perspective, they now had a place to go where they could hear music tailored to their personal tastes. There were specialized disco, rhythmic and R&B stations to name a few. But there were also contemporary and rock-oriented stations which capitalized on the “disco sucks” anthem and attracted listeners who shared that view.
I believe Cox decided to offer their version of classic hits to an audience who by and large believe disco or anything rhythmic sucks and is just not their music preferences. The playlist is tight and the music is tested. The extreme listener may complain of excessive repetition and lack of variety but there is no denying the station gets results with a few hundred hits and their listeners have remained loyal. 96.9 The Eagle is not for everybody. That brand was brought to numerous markets, almost a one size fits all approach but given the music it features, virtually any other format in those clusters would be safe.
Because there was one basic genre of music - rock leaning hits - the station would prove far easier to program by those who would invariably wear multiple hats. Also, there is considerable care taken in that a station cannot be competition to a sister station. As I consider the kind of music Hot 106.5 features, I figure at least 30% of that playlist – especially Saturday night programming – can be found on traditional classic hits stations.
Since 2005, classic hits in one form or the other has been started and stopped way too often. It is probably THE biggest reason the format has such a tough time in Jax. Listener bonds/ties have been broken so many times so that the demand and the emotion are just not there. Listeners move on to something else. Like yesterday, I remember Cox mentioning they were getting ahead of the power curve when they brought The Eagle to market. That infers there was still time to evolve what already existed but they chose a different course. Other companies may not have done that. It was an unfortunate blow to the format and it is the reality that is Jacksonville.
Perhaps, it will take a different approach, maybe a different company or even a tweaking of something that already exists to bring a pop-oriented 70's and 80's station, or even soft leaning format to Jax. But then I look at the clock. 1980 is already 33 years ago. Most of the format offers music from around that time give or take 5-7 years in each direction. There's a lot of overlap but there's also songs no one really features. But speaking of time, there has been a lot of time lost and a lot of momentum and demand gone too.
The format found a new home in 2005 but that didn't last long. Looking back, there were a number of things that were done very well. Some things made no sense and proved very costly. I'm sure a Part 3 will follow down the road. I'm tuckered out for now. Still, decisions have consequences, don't they?
From Nfladxer's previous post: "JohnJax, Yes, I made the suggestion to the OM at Renda Jax that Sunny 94.1 could evolve into a more upbeat "Sunny"... now get this, playing "Jacksonville's Greatest Hits"! This was before I left, and before W-JGH hit the air! Oh well! "
If only your recommendation became reality! And so, part 3 of this little saga continues now with Renda Broadcasting and how their decisions have negatively impacted the classic hits format.
The concept of a “Sunny” on their then newly purchased station for St. Augustine actually made sense. As a Soft AC and with some similarity to Cox’s The Dove in Tampa, the music was old enough and business-friendly enough to be a great soundtrack for the nation’s oldest city especially for all those shops along St. George Street. As you once said, WSOS FM could have easily represented St. Augustine’s Oldies Station.
As I mentioned earlier, Renda was juggling lots of balls with the station purchase and new format launch of WSOS FM, getting 99.9 Gator Country off the ground and flipping Arrow to the oldies format at 100.7. I can actually understand that perhaps a Soft AC was just in the works and they were moving forward come hell or high water. Honestly I believe there was not sufficient time to think long-term strategy.
I’m not sure when you made your comment that WSOS-FM should have evolved into Jacksonville’s Greatest Hits but that opportunity certainly had the best chance of reality when KOOL 100.7 bit the dust. That was the strategic move.
However, the biggest obstacle to a pop-oriented classic hits format was the former Renda GM. For those of you who do not know, this individual came to Renda Broadcasting from Cox. If you followed my previous post, it should be obvious to anyone that Cox had no interest in this type format.
This individual, no doubt, probably embraced the Cox philosophy and he never saw the reasons why the format COULD WORK but rather all the reasons why it WOULD NOT. It was a tough scenario making the case for the format, especially given KOOL 100’7’s shortcomings and eventual failure. No one evidently concluded the signal was wrong for the format. The launch and the first several months were a programming disaster. Listeners probably got a bad perception and they just never got excited over KOOL 100.7 despite positives such as adding Tom Kent at night and Tom Murphy in PM drive. It was just a little too late.
When Sunny 94.1 was “Dove-ish” their numbers were slowly but surely rising until they got to around a 2 share which I thought was pretty impressive considering they were basically a St. John’s County signal and station. For reasons I will never understand, after KOOL died in 2006 and a void created, there were a series of tweaks that turned WSOS-FM into a slightly older version of WEJZ. The ratings started to drop and they continued to do so to the point that Sunny 94.1 was earning fractional shares for quite some time.
We heard the word “placeholder” in a previous post and I always suspected Sunny was deliberately held back and it basically failed by design. I’m convinced I was right. There was no plan to bring the format to a Jacksonville signal. Still, this was totally illogical to me because fractional shares had to impact revenue potential. While this is speculation on my part, I’m convinced a pop oriented classic hits station would have not only filled a void but the potential existed for the format to earn a 3 share at a minimum. This could have helped WEJZ’s if “Sunny” could have impacted Eagle by even 1 share.
From a cluster perspective and for market format variety, Renda could have had an AC, a Classic Hits and a Country format. 100.7, being the wildcard, could have become Classic Rock when Rock 105 became Rock 104.5. Most people agree Jacksonville is overstated in Country by at least one station, this could have corrected that as well.
Obviously, things didn’t quite work out that way. From 2006-2010 Jacksonville was once again without our own version of a WCBS-FM. 4 years is an eternity and it could be the nail in the coffin to virtually any format that attempts a comeback. But it did and that was Magic 107.3. Things looked so promising early on and so much changed. I was privy to a lot of things that went on. I have never violated the trust of those who have told me things in confidence and I will not do so now. But, in general terms, I need to get some more off my chest and that will follow later….
"If only your recommendation became reality! And so, part 3 of this little saga continues now with Renda Broadcasting and how their decisions have negatively impacted the classic hits format.
The concept of a “Sunny” on their then newly purchased station for St. Augustine actually made sense. As a Soft AC and with some similarity to Cox’s The Dove in Tampa, the music was old enough and business-friendly enough to be a great soundtrack for the nation’s oldest city especially for all those shops along St. George Street. As you once said, WSOS FM could have easily represented St. Augustine’s Oldies Station.
As I mentioned earlier, Renda was juggling lots of balls with the station purchase and new format launch of WSOS FM, getting 99.9 Gator Country off the ground and flipping Arrow to the oldies format at 100.7. I can actually understand that perhaps a Soft AC was just in the works and they were moving forward come hell or high water. Honestly I believe there was not sufficient time to think long-term strategy.
I’m not sure when you made your comment that WSOS-FM should have evolved into Jacksonville’s Greatest Hits but that opportunity certainly had the best chance of reality when KOOL 100.7 bit the dust. That was the strategic move.
However, the biggest obstacle to a pop-oriented classic hits format was the former Renda GM. For those of you who do not know, this individual came to Renda Broadcasting from Cox. If you followed my previous post, it should be obvious to anyone that Cox had no interest in this type format.
This individual, no doubt, probably embraced the Cox philosophy and he never saw the reasons why the format COULD WORK but rather all the reasons why it WOULD NOT. It was a tough scenario making the case for the format, especially given KOOL 100’7’s shortcomings and eventual failure. No one evidently concluded the signal was wrong for the format. The launch and the first several months were a programming disaster. Listeners probably got a bad perception and they just never got excited over KOOL 100.7 despite positives such as adding Tom Kent at night and Tom Murphy in PM drive. It was just a little too late.
When Sunny 94.1 was “Dove-ish” their numbers were slowly but surely rising until they got to around a 2 share which I thought was pretty impressive considering they were basically a St. John’s County signal and station. For reasons I will never understand, after KOOL died in 2006 and a void created, there were a series of tweaks that turned WSOS-FM into a slightly older version of WEJZ. The ratings started to drop and they continued to do so to the point that Sunny 94.1 was earning fractional shares for quite some time.
We heard the word “placeholder” in a previous post and I always suspected Sunny was deliberately held back and it basically failed by design. I’m convinced I was right. There was no plan to bring the format to a Jacksonville signal. Still, this was totally illogical to me because fractional shares had to impact revenue potential. While this is speculation on my part, I’m convinced a pop oriented classic hits station would have not only filled a void but the potential existed for the format to earn a 3 share at a minimum. This could have helped WEJZ’s if “Sunny” could have impacted Eagle by even 1 share.
From a cluster perspective and for market format variety, Renda could have had an AC, a Classic Hits and a Country format. 100.7, being the wildcard, could have become Classic Rock when Rock 105 became Rock 104.5. Most people agree Jacksonville is overstated in Country by at least one station, this could have corrected that as well.
Obviously, things didn’t quite work out that way. From 2006-2010 Jacksonville was once again without our own version of a WCBS-FM. 4 years is an eternity and it could be the nail in the coffin to virtually any format that attempts a comeback. But it did and that was Magic 107.3. Things looked so promising early on and so much changed. I was privy to a lot of things that went on. I have never violated the trust of those who have told me things in confidence and I will not do so now. But, in general terms, I need to get some more off my chest and that will follow later….
And so my explanation to the subject question concludes with WJGH – Magic 107.3 and Clear Channel’s tossing their hat into the ring bringing classic hits to Jacksonville in early August, 2010.
At this time, Jacksonville was preparing for PPM. Magic 107.3 wound up performed exceedingly well in early PPM and it validated a number of points. While I can appreciate the fact that a bump is usually a part of anything new, I wouldn’t be surprised if even CC was pleasantly surprised with a Top 3 showing in 25-54 given there wasn’t a PD, no jocks and really no promotion.
My understanding is the music was scheduled by the MD at sister WOLL in West Palm. Kudos to this individual as a really good mix of 60’s, 70’s and 80’s was presented. There were a number of songs Jacksonville had not heard for well over 5 years. Listeners responded because the station sounded different than anything else. Some of what we know about PPM also became reality and that is listeners do not respond to clutter and hype. There were several 90 minute music sweeps during the day and that certainly helped attract listeners.
When I talked of the heyday of AM music radio earlier, I was also reminded that even the most powerful PD’s of the day did not always have full control of their station. There were FCC requirements to carry news every hour or even twice an hour. If you were part of a network, and especially if you were a flagship station, there were non-music shows that proved to be ratings killers. Still, the successful PD overcame those things because they still had control over large portions of the station.
There were a number of things Magic 107.3 was forced to air as well, especially anything iHeart which I always believed added to the clutter. Magic was also designed to be personality driven. However, after years of automation and an overall downplaying of the talent, PPM says listeners have embraced the “less is more” approach with talent participation. WEJZ, for example, does a really good job not being in your face. Listeners appreciate hearing something relevant to them. To make a point, one day Carly Simon’s ”You’re So Vain” was talked up @Magic along with the Mick Jagger speculation. That song is 40 years old. No value was added with that comment as we have been hearing that stuff for decades. UGH.
For shitz and grins, I reviewed about a week’s worth of programming @WCBS – FM yesterday. They continue to perform very well and they are doing a good job attracting younger demos to the station. There are some core songs that are repeated. But overall, the mix is just awesome and The Eagles, Fleetwood Mac and Elton John are almost rarely heard because there are so many other artists represented. From day to day, there was little repetition. Saturday night programming is just alive and kicking with familiar rhythmic songs of the 70’s and 80’s as well as songs I hadn’t heard in years and they change songs each week for that show.
To me, the music programming is the bread and butter of the station. CC and CBS Radio are two different companies. But without doubt, CBS Radio has nailed the classic hits format because they do keep the programming fresh. Each week, listeners are treated to Beatles Wednesday where each hour a Beatles track is presented with many lesser heard album cuts. There are numerous “specials” that bring back those “lost” hits as well. The more they play, the more people get to know them and expect that sort of thing. It makes for interesting radio.
I understand a PD at a big company has very little control over the playlist. But when I look at a station that in effect was locked in neutral for quite some time, I believe opportunity for growth was lost because there was little incentive for more listeners to make the switch. Featuring many of the same songs in both AM and PM drive with hardly any changes day to day made no sense to me. With programming that also was fed from Premium Choice, I often shuttered when songs heard in the 5AM were also heard in the 6AM hour. There is no excuse for that! Doubling up on spots one hour to support an upcoming supposed commercial free hour made no sense either.
Interestingly, the new 105.3 The Mix uses a sweeper line where they talk of not hitting their listeners over the head to get them to listen. Promoting a station is critical but if a contest is perceived as too hard to win or just adding to the clutter and detracting from the music, it actually does more harm than good. Running national contests twice an hour – I’m not sure if this was a corporate decision or a local management one – but it was the wrong one.
From a number of sources, to include South Florida radio folks, it was no secret that the when the management upheaval occurred @CC and a new GM was brought in, he was on the record for not liking the format. Even putting that aside, that role requires leadership. That individual must inspire and coach and have the skills and the desire to turn adverse situations around. Everyone needs coaching and mentoring and that includes even the most successful PD and seasoned talent. Someone wise on this board once said something to the effect “the station can never be better than the GM.”
Magic 107.3 had a lot of things going for her. It was not a train wreck by any stretch but it was more like a runaway train. The quest to get out of neutral and compete for #1 saw way too many changes happening way too fast over a very short period of time. Add in signal disruption that lasted for months because of a lightning strike and it’s like the format just can’t catch a break in Jacksonville.
Apologies for running way too long but I just had to say these things. I follow the goings on of the format on other boards and I don’t believe any other place exists that has seen A “Greatest Hits” format earned as many hard knocks as it has in Jacksonville. As for me, life goes on and I have lots of family responsibilities and work in South Florida that keeps me busy. I’ll be back there next week for a bit. A fantastic greatest hits station awaits me there. It's good to see what can happen when everyone on the team pulls together and makes the right decisions to turn things around. We haven't been as fortunate in Jacksonville. But in radio, things can change on a dime. So who knows maybe with a Jedi mind melt and other factors, something great will happen even in Jacksonville.
At this time, Jacksonville was preparing for PPM. Magic 107.3 wound up performed exceedingly well in early PPM and it validated a number of points. While I can appreciate the fact that a bump is usually a part of anything new, I wouldn’t be surprised if even CC was pleasantly surprised with a Top 3 showing in 25-54 given there wasn’t a PD, no jocks and really no promotion.
My understanding is the music was scheduled by the MD at sister WOLL in West Palm. Kudos to this individual as a really good mix of 60’s, 70’s and 80’s was presented. There were a number of songs Jacksonville had not heard for well over 5 years. Listeners responded because the station sounded different than anything else. Some of what we know about PPM also became reality and that is listeners do not respond to clutter and hype. There were several 90 minute music sweeps during the day and that certainly helped attract listeners.
When I talked of the heyday of AM music radio earlier, I was also reminded that even the most powerful PD’s of the day did not always have full control of their station. There were FCC requirements to carry news every hour or even twice an hour. If you were part of a network, and especially if you were a flagship station, there were non-music shows that proved to be ratings killers. Still, the successful PD overcame those things because they still had control over large portions of the station.
There were a number of things Magic 107.3 was forced to air as well, especially anything iHeart which I always believed added to the clutter. Magic was also designed to be personality driven. However, after years of automation and an overall downplaying of the talent, PPM says listeners have embraced the “less is more” approach with talent participation. WEJZ, for example, does a really good job not being in your face. Listeners appreciate hearing something relevant to them. To make a point, one day Carly Simon’s ”You’re So Vain” was talked up @Magic along with the Mick Jagger speculation. That song is 40 years old. No value was added with that comment as we have been hearing that stuff for decades. UGH.
For shitz and grins, I reviewed about a week’s worth of programming @WCBS – FM yesterday. They continue to perform very well and they are doing a good job attracting younger demos to the station. There are some core songs that are repeated. But overall, the mix is just awesome and The Eagles, Fleetwood Mac and Elton John are almost rarely heard because there are so many other artists represented. From day to day, there was little repetition. Saturday night programming is just alive and kicking with familiar rhythmic songs of the 70’s and 80’s as well as songs I hadn’t heard in years and they change songs each week for that show.
To me, the music programming is the bread and butter of the station. CC and CBS Radio are two different companies. But without doubt, CBS Radio has nailed the classic hits format because they do keep the programming fresh. Each week, listeners are treated to Beatles Wednesday where each hour a Beatles track is presented with many lesser heard album cuts. There are numerous “specials” that bring back those “lost” hits as well. The more they play, the more people get to know them and expect that sort of thing. It makes for interesting radio.
I understand a PD at a big company has very little control over the playlist. But when I look at a station that in effect was locked in neutral for quite some time, I believe opportunity for growth was lost because there was little incentive for more listeners to make the switch. Featuring many of the same songs in both AM and PM drive with hardly any changes day to day made no sense to me. With programming that also was fed from Premium Choice, I often shuttered when songs heard in the 5AM were also heard in the 6AM hour. There is no excuse for that! Doubling up on spots one hour to support an upcoming supposed commercial free hour made no sense either.
Interestingly, the new 105.3 The Mix uses a sweeper line where they talk of not hitting their listeners over the head to get them to listen. Promoting a station is critical but if a contest is perceived as too hard to win or just adding to the clutter and detracting from the music, it actually does more harm than good. Running national contests twice an hour – I’m not sure if this was a corporate decision or a local management one – but it was the wrong one.
From a number of sources, to include South Florida radio folks, it was no secret that the when the management upheaval occurred @CC and a new GM was brought in, he was on the record for not liking the format. Even putting that aside, that role requires leadership. That individual must inspire and coach and have the skills and the desire to turn adverse situations around. Everyone needs coaching and mentoring and that includes even the most successful PD and seasoned talent. Someone wise on this board once said something to the effect “the station can never be better than the GM.”
Magic 107.3 had a lot of things going for her. It was not a train wreck by any stretch but it was more like a runaway train. The quest to get out of neutral and compete for #1 saw way too many changes happening way too fast over a very short period of time. Add in signal disruption that lasted for months because of a lightning strike and it’s like the format just can’t catch a break in Jacksonville.
Apologies for running way too long but I just had to say these things. I follow the goings on of the format on other boards and I don’t believe any other place exists that has seen A “Greatest Hits” format earned as many hard knocks as it has in Jacksonville. As for me, life goes on and I have lots of family responsibilities and work in South Florida that keeps me busy. I’ll be back there next week for a bit. A fantastic greatest hits station awaits me there. It's good to see what can happen when everyone on the team pulls together and makes the right decisions to turn things around. We haven't been as fortunate in Jacksonville. But in radio, things can change on a dime. So who knows maybe with a Jedi mind melt and other factors, something great will happen even in Jacksonville.
JohnJax as always your posts are great. I did grow up and program several radio stations in and near Pittsburgh. However 1250 WTAE was my dream station and the reason I got into the business 35 years ago. We've all had that one favorite station growing up.
The OM/PD of the format Magic in Jax is a long time friend. I don't know why Jacksonville's major companies have never given the classic hits format long enough to truly take hold. Or better yet they didn't put together the proper sales staffs to drive them.
The demos and success of Orlando's Sunny 105.9 are not that much different than Jacksonville, and look how successful its been. Then again its CBS, who does oldies/classic hits better than any one else. And your also right about the success of WAPE over the years.
Lets hope another company in the future makes the correct move and does the format right. I know I could certainly help them!
The OM/PD of the format Magic in Jax is a long time friend. I don't know why Jacksonville's major companies have never given the classic hits format long enough to truly take hold. Or better yet they didn't put together the proper sales staffs to drive them.
The demos and success of Orlando's Sunny 105.9 are not that much different than Jacksonville, and look how successful its been. Then again its CBS, who does oldies/classic hits better than any one else. And your also right about the success of WAPE over the years.
Lets hope another company in the future makes the correct move and does the format right. I know I could certainly help them!
JohnJax -
Your posts are always a pleasure to read. As someone who has programmed classic rock and classic hits, your insight hits home. Thanks for the great read.
Your posts are always a pleasure to read. As someone who has programmed classic rock and classic hits, your insight hits home. Thanks for the great read.
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